Claim OwnershipLeadership Conversations @ The Kitchen Table
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© Berlin Maza 2022
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Captain Berlin Maza & Deputy Fire Chief Bill Mack sit down with leaders in all professions and industries from across the country to have leadership conversations at the firehouse kitchen table!
Leaders share their stories, philosophies and perspectives on leadership. They talk about their non-negotiable behaviors, actions and traits, as well as offer action items for newer employees, emerging leaders, and senior members of organizations to grow as leaders!
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A powerful conversation with Mike Dugan, a 27-year veteran of the FDNY and retired Captain of Ladder Company 123, whose fire service journey spans nearly five decades. A recipient of the prestigious FDIC International Tommy Brennan Lifetime Achievement Award, Mike brings unmatched perspective on what leadership truly looks like—both in the firehouse and on the fireground. In this episode, he challenges the traditional mindset with a simple but impactful truth: everyone is a leader. From promoting yourself and investing in others, to the often-overlooked skill of truly listening, Mike delivers candid insights that resonate across all ranks. He also tackles the critical conversation around mental health in the fire service, reinforcing that seeking help isn’t weakness—it’s survival. Because sometimes, talking to someone can save your marriage, your career, and even your life.
Chuck DeSmith, a retired Deputy Fire Chief with 35 years of service at Renton Regional Fire Authority in Washington draws from decades of leadership experience sharing his passion for peer support and the importance of modeling resiliency within the fire service. He challenges today’s leaders to move beyond treating peer support as a program, and instead embed it into the organization’s operating budget with clear policy and long-term commitment. This conversation offers practical insight into building a culture that truly supports the people behind the badge.
With more than 40 years in the American Fire Service, Paul Conway’s journey—from firefighter to assistant chief of the Milwaukee Fire Department—is a masterclass in leadership earned the hard way. Throughout his career, he served at every level of the organization—operational, tactical, and strategic—leading emergency response, managing complex resources, and overseeing multidisciplinary teams with a steady hand and a servant’s heart. But what makes Paul’s story powerful isn’t just the titles; it’s the lessons learned from a life full of mistakes, growth, and reflection. In 1985, he founded Conway Shield with a vision to become the nation’s leading provider of protective gear, safety equipment, and training—proof that leadership doesn’t retire, it evolves. In this episode, we talk about what it really means to “be where your feet are,” to enjoy the view even in the chaos, and to remember that in the fire service, you don’t have to do this job—you get to.
Retired Seattle Fire Department Captain and 2008 FDIC International keynote speaker Mike Gagliano brings decades of fireground leadership and life-earned wisdom to the show. As president of the Firefighter Air Coalition and co-author of Air Management for the Fire Service and Challenges of the Firefighter Marriage, he shares a powerful message for today’s firefighters: expect challenges, don’t quit, and remember—no one is stopping you from becoming the best firefighter you ever wanted to be. Lead with gratitude, stay disciplined, and don’t forget to have fun along the way.
Captain Tyrall Quinn, author of The Calling: The Unseen Work of Leading Well, joins the podcast to share a powerful story of service, departure, and return. After stepping away from the fire service following 20 years on the job, Quinn reflects on what it meant to be welcomed back by his department and how that experience reshaped his understanding of leadership. The conversation explores humility, confidence, accountability, and mental wellness—both on and off the fireground—while honoring the legacy of those who paved the way. As Quinn reminds us, “If I have seen further [than others], it is by standing on the shoulders of giants,” a truth that underscores the importance of remembering those who came before us as we lead, grow, and serve.
Fire Chief Randy Chevalier of Timber Mesa Fire and Medical District shares hard-earned lessons on leading through crisis and challenge. Having guided his department through three firefighter line-of-duty deaths, Chief Chevalier discusses the importance of building a solid support team inside and outside the organization, understanding that no leader can do everything alone. He emphasizes navigating crisis with a focus on mental health, and the necessity for leaders to give themselves grace while extending grace to others.
Lieutenant Ash Shapiro of Hartford Fire Department talks getting the job done, especially if no one else is. Take the job seriously but don't take yourself too seriously. A good leader keeps their eyes open and watches people. They must get to know the people they lead and have a little fun. There will always be a few bad apples, but leaders must learn their strengths and weaknesses too. It's ok to knock someone down, as long as you build them back up!
Deputy Chief Ryan Power of the Spokane County Fire in Washington talks about the lost art in the fire service, "The Human Factors of Communication." Chief dives into the 4 C's of Communication: 1) Connection, 2) Choice, 3) Competency, 4) Consistency. Chief also dives into the different styles of communicators: 1) Social, 2) Direct, 3) Empathetic, 4) Logical. Effective communication is a cornerstone to effective leadership and the best leaders can transition between the different styles seamlessly. Chief Power emphasizes that communication and emotional intelligence are tactical skills and they should be practiced like anything else, and that you can't lead people effectively if you don't understand people.
Fire Chief Sionna Stallings-Ala'ilima of the Tacoma Fire Department talks Family & Servant Leadership! Be purposeful on how you show up every day in whatever role you are in, because pessimism and optimism are both contagious! Every leaders holds a certain amount of power. The most influential of leaders have the power of respect and are experts at their job. Remember that people will follow you if they respect you and if you are really good at your job.
Deputy Chief/Senior Tour Commander Leigh Shapiro (ret.) of the Hartford (CT) Fire Department and author of the book An Insiders Guide to Mentoring the Fire Officer talks Mentorship & Coaching and Succession Planning. Chief discusses the difference between being "prepared" vs being "ready" to step up into the "next" role. Chief also talks the importance of organizational skills, administrative skills, emotional maturity and communication skills in strong fire officers and leaders. Regarding training, education and experience: Money spent on your education, books and certifications is money well spent. Embrace, own and learn experiences, because their is no substitute for experience.
Fire Chief Adrien Sheppard of the Redmond Fire Department dives deep into Succession Planning & Strategy. He stresses the importance of talent acquisition, cultural fluency and providing for fail safe environments for growth and development of your people to take place. Succession planning is not about an individual or a person, it's about the organization. Don't be afraid to think differently, and show vulnerability. Remember, "Don't take things personal!"
Retired Battalion Chief Jerry Wells of the Lewisville, Texas Fire Department discusses how the Fire Service is the Ultimate Team Sport! He stresses the importance of "Being Here Now," whether you are busy training, working out, or playing video games , make sure your mind, body and soul are all in! Every shift, every firefighter should be doing something for your 1) Mind, 2) Body, and your 3) Rigs. Everything in the fire service and in life, "starts with me."
Fire Chief Jake Rhoades of the City of Buckeye Fire-Medical-Rescue Department in Arizona unpacks leading people through change. Leaders must always be leaning in: Be students of the profession, learn the job above you and teach the job below you. Build your networks early. Be intentional with the relationships you build and the time you invest with those relationships.
Deputy Chief Nicholas Papa of the New Britain (CT) Fire Department focuses on Service above Self. Nick is a Fire Engineering best-selling author of the book Coordinating Ventilation: Supporting Extinguishment and Survivability. In one of his courses he teaches the concept of: “There are no bad fire companies, only bad company officers," a spin from Jocko Wilink's "There are no bad teams, only bad leaders." Chief Papa is a subject matter expert in ventilation, as he emphasizes the 3 C's of coordination, paralleling leadership traits: 1) Communication, 2) Control, 3) Competency.
Fire Chief Mark Niemeyer of the Boise Fire Department discusses Succession Planning & Culture. Understand that your leadership path does not have to be traditional. Winning breeds winning and losing breeds losing. Train your people so well that they can go anywhere, but treat them so well they won't. A fire chief's #1 job is to 1) Layout the vision, #2) motivate your people and #3) Support them. All FF's should find themselves smiling more than you complain!
Deputy Chief Shane Smith of Twin Falls, Idaho talks leading through adversity and how everything starts with humility. Strong leaders have the ability to reflect, have a servant's mindset, as well as practice mindfulness. Shane also dives into the importance of fire service instructors investing all 100% into the students, not wasting their time, and giving them what they paid for.
Battalion Chief Tim Rogers (ret.) of Charlotte Fire Dept. & Senior Master Sergeant of the Air Force Greg Elmore (ret.) dive deep into the topic of how "Leadership is your job no matter what your job is." It is never too early to start learning leadership. Leaders have got to start building a culture of learning and a culture of leadership. Don't let the business get in the way of leadership!
Fire Chief Brian Fennessy of Orange County Fire Authority discusses the Mission Drive Culture, the Orange County Fire Way and Leader's Intent. The chief emphasizes that leadership is a journey, and that investing in leadership development matters. Even when organizations don't or can't, individuals must invest in themselves. Authenticity and empathy are critical traits in leadership!
Retired Deputy Chief of Seattle Fire Department Phil Jose discusses Curiosity as a required leadership trait. "Replace judgement with curiosity!" Chief Jose teaches internationally on the Art of Reading Smoke, Tactical Decision-making, and Instructional Craftsmanship: Building your Expertise and Ability at the Front of the Room. Leaders must learn the art of teaching to be effective. Leaders must fulfill their oath by using all of their resources around them to deliver the best service possible.
Battalion Chief Nathan Travis of Little Rock Fire Department in Arkansas talks Unexpected Leadership. Leadership means serving everybody. Leaders should know the role above them and step up and take on roles even if you don't want them. Chief Travis suggests to grow, you should feel like 1) you don't belong in the room, 2) you aren't the smartest in the room and 3) you are uncomfortable. Those 3 things will help you grow in your career faster than you imagined . Not everyone is about the wins. Failures speak louder than your achievements. Server everyone and respect everyone!
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