Live from CrimeCon 2017
The Up and Vanished team travels to Indianapolis, IN for the first ever CrimeCon 2017 in this Bonus Episode!
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the the the the guys today we have a special bonus episode for you last weekend up in bed his team and I flew to Indianapolis for the first annual crime confidence crime Khan is kind of like comic on a Dragon Con except we're all about true crime was joined over two dozen fellow pod casters popular guest speakers like Nancy Grace and even the prosecutor and lead detective from the Steven Avery Cates from the Netflix documentary making a murder we got the chance to meet some of the fans up in Venice face to face here's some highlights The the crime were setting up our booth and as was say to cast their Kathy and I ain't very good I'm good I'm waken up have coffee so we setup the booth here at Crown cars and a lot of stuff going on around us looking forward to a wonderful time here from the the the the the record that the sum the Actually and stuff and had the opinion that had the urge to pick them yet and not just trying to play both sides he knew for all my friend that listens she texted me and she's like wow he is sassy and the like I know I was the end of his has right to play the bitch down light posts but in this horrible situation can see with this horrible situation in life he said his twenty one years old you know right from wrong path and don't go into for free the move a little bit more than I imagined I didn't imagine the street corner amongst all the true crime fans we don't know each other but still you get the same room got this thing in common that you share and is becoming like a little bond so so far so good on having a phenomenal a lot and banished cereal thinking sideways I've just subscribed this morning excited about that the the the the the the uh the uh the the fourth of voters being able to post it was already the system to the top of the call the city and has not deviated from the day the more the the one day to a crime gone Reese got one Philip Holloway to myself till the Q A session with a live audience to hear that next after a quick word from one of our sponsors are you tired of over paying for uncomfortable contact lenses do you wear once just to save some money if I told you you can get a fresh pair of lenses every single day for less sixty contacts for thirty dollars Do the math that's one dollar a day this is half the price of other brands so no more over paying over wearing for years my mom is worn contacts and just recently she made the switch to Hubble will just take my word for it take my mom's word best part of the vote of August for a while you travel and really wants a banana today and I named him in the lottery this is the place to go in right now has an offer exclusively for Up in Venice listeners could hobble contacts to come get your first two weeks of lenses for free fifteen pairs of lenses for free you can't beat that deal that's two weeks of free contacts so give it a try the whole context dot com and get twenty twenty vision for half the price that's Hubble contacts dot com any chance that broke are any of the family members the mother will get any of the reward money I know you talked about our little band on the podcasts keys to that at all I mean there's definitely a chance technically the person who brings information to help solve this thing is eligible for the money so if her story is true then technically I think would be her mother who would get the money but I have text messages from Bowen his friend and he confirms that when Brooke talked to the GBI they told her that she would get the reward money Bo told his friend I'm wondering what was going through your mind pain Brock explaining how all Bo just did what anybody would do in that situation and it's just so a vile and horrible is the casual ness is because it's been so many years are what I don't know why it's that wasn't more disturbing I guess to her yes I mean I thought the same thing was like she was to the whole idea the bow had burned someone's body talking up to a bad decision time was in one decision that caused all this to get right to it he burned her body for days was like he just pressed a button and caution to press the button this was a huge thing that most people in the world will ever do so to try talking up to one bad decision as a kid in that kids do that piss me off honestly UN's note that showed in the podcasts on my own backlash for talking the way I did too but I would have got equal amount of backlash if I just sat there and said Yes ma'am No ma'am kids don't do that I don't know any kids to do that so I just didn't understand what she was telling me to sell me on this narrative that he's still guilty for all these this is one little decision please on one interview she she had inset map there in the pecan orchard for six weeks in his truck because he felt remorse and another interview she said it was a week yeah that was going to be my question do you think Bo is than he is claiming to be I mean can potentially have done it and duped Brian into confessing all to say that I think it's very strange that he doesn't have answers for the only important questions his answers for everything else that doesn't at this point in KR person he's were put in the dumpster what's less important now that we think we know it happens and it's gone forever anyways but why is he not know what happens when Ryan got into our house Ryan told Bo that he used a credit card to get a house in the process of him telling that story so was the go use a cord to get into a house then what happens how do you not know the end of that story ask what happens next also know with so much common is that Ryan killed or b don't is suspicious to me I want to know the answer to those questions there's a reason why boat is now in answer to those questions I think he does have an answer I think the answer either makes him look bad as in he knows what Ryan and it was an awful thing it makes him look like a worse person for having gone along with this so he minimized or he is more involved are saying or both my question as they're claiming that they soaked in oil or oil and her two burner I'm there nineteen at the time Young Wright twenty one twenty K Houser twenty one year old know this average person they're just kids how they know that these are kids who have parties with huge bonfires well in the pecan orchard I mean aren't you from the areas that to describe why you did everything that have all the resistance is thankfully room most of the bag I grew up in the intestine which is just a fifteen minute drive maybe twenty from SIL I ceased to be a cop parked on the syllabus way before this happened but it's a rural area very rural and what I do love it was completely dry candy cane no alcohol can be purchased the restaurant of the county line if you want to buy a beer or liquor anything but the place to go have parties was out in some field somewhere and it was maybe a pasture or you know we had our own pecan orchard that if there was going to be if I ever bought in high school IB I would know about it in advance and so you all know where exactly to go in that pecan orchard to watch the fight and to drink beer you know that kind of stuff so it's a place it's a part of the state that's very agricultural so there's a lot of farmland and other places to go back for high school reunion a few years ago and my wife was with me and she was amazed the first thing that we did the first item on the agenda was to go out to a field somewhere and have a big party and the reason we did that it was like just to relive old times except the difference this time was we were all Duff be doing the things that we were doing and the local sheriff was in attendance because he was married to my classmates but we went back to feel in the middle of nowhere and had great because those but we stood as an ethical question as a podcast or in your role when you got the tip about the body or possible body under the house and you decided to go out and crawl and investigate it yourself did you base that dilemma of should I call the GBI or is this than my right to do it yes I did this whole thing is that ethical dilemma there's no written rules for me to follow always know if I'm doing the right thing or not with that example a typical search underneath his house the first thing I'm thinking is should I go here I do this when I found out that it's happening with or without me pretty much his neighbors in to go do it then I may do it so I was there with the property owner and the neighbor so I wasn't like trespassing on someone's property and searching for something I was essentially just helping the owner of this house if there's anything underneath his house and I've been told that the GBI already been here so chances are one funny thing anyway all those things and kind of make the best decision ans i wanna trust in you know I should trust the GBI early on in some of the trusted me so I didn't know what happens and it looked like they didn't know what happened either so was I going to solve it I was going to keep them out of the loop if I found something I was going to share it with them first but I wasn't going to just pass the ball to the GBI up and assume that this look it's all they've done that for eleven and nothing happened so if I just did it again I wouldn't be serving this thing any justice so just when I think of it to any of the belief that there might be further charges for other people who it seems blatantly obvious to me knew at least some of what happens but never did any there's definitely people who knew about this and didn't do anything about it but they're not going to charge anything I feel like that and what they did there's no statute of limitations on murder so if someone else was involved in a murder they can still be prosecuted if there's sufficient evidence to bring that but I think to the broader point you make we've sat around yesterday and we just have to bat around some of these ideas and I don't personally in my opinion believe that the official narrative if you will that we're getting by way of the arrest warrants in the charging documents later in the indictment is what happened it may very well be active be wrong I'm sure people call me Allen said all along that this doesn't make sense we see through charge I don't buy into the This was a botched burglary gone wrong can a theory I think there was something much more sinister going on and if evidence exists that you know says that some other person could have been involved in her murder or anything like that yeah there's absolutely could be charges and should be but if it's something like you know short of murder most everything else has a statute of limitations so if someone else was involved in helping destroy evidence in the police were not but they now found out about it is they're not going to be able to do anything because the statute of limitations I don't think America is is accurate and up a stop in awe feel last knot and I was just wondering if all the GBI agent who wrote to warn if he cleared that the AC them first before they caught the judge's son and I don't think you did so I just don't believe that the total narrative know if it's not true Helen true is that what really happens as a just slightly off or is the whole thing just wrong do you think they are coming to her mom coming foward when she did ii think that was motivated by the money from the reward or pressure the year podcast beings sole public and sewed widely listened to was putting pressure on the family I think that there was a race to the reward money we brought new about Bo's involvement least thirty days before she came forward to see was the podcast has so many people how can everything see she the other people who due to the hobo stove or whatever so she was really taken a chance everyday to somebody else could come forward to the GBI and tell the story that happened just over leave them out she got jump on it to see the reward money makes a lot of sense especially for somebody who really needs that much money yet the question she was even thinking about it all mean it's still a big risk to admit that you did this heinous crime and hope that you don't go to jail and get this money is almost like it may have encouraged them to do it which is an ironic way a good thing that there is reward money because I think it's a combination of maybe the pressure from the podcast keeping the story out there it's easy to keep a secret when nobody is talking about it but when everybody's talking about it it's a lot harder to keep the secret and you're probably talking about it but with two with Bo in a few for some reason felt like the podcast or anybody else in the community for snow it was maybe getting closer to you because all this new information surfacing in it's a popular topic in the town again and it is time for you to get your stuff together and get that reward money before they get to you first think of a combination of both those things I can't say with certainty that the podcast main income for but what did it was just the war money why not do it ten years ago I told you there was an app that's like Hoover for dog walkers lag is an on demand app for getting a dog walker you press the button in a thoroughly vetted Walker comes in walks your dog if you have a busy schedule you work in the day is perfect my dog Layla loves going outside I thought about lag been going outside lag has been a lifesaver if you're stuck in traffic are you stuck at the office you can use lag in a professional walker can walk your dog every walkers thoroughly vetted to get quality people have experience with dogs with the wag app you can see every step of the process to ease your mind walks towards you get a text message you can live GPS or dogs walk your dog poops or pees get a notification your phone was actually pork if you lag is a must have app for every dog owner right now they have an offer for you you can get your first wag Walk for free by texting vanished to two five three to four will send you a download link for the app you'll get your first walk absolutely free just text vanished to two five three to four so in addition to Payne's natural ability to be able to tell a story which are so good at I think that when the great things about the podcast in particular is a different perspectives and professional backgrounds that Maurice and Phil bring to the table as well so I was just curious really about how that all came about and in particular mores I know that you responded to that initial posts that Payne posted in the webs loose group and even a somebody here crime con I've never been to Webb's loose laces curious do you frequent this regularly or did somebody specifically flag that for you because of the subject matter in recess is really strange of always knowing what happens on the Internet immediately I am pretty good with my phone and stuff but I don't know what kind of notification set up he's got but he knows and said he called Getting put my number already traced it was like pain the night he knew immediately so it's just props to that first of all I don't know how you do that but I didn't want to go into this thing alone wouldn't be smart to a lot of things I don't know about one of them being the case I didn't know all the details but with the help of Marie's I was able to make sense of it all like I said Yeah I want to tell a story I want to tell a story of me trying to solve this case and I wanted the ending to be solving the case so whether I was a storyteller you want to call me a journalist I had to kind of where almost all those fats away with the I knew I was good that was maybe telling a story but I had to get good at or better at all the other things so I solicited the help of people like Phil the guy not only me but you guys to not going to assume that everybody is Marie's got one or Philip Holloway might be some but to the regular this are a little person we don't know all the sky we listen to as well want to pretend like I knew everything either proud to say that I don't send these guys know but I think that it's kind of shows you that any regular person can pick up and try to solve something there's people out there who have a lot of knowledge who can are happy to give it to us why they have it that's why they learned what the school until the stuff to help you do your thing as a total collaborative effort I'm happy to have people like these guys on board and help shape the saying I had never ever listen to podcasts in my life to last or listen to that the reason I started listening to up and vanishes because being from the area saw a lot of friends and contacts down there and I lived in Tipton Georgia in nineteen ninety Kerrigan said was crowned the expression law down there so I remember when this disappearance occurred and I've kept up with it whenever there was anything in the in the media about what that someone alerted me to this podcast that exists about this thing so that caught my attention so far listing in then at the point there was suddenly going to be a court case the OK from the rest will be made and knowing that this podcast was probably about to turn course unexpectedly and get into some legal stuff that pain may not have the ability to understand what is man or well you know what the question answer that people call him with legal questions and it was almost happenstance to many I think told pain to seek me out enough that I need to try to see if I can be of any assist you on Twitter every week we follow each other on Twitter at about same time and then there was some direct messaging going end of the scum how well did find that tweet real quick you message me on what I will I will say this without any help on the learning curve if you could find enough information before the rest of the learning curve would have been two years for the average person are so many people involved in this I even before the rest is just so much information on time that there's like a two year learning curve on this case yeah man surely the next six months but now you are notes for my dad spark notes whatever I felt that we it's very underwhelming this is due to me glad you followed me we should talk sometime the guess I did fall U verse the other day I can use the the you are you in south Georgia today was just about the message you yes we should know this is a truly investigated podcasts this is not just two people three people were brainstorming about what I think it has happened in case I mean like I said earlier a Hemi podcast by going her house digging in dirt we just don't hear it this was our real time investigative podcast who was looking at people top of the people move if one lead another you don't find him podcast so I think that he sae he started something here with the US so while I agree that he and Brian and Bo deftly killed Tara I don't believe that they did of their own volition is it possible that maybe tears ex had a hand in getting them to do it because I don't agree that as a burly gonna believe they're there for a purpose I don't think so I don't think that any of tears ex boyfriends hired kids to kill Tara is easy to look it Ryan dew or Bo Duke's and say why these kids why this dance I understand that part of it but there's more the store we just all know I said early on I came or what but it was but I said it was after reading those emails that you gave me that were between terror and Marcus Harper her ex boyfriend's mom just reading the emails that air was writing to me seem like she was in a very bad emotional state seem very vulnerable said to you I think on the podcast one time no matter what I think what this really means is that there was vulnerable at this time and I'm almost certain that her vulnerability is related to what happened to her maybe she was in a spot where shoes and go do something different or meet somebody or something else going on she didn't act like normal tear that night it was more that I think the vulnerable that to me is too ironic it's hard to fathom these kids doing that but none of the full story I don't think Ryan went over on a whim probe into how the credit card your dog did notice wearing gloves drop on the way now and then take his body and drive it to Fitz trailed in Bo's truckin no one sees anything that sounds crazy there's nothing to steal their mean nothing while that house while the know that makes a nice and she your car would be two weeks in the house and there was nothing there is it's a rental house one bedroom didn't have anything really valuable wouldn't think to the whole theft and burglary think this doesn't ring true with me with that being said do you believe the scene of the murder was at the house or do you believe it was elsewhere that's a tough one the police are alleging that occurred in the house and there's been a lot of information and misinformation about what evidence was in the house that could lead to you is ready that certain things that you found made you think that the murder occurred in their struggle a struggle occurred in there so it's still possible and less tear let Ryan than I could see that possibly happening in our house why would Ryan going to our house work or is there mean it's the tiny house I've been there couple times it is very tiny you would totally at the door going in there it's not the right place to rub it's not the place where you would get away with anything burglar as is the correct legal term burglarized at CS why these guys are here also she wanted she was I don't think she was asleep because she had blown chandelier or awe or rings on or miss and still today and I don't think she lay down on the bay and sleep with ear rings own yet I can't definitively say that it happened in the house or our orchard to me they're both still possibilities but I think it's safe to say that the winter house and just killed her or surprise or I think that either she let somebody in and then there was a struggle or she went somewhere else then something happened so without the risk of sounding like I'm defending what do you think the chances are cuz my personal belief is that the roles are reversed and that he handed out boat just got the deal basically before he talked before I'm good soul my question would be pure speculation but what if late and if you take the deal five ten years down the road we're going to hear a podcast or something about a wrongful conviction for Ryan will have crystal balls it will look into it in years in the future you know we're starting to swarm podcast that I'm hosting it comes out this Wednesday the fourteenth all your two guests all subscribe to it but that would be a good thing for sworn to do if it turns out that was wrongful conviction in this case I think it's only a truly is one of the topics that will get into with this war there's no way to in my opinion disprove what you just speculated about I don't have access to the of this obviously and the police are releasing anything I've never understood why I long for and prosecutors are not more forthcoming but in this case happens to be a court order that prevents him from doing a court order that nobody involved in the case ever objected to have had to be the media got involved to sue basically cost original gag order was that if there was a trial will be in a closed courtroom and you know if I'm a defense attorney got a client charged with a crown and the judge has ordered that says we're going to try him in secret to raise holy hell about that and I'm going to oppose the gag order and you don't have to wait on the Atlanta Journal Constitution everybody else and can send their lawyers down there to find that it can be modified I don't want my client prosecuted in a closed courtroom so as to some many things about this that are odd and I've got a lot of reasons for the opinions that hold and I haven't shared all my opinions maybe I will at some point is can be very interesting to see what happens erm did you guys ever think for a sec and that tariff ran away I did and it just doesn't happen and I had an X for early on tell me that doesn't happen he couldn't think of one instance really a woman had ran away for ten plus years and was just living a good life over here it's clearly a theory can't rule all the way now but is it makes sense why would tear through all this mess because she was upset about something and make it look like she was there and staged this whole thing and then commit suicide something everyone I talk to her friends they told me that Tara would scream from the rooftops for an tell you how she felt she wasn't the kind of person everyone would know that's why I was weird that she was in their pots and other financial stuff Security number had been used all these years do you think that we will ever really find out the truth of what happened that night yes I do I didn't at first without a doubt there is more the story in USA that is that more people knew about this is because of them that Terri's parents are tears mother who passed away never knew happen to our daughter some people wants the look of the podcasts in a negative way and be like you would come all these people and they have real and that's true it's a very sensitive subject I always think about what I say before say it but at what point does somebody come in here and shake things up and not be afraid to say something that to me
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