DiscoverPeople Behind the Science Podcast Stories from Scientists about Science, Life, Research, and Science Careers
People Behind the Science Podcast Stories from Scientists about Science, Life, Research, and Science Careers
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People Behind the Science Podcast Stories from Scientists about Science, Life, Research, and Science Careers

Author: Dr. Marie McNeely, featuring top scientists speaking about their life and c

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Are you searching for great stories to ignite your curiosity, teach you to perform better in life and career, inspire your mind, and make you laugh along the way? In this science podcast, Dr. Marie McNeely introduces you to the brilliant researchers behind the latest scientific discoveries. Join us as they share their greatest failures, most staggering successes, candid career advice, and what drives them forward in life and science.

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Greetings science fans!

We're elated to welcome you to People Behind the Science where we explore the lives and experiences of the people behind the research and scientific discoveries of today.

People Behind the Science's mission is to inspire current and future scientists, share the different paths to a successful career in science, educate the general population on what scientists do, and show the human side of science.

In each episode, a different scientist will guide us through their journey by sharing their successes, failures, and passions. We are excited to introduce you to these inspiring academic and industry experts from all fields of science to give you a variety of perspectives on the life and path of a scientist.

Our esteemed guests will tell you:

what motivates them and how they balance their competing responsibilities
how they worked through some of the most challenging times in their careers
advice to help you through your own journey through life and science


Our Podcast

People Behind the Science is a podcast focused on the people doing fascinating research through interviews with top scientists. We are proud to have interviewed so many inspiring scientists, including U.S. National Academy scientists like Josh Sanes, Nick Spitzer, Lou Muglia, Jacob Israelachvili, Gene Robinson, Larry Squire, John Dowling, James Berger, and David Spergel, as well as popular scientists in the media like Donna Nelson (science advisor for the TV show Breaking Bad) and Jack Horner (science advisor for the Jurassic park movies). We are honored to have shared their amazing stories with people in all 50 states in the USA and in over 120 countries across the world.
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Dr. Donovan German is Associate Professor of Ecology & Evolutionary Biology in the School of Biological Sciences at the University of California, Irvine. Donovan aims to better understand how materials move through the gut, which enzymes are secreted during digestion, what microbes are present, and what role these microbes play. In particular, Donovan focuses his research on animals with unusual diets, such as fish that eat wood or algae, to understand how these foods are digested and how animals can survive on these lower quality foods. Beyond his interests in science, Donovan loves sports and music. He played football through college, and he now enjoys coaching his kids' baseball and soccer teams. Donovan played bass in a band during college, and he also plays the guitar and drums. Donovan received his B.A. in Marine Science from the University of San Diego, his M.S. In Biology from California State University in Fullerton, and his Ph.D. in Zoology from the University of Florida. Afterwards, he conducted postdoctoral research at UC, Irvine before joining the faculty there in 2011. Donovan's awards and honors include receipt of the UC President's Postdoctoral Fellowship, the UCI School of Biological Sciences Dean's Award for Postdoctoral Excellence, and the UCI School of Biological Sciences Chancellor's Award for Excellence in Fostering Undergraduate Research. In our interview Donovan shares more about his life and science.
Dr. Trudy G. Oliver is a Professor in the Department of Pharmacology & Cancer Biology as well as a Duke Science and Technology Scholar at Duke University. Trudy's research focuses on small cell lung cancer, a disease known for its remarkable ability to "shape-shift" or undergo cellular plasticity. This adaptability allows cancer cells to change types and develop different therapeutic vulnerabilities (or invulnerabilities), making treatment especially challenging and preventing the development of a one-size-fits-all approach. When she's not in the lab, Trudy unwinds with walks, jogs, music, and true-crime podcasts. She also enjoys spending quality time with friends, family, and her two energetic orange kittens named Basal and Tuft after her favorite lung cell types. She received her Bachelor's degree in chemistry from Oklahoma Baptist University, and her PhD in cancer biology from Duke University. Afterwards, she conducted postdoctoral research at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, and subsequently at MIT. Trudy served on the faculty at the University of Utah for more than a decade before joining the faculty at Duke University where she is today. She has received numerous awards and honors for her work, including the Heine H. Hansen Lectureship Award for Small Cell Lung Cancer from the IASLC World Lung Conference, the William C. Rippe Award for Distinguished Research in Lung Cancer from the Lung Cancer Research Foundation, the Lung Cancer Discovery Award from the American Lung Association, the American Cancer Society Research Scholar Award, the Damon Runyon-Rachleff Innovation Award, and the Jimmy V Scholar Award from the V Foundation for Cancer Research. In this interview, Trudy shares more about her life and science.
Dr. Ian Winship is an Associate Professor and a former Alberta Innovates Health Solutions Scholar in the Department of Psychiatry at the University of Alberta. He is also Director of the Neurochemical Research Unit there. Ian is interested in understanding how we can reduce the damage early after a stroke and ways we can improve recovery in people who had a stroke a long time ago. His research also examines changes in the brain that lead to symptoms in other brain disorders like schizophrenia. Much of Ian's free time is spent on or near the ice rink. He coaches his son's hockey team and his daughter's ringette team, as well as playing on his own recreational hockey team. In the summer, Ian enjoys being outside, traveling, visiting the mountains, and relaxing at the beach. Ian received his bachelor's and doctoral degrees in Psychology from the University of Alberta. Afterwards, he conducted postdoctoral research at the University of British Columbia before returning to the University of Alberta to join the faculty. In this interview Ian shares more about his life and science.
Dr. Ana Spalding is Assistant Professor of Marine and Coastal Policy and Affiliate Faculty at the Pacific Marine Energy Center at Oregon State University. She is also a Research Associate at the Smithsonian Tropical Research Institute (STRI) in Panama as well as at the Coiba Research Station in Panama. As a social scientist who works in marine and coastal policy, Ana's research is focused on the intersections of people, the environment, and policies. She is interested in understanding people's perceptions of the ocean and coast, policy and management frameworks surrounding resource use in these areas, and the major cares, concerns, and conflicts that people have related to coastal areas. Outside of work, Ana has been having an amazing time participating in the Corvallis Rowing Club. She used to row in college, and it has been fun to get back into the sport with people from a variety of ages and backgrounds. Ana received her B.A. in Economics and International Studies from the University of Richmond, her M.A. in Marine Affairs and Policy from the Rosenstiel School of Marine and Atmospheric Science at the University of Miami, and her Ph.D. in Environmental Studies from the University of California, Santa Cruz. Afterwards, Ana conducted postdoctoral research at the STRI in Panama before joining the faculty at Oregon State University.
Dr. Chin-Cheng "Scotty" Yang is an Assistant Professor in the Department of Entomology at Virginia Tech. Scotty's research focuses on ants. He's interested in understanding their fascinating biology and how they respond to pathogens, as well as finding better ways to control ant infestations and invasive ant populations. When he's not working, Scotty spends most of his free time with his two kids, and he especially enjoys playing and coaching basketball. He's a passionate fan who even adopted the name of his basketball hero, Scottie Pippen. He received his BS, MS, and PhD degrees in entomology from National Taiwan University. Scotty served as a Visiting Scientist at the Center for Medical, Agricultural and Veterinary Entomology (CMAVE) within the US Department of Agriculture's Agricultural Research Service. He then conducted postdoctoral research in the Biodiversity Research Center at Academia Sinica in Taiwan. Scotty served as a faculty member at National Taiwan University, Kyoto University in Japan, and National Chung Hsing University in Taiwan before joining the faculty at Virginia Tech where he is today. In our interview, Scotty shares more about his life and science.
Dr. Jonathan Payne is a Professor and Chair of Geological Sciences at Stanford University. He also holds a courtesy appointment in Biology, is a Member of Stanford's interdisciplinary biosciences institute Bio-X, and is an Affiliate of the Stanford Woods Institute for the Environment. Jonathan studies the history of life on Earth. He is interested in the interactions between the changes in earth's environments and the evolution of life on Earth. In particular, Jonathan focuses on large extinction events like asteroid impacts and volcanic eruptions, and how these impacted life in the oceans. When not working, Jonathan is often going to sporting events, traveling, and playing Nerf basketball in his house with his wife and two kids. He also enjoys hiking and working out at the gym. Jonathan received his B.A. in Geosciences from Williams College. Afterwards, he worked as a high school math and science teacher in Switzerland for two years before returning to graduate school. Jonathan was awarded his Ph.D. in Earth and Planetary Sciences from Harvard University, and he conducted postdoctoral research at Pennsylvania State University before joining the faculty at Stanford. Jonathan has received many awards and honors for his work, including the Stanford University Medal for excellence in advising undergraduate research, the Charles Schuchert Award from the Paleontological Society, and a CAREER Award from the National Science Foundation. He has also been named a Fellow of the Geological Society of America as well as a Fellow of the Paleontological Society. In this podcast interview, Jonathan spoke with us about his experiences in life and science.
Dr. Kathryn (Katie) Whitehead is an Assistant Professor in Chemical Engineering at Carnegie Mellon University where she also holds a courtesy appointment in Biomedical Engineering. Katie received her bachelor's degree in chemical engineering from the University of Delaware and her PhD in chemical engineering from the University of California, Santa Barbara. Afterwards, she conducted postdoctoral research in the Koch Institute for Integrative Cancer Research at MIT. Katie has received numerous awards and honors, including the DARPA Young Faculty Award, the DARPA Director's Fellowship, the Controlled Release Society Capsugel/Pfizer Oral Drug Delivery Award, the Diabetes Technology Society Peterson Research Award, a UC Graduate Research and Education in Adaptive Biotechnology Fellowship, an NIH Ruth Kirschstein National Research Service Award Fellowship, the Kun Li Award for Excellence in Education, the Popular Science Brilliant 10 Award, and very recently the 2018 National Institutes of Health (NIH) Director's New Innovator Award. She has also been named an MIT Technology Review Innovator Under 35 and the 2016 Young Innovator Award from Cellular and Molecular Bioengineering (CMBE). In our interview, Katie speaks more about her experiences in life and science.
Dr. Heather Lench is Professor in Psychological and Brain Sciences and Senior Associate Provost for Faculty Affairs at Texas A&M University. Heather's research focuses on emotions, and how emotions affect people, their thinking, and their behavior. She is particularly interested in anger and boredom. In her free time, Heather enjoys exploring a variety of hobbies, and her favorite pastimes continue to change over time. She loves going scuba diving, painting, reading, long-distance running, and glassblowing. A few years ago, she also began to experiment with building things with power tools, including fences and stairs. She received her undergraduate degree in psychology from Florida State University, her Master's degree in Experimental Psychology and Marriage and Family Therapy from California State University, Fresno, and her PhD in Social Psychology from the University of California, Irvine. After completing her PhD, Heather joined the faculty at Texas A&M University in 2007. She has received numerous awards and honors for her work, including the American Psychological Association New Investigator Award, the Texas A&M University Faculty Merit Award, and she is a Fellow of the Association for Psychological Science, the Society of Personality and Social Psychology, and the American Psychological Association. In this interview, Heather shares more about her life and science.
Dr. Uri Tabori is a Staff Physician in the Division of Haematology/Oncology, Senior Scientist in the Genetics & Genome Biology program, and Principal Investigator of The Arthur and Sonia Labatt Brain Tumour Research Centre at The Hospital for Sick Children (SickKids). Uri is also a Professor in Paediatrics and Associate Professor in the Institute of Medical Sciences at the University of Toronto. Uri works as a physician treating kids with cancer, particularly brain tumors. Through his research, he is working to identify drugs and make new discoveries that may cure cancers or improve patients' lives. When he's not hard at work in the lab or clinic, Uri enjoys spending time with his family, watching American football, and exploring the wilderness of Canada. He is especially fond of canoeing and canoe camping with his family. He received his MD from the Hadassah School of Medicine of Hebrew University in Israel. Afterwards, he completed a Rotating Internship and his Residency in Pediatrics at the Sorasky Medical Center in Israel. Next, Uri accepted a Fellowship in Pediatric Hematology and Oncology at the Sheba Medical Center in Israel. He served as a Staff Physician in Pediatric Hematology and Oncology at The Sheba Medical Center for about a year before accepting a Research and Clinical Fellowship at The Hospital for Sick Children in Canada SickKids where he remains today. Over the course of his career, Uri has received numerous awards and honors, including the Early Researcher Award from the Ontario Ministry of Development and Innovation, the New Investigator Award from the Canadian Institute of Health Research, the Junior Physician Research Award from the University of Toronto Department of Pediatrics, The New Investigator Award from the Terry Fox Foundation, A Eureka! new investigator award from the International Course of Translational Medicine, A Merit Award from the American Society of Clinical Oncology Annual Meeting, and The Young Investigator Award from the Canadian Neuro-Oncology Society. In our interview, Uri shares more about his life, science, and clinical care.
Dr. Elaine Guevara is a Lecturer in Evolutionary Anthropology at Duke University. She teaches biology and conducts research on the evolution of primates using molecular approaches. One area of Elaine's research examines the evolution of brain aging and how brain aging differs between humans and our primate relatives, including certain species of lemurs. When it's time to relax, Elaine loves to read. She is particularly fond of Golden Age mysteries, similar modern mystery authors, investigative journalism, history, and social science content. In addition to reading, Elaine enjoys biking, being outdoors, exploring the mountains, observing wildlife, playing games, sipping wine, and hanging out with friends. She received her BA in biological anthropology from the University of California, Santa Cruz, and her MA in biological anthropology from Hunter College. During her master's program, Elaine also worked at the American Museum of Natural History as an Archives Assistant and subsequently a Database Assistant. She then received her PhD from Yale University. Afterwards, Elaine conducted postdoctoral research at The George Washington University. She joined the faculty at Duke in 2021, and she also served briefly as a faculty member at the University of North Carolina Wilmington. In our interview, Elaine shares more about her life and science.
Dr. Kristen Lynch is a Professor and Chair of Biochemistry and Biophysics at the University of Pennsylvania. Kristen's research focuses on alternative splicing. Her lab is investigating how cells decide when to use an entire portion of the DNA instruction manual versus when to exclude parts of the instructions that are not useful or would be harmful. In particular, Kristen is interested in alternative splicing in the immune system and what happens when cells are faced with an immune challenge. When she's not at work, Kristen loves being outdoors. She spends her free time kayaking, paddle boarding, biking, hiking, and doing yoga. She received her B.A. in biochemistry and her Ph.D. in biochemistry from Harvard University. Afterwards, Kristen pursued postdoctoral training at the University of California, San Francisco. She served on the faculty at the University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center prior to joining the faculty at the University of Pennsylvania in 2009. Kristen is the recipient of many awards and honors for her work, including a National Science Foundation CAREER Award. She joined us for an interview to talk about her experiences in life and science.
Dr. Nick Haddad is a Professor in Integrative Biology at Michigan State University and a Senior Terrestrial Ecologist at the W.K. Kellogg Biological Station. In addition, Nick is the author of the recently released book The Last Butterflies: A Scientist's Quest to Save a Rare and Vanishing Creature. Through his research, Nick searches for the rarest butterflies in the world and works to understand what factors cause the decline of these butterflies and what we can do to conserve them. Outside of work, Nick has been enjoying renovating his home with his wife who is a historic preservationist. Their home was built in 1840, so they have been tackling a wide variety of projects including updating the plumbing and replacing all of the electrical wiring. Nick received his BS in Biology from Stanford University, and he was awarded his PhD in Ecology from the University of Georgia. Afterwards, Nick conducted postdoctoral research at the University of Minnesota. Before joining the faculty at Michigan State, University, Nick served on the faculty at North Carolina State University for about 19 years. In our interview, Nick shares more about his life and science.
Dr. Louis L. Jacobs is Emeritus Professor in the Roy M. Huffington Department of Earth Sciences and President of the ISEM at SMU. As a vertebrate paleontologist, Louis studies the fossils of animals with backbones. His goal is to understand their evolution and how it fits together with the earth and the environment to present a holistic picture of our world. When he's not working, Louis loves to look at rocks, tend to orchids, bind books, and spend quality time with his grandchildren. They are insatiably curious and interested in everything, including rocks, fossils, and space. He received his B.S. degree from the University of Southwestern Louisiana (now the University of Louisiana at Lafayette) and his M.S. and Ph.D. degrees in Vertebrate Paleontology and Evolution from the University of Arizona. After completing his training, he worked as a research paleontologist at the Museum of Northern Arizona, a geologist for the U.S. Geological Survey, a lecturer and a research associate at the University of Arizona, Head of the Division of Paleontology at the National Museums of Kenya. He joined the faculty at SMU in 1983. During his time at SMU, Louis has held leadership positions at the Dallas Museum of Natural History as well as the Shuler Museum of Paleontology at SMU, where he ultimately served as Director for 13 years. Louis has won numerous awards and honors for his scholarship, his service, and the books he has written, including the University Scholar/Teacher of the Year Award from SMU, the Joseph T. Gregory Award for Service to the Society of Vertebrate Paleontology, The Texas Earth Science Teachers Association Lifetime Membership and Friends of TESTA Award, and many others. In addition, he is a past Fellow of the Explorers Club, Past President of the Society of Vertebrate Paleontology, and ten fossil species have been named after him. In this interview, he shares more about his life and science.
Dr. Karen Daniels is a Professor in the Department of Physics at North Carolina State University. Karen's lab investigates the physics of how materials change state (e.g. from solid to fluid), how they deform, and how they may ultimately fail. She studies these questions across a variety of length and time scales, from microscopic phenomena that occur in less than a second to shifts in land that occur on geologic timescales and may lead to landslides. Travel is a passion for Karen. While traveling, she loves hiking on mountain trails, eating delicious food, discovering new foods that she can try to make at home, reading books, knitting, and interacting with new people and places. She received her BA in physics from Dartmouth College. Karen then worked for about three years as a science teacher at Saint Ann's School in Brooklyn before enrolling in graduate school at Cornell University where she earned her PhD in physics. She then conducted postdoctoral research at Duke University before joining the faculty at NCSU in 2005. Karen has been awarded a fellowship from the Alexander von Humboldt Foundation to support a yearlong sabbatical at the Max Planck Institute for Dynamics and Self-Organization in Göttingen, Germany. In addition, Karen was the recipient of a National Science Foundation Early Career Development (CAREER) Award, the Equity for Women Award from NCSU, and the LeRoy and Elva Martin Award for Teaching Excellence. She has also been named a Fellow of the American Physical Society. In our interview, Karen shares more about her life and science.
Dr. Leif Karlstrom is an Assistant Professor in the Department of Earth Sciences at the University of Oregon. Leif uses fluid and solid mechanics approaches to better understand how water moves through glaciers and how magma moves through the Earth's crust to erupt in volcanoes. Much of his work involves developing theoretical models to better describe these processes. In addition to his career as an academic scientist, Leif is also a professional musician. He plays violin and tours nationally and internationally as a member of bluegrass and folk music groups. When he's not engaging in scientific or musical pursuits, Leif enjoys rock climbing, river rafting, and generally spending his time outdoors. He completed his undergraduate training at the University of Oregon, receiving a B.S. in Physics and Mathematics, as well as a B.M. in Violin Performance. He received his PhD in Earth and Planetary Science from the University of California, Berkeley where he was awarded the Louderback Research Award. Afterwards, Leif was the recipient of an NSF Division of Earth Sciences Postdoctoral Fellowship to conduct research at Stanford University. He joined the faculty at the University of Oregon in 2015. Leif is here with us today to talk a little about his research and tell us all about his journey through life and science.
Dr. Djuna Croon is Associate Professor in the Department of Physics and the Institute for Particle Physics Phenomenology at Durham University. Trained as a particle physicist, Djuna is interested in the most fundamental building blocks of nature. She studies dark matter, a mysterious type of subatomic particle that we don't yet know much about yet. Their work uses astrophysical measurements and particle physics experiments to better understand dark matter. Much of Djuna's free time is spent with her two young boys. They love going to playgrounds, visiting farms, and baking cookies together. She received her bachelor's degree in physics from Amsterdam University College and her master's degree in physics from Kings College London. Next, Djuna was awarded her PhD in Theoretical Particle Physics from the University of Sussex. Afterwards, Djuna conducted postdoctoral research at Dartmouth College and subsequently at the Tri-University Meson Facility (TRIUMF), Canada's particle accelerator centre. She joined the faculty at Durham University in 2021. In this interview, she shares more about her life and science.
Dr. Chris Buddle is an Associate Professor in the Department of Natural Resource Sciences and Associate Dean of Student Affairs at McGill University. He is a community ecologist who studies biodiversity of different species, and he is interested in figuring out what animals are where in our ecosystem. In particular, his work focuses on spiders, insects, and other arthropods. Chris is a bird aficionado who loves to draw birds and go birdwatching. For him, drawing is a great way to learn more about things and get a new perspective on what they look like. He also keeps busy chauffeuring his three kids to different activities, riding bikes, and spending time with his family. He received his undergraduate training in Ecology at the University of Guelph and was awarded his PhD in Ecology and Environmental science from the University of Alberta. Afterwards, Chris conducted postdoctoral research at Miami University before accepting a position at McGill where he is today. He has received a number of his awards for his exceptional teaching and research, including the Entomological Society of Canada's C. Gordon Hewitt Award for Excellence in Entomology in Canada, the MacDonald Campus Award for Teaching Excellence, and the Society for Teaching and Learning in Higher Education's Desire2Learn Teaching Innovation Award. Chris also writes great articles in his Arthropod Ecology Blog. He is here with us today to tell us all about his journey through life and science.
Dr. Beth Stroupe is a Professor in the Department of Biological Science and the Institute of Molecular Biophysics at Florida State University (FSU). She is also Director of the Molecular Biophysics Graduate Program there. Research in Beth's lab focuses on understanding what molecules and proteins look like. This is important for better understanding how these molecules work, both from a basic science perspective and with an eye towards controlling molecules for clinical applications. They use a variety of different techniques that allow them to visualize these very tiny molecules. When she's not working, Beth and her partner enjoy spending quality time with their two cats, as well as growing black-eyed peas and other vegetables in their garden, kayaking, hiking, and exploring the great outdoors. Beth completed her undergraduate training at Wake Forest University where she majored in chemistry and minored in music. She was awarded her PhD in biochemistry from the Scripps Research Institute. Afterwards, Beth conducted postdoctoral research at Brandeis University before joining the faculty at FSU where she is today. In our interview, Beth shares more about her life and science.
Dr. Zach Eilon is an Assistant Professor in the Department of Earth Science at the University of California, Santa Barbara, and he is also conducting research at Brown University. Zach is interested in understanding the earth's tectonics, including how continents are built, how they break apart, and what is going on under the earth's surface beneath the ocean floor. He wants to know how tectonic plates move and interact with each other. To study these tectonic movements, Zach uses data collected on the energy released during earthquakes. This energy picks up different signals on its way through the earth, and Zach creates computer programs to interpret those signals and produce snapshots of what is occurring inside the earth, including the types of rock that are present, their temperature, and other features. Zach spends his free time hanging out with friends, scoping out potential new houses on the internet with his wife, and running. He recently completed his first marathon and is looking forward to the next one. In addition, Zach is an enthusiastic home chef, and he loves listening to a wide array of podcasts. He hails from the United Kingdom where he completed his undergraduate and masters degrees in Natural Sciences at the University of Cambridge in the United Kingdom. Afterwards, he was awarded the Herchel Smith Scholarship to attend Harvard University for a year for a Special Studentship. Zach was next received his MPhil and PhD in Seismology from Columbia University. He recently completed his position as a Postdoctoral Research Associate at Brown University. Zach has joined us today to talk about his experiences in life and science.
Dr. Tess Russo is an Assistant Professor in the Department of Geosciences at The Pennsylvania State University. Tess is a hydrologist which means she studies water. Her research examines how water moves, how much of it there is in the world, and how the actions of humans change how water moves in the world. Tess has been spending a lot of time doing home renovations. When she's not working on her house, she likes to visit family and travel. She received her PhD in Earth and Planetary Sciences from the University of California, Santa Cruz and completed a postdoctoral fellowship at the Earth Institute at Columbia University. Her fantastic work is already getting a lot of attention. Last year, Tess was featured by the Green Sense Podcast, Scientific American, and she is a guest on an upcoming episode of Startalk Radio with the wise and wonderful Neil Degrasse Tyson. Tess is with us today to tell us all about her journey through life and science.
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Comments (4)

RYAN

you see my comment Dr?

Mar 5th
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RYAN

thanks a lot🌱🌎

Jan 17th
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RYAN

do you read comments? my comment arrive for you??

Nov 4th
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RYAN

Hello.how are you? im PEZHMAN SALEHI of IRAN(persion) ,im bachelor Genetic degree and i will be student Medical genetic (MD)next year .I love your podcast.But some voices are too sharp and annoying to hear when talking on the phone. Enhance the quality of the voices of your guests talking on the phone as well as the sound of your own voice being clearly heard.i so enjoy of your activity. and I hope you that you rich highest levels up in the world. Thanks.🌱🌎

Oct 7th
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