If You've Come This Far

Chris and Shaun sit down with Zach Gale, an elementary special education teacher and the founder of Me to We. Zach discusses his journey from a hyper-competitive sports family to finding his purpose in supporting students with behavioral needs. We explore the transition from "Me" to "We," the importance of routine for mental health, and why Zach believes your story can one day become someone else’s survival guide.Key Takeaways:Behavior as Communication: A core pillar of Zach’s teaching philosophy—understanding that every action from a child (or adult) is an attempt to communicate an underlying need.The "Me to We" Shift: Inspired by Inky Johnson, Zach explains how attaching yourself to a purpose and mission makes you "dangerous" in the best way possible.The Savage Servant: Trading the idea of being a "nice guy" for being a "good man"—someone who stands their ground and holds core values while remaining a "warrior in a garden."The Power of Routine: Why waking up at 4:00 AM and investing in self-discipline is Zach's greatest form of self-love and mental health maintenance.Episode Highlights:[00:00] Intro: Celebrating Angela Saini and the Daniel Radcliffe connection.[05:30] The Gale Household: Growing up with a father who coached for 23 years and the "Golden Year" retirement video.[13:45] The Pivot to Special Ed: How "Bartlett Baseball Buddies" changed Zach's career path just days before college.[19:20] Men in Education: The disparity of male teachers at the elementary level and the importance of male role models in schools.[25:10] Perspective in the Classroom: Having tough conversations with veteran teachers and putting personal biases aside for the students.[33:00] The Origins of Me to We: Starting with Zoom workouts during COVID and evolving into a formalized LLC and men's group.[40:15] Family & Addiction: Zach’s middle brother’s journey to sobriety and his role in the men's group today.[48:40] Imposter Syndrome & Social Media: The struggle for authenticity in a society that casts judgment.[55:20] Curiosity Over Judgment: How Ted Lasso and "perspective taking" drive connection in Zach’s workshops.[01:02:00] The Best Sports Movie Debate: Miracle vs. Facing the Giants (and the notable absence of Hoosiers).Connect with Zach Gale:Organization: Me to WeLinkedIn: Zach GaleThanks to our sponsor, Mental. Mental is a wellness app built specifically for men, offering a sanctuary from "toxic positivity" and generic advice. It provides personalized, affordable, and science-backed support through real-life coaching designed to help you navigate life's messiest challenges. If you've been thinking about doing something for your mental health, visit https://app.getmental.com/subscribe to get started.If you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify—it helps more people find these important conversations!

In this episode, we sit down with author, activist, and education policy expert Justin Cohen to explore the evolving role of fatherhood in the 21st century. Justin shares his personal journey from growing up in a household steeped in education advocacy to launching Dads for All, a movement designed to engage fathers in both community building and "bite-sized" civic action. We dive into the "low bar" of current fatherhood expectations, the lack of dedicated "dad spaces" in the advocacy world, and how to build a movement that prioritizes authentic connection over corporate metrics. Finally, Justin reflects on the importance of "staying in the pocket" when tackling long-term social struggles.Key Topics:The "Expert" Paradox: Why Shaun and Chris believe the most important conversations happen when "non-experts" stay curious and dive into deep issues.Education in the Water: Justin reflects on growing up with a special ed teacher mother and a global policy expert grandfather, and how their warnings shaped his career.The Dads for All Movement: Moving beyond the "nonprofit industrial complex" to build a movement that focuses on "belonging-adjacent activation."Bridging the Policy Gap: How to get dads involved in systemic issues like childcare affordability and paternity leave without making them feel like they’re joining a "mom space."Movement vs. Nonprofit: Justin explains why he pivoted away from raising money for a "job" to focus on building a sustainable base of engaged fathers.The 2030 Landscape: A look at how issues like AI-driven unemployment and the cost of childcare are the next frontiers for organized fatherhood.Notable Quotes:"Men in my generation are doing 3x the childcare their dads did... but my statistician friend calls that a 'low bar easily cleared.'""We’re not building a nonprofit; we’re building a movement. If this ends up looking like a nonprofit because that’s what I’m comfortable with, I will have failed.""Stay in the pocket. Once you get out of the pocket, you can’t get back in."Resources Mentioned:Dads for All: https://dadsforall.com/Justin’s Book on School Improvement: https://www.amazon.com/Change-Agents-Transforming-Schools-Ground/dp/1071875787Thanks to our sponsor, Mental. Mental is a wellness app built specifically for men, offering a sanctuary from "toxic positivity" and generic advice. It provides personalized, affordable, and science-backed support through real-life coaching designed to help you navigate life's messiest challenges. If you've been thinking about doing something for your mental health, visit https://app.getmental.com/subscribe to get started.If you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify—it helps more people find these important conversations!

In this episode, we sit down with author and activist Jonathan Mooney to explore the myth of "normalcy." Jonathan shares his personal journey navigating the education system with ADHD and dyslexia and discusses the powerful influence of the people who championed his differences. We also delve into the dark history of eugenics and its lingering impact on society's perception of disability. Finally, Jonathan introduces the Divergent Impact Fund, a new initiative aimed at supporting neurodivergent innovators.Key Topics:Redefining Normal: Why the concept of a "normal" person is a harmful abstraction and how we can move toward a more inclusive design for society.The Power of Support: Jonathan reflects on how his mother and a transformative third-grade teacher, Mr. R, helped him see his challenges as strengths.The Dark History of Eugenics: A look at the US Eugenics movement and its shocking influence on global policies, including those in Nazi Germany.The Divergent Impact Fund: Jonathan’s mission to support innovators solving real-world problems for the neurodivergent community.Parenting and Technology: Navigating the unique challenges of raising children in a hyper-connected, digital world.Notable Quotes:"The only normal people are people you don't know very well.""Our design principle for our world should be the reality of human difference, not the myth of the normal human."Resources Mentioned:Jonathan's website: https://www.jonathanmooney.com/Jonathan's books: Normal Sucks, The Short Bus, and Learning Outside the Lines.The Divergent Impact Fund: divergentimpactfund.comThanks to our sponsor, Mental. Mental is a wellness app built specifically for men, offering a sanctuary from "toxic positivity" and generic advice. It provides personalized, affordable, and science-backed support through real-life coaching designed to help you navigate life's messiest challenges. If you've been thinking about doing something for your mental health, visit https://app.getmental.com/subscribe to get started.

Chris and Shaun welcome Sean Harvey, an advisor, consultant, author, and ordained interfaith minister. Sean has dedicated his life to helping men in hyper-masculine systems--ranging from Wall Street to police departments and the military--reconnect with their humanity. The trio discusses Sean's journey growing up as a gay man in Southwest Ohio, his transition from a high-stakes Wall Street consultant to an interfaith minister, and how to find common ground with those on the opposite end of the ideological spectrum. Sean explains the "Masculinity Imprint" on our organizations and how the term "Warrior" can help men embrace compassion.Notable Quotes"Compassionate Warrior is an identity that you can claim. Warrior Compassion is an energy within that men, when they’re courageous enough, can access." — Sean Harvey"I am never going to tell you what you should be as a man. I’m never going to tell you that you need to embrace healthy masculinity...I’m going to talk about some of the realities on the journey." — Sean Harvey"When we humanize and give officers more capacity, it actually makes them stronger. It’s not about softening; it's about strengthening." — Sean HarveyResources MentionedSean’s Org and Book: Warrior Compassion: Unleashing the Healing Power of MenMenLiving Website: menliving.orgHere’s the bluegrass song detailing the devastating 1974 tornado that struck Xenia, Ohio: Oh! What a StormThanks to our sponsor, Mental. Mental is a wellness app built specifically for men, offering a sanctuary from "toxic positivity" and generic advice. It provides personalized, affordable, and science-backed support through real-life coaching designed to help you navigate life's messiest challenges. If you've been thinking about doing something for your mental health, visit https://app.getmental.com/subscribe to get started.

In this episode, Shaun and Chris interview Janice McCabe, a sociologist from Dartmouth College and author of "Making, Keeping, and Losing Friends." They discuss making friends in college, the importance of propinquity and homophily, tight knitters, compartmentalizers, and samplers, friendship markets, the Dunbar number, her recommendation for students, parents and colleges, men and women as friends, the importance of intention in making friends and more.Get your copy of Janice's book hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, the guys talk with acclaimed photographer, Stacy Waldman Bass, about her memoir, Lightkeeper. They explore Stacy's draw to photography, the value of stories and photos to keeping memories alive, the tragic accident that changed her life, what it's like to write a memoir, the therapeutic value of writing, the challenges of balancing grief and joy, and more.Get your copy of Lightkeeper hereCheck out Stacy's work hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Chris and Shaun talk with Jim Maley, teacher and founder of the Maley Way. The guys discuss Jim's struggles with depression, his time as a Northwestern hoop player, enrolling at Holy Cross, screening selfishly, his mom's genius, his dad's brilliance, his wife's love, his role as a "depression agent," speaking to kids about mental health and more.Learn more about Jim and the Maley Way hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

Join Chris and Shaun as they chat with Pete Davis, writer, film maker, and civic advocate about his book, Dedicated: The Case for Commitment in An Age of Infinite Browsing and his documentary, "Join or Die." The guys cover the influence his mom and dad had on him, growing up in Falls Church, making a life in Baltimore, why he decided not to be a lawyer, the importance of community participation, the power of invitation, the challenge of connecting in our technological times, the need for good leaders in the effort to revive civic engagement, and more.Learn more about Pete and his missions https://petedavis.orgWatch Join or Die https://joinordiefilm.comGet a copy of Dedicated hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Shaun and Chris talk with Kaitlyn Tierney, co-founder and CEO of Diverting Hate, an applied research nonprofit disrupting digital radicalization of boys and men through the use of evidence, empathy, and innovation. The guys talk with Kaitlyn about the challenges of running a non-profit, the value of partnerships, dealing with threats, moving to an island, ICE, the definition of rich, the power of social media, and more.Learn more about Diverting Hate hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Chris and Shaun talk with Blayne Smith, co-founder of Applied Leadership Partners. The guys discuss Blayne's decision to go to West Point, his time there, and his time as a Special Operations Forces member. They also discuss golf, rucking, parenting, applied leadership, PTSD, perseverance (His book with co-author and business partner, Brandon Young, is Perseverance is Greater than Endurance), his time at Team RWB, and supporting the "Veteran Check In" initiative at the George W. Bush Institute, which provides free mental health resources for veterans and their families, and more.Learn more about Blayne and Applied Leadership Partners hereGet Rucking at GORUCK hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In the 17th episode of the season, Chris and Shaun interview Matt Candler, educator, inventor, investor, and coach. The guys discuss the state of education, mad libs, parenting, park bench pitches, Matt's sweet garage, electrification, the intersection of joy and curiosity, fossil fuels and renewables, kindness, and more.Learn more about Matt here

In this episode, Chris and Shaun interview Bill Burke, founder of the Optimism Institute. The guys discuss Bill's relationship with Ted Turner and his early career at Turner Broadcasting, his time leading the Weather Channel and his life in minor league baseball as owner of the Portland Sea Dogs. They discuss the importance and power of optimism, The Paradox of Modern Optimism (Burke's forthcoming book), the difficulty to remain optimistic in part to the constant negativity and "doom scrolling" fueled by social media, and more.Learn more about the Optimism Institute hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Chris and Shaun interview John Moe, a writer, longtime radio host, and creator of two mental health podcasts, "The Hilarious World of Depression" and "Depresh Mode with John Moe." The guys talk about the importance of hope and resilience, comeback stories, the need for open discussions about mental health and the impact of humor and empathy in addressing these issues, Patton Oswalt, the significance of community support in mental health advocacy, and more.Learn more about John hereListen to Depresh Mode with John Moe hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, the guys interview Jon Macaskill, former Navy SEAL and co-host of the "Men Talking Mindfulness" podcast. After doing a quick opening meditation, they discuss Jon's growing up in Louisiana, great coaches, Jon's choice to go into the military, his journey from enlisting in the Navy to becoming a SEAL, his struggles with PTSD and subsequent recovery through mindfulness. the creation of his podcast with Will Schneider and more.Learn more about Jon hereListent to Men Talking Mindfulness hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Chris and Shaun interview Dr. Eli Joubert, a psychosexual therapist from Leeds, UK. They discuss Eli's work on human sexuality and the concept of "sexy facts." , growing up in South Africa, transitioning from a career in fine art to psychology, and focusing on masculinity and sexuality. Eli highlights the need for open conversations about sex and sexuality, emphasizing the importance of understanding individual experiences and normalizing behaviors. Dr. Joubert shares his idea of a platform where people can anonymously share their sexual practices and preferences, aiming to provide accessible, public data on human sexuality. He believes this could lead to healthier relationships and reduce shame around sexualityLearn more about Eli hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

in this episode, Chris and Shaun talk with Sam Pressler, founder of the non-profit, the Armed Services Arts Partnership (ASAP) and his new project, Connective Tissue. The guys discuss entrepreneurship, grandmothers, flourishing, professionalism, veterans, humor as a connection mechanism and more!Learn more about Sam and his projects hereFollow the Connective Tissue Substack hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

The guys chat with Chris MacLellan, also known as "Father Mac," founder of the Whole Care Network and Aging Gayfully. They discuss Chris' journey from professional bowling to caregiving, his experiences caring for his partner, Richard, who passed away from cancer in 2014. Chris highlights the challenges faced by same-sex couples in healthcare. He also talks about his work building the Whole Care Network, his screenplay based on his experiences, his time in the seminary (twice), his bowling career, and more!Learn more about Chris and the Whole Care Network here.Tap into Aging Gayfully hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

Chris and Shaun talk with Chris' friend, Trish Tierney, co-founder of WAKE, Women's Alliance for Knowledge Exchange. The gang discusses Notre Dame, rowing, kids, Trish's development of WAKE, lessons in travel, matchmaking women in tech with nonprofits around the world, WAKE's aims to scale its US program while exploring new countries for its international efforts, WAKE success stories, men's involvement in the program and more.Learn more about Trish and WAKE hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Chris and Shaun interview Joe Gidjunis, creator of the PBS documentary series "Grown Up Dad," which explores modern fatherhood. Joe's pilot episode, featuring a trip to Australia, received over 100,000 viewers. Upcoming episodes will cover topics like screen time challenges, evolving masculinity, and media literacy. Joe emphasizes the importance of intentionality and presence in parenting. He also discusses the challenges of balancing fatherhood with work and the impact of social media on children. Joe's personal journey includes finding role models in cartoons and addressing his own father's absence. The series aims to support and educate parents.Check out the show hereLearn more about Joe and Grown Up Dad hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF

In this episode, Shaun and Chris welcomes Dr. Daniel Ellenberg, a psychologist, former president of Division 51 of the American Psychological Association, and founder of the Men and Boys Compassion Coalition. The guys discuss compassion, pain and suffering, New Jersey, Strong Boys with Heart, growing up Daniel, the negative perception of compassion in men, Daniel's coming book, "Strength with Heart," with Fred Rabinowitz, and much moreLearn more about Daniel hereLearn about the Men and Boys Compassion Coalition hereGet Mental at 20% discount: http://getmental.com/IYCTF