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Data Over Dogma
Data Over Dogma
Author: Daniel McClellan and Daniel Beecher
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© 2023
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This ain't your pastor's Bible podcast. This is a deep interrogation of the book, and we're bringing receipts. Bible scholar Dr. Dan McClellan and atheist podcaster Dan Beecher team up to discover what the Bible actually says, what it decidedly doesn't say (even if everyone thinks it does), and explore the history of the most popular book of all time.
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Most people who talk about the Bible are pretty sure they know what it is they're talking about. But do they? Do you? How sure are you that when you say "the Bible" you're talking about the same thing as the person next to you?
Today, we're diving into the surprisingly broad category of books that all bear the name "Bible". We'll explore who believes which canon, and why certain texts made certain cuts, while others were excluded. You'll never look at your Bible the same!
Then... Woof. When Trump's Department of Homeland Security decides to quote Jesus in a recruitment video, you KNOW we're going to talk about it! And when they quote the Beatitudes? Something is seriously out of whack. Maybe DHS is taking on a new role, really trying to promote peace? But let's face it: probably not.
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This week, it's a double-feature! Two totally different topics, both coming from the same chapter in Acts. So open your Bibles to Acts chapter 7, and let's dive in.
First, we're looking at a fascinating little twist of linguistics that gives us insight into who the author of acts was. Or more accurately, who he wasn't. It's a mystery that can only be puzzled out by comparing ancient versions of the Hebrew Bible in semitic languages (Hebrew or Aramaic) and the septuagint in Greek. What does all this tell us about who wrote this book? And was that author present for the events he's describing?
Then, we're looking to the heavens, and divining what we can about biblical astrology. But we're not the first to do it. A bunch of creators online have been using lines from Acts 7 as an antisemitic bludgeon, and we're going to look at their claim.
What is "the tent of Moloch"? Who is the god Rephan? And what does any of this have to do with the star of David???
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This week we're serving up two of the most charming authors you'll ever meet! Listeners may recognize the brilliant Aaron Higashi from past episodes, but this time he's bringing along the brilliant Jennifer Garcia Bashaw. Together they are the authors of the new book Serving Up Scripture: How to Interpret the Bible for Yourself and Others.
We've talked many times on Data Over Dogma about the fact that, regardless of what people often say, the Bible doesn't mean anything on it's own. In order to find meaning, you must interpret it. In their book, Bashaw and Higashi give practical advice for how to do that interpretation consciously and effectively, and how to spot less useful or even harmful interpretations.
Find their book wherever you get your best reading material, or just click this link:
https://www.broadleafbooks.com/store/product/9798889835561/Serving-Up-Scripture
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Did you know that there is a sin so awful, so egregious, so outrageous that even God would not be able to forgive it? If you answered yes, then we're sorry. That probably means you've been needlessly traumatized.
But before we get to that, we're going to introduce you to a book you've almost certainly never heard of. It's a book that didn't make it into the modern biblical canon, but very well could have. And if it had, WHOO DADDY! Things would be different today.
This is the Acts of Paul and Thecla, which is the story of a woman so devoted to her faith that she throws herself into a lightning pond full of killer seals. And if you want that sentence to make sense, and get even more awesome than that, you really need to hear this story.
Then, it's time for the Dans to get unforgivable. The Bible talks a lot about forgiveness, and the ways one might be forgiven. Sacrifice of an animal, repentance, baptism, grace... all of these are ways that one could be forgiven of their sins. But there's one sin that is specifically called out as being beyond forgiveness. Which is terrifying!
So what is it, really? Is it actually unforgivable? Have you committed this sin??? (Spoiler: no, you haven't)
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This week we're talking about showing off your love for God, and whether that might not be a such great idea. And our example of not mentioning God comes straight from the Bible??
First, we're looking at the book of Esther. It's a story with all the twists and turns of a Disney animated movie (complete with cartoon villain), and about as much plausibility. It's a wild ride, and by the end someone's going to be killed on a fifty-cubit pole. But something important is missing...
Then, should Christians proclaim their religiosity boldly and loudly out into the world, or should they keep it to themselves? Are big public displays effective means of spreading the gospel, or are they just a way to signal piety, while annoying everyone around you? Maybe that's the point?
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Jesus fulfilled the law! It says so right there in Matthew. But what on earth does that actually mean? Different people have had vastly different interpretations of that idea, and the consequences of their ideas are significant! Are the old laws still in effect, or did Jesus abolish them? Should we throw away Leviticus? Should we stop eating shellfish? What does it mean???
Then, since we talked about Deuteronomy rules of war last week, we're going to take another look. We mentioned the Assyrian vassalage treaties, but only scratched the surface of that lunacy! What do the laws of God have to do with the terms forced on conquered territories by tyrannical rulers? Did God copy from the notes of Assyrian rulers? Is this connection valid or a stretch? And who is S. R. Haddon?
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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What do you know about baptism? Why do Christians do it? Where does it come from?
This week, we're exploring the most important baptism of all: that of Jesus. It's clearly a pivotal moment in the narrative of the life of Jesus, but it also presents some pretty important theological problems. And if it's so important, why do the gospels seem to disagree about how it went down?
Then, it's the rules of war! Deuteronomy 20 presents some pretty specific rules about how the Israelites are supposed to conduct themselves when they go up against other groups, and WOOF! Let's just say that it's definitely no Geneva Convention!
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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John the Baptizer was a fascinating character. More attested to historically than Jesus, John was a genuinely big deal! One of the historically attested facts about John was his execution by Herod. Which Herod? You're going to be sorry you asked.
But John's death is fascinating- what do the gospels say about it? Do they agree with each other about how/why it happened (what a world that would be!)? And do the gospel accounts line up with other extra-biblical tellings of the story?
Then, we're talking pastors. What, exactly, is a pastor? Who gets to be one (only men?)? We're going to dive into the New Testament clergy org-chart, and figure out what the Bible actually says.
Pastor, apostle, bishop, deacon... does the Bible tell us what these positions are? Who is supposed to do what? Who qualifies for which position? Who gets to tell who what to do?
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Get some sunglasses, because this week we're shining bright like a diamond! That's right, we're diving into all the glowy sparkle that is the transfiguration of Jesus. What is that story really about? What happened on that hill? And why does everyone drag Peter for offering to set up tents? He was just brainstorming! No stupid questions, right?
Then, gather 5,000 of your best friends and let's have a pot-luck. We're talking loaves, we're talking fishes, and we're comparing not two, not three, but ALL FOUR GOSPELS! It's a miracle!
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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It was a setup, I tell ya!
This week, we're focusing on "the fall," and the two poor suckers who were set up to take that fall. First, we're going through the story of Adam, Eve, the tree and the snake, and parsing out exactly what did and didn't happen in Eden. Who lied and who told the truth? Who knew what and when did they know it? Who, if anybody, actually committed a sin?
Then, speaking of sin, we're going to get original. What is the doctrine of "original sin"? Is it in the Bible? Where did it come from, and should we be worried about it, or can we all just relax?
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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The birth of Jesus is obviously one of the most important Christian narratives. Or is it two of the most important Christian Narratives? Either way, one of the great apologetic claims about nativity is that it fulfilled over three hundred prophesies. This week, we're going to look at what Ken Ham's Answers in Genesis says about some of those prophesies, and see if those claims hold up.
Then it's roll-play time. Dan B will do his best to take the place of online apologists who challenge Dan M's claims. Will McClellan actually answer their complaints, or will this be an exercise in straw-manning their arguments? You be the judge!
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Tucker Carlson and Jeremiah Johnston don't know what they're talking about when it comes to history. Johnston recently went on Tucker's show (he still has a show- weird, right?), and claimed, among many other things, that Jesus and his crucifixion are better attested by the evidence than Julius Caesar. It's an odd apologetic, but is it possibly true?
Then we'll discuss the immaculate conception, which everybody thinks they understand, but only half of them are right. But even if you correctly understand what that phrase is referring to, is it Biblical?
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Have you ordered Dan McClellan's New York Times bestselling book The Bible Says So yet???
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Look out! 'Cause this week we're looking at a controversial issue, and perhaps strangely for us, the impetus for this has nothing to do with Mormonism. No, recently a Missouri pastor named Rich Tidwell made waves in Christian circles by claiming that the Bible--yes, even the New Testament--is pro polygamy. And, really putting his matrimony where his mouth is, he has the wives to prove it.
So is the Bible as positive about plural marriage as Tidwell claims? And if so, does that mean that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints should reclaim their highly decried practice?
Then we'll move on to one of the Bible's most prolific polygamists: Solomon. Or rather, his son Rehoboam. If Solomon was wise (and really... was he?), Rehoboam was rash, impetuous and authoritarian. The apple fell far from Solomon's tiny little tree. But what is this story really about?
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Remember when Jesus told the poor to get off their butts and pull themselves up by their bootstraps? I don't either, but lots of people think they remember when Paul said it.
This week, we're looking at 2 Thessalonians, 3:10. It's one of those passages that, if someone's bringing it up, you know you're about to hear something wild. It's the bit about anyone unwilling to work shall not eat. Which sounds straightforward (if cold-hearted) enough. But does it actually mean what right-wing congresspeople want to claim it means?
Then, we're looking at a group of people that might offer some powerful insight into truth claims of the Hebrew Bible. The Hyksos were semitic rulers in ancient Egypt. Could that mean that the Exodus actually happened? Or could it provide evidence of Joseph and his fancy rainbow outerwear?
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Its Jubilee time- and what are we celebrating? A no-longer-canonical book, I guess. Jubilees is a Second Temple rewrite of Genesis that reshapes creation stories, adds angelic narration, and updates the calendar to aaaaaalmost get the number of days in the year right.
Then we tackle the viral claim that the Bible has 63,779 perfect cross-references. Does it prove divine authorship? Maybe! Ok, no. But we still have a lot of fun breaking it down. We look at how these “links” are created, where the argument collapses, and why the attractiveness of a chart doesn't mean it's actually useful.
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Catholics don't read the Bible! Or at least, according to studies most don't read it in their homes. But according to our guest, Michael Peppard, that doesn't mean that they don't have a deep and meaningful relationship with it.
This week, we're talking with Dr Peppard about his book How Catholics Encounter the Bible". It's a fascinating look at the world of Catholicism: the culture, the theology, and specifically the ways in which Catholic people learn and understand the teachings of the Bible.
In a world where Christian sects often put high emphasis on dissecting each passage of the Bible, it's refreshing to talk about coming to the book with a bit more ease. A lighter touch.
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Dominion! Do men have it over their wives? This week we're looking at Ephesians 5 where it very clearly says that wives should be subject to their husbands as to the Lord. OR DOES IT?!?
We're going deep into Doc McClellan's linguistic grab-bag to parse out what it actually says. Because ancient Greek is tricky, and doesn't operate the way modern English does.
Then, it's ANCIENT ALIENS!!! Were people in antiquity visited by extra terrestrials? Are the gods and angels written about in the Bible actually aliens from another planet? Pop some corn and break out your faraday cage, because the conspiracy theories are flying fast and furious, and the History Channel might be coming for us!
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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Giving you good biblical data is our cross to bear, but what that cross looks like and what it symbolizes is a question! We're all very aware of the traditional crucifix or cross as a symbol of Christianity, but how did the thing that killed Jesus come to represent his followers? And why? And is it possible that Jesus didn't die on a cross at all (that's what Jehova's Witnesses believe)?
Then, we're looking at "the way of the spirit," and no, that's not a self-help book by a hippie mystic. It's Ecclesiastes 11:5, and even if it seems innocent at first, trust us: it's a puzzler! It's difficult nature is VERY evident when you look at how different translators have rendered it, but considering it has possible implications for views about when a soul enters the body, it's an important one to look at.
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Have you ordered Dan McClellan's New York Times bestselling book The Bible Says So yet???
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Ooooh... this week's show is keeping it SPICY!
First we're going to tackle what might at first feel like one of the least controversial of the Ten Commandments. But if you've listened to this show, you know that's almost never the case. So when the Bible says "thou shalt not commit adultery," what is it really getting at?
Then we dive into the book of Hosea, which comes out swinging, and only gets weirder. What does it mean that God tells Hosea to take a wife of prostitution? And why would God want that? Is there really a context in which that makes sense?
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For early access to an ad-free version of every episode of Data Over Dogma, exclusive content, and the opportunity to support our work, please consider becoming a monthly patron at:
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The antichrist is coming! According to Peter Thiel, anyway. But who or what he thinks the antichrist actually is seems a little fuzzy. Well, this week on the Data Over Dogma show, we're looking at Thiel's odd take on the end times to see if it stacks up with what's in the Bible.
Then, we're looking at the star of David. Where did it come from? How did it come to be the symbol of Judaism? And are the conspiracy theories online about it based in truth, or just more silly antisemitism?
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This episode is very important. maybe not the most important one. But it's very very important.
Not to mention these oppressors are the ultimate alien considering they're not the original natives.
What a great interview! I'm definitely buying her book, love her.
I call it Xitter (x pronounced like sh)
Harper College, not Harvard. Briefly.
The one with (or without) foreskin. 😃😃😃
"There's nothing wrong with making money off housing" are you sure about that?
if only the eagle & flag crew scrutinized anything Trump says/does half as much as they do the truth
Anyone who tells you they have an objective, facts only outlook on theology is selling something. These guys are no different. If you're interested in a "scholarly", atheistic, critical, cynical, antisemitic, and anti-christian take on Judeo-Christian "mythology," this is for you. They do bring some true and interesting linguistic and archeological context, but know they will frame it in the most cynical and demeaning way possible, and much of it is highly interpolated bull crap.
ADHD kicked in. brain came back to attention when it heard Metallica's "And Justice For All" mentioned. Now I'm unsure if it's also in the Bible. I'll just tell people it is anyway.
oof. First episode I listen to gets cut off at the end, and I'm told to pay to hear the end. Not a great start.
don't do this to me. I don't want your suggestions.
Maybe, maybe, Mery was tall.