Ways We Learn

Sometimes there’s a fine line between “disruptive innovation” and “copyright violation.” Today’s guest pushed pretty hard on that line. Ariel Diaz is a serial entrepreneur who has co-founded companies in video education, B2B SaaS, and Health and Wellness. But he joined us to discuss his digital textbook company, Boundless Learning, which was at the center of a firestorm about copyright in the early 2010s. Boundless Learning built a business that undercut the college textbook market by providing open source equivalents at much lower prices. They were sued by three major textbook publishers in a case that had the potential to reshape the interpretation of US copyright law through a court decision. The publishers’ side of this story is widely available online and we recommend reading those links in the episode notes to round out your opinion of what happened. Our purpose at Ways We Learn is not to present Ariel’s view as fact, or to choose sides. But today you get a very special Ways We Learn, Legal Edition: Boundless’ CEO, Ariel Diaz, shares his side of the story. Contents: 04:35 The Genesis of Boundless Learning 07:04 Building the First Prototype 10:19 Challenges and Reactions 13:04 Marketing Strategy and Legal Issues 24:40 The Lawsuit 27:43 Copyright and Trademark Disputes 30:37 Settlement 37:50 Evolution 42:56 Acquisition 44:23 Legacy and Impact on the Textbook Market Links and further reading: Ariel’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arieldiaz/ Chart of textbook prices: https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/chart-of-the-day-or-century-5/ Links and further reading: Ariel’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arieldiaz/ Chart of textbook prices: https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/chart-of-the-day-or-century-5/ The complaint: https://www.insidehighered.com/sites/default/files/files/boundlesslearninglawsuit.pdf Motion to dismiss: https://casetext.com/case/pearson-educ-inc-v-boundless-learning-inc Docket report: https://dockets.justia.com/docket/new-york/nysdce/1:2012cv01986/393501 Publishers Sue As Boundless Learning Grabs $8M (TechCrunch): https://techcrunch.com/2012/04/05/publishers-sue-as-boundless-nabs-8m/ 4 Thoughts About Boundless, Publishers, and the Lawsuit (Inside Higher Ed): https://www.insidehighered.com/blogs/technology-and-learning/4-thoughts-about-boundless-publishers-and-lawsuit

I've spent years in the field of ed tech. Along the way, I became disappointed by a lot of what I saw. There has been way too much “shiny new object syndrome,” and way too little of the actual learning transformation that it promised. Starting with blackboards, then whiteboards, then radio, then film strips, then TV, then calculators, then computers, then many other EdTech things – they all promise transformative learning, but they don't always deliver. So my question: is AI going to be different? Thankfully, Steve Midgley and Whitney Whealdon have some answers! Steve is the Founder and Managing Director of Learning Tapestry, and Whitney is the Director of Learning Innovation. Steve served as the Deputy Director of Educational Technology for Arne Duncan at the U. S. Department of Education and the Director of Education at the FCC. Whitney has worked in education for over 20 years, including 10 years at the Louisiana Department of Education, and led the creation of the ELA Guidebooks, which is an English language arts curriculum used in over 80 percent of Louisiana districts and other states nationwide. Both of these folks really know education, and they’re perfect guests for my big question today: how do the affordances of AI lead to truly transformative learning? Contents: 01:00 The Evolution and Challenges of EdTech 02:23 Learning Tapestry’s Purpose 03:43 Steve's Background and Vision 04:47 Whitney's Perspective on EdTech 10:46 AI's Potential in Education 21:08 AI in the Classroom 39:23 Academic Integrity 41:05 Practical AI for Teachers 43:52 AI as a Collaborative Partner 53:40 Quality Assurance in AI-Driven Learning 59:43 Ethical Considerations Links and further reading: Learning Tapestry: https://www.learningtapestry.com Steve’s bio: https://www.learningtapestry.com/steve-midgley.html Whitney’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/whealdon/ And here’s the knowledge-building app they described! (Remember the frog > lily lad > chlorophyll example?) Wonderwood is an infinite digital encyclopedia and interactive learning app for children ages 3-8 to build their knowledge of the world: ⁠https://wonderwood.me/⁠ And here's the quote Steve referenced, with his intro: Here's a quote that is old but, for me at least, informs where our expectations need to shift to in the age of AI. The movement from computational to concept-based math is parallel to a movement from expressive to concept-based ELA - and the skills below reflect what I think are valuable to students regardless of how much support they get from AI in their schooling. "At school you are engaged not so much in acquiring knowledge as in making mental efforts under criticism... You go to a great school not so much for knowledge as for arts and habits; for the habit of attention, for the art of expression, for the art of assuming at a moment's notice a new intellectual position, for the art of entering quickly into another person's thoughts, for the habit of submitting to censure and refutation, for the art of indicating assent or dissent in graduated terms, for the habit of regarding minute points of accuracy, for the art of working out what is possible in a given time, for taste, for discrimination, for mental courage, and for mental soberness." - William Johnson Cory, 19th Century Headmaster at Eton

Think about your experience with education. What was that experience like? For many of us, organized learning was sort of like a factory. A bunch of students along for the ride, not necessarily wanting to be there, but ingesting a lot of information that was handed down by a teacher, and waiting for a big scary test at the end. Now think about a time you've played a game. You may have found the game more enjoyable than some of your learning experiences. You’re more active in a game. You get quick feedback in a game. A game is really meant to be fun, even in that big scary test at the end. Seth Trudeau is someone who thinks education can and should be more like games. He is the founder and managing director of Routine Chaos, where he works with companies to build transformative products through deep product discovery and rigorous product development. He's built games, simulations, and applications for learners from primary school up through postgraduate studies. We sat down to discuss the potential benefits of gamification in education from classics like “Oregon Trail” to modern games like “Minecraft,” and the importance of creating engaging, skill-building environments in games. We talked about Pokemon tournaments and how such community-driven, game-based learning can be applied to educational contexts. And we looked at project-based and self-directed learning, and how teachers can foster meaningful motivation and interest in students. Contents: 00:58 Games vs. Traditional Learning 02:45 The Evolution of Gamification 09:09 Challenges in Educational Gaming 11:27 Effective Educational Games Today 13:48 The Value of Games in Learning 20:18 Gamification in Professional Training 24:17 Leveraging LLMs for Scenario-Based Learning 27:42 The Pokemon Company and Education 36:36 Mixed-Age Communities and No Age-Based Hierarchies 37:07 The Pokemon Tournament Experience 40:36 Rethinking Traditional Education Hierarchies 42:43 The Role of Critical Thinking in Education 53:45 Conceptual Exposure in Math Education 58:11 Project-Based and Interest-Driven Learning 01:04:26 Advice for Traditional Classrooms Links and Further Reading: Seth’s writing on gamification: https://routinechaos.substack.com/p/what-if-the-pokemon-company-took More of Seth’s thoughts: https://routinechaos.substack.com/p/a-bit-more-on-gamification Marc LeBlanc's 8 kinds of fun: http://algorithmancy.8kindsoffun.com Jesse Schell's Art of Game Design: https://schellgames.com/art-of-game-design The Importance of Play: https://www.routine-chaos.com/introducing-pursuit-of-play/

It’s the day before Election Day. We’ve got two challenges for you: Vote Talk Quick but important episode today. Links and further reading: https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/2074791/2147483647/strip/true/crop/1200x800+0+0/resize/840x560!/format/webp/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F94%2Fa2%2F652b525841fc9355463860f2bf49%2F080622.op.dnt.covertoon2.jpg

We covered AI as early as the second episode of this show. It’s so central to the education landscape today and it's something that all of us are really interested in just personally and professionally. So we were very excited when our friend Rob Cobb reached out to us about the work he's doing and how he's thinking about AI and education these days. We all worked professionally with Rob back at Flatiron school. Joe hired him as an instructor there, he was a member of my team of instructor trainers, and he was on Brian’s Curriculum Design team as well. We also know him as a great thinker and practitioner about education as well as a superstar programmer and a software developer. Plus Rob has worked for more than a decade in high tech education, including a stint at one of Brian's startups, Schoolhouse. Rob thinks deeply about building software and building educational experiences, which is just awesome, and he recently co-founded Kibo School, an affordable online bachelor's degree in computer science for students in Africa. We got to talk with Rob about his work at Kibo School, how the reality of AI influenced his curricular design, and how the educational landscape should adjust to the changes inherent in AI. Contents: 02:27 Rob's Journey in Computer Science 06:12 Founding Kibo School 10:41 Challenges and Innovations 16:37 Exploring AI and Cognitive Science 26:24 Designing Curriculum with Surprising Situations 27:08 Creating Purposeful Surprises in Education 28:28 The Role of AI in Curriculum Content 30:41 AI as a Writing Assistant: Impacts on Thought 33:13 Empowering Students with AI Tools 39:16 Integrating AI into Program Design at Kibo 48:12 Balancing Accreditation and Affordability 51:10 Connecting Education with the Job Market Links and further reading: Kibo School: https://kibo.school/ Rob’s Blog: https://rob.co.bb/ Play in Predictive Minds (summary) https://rob.co.bb/posts/2022-07-08-review-play-in-predictive-minds-a-cognitive-theory-of-play/