Claim OwnershipZach Abramowitz is Legally Disrupted
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My name is Zach Abramowitz and I am Legally Disrupted. Once a conventional law professional, I ventured into startup territory, and now through my consulting firm, Killer Whale Strategies, I guide law firms, legal departments, and strategic acquirers to capitalize on disruptive legal trends. Want to stay current on how all of this is impacting the legal profession? I’ve got you covered. By spotlighting key players, identifying significant trends, and showcasing innovative companies, I provide a concise, engaging view of the legal shake-up and I try my best to make it fun!
45 Episodes
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Zach sits down with NetDocuments Chief Product Officer Dan Hauck to unpack how AI is truly being used inside law firms and in-house legal teams today - from large-scale document profiling to agentic assistants that search, summarize, and edit directly within the DMS. Recorded live at ND Inspire conference, Dan explains why lightweight models are unlocking new automation, how in-house teams are often leading on adoption, and why the real ROI of legal AI goes beyond efficiency to include better onboarding, less isolation, and more confident decision-making for lawyers at every level.
In This Episode
The biggest changes Dan has witnessed after 8 years of the Inspire conference
How firms are using AI at scale — not just on pilot use cases
Why automated document profiling is now possible across millions of docs
Understanding small models vs. large models in legal workflows
How AI pipelines classify, extract, and enrich metadata instantly
New use cases emerging inside the DMS (repapering, diligence, discovery, onboarding)
Why in-house teams are often ahead of firms in AI adoption
How agentic AI assistants reduce loneliness and cognitive overload
The ROI debate: real numbers vs. intangible benefits
What lawyers gain: better focus, faster context loading, and stronger client service
Why this moment feels like a once-in-a-generation shift in legal technology
Learn More:
Zach - legallydisrupted.com
Dan - https://www.netdocuments.com/company/our-people/dan-hauck/
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Dan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/danhauck
Zach talks with Jen Berrent, former WeWork executive and founder of Covenant, an AI-first law firm reimagining how deals get done. They dive deep into what it means to build a law firm from the ground up around artificial intelligence — not as a tool, but as the foundation. Jen shares her perspective on why too much work still runs through Big Law, how AI is transforming the middle tier of legal work, and what it takes to balance human expertise with machine efficiency.
In this episode:
What an “AI-first” law firm actually looks like
How Covenant is redesigning legal workflows from scratch
The problem with Big Law’s “too much work, too few alternatives” model
Why reading comprehension is AI’s legal superpower
Building client trust in the age of automation
How AI can accelerate deals — without sacrificing rigor
The difference between a “relationship ramp” and a “SaaS snowball”
The challenges (and advantages) of raising funding in legal AI
Lessons from Robin AI’s struggles — and why clarity of business model matters
Why this is a once-in-a-generation moment for lawyers who want to innovate
Learn More:
Zach – legallydisrupted.com
Jen – https://covenant.co/about
Follow Along:
Zach – linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Jen – https://www.linkedin.com/in/jenniferberrent
Zach sits down with Harvey cofounder Gabe Pereyra to talk about what changed after “Attention Is All You Need,” why partners - not juniors - are driving Harvey’s adoption, and how AI is teaching law firms to learn faster than ever.
In this episode:
The origin story of Harvey and how it became the “Dallas Cowboys of Legal Tech”
Lessons from the early days of AI at Google Brain and DeepMind
Why the real opportunity isn’t automation — it’s amplification
How top law firms are already using AI for high-level strategic work
The emerging hybrid model of AI + human legal reasoning
Why firm size and structure could shift dramatically in the next decade
Rethinking ROI: morale, retention, and client trust as key performance drivers
How Harvey is helping firms pitch, collaborate, and win new business
The future of AI-first law firms — from pricing models to client partnerships
Learn More:
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Gabe - https://www.harvey.ai/blog/author/gabe-pereyra
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Gabe - https://www.linkedin.com/in/gabepereyra
Zach and Richard delve into the recent challenges faced by Robin AI, a pioneering legal tech company that has laid off staff and is seeking a buyer due to disappointing growth. They explore the significance of this news within the broader AI and legal tech industry, discussing whether Robin AI's struggles signal larger issues in the AI market.
In this episode:
Robin AI's Struggles
Personal Connections and Reflections
Speculations and Broader Implications
Comparing AI Legal Tech Companies
Legal Experts in Tech Companies
Investment in AI-Driven Legal Services
The Importance of Expertise with AI
Legal Innovators London Event Preview
The Future of AI in Law Firms
Learn More:
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Richard - tromansconsulting.com, artificiallawyer.com
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Richard - linkedin.com/in/artificiallawyer, https://x.com/ArtificialLawya
In Episode 30 of 'Legally Disrupted,' Zach engages in a thought-provoking discussion with Catherine Kemnitz, Axiom's Chief Strategy Officer. They address a LinkedIn debate on how AI will disrupt both Contract Lifecycle Management (CLM) and Alternative Legal Service Providers (ALSPs). Katherine offers insights from her extensive legal industry experience, including her tenure at Axiom and Thomson Reuters, highlighting major transactions and strategic pivots influenced by technological advancements.
In this episode:
Catherine Kemnitz's Career Journey
Axiom's Strategic Moves and Innovations
The Impact of AI on Legal Services
Generative AI and Legal Tech Evolution
AI Adoption in Legal Departments vs. Law Firms
Axiom's Approach to AI and Future Outlook
Learn More:
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Catherine - https://www.axiomlaw.com/about-us/our-team
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Catherine - https://www.linkedin.com/in/catherinekemnitz
Zach sits down with Centari founder Kevin Walker to unpack the opportunities and obstacles of selling AI to law firms when it isn’t a generalized assistant like ChatGPT or Harvey. Kevin makes the case for why tackling highly specialized problems, such as Deal Intelligence, delivers unique, lasting value to firms.
In this episode:
Understanding Centari's Vision
Unique Market Insights and Adoption
Challenges and Opportunities in Legal Tech
Building Trust with Law Firms
Future of Legal Practices
Fried Frank Partnership
Navigating Market Noise
First Principles and Differentiation
AI Adoption in Law Firms
Reddit Thread Controversy
Building a Strong Company Culture
Learn More:
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Kevin - https://www.centari.com/about-us
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Kevn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kpwalker1, https://x.com/_kevinwalker?lang=en
Zach and Richard break down AI-first legal services, ALSPs, and the EUDIA announcement. Asking who really owns legal AI, whether ROI even matters, and how these new firms might rewrite the rules of the industry.
In this episode:
Non-Lawyer Ownership of Law Firms
AI in Transactional Work
The Business Model of AI-First Law Firms
Measurable ROI in Legal Tech
The IKEA Catalog Scenario
AI-First Firms vs. Incumbents
Market Saturation and Future Predictions
References:
https://www.artificiallawyer.com/2025/09/03/eudia-opens-ai-augmented-law-firm-for-ma/
Learn More:
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Richard - tromansconsulting.com, artificiallawyer.com
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Richard - linkedin.com/in/artificiallawyer, https://x.com/ArtificialLawya
In this episode of 'Legally Disrupted,' host Zach Abramowitz introduces a new recurring segment called 'Zach and Richard's Legal AI Adventure' with Richard Tromans from Artificial Lawyer. They discuss the rapid evolution in the legal tech sphere, particularly focusing on big deals and announcements from legal AI companies like Harvey and Legora. The duo debates the impact of generative AI productivity platforms on the legal market, the notion of a 'land grab' as firms race to adopt AI, and the potential for AI to become universally adopted in legal workflows. They also touch on the pricing dynamics of legal tech and the challenges faced by legacy companies in incorporating AI.
In this episode:
Summer Surge in Legal AI Deals
Generative AI Platforms for Lawyers
Market Share and Productivity Tools
Global Legal Market and Pricing Strategies
Emerging Competitors and Market Dynamics
The Battle for Legal AI Dominance
The Future of Legal Tech Giants: Mergers and Acquisitions
The Role of Investors in Legal Tech
The Importance of Specialization in Legal Tech
The Future of AI in Legal Tech: Assistants vs. Automators
Learn More:
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Richard - tromansconsulting.com, artificiallawyer.com
Follow Along:
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Richard - linkedin.com/in/artificiallawyer, https://x.com/ArtificialLawya
In episode 26 of 'Legally Disrupted,' host Zach Abramowitz brings us a live conversation from the Legal Innovators California Conference in San Francisco. The discussion features Chris Fisher of Myriad Ventures and Jonathan Levy of Y Combinator, two prominent investors in the legal tech space. They delve into the shifts in legal tech investments from the pre-ChatGPT era to the post-ChatGPT world, the impact of AI on legal services, and the emerging talent in the field. The investors also share insights on their investment strategies, the importance of domain expertise, and their vision for the future of legal tech.
In this episode:
Investing in Legal Tech: Pre and Post ChatGPT
The Talent Surge in Legal Tech
AI's Impact on Legal Practices
Future of AI in Legal: Opportunities and Challenges
AI in Legal Apprenticeship
AI as a Junior Associate
Investment Strategies in Legal Tech
Specialized Legal Tech Solutions
VC Model and AI Startups
Evaluating Legal Tech Startups
Productizing Legal Services
Learn More:
Chris - https://www.myriadventures.com/profile/chris-fisher
Jonathan - https://www.ycombinator.com/people
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Chris - https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-fisher-111a9025
Jonathan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jon-levy-b98986b3
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
E25 - Are Lawyers Adopting AI? With David Wong and Raghu Ramanathan
In episode 25 of 'Legally Disrupted,' host Zach Abramowitz sits down with David Wong, Chief Product Officer at Thomson Reuters and Ragunath (Raghu) Ramanathan, President of Legal Professionals and Government at Thomson Reuters, to discuss the 2025 Future of Professionals Report. The conversation explores AI's increasing adoption and its impact on the legal industry.
In this episode:
Discussing the Future of Professionals Report
AI Adoption and Productivity Insights
Comparing In-House Legal Departments and Law Firms
AI Strategy and Leadership in Law Firms
Understanding the ROI in Law Firms
Time Savings and Efficiency Gains
Quality Improvements and Creative Benefits
Adoption Strategies in Small vs. Large Firms
Thomson Reuters' AI Strategy and Market Position
Domain-Specific AI vs. General AI
References:
2025 Future of Professionals Report - https://www.thomsonreuters.com/content/dam/ewp-m/documents/thomsonreuters/en/pdf/reports/future-of-professionals-report-2025.pdf
Learn More:
David - https://www.thomsonreuters.com/en/about-us/executive-team
Raghu - https://www.trust.org/people/ragunath-ramanathan/
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
David - https://ca.linkedin.com/in/dfwong
Raghu - https://www.linkedin.com/in/raghunathr
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
In this episode, Zach interviews Tara Waters, founder of TLW Consulting and former Chief Digital Officer at Ashurst, who led the firm’s rollout of Harvey. They discuss Harvey’s meteoric rise in legal AI, Tara’s firsthand experiences adopting Harvey within a global firm, and how legal teams evaluate AI tools. The conversation explores why lawyers initially gasped at Harvey’s capabilities, how expectations have matured, and what true digital transformation in law might require. Tara emphasizes that law firms should rethink their entire business model and workflows rather than just choosing a tool.
In this episode:
Early Days of Harvey
Adoption and Impact of AI in Law Firms
Challenges and Realities of AI Integration
Future of AI in Legal Industry
Law Firm Transformation and AI
Links Mentioned in this episode:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCEmiRjPEtQ
https://www.legallydisrupted.com/p/has-harvey-already-won
Follow Tara:
Website - https://www.tlw-consulting.com/
Content: https://www.innovationesq.com/
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tlwaters/
Follow Zach:
Website -https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Linkedin - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
In this episode, Zach Abramowitz is joined by Eli Amsellem, an investor at Ridge Ventures, to delve into the hot topic of investment in legal AI. They discuss the hype around billion-dollar valuations and the reality behind customer adoption and revenue sustainability. Eli shares insights from his hands-on approach, including talking to actual buyers and hosting GC therapy dinners. They debate the future of legal AI, whether horizontal AI assistants or vertical workflow automation will prevail, and examine companies like Harvey, Legora, New Code, OpenPolicy, and Legalmation. This episode offers a nuanced view on the challenges and opportunities in the legal AI space.
Discover:
Deep Dive into Legal AI Adoption
The VC Perspective on Legal AI
Challenges and Opportunities in Legal AI
The Future of Legal AI and VC Investments
Case Studies and Market Dynamics
The Role of Innovation in Legal AI
Concluding Thoughts and Upcoming Events
References:
Conversation with Paid CEO Manny Medina - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESa1TdS3dI4&t=318s
Learn More:
Eli - https://ridge.vc/eliyahou-amsellem/
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Eli - https://www.linkedin.com/in/eliyahou-amsellem-13aa2b164/
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz, https://x.com/ZachAbramowitz, https://youtube.com/@legallydisrupted?si=MGT7nW96PdM4a2ZM
In this episode, Zach delves into the evolution and impact of AI on contract management with Preston Clark and Electra Japonas.
In this episode:
AI and Contracts: A Boring Use Case
The Adoption Curve of AI in Legal
The Story of Law Insider
The Birth of One NDA
The Future of AI and Contracting
Legacy Product Overview
AI Capabilities and New SKU
User Growth and Market Excitement
Product Distribution and Democratization
Customer Focus and Data Utilization
CLM Market Insights and Future
Learn More:
Electra - https://www.onenda.org/about
Preston - https://www.lawinsider.com/resources/contributors/preston-clark
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Electra - https://uk.linkedin.com/in/electra-japonas
Preston - https://www.linkedin.com/in/prestonjclark
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
This episode of Zach Abramowitz is Legally Disrupted features a conversation with lawyer and technologist Carolyn Elefant about whether legal specific tools and legacy software will be able to keep up with general applications like ChatGPT.
In this episode:
The Rapid Evolution of AI in Law
The Future of AI in Legal Practice
Exploring AI Tools for Lawyers
Legal Research and AI Integration
The Impact of AI on Legal Research
The Future of Legaltech and AI
Learn More:
Carolyn - https://lawofficesofcarolynelefant.com/
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Carolyn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/carolynelefant/
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
In this episode, Zach and Charlie delve into the rapid advancements in AI, particularly in the legal tech sector. The discussion transitions to the increasing caliber of entrepreneurs in legal tech and the acceleration of innovation in the field. They reflect on the evolution of legal AI from 2015 to 2023, noting the shift from mere ideas to full-blown products. The conversation also explores the potential for AI to reshape traditional legal processes, improve efficiency, and alter the way legal professionals approach their work, concluding with an optimistic outlook on the future of legal tech.
In this episode:
The Rise of Legal Tech Entrepreneurs
AI's Impact on Legal Tech
Challenges and Opportunities in AI Adoption
The Evolution of Contract Lifecycle Management (CLM)
Applying Machine Learning in Legal Tech
Generative AI vs. Automation
AI as a Legal Assistant
Training Lawyers with AI
AI in eDiscovery
The Future of Legal Tech
Learn More:
Charlie - https://gravitystack.com/
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Charlie - https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlieconnor
Gravity Stack - https://www.linkedin.com/company/gravity-stack-law-llc
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
In this episode, Zach speaks with Legora's head of strategic partnerships and community, Chris Williams, about the rebranding journey and the strategic role of Legora in the AI-driven legal tech landscape. The discussion covers the responsibilities of his role, the transition from selling no-code, low-code platforms to generative AI, and the significant shift in how AI is transforming legal practices. The episode also explores differences between Legora and other AI tools like Harvey, the challenges and opportunities in the market, and the future direction for legal professionals using AI. Tune in to learn about Legora's mission to build the world's first truly collaborative AI for lawyers, enhancing strategic business development while reducing non-billable work.
Discover:
The Role and Responsibilities at Legora
Transition from Selling Traditional Tech to AI
The Impact of Generative AI in Legal Tech
Rebranding from Leya to Legora
Collaborative AI for Lawyers
Adoption of AI in Law Firms and In-House Teams
Comparing Legora and Harvey
The Future of Legal Work with AI
Connecting with Legora at Legal Week
Career Opportunities at Legora
Learn More:
Chris - Legora.com
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Chris - linkedin.com/in/chriswiiiiams/
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Zach, Ken and Josh talk about the upcoming three day conference in Myrtle Beach focusing on AI, Cybersecurity and Data Governance. Attendees will have opportunities to interact with cutting-edge AI companies and products.The event features specific presentations, including those by startup community members, covering practical AI applications in fields like legal finance, pricing, collections, and timekeeping.
Register - https://www.iltanet.org/live-events/evolve#speak
Follow Along:
Josh Smith https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshuadsmithcissp/
Ken Jones https://www.linkedin.com/in/kennethejones/
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Learn More:
https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
In this episode, Zach interviews Eleanor Lightbody, the CEO of Luminance, about her journey from working at Darktrace to leading Luminance, a legal tech company. Eleanor shares insights from her four years as CEO, highlighting the transformative impact of AI in the legal tech space. They discuss Luminance's growth strategy, the development of their contract lifecycle management tool, and the shift from M&A-specific uses to a broader, more inclusive approach. Eleanor also delves into how generative AI is changing user expectations and behaviors, and emphasizes the importance of balancing current customer needs with future innovations through a specialized 'blue sky thinking' team. Follow Luminance's developments on LinkedIn, their website, and at key industry conferences like Legal Week.
Eleanor's Background
Journey at Darktrace
Transition to Luminance
Growth and Strategy at Luminance
Evolution of Luminance's Focus
Impact of Generative AI
Future Vision and Blue Sky Thinking
Learn More:
Eleanor - https://www.luminance.com/team.html
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Eleanor - https://www.linkedin.com/in/eleanor-lightbody-69a6b784/
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
In this engaging conversation, Ilona and Evan discuss their roles and experiences in leading innovation within their respective law firms, Cleary Gottlieb and Fisher Phillips. Ilona, the Director of Practice Innovation at Cleary, shares her journey from McKinsey to leading a transformation journey at Cleary. Evan, the Chief Knowledge and Innovation Officer at Fisher Phillips, talks about his shift from labor and employment law into knowledge management and legal technology. The discussion covers their strategies for partnering with early-stage companies, the impact of generative AI on the legal industry, the importance of being thought leaders, and the challenges and opportunities of incorporating AI into legal practices. They also delve into the long-term benefits of working with startups, AI governance, and the future trajectory of AI in redefining the value proposition of the legal profession.
Topics discussed:
IIona's Journey and Role at Cleary
Evan's Career Path and Role at Fisher Phillips
The Impact of Generative AI on Legal Tech
Pre-Generative AI Adoption Strategies
Evaluating Startups and Early Partnerships
Risk Management and AI Governance
Learn More:
Ilona - https://www.pli.edu/faculty/ilona-logvinova-i2002979
Evan - https://www.fisherphillips.com/en/people/evan-shenkman.html
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Ilona - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ilonalogvinova
Evan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/evan-shenkman-5445123
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
Katya Fisher introduces her journey from a practicing attorney to a tech entrepreneur. She shares her experience of building a successful law practice during the Great Recession and how she acquired a unique set of legal skills. Katya talks about the inefficiencies in the legal world that led her to build Aracor.ai, a legal tech product tailored for in-house counsel of investment firms such as venture capital funds, private equity groups, and family offices.
Learn More:
Aracor - https://www.aracor.ai/
Zach - https://www.legallydisrupted.com/
Follow Along:
Katya - https://www.linkedin.com/in/katyafisher/
Zach - linkedin.com/in/zachabramowitz
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