Work For Humans
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© 2025 Work For Humans
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Too often business leaders are forced to choose between the needs of their company and the needs of their employees. It’s a lose/lose scenario leaving managers burned out and workers seeking other opportunities. At Work for Humans, we believe work can be designed differently. When you design work like products people love, your company wins. Work becomes irresistible, employees passionately buy into their roles every day, and your company takes measurable strides towards your vision.
176 Episodes
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When playwright Matthew Gasda credited ChatGPT and Claude in the program for his play Doomers, it sparked a debate about whether machines belong in the creative process. The play wasn’t written by AI. It used AI as a dramaturg, a kind of philosophical collaborator, and that simple credit forced audiences to confront what it means to create alongside a machine. In this episode, Dart talks to Matt and Isobel about AI as dramaturg, the creative tension between human and machine, and how the sour...
Surveys and numbers can capture averages, but they can’t reveal the raw humanity of lived experience. Stories can. Stories connect us, capture nuance and emotion, and uncover the “why” behind our choices in ways numbers never will. In this episode, Dart and James Warren talk about why stories reveal truths surveys miss, how personal narratives can be transformed into meaningful change, and how organizations can flip the script to see their people more fully. James Warren founded Share More S...
Leaders today are under pressure from every direction: an unpredictable economy, the rise of AI, and the constant demand for transformation while keeping the business running. Few people see those challenges more clearly than Michael Smith. He argues that leaders make the greatest impact when they act as architects of transformation rather than playing defense. In this episode, Mike and Dart discuss what happens when HR is seen only as a cost and how CEOs and CFOs can unlock the real value of...
One line in Martin Buber’s I and Thou stopped Jim Ferrell in his tracks. It made him realize that leadership isn’t inside the individual — it lives in the space between us. That insight became his new book, You and We: A Relational Rethinking of Work, Life, and Leadership. In it, Jim argues that progress doesn’t come from sameness, but from uniting across difference. In this episode, Jim and Dart discuss the four laws of relation, why relation is not the same as relationships, and how leaders...
For years, Dart doubted that companies could actually make skills the building blocks of work. They felt too abstract, too static, too disconnected from real daily work. But Sandra Loughlin proved that in some cases, skills can deliver real value. In this episode, Sandra explains why skills only matter in context, why stretch assignments drive real learning, and what it takes to build a true learning organization at scale. Dr. Sandra Loughlin is Chief Learning Scientist at EPAM Systems. She ...
The germ theory of disease is one of the greatest breakthroughs in human history. But it took more than 2,000 years of false starts and resistance before medicine finally recognized that germs cause disease. In his book Germ Theory, Dr. Robert Gaynes unpacks why this shift was so hard to achieve. In this episode, he and Dart explore what it teaches us about paradigm shifts today: why new ideas face such resistance, how the personalities of innovators influence acceptance, and what happens whe...
Emily Yang’s work sits at the intersection of AI ethics, governance, and human experience. She is an early advocate for bringing human-centered design and responsible innovation into the heart of enterprise AI, especially in HR and talent functions. For her, ethics is an activity — something we do, not just something we believe. In this episode, Dart and Emily talk about why AI feels both helpful and destabilizing, how bias and invisible harms emerge, and what it takes to preserve human agenc...
When we think about fixing burnout, most conversations start with purpose, work design, or leadership. But according to Jennifer Moss, the real starting point is hope. And not vague optimism, but cognitive hope—a measurable skill that gives people the power to set goals, find ways to reach them, and keep moving forward, even in uncertain times. In this episode, Dart and Jennifer discuss the link between hope and purpose, the warning signs of hopelessness at work, and what leaders can do to bu...
Sam Arbesman writes deep, beautiful books about the boundary between technology, knowledge, and wonder. His most recent book, The Magic of Code, is another profound exploration—this time into the wonders revealed by code. Sam describes code as “a universal force—swirling through disciplines, absorbing ideas, and connecting worlds.” In this episode, Dart and Sam talk about the experience of coding: what makes it great, when it feels arduous or magical, and how AI could change the experience. ...
Bree Groff’s new book, Today Was Fun, pushes the reset button on expectations about work. There is no reason work can’t be fun. About half of the things that make it un-fun are self-inflicted—we can just stop doing them. Take off the serious-people costume. Stop all performative work. Take a nap that is for you, not just to recharge for more work. Stop suppressing emotions. Have fun with work friends, and keep work in its place—a good part of life, but not your whole life. Bree Groff is a for...
Sandra Waddock has spent decades exploring the systems beneath the systems, asking questions about purpose, story, and the deeper operating logic of business. Sandra argues that the current model focused on growth, control, and short-term profit is no longer serving people or the planet. Instead of fixing surface-level symptoms, she invites us to reimagine the foundational assumptions business is built on. In this episode, Dart and Sandra talk about the myths that drive our current system, ...
As one of the world’s leading experts on customer centricity, Peter Fader noticed that many businesses were making a critical mistake: they were treating all customers the same. Peter argues that customer centricity means focusing on the customers who matter most—those who are truly driving value for your company. His work is reshaping how businesses think about growth, loyalty, and strategy. In this episode, Dart and Peter talk about why not all customers are created equal, how to measure t...
Ashley Whillans has spent years studying how time, money, and workplace culture shape our well-being. As a behavioral scientist at Harvard Business School, she’s found that time poverty is more than a personal stressor—it’s a leadership challenge, an organizational blind spot, and one of the biggest barriers to well-being at work. In this episode, Dart and Ashley talk about why traditional perks miss the point, why more control over your time can matter more than a raise, and what it looks l...
Stephanie Reuss and Victoria Stuart noticed that companies were making big decisions about jobs, teams, and strategy without really knowing what people were doing. So they built Beamible, a platform that maps work at the task level. It helps organizations see what is working, what is slowing people down, and what actually creates value for the business. In this episode, Dart, Steph, and Vic talk about why visibility is the first step to meaningful change, how AI is transforming job design, an...
Most of us don’t realize how much fear shapes how we live and show up at work. But Amon Woulfe sees it clearly. As the founder of 432Hz, he has spent over a decade helping leaders understand the deeper fears that silently drive behavior, limit growth, and erode connection. In this episode, Dart and Amon explore how fear shapes leadership, why change agents often burn out, and what it takes to shift from protection to presence. They also discuss the limits of personality tests, the illusion of...
1Michael Cholbi approaches work not just as a function of economics or management but as a deep philosophical question. He brings a rare lens to the topic, one that connects ancient wisdom, contemporary ethics, and the day-to-day experience of workers today. In this episode, Michael and Dart explore how work shapes us and how it might be reimagined to serve us better. From Plato and Marx to Bullshit Jobs, dignity to autonomy, they ask what makes work just, and whether companies are morally res...
Anthea Roberts began her career in international law. But after years of studying global conflict and power, she realized the real problem wasn’t policy—it was perspective. People weren’t just disagreeing on solutions; they weren’t even seeing the same problems. This realization led Anthea to develop "Dragonfly Thinking," a framework designed to help individuals and organizations view challenges through multiple lenses. She is now creating AI tools to apply this methodology to real-world deci...
Lisa Kay Solomon sees design everywhere—not just in products, but in conversations, strategies, systems, and futures. As a futurist and strategist, she has spent her career helping leaders and organizations think long-term, navigate uncertainty, and drive meaningful change through intentional design. In this episode, Lisa and Dart talk about how to lead with imagination in uncertain times, why good strategy needs emotional engagement, and how design can be a form of applied hope. They a...
Nubank is the largest digital bank outside of Asia and one of the fastest-growing companies globally, recently surpassing 119 million customers across Brazil, Mexico, and Colombia. Much of that growth has been fueled by an obsessive focus on customer experience. Now, Suzana Kubric and Jessica Matsumoto are bringing that same mindset to employees. In this episode, Dart talks with Suzana and Jessica about what it means to design HR as a product, why Nubank brought in PMs and designers from othe...
If work is a product, and employees are customers of that product, then every company is a multi-sided business, one that must serve both consumers and workers. According to platform economist Andrei Hagiu, how companies design that experience, how they structure control, pricing, and participation, matters more than we realize. He has spent his career studying the world’s most influential platforms, from Uber and Airbnb to Apple and Amazon. In this episode, Dart and Andrei explore what platf...
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