76 - My Own Sinkhole
This week, Karen and Georgia discuss the murders of master forger Mark Hofmann and the case of the Central Park 5.
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hey guys this is Esther and Caroline a brand new podcast launching on feral audio this coming July Fourth and whoa it's cold and blowing up hands well the day is over my head no hey guys as surging Carolina have a brand new podcast launching unfurl audio this July Fourth it's called growing up and it's all about beauty and makeup diet exercise basically our journey to blow up and be beautiful on the inside now and you know are talking about is going to Chloe and you can find us on Apple podcast that girl audio dot com or wherever you listen to podcasts and fall or Instagram growing a podcast to be so fun to be updating you on all things Chloe had her You Need Coffee rhetoric coffee once again it here and they're cool people and school coffee and then copy and it's hot some call you Can I sit here and there are companies like them they have in my favor murder planned and they support artists which is super cool yet so it's seeing a thirty percent off right now by going to read or coffee to calm the promo code is murder we really should get the The platelets are never suffer the land north of the fifth to the It's not if the sex hello welcome to my favorite murderer or a whole town thinks are coming that scare until the started like it's super uncomfortable we got over this a million times were staring this waiting staring each other to see who's going to go first and then the fake guest voices to offer come out of our heads and then wastes gas to start over but we don't say we never plan anything I mean what the plan the plan or anyone who cares anyway all the things have you seen a picture the newest pictures of a comeback from the Hubble telescope that show the Galaxy's the purple bead It basically it's like black background and they did purple where the galaxies in the picture and orange was the gas the different things of gas that makes stars in it like there's a countless number of galaxies in this photo anxiety attack I'm just saying Who cares at this podcast either Stardust Theater made a star can't even start to think about it that is at the the vastness of space gives you anxiety the vastness of space the reality what is a boy are more aliens clearly I mean an I'm actually Irish I dah worse the the um there's the duvet podcast you love mysteries abound to go to sleep too unlike the last episode is like ours are humans actually aliens and it's like my guests I got so episode that mile went to Petaluma for Father's Day I landed came and pick me up I got into the car and was like so the thing is that there's a greater chance for all to explain it very poorly it's not like I don't I don't remember them and turned him in one night Elvis was a damn im sad to think after a life of his dislike know I am now I he has the like or what they called he's the voice Yes them oh speaking of which there's a reason we can never think of the word trophy and I would like to say I would like to take responsibility for his I think every time it's happened it's been in and as a serial killer takes trophies yet they take a thing may keep it so they can look at it remember about being a dad that's called a trophy give it up the word Memento which is what he is the same word yet but I guess I guess the most often used term and the ones that people Stewie to us in all caps exclamation points and the trophy from the So maybe here in the podcasting loft which we finally moved into an everyone or you can ever tweet text or put pictures I just like didn't feel like it was done yet but I should just post it so that you guys all of the awsome are few centers and goals as an pictures and everything Georgia has arranged in her loft excessively and it looks so cool it's a super fun reading and on them social media but there's like things I want to frame stolen things I need to put up here and there but I'll post it for now and there's let sit for couldn't talk straight yes I thought it was funny when I hung a crooked yes twice I'd immediately and it made me laugh it's driving me crazy like a decade as a Second City I got a point there's a reason is that I don't need to download app and is a or who second half that you did you come up for anything now man on the grid goes down we're going to force crude nothing will be straight and no friends will be straight and that you won't know even if there are are like land lines of family could you do you know you even your own phone number via Jim I know I have I been so nice purposely were memorized each other's enemy to colors day or night today that like I'm super prepared trying to prepare for earthquakes you know once I got Lake ext this is boring the the boring to hear DJs coke thing here in a cover for at least thirty seconds well what I'm preparing for earthquakes is necessary and a reality California but would you do buy some flashlights the engine up a little flashlight I have of external batteries in my car in my hand crank I moan on the phone like like to have a charge break listen everyone be prepared that's it's a very important let go and live in earthquake it in my front closet but only think of is what if that's the part a house that goes down like little out of the collapse of what is I stick flashlights under everything in my and I've I had to sign a piece of paper declaring that my house is on land that if there's a strong earthquake it turns to liquid and sinks into the earth what I will get my own sinkhole which has as many people know one of my great passions of life is in coleslaw I have a question what kind of like a liquid are we talking about because it's something fine like Kool guess I was a coiled spring under the file home no it's because I'm near the Cotton Cordell there is one that's feet from my door yes well that goes right up kind wind that creates the water table is great I guess close to under my house so basically the ground shakes the girl the kind of the silt or ground will just mix with the water become like sand quicksand the and good bye can I So just things to who skippers the back stairs this places where there isn't and won't be earthquakes ever high you never know though I think there's a geologist who listens to a quick doctor yes definitely took a few emails they are completely incorrect about all of this and for my sign paperwork lists home speaking of it but I'm not though experts that's right I know that a letter an email from the girls who excited in fucking insane mainline murders last week yes and that girl who was his dad was involved in the case the mass whoa okay I sense a menu cover the mainline last episode as my dad was very closely involved in the case he prosecuted Karen rants lever William Bradford patches patches that provides after stealing from her estate to the one thing he got me any time he described Brad field as a master manipulator and a truly despite being a prosecutor for over thirty years including hundreds behind bars including billionaire John du Pont who wait is up to a cross Hawks catcher the my dad says no cases ever affected him cry like this fine he's a father of four daughters Annie still tears up and talks about the kids that innocent children in the discovery of Karen's art museum on the floor the car and by the way actually call her Carol at the very end of it and let's just say you were off the page though you are just trying to talk and yes that's always a mistake I made the mistake that were were dedicated to make never apologize for like I just about the patches and Principal Smith were co conspirators he thinks and that patches had agreed I'm re I'm just going to miss yet agreed to split Karen's life insurance money with the prince of awe in exchange for killing Karen and her children to this day he still heartbroken over the police mishandling evidence that led to J Smith's conviction being thrown out thank you I say much except track set trap dominated a FK things against a sex game murder Briana PS and Steve into the act will carry the fee on find my own and their CIA says they I'll decide after getting cut at seven p S Even still nope i i is Stephen state he steam in single Sorry cinema take this one can we you can cut this out obviously in charge of this whole show know is that so many so many listeners like this be our inquiry a cat guy which lots of girls but don't mistake that for innocence orc or any kind a don't miss his kindness for gentleness as the saying the mistake my weakness for kindness like that I saw that one time on It by Stephen this is going profile I call a clip of this podcast is the whole thing where when I've decided okay I think you should take it over to what's called Too Many Fish in the Christian dating site too many fishes that was FARC or anything I like this so I feel has yes even religion what's really important meal I I over too many fish and then make a change of pace speaking of traveling the one thing as quickly as the end of the email did she start calling because Karen was the daughter yet right now because though may have the discovery of Karen's art museum at the floor the car so the kids the kid but then later the air a she may have at what can I not just me for a moment now I feel half of the mother's hse now this isn't right okay anyways the area were just so just so actually start was a run through I'ma say this the clearer the Cleveland knows how to meet up they sent us pictures they sent as a video there's they're good looking groom they a bar enthusiastic and it's a lot of people or treating just saying what a great group that was how happy it made be a part of it other people writing saying Hey and they ended up collecting five hundred dollars backlog that is the you guys so much and congratulations to go because that really makes a difference that's lovely thanks to more lame sorry points Larry with the sorry word I said actually no idea what it's like they're apparently it's lovely yeah I think I was like a great place and there up to where they went and saw despicable Me together I like I owe you don't have to make them and have cocktails with money may not go watch a movie that's so good there is a summery scent I can't tell if he was the person that sentence was wearing a sweatshirt because it kind of look like a model or from just showing the picture of a sweatshirt but you can get a sweater that says Des Moines D U H Lyles base lease may spell fanatic Leone laugh really hard yes well so we're you know our number on each other's my calf were in an area yeah speaking of traveling Stephen is coming with us to Australia that's right everyone thinking announce that yet so don't look so um okay there's a friend of a friend of events A and she is a leather worker and she sent us the passport covers in leather it's it's like a fool SSD jam and her and Martine is the name of the company its M and T I and we move there with him live as much as that symbol it's like classy classy as they mock Tina I've ever jam gorgeous and cool ranks from Sarah Sarah yet more ugly matchy matchy hour walk through security just like yellow like Oh for them to as FBI agents yet every year this thing open I learned to flip your thing open with one hand I'm taking over this thing oh can I say one more thing about Instagram they're having I guess the thing called lettering challenge which I didn't know is the things people really into calligraphy in light grey and like lettering raises a thing or having my favorite murder lettering challenge I guess it's like haw it's a whole community they have challenges for like the month and so there is hashed F AM and I think I found my girl who was going to design my tattoo of my favorite Etsy oh Trey said you wanna get one with me or should it surprise you that is so fucking weird I had night that everyone in my family was getting a tattoo together and I were in the dream I was like really can't marry in your mid seventy s the care of my camping bag and you a tattoo of June some toast the eye the I look it up but yes I'll get a tattoo if you are alone together yes okay can I want to get mine all across to the bus think imma gna get mine like with this column under our armpits my body read this I love it and then I met again after SST jam and this chicken is clear if he really was the shutout when they attacked it I'm unhappy I'm having a design something male came in as a serial my I use no guy that used to call neck tattoos job Stoppers then hand tattoos I don't think that's true anymore how many chefs do you see yet not talk to her like pod casters me and people are tied up or like yam of folky I company I have a face tattoo Zoo with Nana make more money to my own boss too bad your dad meets the eye does driving less now and he said I keep wondering if all these young girls to get my car her murder sounded like he is going to kill the day is to be careful of how he brings up the ass if you see Marty picking up on left my day I think that's all it's all feel uneasy with little fun thing for for s based on last week's story on your car sorry Karen I know now but I think it's never too early for Okay All right what is that the Christmas Special first and this was the one that like was it was it that it was this is the highest ranking TV before he got knocked out by some Super Bowl yet the classics this is when time that we can see the that is may He save it for Christmas ok July Chris a special event to thank you so much weight someone sent it the man if they to watch aware that come to you disqualified time one that didn't bring presents for everyone these though you didn't know she got queue she sent them to us on her own accord and I thought you'd like no no no a friend in immense is does this thing so she sent a Sizzler has neo con glad I clarified to take responsibility for her ok I'm going is in the we have a sinkhole I kept podcasts were more lenient and the one we are blessed truly blessed truly truly truly locates me this week right yes yes I know now you know Susan can pay attention to the styling of the IDF will ever see yes his narrow back roll a row on again what a bummer though I think that we have this often is that mine at the end and I hate closing with a real bummer yeah but something that's positive that's why we turn hard we had a hard left in the positive lands people like and murder podcasts are real bummer they don't know if it's the whole point ok mine that it's her sometimes as we're about to get for me to get my home are done it's the A and especially I will work on something for awhile and then if I've a friend who goes have ever I will immediately my friend I switch a switch in a new half lead and Saunders it no ice which all the time via the fans so stories because you know you guys aren't just isn't a true crime if not more than either of us so often times you feel like I'm only telling a third of the story I know have read an entire book about this whatever other people to come so sometimes just because I know has much more to it and should invest more time and I can get adjusted sucess rate exact someone else already has but this was it so much from my friend Bridger is the one who told me about it he's hilarious he's he's very famous on Twitter and he's a great writer and he grew up in Utah so he was like Have you ever heard and I anything about it turns out there's a Friends of files there's lots of stuff there's an amazing book um but anyway ounce give you I'll give so word saw were in Salt Lake City but this was our cars called anything I'm not calling because I usually I end up giving us I told her she sorts the Lake City the morning of October fifteen to nineteen eighty five when a man named Steve Christiansen husband a father of four and a bishop of the Mormon church here eyes at his office on the sixth floor of the judge building in downtown Salt Lake City up one time I did a story and it was that horrible her kids off the top of the hotel in Utah in Salt Lake City even greater than in throughout the day random that it was a very because you know all of you talk I assume that saw Lake City would be a conservative ten well I was kind of about that would like to say now I now know because of making a mistake that actually saw Lake City is the like the liberal part of Utah and it's a college town it's the hip places it's probably best case area and if you're looking for I don't know a great shirt or some really cool flats and I are so deceived Christensen gets to his office he sees a brown wrapped box shaped package office door and his names written on top of it he picks it up and immediately immediately explodes home fuck care of I know something else than this is fuckin let's do yet so it was a pipe bomb I see is killed in the tobacco and fight yeah it's it will pipe bomb that with concrete nails were inside and concrete nails are the nails to pound of concrete you're strong industrial size nails to pound into concrete so the person that made this pipe bomb wanted the person who picked it up to be killed from her yet so the ATF officers arrived they begin to piece the bomb back together to figure out that it's a pipe bomb um and that was activated by a mercury switch that would go off when the package was picked up in the of men at the Mercury like chefs exactly it's a little glass or get her and if it in a tool is laying glass thing and then when you pick it up if you are the tip it one or the other the circuit came next and that's when the bomb explodes they know from a bomb like that that the person that the bomber dropped in that box off because to make sure it stays exactly the weight as I can email you can't just get somebody else and so on I also inside the bomb worked and batteries which is as many RC enthusiasts Candy is the RadioShack brand of batteries really um so they locate the local radio shacks trying to find out who's bought batteries there and you know the past week or ever they also I find out that Steve Christiansen and recently worked at a financial company called CFS which after doing huge business and the seventies and early eighties had started losing money and was in serious trouble so this is the part actually found really interesting cuz so the like a time of big money pretended to be rich and preppy Zahn Izod Coke time and apparently at the Salt Lake City in that time for financial fraud really so what people would do Carmen would go to Salt Lake City and they would kind of like get get into they would either pretend be friends higher ups in the Mormon church and then when they would do business they would say it like say they're in securities the whatever stocks bought a like I got a ground floor second thing get in on exactly and then the elders or whoever in the church would be like Oh this guy A trustworthy all the parishioners or the Mormons I'm not sure what you call the general word for butt all the people in that church would then trust that person and buy into whatever the person was bringing to the table high finance or are also very popular a pyramid scheme vitamin sales got to be very popular with the fuck back then yes it was kind of an ant there is let's am weighing the kind of bullshit going at the vitamins they ever get the vitamin they ever get the vitamins I don't know but it was a it was a kind of thing they call it um affinity fraud and it happens in lots of different kinds different kinds of religions this is my money as an arm and right and trust no one it's the same it's the at the assumption and quote him quote one of your own is going to look out for your as opposed to an outsider anyone you know I'm scared I'm scared of how whatever the fuck am I a lake and scared i that's its sole I anyone can tell you anything if you don't know exactly what's going on a duty to you it's a hundred percent pure truck and people are that like there in yeah okay so it's the same thing Bernie Madoff did too he got twenty as you well know watching that documentary that come from wealthy Jewish people a guy named Allen Stanford it to Southern Baptists how a seven million or seven billion empire that fell there is even a con man named Monroe L beachy who became a trusted within the Amish community and he went to prison for orchestrating a scheme that defrauded twenty seven hundred investors the deck so it's just a very common practice this idea that your religion would would stand for your good morals and that day that therefore the business is trustworthy Thomas Morse Kahn you know clients because these people are trusting because they because here in Maryland and it's because you believe the same things you have the and their tit they're going the inside not just standing out like rolling the dice and maybe there they're asking you are playing on your ultimate faith yet which is very ugly and and um the Mormon it was the kind of thing where there are a I believe that know lots of Mormons I've grown up I grew up with Mormons good friends that are used to work with Betsy is a Mormon and you know it's it's a very moralistic date the life they live is really the whole idea of it is that you live this life based on your face so it's like my friend us at the other days like Mormons the walk yeah so it's not just animate this because sewer hose like design that you see these days and when you trace them back it's like a young Mormon family and it's like the most beautiful you know table the cutest design it's like yours a great thing for your baby have heard so many bloggers like famous bloggers are like the big one fabulous sites are Mormon for some reason ye because it's kind of like it's that the whole idea of like home building and yet like putting the best Indy are home right and being ambitious having something anyways yeah yeah I mean these are insane we're not speaking for every single person that's in the religion but there's just something to that effect something to that um where'd tears and there there seems to be an innocence that that in the seventies like we can exploit this this community the sense of community that I have like um okay two hours after Steve Christiansen zz attack there's another bombing at the home of Gary and Kathy Sheetz Gary sheets was Steve Christiansen boss at CFS and his wife Kathy was the one who picked up the package it exploded in her hands and she was killed only to how I never heard of
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