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Don't Say Content

Author: Devin Bramhall & Margaret Kelsey

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Marketing and business strategy podcast for executives and marketing leaders who want to improve outcomes from marketing.

Marketing veterans Devin Bramhall (Animalz, Help Scout) & Margaret Kelsey (InVision, OpenView) use their combined 20+ years of experience to increase the business impact of marketing by creating shared understanding of its purpose and outcomes among marketing leaders, founders/CEOs & others in the C-suite.

  • Join us for in-depth conversations about B2B marketing behind the scenes:
  • How to run effective marketing teams
  • Hiring best-in-class marketing teams
  • Marketing strategy: Product-led Growth (PLG), Community marketing, Influencer marketing, micro influencers
  • Trends in B2B marketing: AI, TikTok, YouTube, LinkedIn, social platforms, email, and more

Created in partnership with Share Your Genius

An award-winning B2B podcast production company: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/

Building a community isn’t as simple as posting content and hoping for the best. It’s about real connections, authentic conversations, and making people feel like they’re part of something bigger than just your brand.In this episode, Devin and Margaret explore what it really takes to build a community-driven brand, the challenges that come with it, and why it’s way more than just the “marketing tactics” you read about. They break down how to foster genuine relationships and why understanding your audience is the key to it all.Because in the end, real community is about showing up, being human, and letting people be part of something meaningful.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
B2B buyers used to be wowed by a sleek product demo and a well-placed buzzword. Now? They’re rolling their eyes at your AI-powered, next-gen whatever.The reality: your buyers have changed. They’re more diverse, more skeptical, and they don’t care about your shiny tech unless it actually solves a problem. They grew up with software, they expect it to just work, and they see through the fluff. So why are so many marketers still selling like it’s 2015?In this episode, Devin and Margaret get into what’s actually shifting—generational shifts, demographic changes, the great wealth transfer—and why this is the biggest opportunity since SEO became a thing. If you want to keep up (or at least not get left behind), it’s time to rethink your playbook.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
Control and creativity don’t always play nice together—especially when you’re leading a team. Knowing when to hold tight to your vision and when to let go is a balancing act that even the best struggle with. Some leaders micromanage every detail, others delegate so freely they lose sight of the bigger picture. And somewhere in between? That’s where the magic happens.So how do you trust someone else to take the reins without losing the essence of what makes the work great? And how do you know when it’s time to step back versus step in?In this episode, Devin and Margaret explore the messy reality of creative control, why it’s so easy to cling too tightly, and how data can help cut through your own bias. Because good leadership means making yourself less necessary. Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
Stealing ideas is as old as time, but in the age of AI and content overload, the lines between inspiration and straight-up plagiarism blur. Some folks remix, some give credit where it’s due, and some? They copy-paste, cross their fingers, and hope no one notices.When someone lifts your words, runs them through ChatGPT, and then presents them as their own—without even a casual nod in your direction—it begs the question: where do we draw the line? And more importantly, why is it so damn hard for some people to just own up to it?In this episode, Devin and Margaret get into a wild story of a LinkedIn post gone rogue and the frustrating reality of getting credit for your work (especially as a woman). They also dig into the emotional labor of thought leadership, the myth of originality, and why sometimes the best response is just… not showing up to the fight.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
What does personal branding actually do for individuals today—especially in a world where trust in institutions and executives is fading?Personal branding is your reputation. As tech evolves and channels shift, your reputation is your leverage. Yes, even in B2B. Actually, especially in B2B.Like it or not, you already have a personal brand—even if you’re not actively building it on social. And no, you don’t need to be an “influencer” for this to matter.Resources:Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
Welcome to Don’t Say Content, a new podcast hosted by Devin Bramhall and Margaret Kelsey.Are you a:—a leader of people?—creative-minded individual?—someone who enjoys a good spicy take?Every Tuesday Devin and Margaret say what’s really on their minds about the marketing industry. After over 10 years in the industry, they are bored with the current state of marketing. So they made a podcast to inspire themselves and fellow marketing leaders who feel the same. They aren’t sharing tactics, playbooks or guides. They aren’t interviewing smart people (or anyone) about marketing. They are talking to each other about why they are annoyed with marketing and what they think needs to change to make it better. Plus, get weekly predictions from futurist astrologer, Jenn Hirsch, founder of Soulful Wealth.For more from Devin + Margaret, head to dontsaycontent.com.Follow Devin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/devinbramhall/Follow Margaret: https://www.linkedin.com/in/margaret-kelsey-104abba/Follow Jenn: https://soulfulwealth.substack.com/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius.Follow Devin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/devinbramhall/Follow Margaret: https://www.linkedin.com/in/margaret-kelsey-104abba/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius.
Fame is a rat race both to reach and then maintain. It’s not for everyone. But these days, folks who want to support themselves as content creators or “influencers” kinda have play the fame game. Only instead of hiring a PR team to stay in the zeitgeist, they have to become constant content machines and algorithm strategists to earn the popularity badge of engagement and make money. But what if you want to be seen and known and involved without living your whole life “on stage”? Influence - the real kind - is a middle ground, and it’s how Don’t Say Content became popular and sustainable and fun for us. It’s an asset of value to our listeners, to sponsors, and to us as a creative outlet. Having an influential podcast means we can be consistent, not constant. And that feels pretty good. In this episode, we’re breaking down why chasing constant visibility isn’t the only way to build a brand and how you can achieve still influence without having to be everywhere all the time constantly forever. Because let’s be real—sometimes the most powerful move is knowing when to say “best of luck on your future endeavors.”Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
Are websites still pulling their weight in B2B marketing, or are we all just clinging to the past?In this episode, we’re throwing a little shade at outdated digital strategies and breaking down the chaos marketers face today—think shifting customer behaviors, the AI takeover, and the sneaky lies your web metrics might be telling you.We’ll get into what’s actually working (spoiler: word-of-mouth is still the GOAT) and what’s long overdue for a refresh. Plus, we’re answering listener questions and serving up no-BS takes on where to focus your energy.If you’ve ever wondered whether your website is a hero or a money pit, this convo will make you look at your digital playbook in a whole new way.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/ 
All marketers have heard absurd statements from bosses and co-workers.In this episode, we’re sharing stories from marketers about the hilarious and downright baffling requests, feedback and mandates they’ve gotten from on high: bosses and others in the C-suite, clients, know-it-all VCs and the beloved tech teams who think they can do marketing better. From unrealistic expectations to bizarre feedback (like, “make it more magical”), we take a look at the moments that will make you lift a brow.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
Are we really at peak content? An IG story is an IG story. A TikTok is…well, a TikTok. Calling everything content isn’t exactly strategic. It’s time to move away from lumping everything into one pile and treat our creations with more intention. When you stop thinking about just creating “content” and start thinking about the message, medium and outcome, you realize there’s still room to create something unique that your customers and community have never seen before - and find valuable.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/Ideas Are Scary commercial: https://youtu.be/LG2oaGh0jmk?si=3YgVH4ln0OAMy0E7 
Has your latest challenge reshaped your definition of success? If yes, you’ve likely unlocked a deeper level of growth. If not, it might be time to consider a new perspective.In a society fixated on constant achievement and proving our worth, what if the toughest moments—like surviving cancer twice—are the ones that teach us to embrace imperfection, laugh more freely, and trust the process?In this bonus episode from the podcast 1,000 Routes with host Nick Bennett, Devin opens up about making bold career pivots and how her battle with cancer transformed her outlook on work and life. She also shares lessons on building a career that aligns with personal values, advocating for yourself in challenging times, and staying motivated through life’s toughest seasons.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/ Subscribe to the 1,000 Routes Newsletter: https://1000routes.com/Full Stack Solopreneur Roadmap https://fullstacksoloroadmap.com/ 
Did your content marketing achieve its intended outcomes? If YES, then it’s quality. If NO, then it’s not quality. B2B marketers are obsessed with “quality” content. Some are obsessed with The Style Guide and are incensed by a missing comma (especially if it’s Oxford). Many are obsessed because they are stuck in an unofficial yet ongoing companywide debate about what makes High Quality Content and can’t get anything out the door. Ultimately, defining quality content marketing should be as simple as: did it work?In this episode, we’re exploring the messy truths about quality, style, and why perfection isn’t always the goal. Because let’s face it—success is about being effective, unique, and embracing the beautiful chaos. Not perfection.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/ 
Ever feel like content marketing comes with way too much drama? Same, bestie. In this episode, we’re taking a closer look at those so-called “emergencies”—typos, broken links, chaotic launches—and letting you in on a secret. It’s never life or death.We’re going to share relatable stories of missteps, embarrassing moments, and the occasional PR hiccup. Because let’s be real—most “emergencies” are just overreactions to everyday challenges.Content marketing has its chaotic moments, but most of what we call crises are just opportunities to regroup, rethink, and laugh about it later.Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com
We meant to record an episode on influence vs fame, but instead we had it out about life in general right now and what we’re doing to thrive and cope. We know other folks are experiencing their own deluge of circumstance, so as per usual, we’re broadcasting our own closet monsters in the hopes that ya’ll might benefit. Expect stories about giving up perfection, letting go of the need to control, and why it’s not about doing more—it’s about doing what feels true to you. (It could also be about doing absolutely nothing at all, which Devin has been leaning into lately.)We’re breaking down the chaotic moments that come with trying to “have it all”—satisfaction, stability, and - maybe a little more often - a sense of peace. From setting boundaries to creating our individual definitions of “success”, we’re going into 2025 skeletons out and ready to face the big hairy monsters head-on. Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
Nobody wants to think outside the box anymore, and it is so boring! While creators and solopreneurs have incorporated video, AI, newsletters, partnerships and more to diversify their product offerings and growth strategy, executives in B2B continue cowering behind old growth tactics. While these execs complain about diminishing returns from SEO, social and paid channels, brave and curious brands are empowering their marketing teams to experiment. They welcome community-forward tactics with qualitative impact measurements.They understand that exponential growth often comes from the intangible, so confining their  creative and critical thinkers the same old linear marketing activities will only achieve the predictable.  According to Semafor’s business reporter, Liz Hoffman, “A world that’s more fractured, risky, and dynamic affords the opportunity to zig where others zag.”Time to learn some new dance moves. Resources: Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/ Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/ 
In this replay episode, we dive into fear and what it can do when left unresolved. And spoiler alert, it keeps us from being productive, connecting with others, and ultimately from personal and career growth. It also never goes away and in fact, can become an even bigger obstacle as you progress in your career. Whether you work for yourself, run a team or a company, fear surfaces over and over to present unique challenges. But when you learn how to work with fear, it can lead to a kind of bravery and curiosity that transforms your creativity and career. So we invited fear to the table for a little chat. Listen as we share our experiences navigating fear professionally and personally, publicly and privately, alongside each other and their most trusted community (including some top-tier advice from Momma Bramhall).Resources:Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
In this replay episode, we summarized the "state of marketing" and what we were looking forward to in the future. Are we there yet? You decide. But we can tell you we’re (still) looking forward to some genuine human connection and fostering authentic content creation in the coming year more than we are into slangin’ the same old worries we’ve been talking about (idk, marketing/exec alignment, AI takeovers, and old school marketing strategies, to name a few).Resources:Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
This replay episode might be one of our favorites of all time.Audacity - or as the kids call it: delulu.  You need more of it in your life.In this episode, we explore our own relationship with audacity, how to cultivate it, why it’s so elusive to maintain, and why it’s so important at this (and any point) in your career.Resources:Subscribe to our newsletter: https://www.dontsaycontent.com/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
In this replay episode, we look back at a discussion we had in Q4 last year around the problems our CEO and founder friends face. Since many of their problems felt, at the time, like nothing new, you can see how we wanted to revisit these again this year. Because even if the problem isn't a new one, that doesn’t mean they aren’t any easier to handle. So we hope our discussion will help bring you back to reality, center your actions around progress, and give you jumping-off points for solving these common problems among your leadership teams.Subscribe to our newsletter: https://dontsaycontent.substack.com/Created in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
In this replay episode, we revisit the stories our CEO & founder friends shared with us last year about what topics are keeping them up at night. While they've probably moved on from these problems, they're still problems that plague many a founder and marketing department in our industry. We channel their full consultative skills and reference their experience in similar situations and roles to answer these three main questions:How do you build a marketing team that buys into your bigger mission and vision? Not spammy tactics. How do you combat analysis paralysis in a small marketing department? How can you embrace and maximize the messiness of the marketplace right now? Connect with Devin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/devinbramhall/Connect with Margaret: https://www.linkedin.com/in/margaret-kelsey-104abba/Subscribe to our newsletter: https://dontsaycontent.substack.com/Subscribe to Devin's new newsletter, Ta Gueule: https://www.devinbramhall.com/newsletterCreated in partnership with Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/
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