The Immortal Life of Agencies

Today’s guest is Ben Rudman, Executive Director at MSQ, one of the fastest growing, private equity backed marketing services groups, positioning itself between the traditional holding companies and independent agencies.Ben shares why the agency model is at a pivotal moment, as AI accelerates the shift from selling time to selling outcomes, products and packaged services. He explains how MSQ has scaled to nearly 2,000 people while maintaining their entrepreneurial agility, and why client-centricity must be behavioural, not rhetorical.The conversation explores the so-called Goldilocks zone between scale and flexibility, the realities of working with procurement, and why agencies must align commercial models to client goals from the outset, rather than retrofit them later.With refreshing honesty, Ben reflects on what hasn’t yet been cracked, the talent challenges AI presents, and why creativity and ideas remain the industry’s enduring advantage.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:25] Scaling MSQ[05:11] Revenue beyond headcount[10:07] Uncertainty driving change[13:33] Aligning to outcomes[18:04] Commercial momentum model[22:50] Client centricity by design[25:51] Creating a Market of One[31:33] Building the AI backbone[33:57] Behaviour shapes culture[39:00] Charging for ideasMORE ABOUT BEN:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/benrudmanWebsite: msqpartners.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Zaid Al-Qassab, Global CEO of M+C Saatchi Group. Fascinatingly, having been client-side CMO with the likes of P&G, BT and Channel 4, this is his first agency role. So his rare perspective is gold dust.Zaid explains why agencies must stop talking to themselves and start truly understanding the complexity faced by modern CMOs – not least how the old brief-led model is being replaced by the need for orchestration.He shares how M+C Saatchi has repositioned itself around ‘Cultural Power’ and why that can – and should – be measurable. The conversation also explores AI, productisation and why agency leaders must make a stronger case for embracing a changing market.HIGHLIGHTS:[03:00] Agency navel gazing[06:28] Treating agencies as partners[07:47] Searching for a new model[11:14] Flexible orchestration[14:08] A former CMO’s advantage[17:32] The Goldilocks zone[22:22] Cultural Power as a proposition[30:35] AI as a democratizer[36:01] AI and the future of work[38:06] Three things that matterMORE ABOUT ZAID:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/zaid-al-qassabHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today's guest is Craig Elimeliah, Chief Creative Officer at Code and Theory, sharing his passion for why technology and creativity must go hand in hand.In his view, clients have been carrying the burden of fragmentation for far too long. That’s why his role blends engineering, strategy and craft to help clients navigate modern complexity.The discussion also explores Stagwell’s orchestration platform, The Machine, and how it’s reshaping integration across the marketing lifecycle. And perhaps most provocatively, Craig challenges our industry’s obsession with scale. If bigger isn’t always better, then agility and systems thinking matter far more.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:29] Inseparable disciplines[04:28] Thinking like architects[07:35] Creativity as change[17:25] AI as creative accelerator[22:59] Platformisation of holdcos[26:14] Evolving business models[30:13] Agentic operating systems[36:05] Knowing what to automate[42:31] Mediocrity scales exponentiallyMORE ABOUT CRAIG:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/craigelimeliahWebsite: codeandtheory.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s episode features Sean McDonald, Global CSO and Partner at Rethink, exploring the power of belief.Sean’s built a reputation for candour, competitive ambition and an unwavering belief in setting the standard. But he hasn’t always led that way. He reflects on how letting go of the need to ‘win’ every meeting transformed his leadership and why discovering the answer matters more than having it.Following his journey from politics and public affairs into advertising, Sean unpacks the myth of the ‘all-knowing’ strategist, explains why strong opinions must be loosely held and shares how envy can raise standards.The conversation also looks ahead, exploring growth, independence and why agencies must commit to what they optimise for.HIGHLIGHTS[02:10] Bluntness with manners[06:22] Discovering over knowing[12:08] Cult of the hero[15:38] Competition and respect[20:32] Setting global standard[24:51] Have an opinion[29:00] The goal isn't growth[31:18] Making bets[33:21] Growth versus ‘good’[38:00] Embracing the futureMORE ABOUT SEAN:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/seanamcdonaldHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Christine Olivas – Practice Director, Advertising & Brand Marketing at Toptal, the world's largest, fully remote workforce.Christine describes how on-demand talent has evolved from a stop-gap to a strategic growth lever for modern agencies, enabling them to build flexible teams that respond faster, protect margins and deliver stronger work.Drawing on her experience scaling on-demand teams globally, she unpacks how moving beyond rigid resourcing helps agencies handle new-business surges, access specialist expertise and reduce pressure on core teams.With an optimistic view of the future, Christine reflects on evolving workforce values, new career paths, and building agencies that are more human, resilient and fit for what comes next.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:33] A shifting workforce[05:03] Dynamic demand for talent[09:12] Moving beyond the stopgap[13:10] CMOs want chemistry[15:58] Support without spotlight[20:03] New business influx[24:29] Flexible pricing[29:01] Freelance is evolving[32:51] Portfolios open doors[36:54] Great ideas come anywhereMORE ABOUT CHRISTINE:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/colivasForbes CMO researchHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Jared Belsky, Co-Founder and CEO of Acadia – the hugely successful digital marketing and analytics agency. This is a masterclass in optimism, principled leadership and long-term thinking.Jared shares why bravery and belief sit at the heart of great leadership, from taking outspoken ethical stances, to building an agency designed to nurture future CEOs.We explore how Acadia has deliberately moved away from the boom-and-bust model that afflicts so many agencies, instead embracing more sustainable economics and intelligent specialization that doesn’t rely on a single vertical sector.Jared also offers a refreshingly positive view of the next generation, arguing they’re the most empowered yet, particularly when genuinely supported with thoughtful use of AI and automation.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:09] Where Acadia came from[04:41] Integrity in media buying[08:51] Stay profitable while doing good[11:50] Agencies as teaching platforms[17:29] Embracing economic diversity[21:12] The mid-market thesis[23:01] Saying "No" to P&G[27:37] Living the values[30:31] Empowering the team with technology[33:23] Three trends reshaping mediaMORE ABOUT JARED:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jaredbelskyHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Beth Ann Kaminkow is CEO of Dentsu North America. She brings a rare candour about why so many agency groups struggle to articulate their strengths, and why Dentsu is choosing to double down on strong, clearly positioned brands rather than chasing endless consolidation.She shares her perspective on where independents are winning, why speed and specialisation matter more than ever, and how global networks leverage their scale advantage.Thoughtful, optimistic and grounded in real leadership experience, Beth Ann also cuts through the hype on AI, from its impact on creativity and craft, to increasing appetite from clients for new pricing models.HIGHLIGHTS:[03:06] How technology amplifies longevity[03:56] Restoring growth[08:18] The ‘One Dentsu’ model[12:24] Client-led media strategy[19:08] AI as media channel[22:22] Pricing unique IP[24:06] The needs that indies meet[28:24] Staying focused amidst gossip[31:55] How cynicism hurts the industry[35:44] The next wave of creativityMORE ABOUT BETH:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/beth-ann-kaminkowMentioned in the episode:Robin’s book – Market of One: amazon.com/Market-One-rewrite-competitive-advantageHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Zoe Scaman, founder of Bodacious – and one of our industry's most original and outspoken thinkers. She’s built her career by following her curiosity, from her early days at Naked Communications to optimising her own business around freedom and variety.Zoe shares her take on why the traditional agency model has reached breaking point, how creativity is being squeezed by efficiency, and what a new era of talent could look like. She also speaks about building her personal brand, using writing as a thinking tool, and the importance of openness, vulnerability and speaking out.If you’re questioning what’s next for agencies – or yourself – Zoe offers both a reality check and a dose of inspiration.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:03] Freedom to be 'Bodacious'[04:24] The magic of misfits[08:35] Death by a thousand cuts[13:11] Data versus creativity[15:07] Freedom versus growth[21:44] The grey soup crisis[25:30] Breaking silence with courage[27:56] Thinking out loud in public[33:59] Learning through disagreement[37:54] Branding by machinesMORE ABOUT ZOE:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/zoescamanWebsite: bodacious.beHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guests are PJ Pereira and Andrew O’Dell, co-founders of renowned creative agency Pereira O’Dell as well as their AI venture SILVERSIDE– fresh from delivering Coca-Cola’s fully AI-generated 2026 Holidays Are Coming campaign.Alongside the controversy and lessons learned, PJ and Andrew explain why SILVERSIDE was spun-out as a separate business, how speed and experimentation are reshaping creative processes, and why culture is everything when navigating change.They also explore how AI is accelerating pressure on traditional agency business models – from production workflows to how value is priced and rewarded. This is an honest, optimistic conversation about fear, reinvention and leadership in a moment of rapid transformation.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:13] Reinventing an icon[07:57] From creative indie to AI Lab[15:48] Resilience in the echo chamber[17:18] Finding the hand raisers[23:45] Rethinking creative value[26:00] Exposing broken models[30:31] Learning by doing[33:14] People-first mentality[36:01] The gap between indies and network agenciesMORE ABOUT PJ PEREIRA AND ANDREW O'DELL:LinkedIn (PJ): linkedin.com/in/pjpereiraLinkedIn (Andrew): linkedin.com/in/andrew-o-dellSILVERSIDE AI: Silverside.aiHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of One

Today’s guests are Brian Wieser and Olivia Morley – not only the co-hosts of the fantastic ‘Agency Business’ podcast, but Brian is also a seasoned analyst across advertising, tech and finance, and Olivia is an editorial and communications specialist, formerly of Adweek and Forrester. Together, they bring an unusually rigorous focus to the choices agency leaders make. We explore why the sector is not, despite the prevailing narrative, in crisis – and why metrics such as capital efficiency and long-term value creation are often overlooked. Olivia offers a critical perspective on organisational structure, culture, and operational reality, while Brian unpacks how agencies should think about investment, scale and survival. We also dig into whether independents are truly ‘having a moment, the divergence between media and creative businesses, and why holding companies are describing themselves as platforms.HIGHLIGHTS:[01:58] Inside agency journalism[03:58] The business of agencies[07:12] Curiosity behind decisions[12:54] Investing wisely [16:52] Facts over feelings[21:22] Pseudo independence[24:38] Media scale versus creativity[26:53] Agencies as platforms[31:04] Technology drives consolidation[37:54] Specialisation as strategyMORE ABOUT OLIVIA AND BRIAN:LinkedIn (Olivia): linkedin.com/in/oliviamorleyFusion Front Media: linkedin.com/company/fusionfront-mediaLinkedIn (Brian): linkedin.com/in/brianwieserMadison & Wall: madisonandwall.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Luke McKelvey, Co-Founder and CEO of MIRIMAR – the creative company helping brands achieve cultural significance in a world where traditional advertising isn’t enough. And as of last week, ADWEEK’s newly minted small agency of the year for 2025.Luke reflects on MIRIMAR’s early challenges, from launching ‘too soon’ in 2019 to navigating the pandemic. He also shares how conviction, focus, and a clear filtering system helped them find their footing with the right clients.The conversation breaks down MIRIMAR’s ‘foundation and fame’ model – aligning brand and business, with smart talent partnerships that create impact without relying solely on paid media. Packed with sharp thinking, honest lessons, and a healthy dose of optimism, this is a masterclass in building an agency you truly believe in. HIGHLIGHTS:[02:02] Navigating early challenges[06:58] Ambition over status quo[09:26] The power of clarity[15:51] Foundation and fame[17:58] Positioning as an entertainment agency[26:17] New era of partnerships[29:18] Aligning intent and incentives[35:12] Doubling down on insight[38:47] Why north stars matter[41:21] Making work worth itMORE ABOUT LUKE:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/luke-mckelveyWebsite: mirimarus.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaireIs your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Richard Huntington – former Chief Strategy Officer and Chairman of Saatchi & Saatchi. He brings a rare blend of honesty, affection and sharp-edged provocation to this conversation about the agency business. Richard describes an industry that’s been commodified – caused by the “creative” agency label that stripped out the commerciality, as well as a pitching culture that trains agencies to give away their most valuable thinking for free.But far from being downbeat, this is a rallying cry for the brilliance inside agencies, and a clear-eyed look at why talent deserves to be paid fairly for the value it creates. From productisation and pricing, to shifting C-suite perceptions, Richard shares his vision for a healthier, more sustainable industry built on confidence, credibility and genuine differentiation.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:20] Advertising’s not dead yet[07:50] Commodified by clients[09:02] Creative as an adjective[17:15] Reclaiming agency swagger[19:41] Collective industry reform[21:56] Rewriting the rules of pitching[24:58] The remuneration shift[28:36] Power of proprietary thinking[34:12] Golden era of startupsMORE ABOUT RICHARD:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/richard-huntington-59a3761b9HOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Market of One If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Christy Hiler, owner of Cornett – the Lexington-based creative agency – and one of our industry’s leading voices for women-owned agencies. A huge advocate of empowering talent, Christy candidly shares her own unusual journey from being Cornett’s president to its owner, including the convictions that guided her forward – and the doubts that held her back. She talks about the importance of the ‘beautiful but deadly’ venus flytrap in describing what makes Cornett different, as well as her commitment to constant evolution. Christy also describes how the striking stat that only 1% of US agencies are women-owned sparked the creation of ‘Own It’ – a vibrant community, podcast and summit supporting women who run agencies.This is an inspiring story and taking charge and making a real difference to the wider industry. HIGHLIGHTS:[05:27] The underdog spirit[09:38] The venus flytrap idea[13:15] Building long-term relationships[17:33] Women leading differently[21:33] The 'Own It' initiative[28:07] How equity fuels creativity[32:07] Unlocking potential[37:13] Doing things differentlyMORE ABOUT CHRISTY:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/christyhilerWebsite: teamcornett.comOwnItHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of One

Today’s guest is Tyler Turnbull, Global CEO of Interpublic’s FCB – remarkably, the winner of Cannes Lions’ North American Network of the Year for seven years running. Tyler shares the mindset that’s driven this sustained creative and commercial performance. He unpacks where resilience comes from, and how curiosity, experimentation and a willingness to challenge legacy thinking underpins FCB’s momentum. Tyler also offers a refreshingly honest view of client relationships – including the crucial roles of empathy and deep commercial impact. Regardless of whether you’re running a small team or a global network, this is a compelling recipe for ongoing success. HIGHLIGHTS:[02:15] The power of consistency[07:27] Resilience through people[10:10] Reinvention never stops[14:31] Walking in your client's shoes[22:28] Challenging old habits[30:46] Why small steps matter[31:40] Culture built on trying[34:28] Being premium by choice[42:16] Commercial experimentationMORE ABOUT TYLER:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/tylerturnbullWebsite: fcb.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Market of One If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Zihla Salinas, CEO of a 40-year-old indie that rebranded as ‘Yes&’. She shares the story behind the name, including how the improv-inspired mindset of ‘accept and build’ has become a blueprint for the business. This philosophy shapes everything from their M&A strategy and client partnerships, to leadership development and creative delivery. You’ll hear why figure-it-out-ability, curiosity and positivity are Yes&’s measurable values, not just words on a wall.Zihla also unpacks how Yes& cracked the code for working with complex clients, and how great account service – not just great ideas – is often what makes the difference. HIGHLIGHTS:[02:25] The power of positivity[07:00] The story behind Yes&[11:04] What makes Yes& different[16:10] Figure-Out-Ability[19:30] Communication as a superpower[21:33] Redefining client service[23:12] Spotting positive mindsets[28:42] Cultural alignment in clients[34:46] Learning from success[36:47] Smart cross-selling[40:21] Building strong partnershipsMORE ABOUT ZIHLA:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/zihlaWebsite: yesandagency.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Market of One If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Jarrod Moses, Founder and Global CEO of United Entertainment Group (UEG) – part of Edelman.Jarrod unpacks how brands, creators, sports stars and celebrities meet in the fast-evolving world of culture and entertainment marketing. He reveals how UEG structures partnerships that go beyond timesheets and deliverables to also reward performance and behaviours. Jarrod also discusses the shifting power balance between creators, agencies and clients, the pitfalls of inauthentic partnerships, and the discipline it takes to stay entrepreneurial while leading a global agency network.From UEG’s early work with Rihanna to long-term lessons in leadership, this conversation offers an inspiring look at the mechanics of one of the world’s pre-eminent marketing disciplines. HIGHLIGHTS:[02:01] The role of emotion[04:35] Enhancing culture[07:46] Taming the celebrity–brand beast[09:35] Three truths of partnership[12:34] Game plans for every client[17:43] Believable spontaneity[22:20] What kills authenticity[27:57] Discovering Rihanna with Jay-Z[33:51] UEG’s commercial formula[35:58] Engaging the C-suiteMORE ABOUT JARROD:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jarrod-mosesWebsite: uegworldwide.com/HOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Website: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Market of One If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Loren Grossman, Global Chief Strategy Officer of the ‘Solutions Group’ within Publicis Groupe – so he’s right at the centre of how the agency world is evolving.Loren describes a ‘golden age’ of impact, explaining how Publicis has built a future-facing model that goes far beyond marketing communications. From bold acquisitions like Epsilon and Sapient, to their ‘Power of One’ approach that brings every capability together, he shares how the group has worked hard to make integration really work – and how that’s fuelled their relentless new-business success with the likes of Coke and Mars. Packed with insights on leadership, culture and the real opportunities in AI and data, this conversation paints a truly optimistic picture of where agencies are headed and how to stay relevant in a rapidly changing market. HIGHLIGHTS:[02:31] Loren’s role[07:44] Reinventing HoldCo.s[09:26] How structure enables strategy[13:19] Making bold acquisitions[15:01] Integration made practical[22:53] The ‘Power of One’ in action[28:10] Partnership as a differentiator[33:05] Avoiding the AI trap[35:22] Building on CRM’s legacy[39:18] The golden era of impactMORE ABOUT LOREN:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/loren-grossmanWebsite: publicisgroupe.com/frHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn:  linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Site: codefinery.comBook: Market of One

Today’s guest – for our 50th episode! – is Haley Hunter, Co-Founder of Party Land – proudly known as comedy’s greatest ad agency. In this lively conversation, Haley unpacks how humour has become a strategic superpower, not just a punchline.She shares how Party Land went from convincing clients that comedy belonged in advertising to being the go-to agency for those wanting to master it – not least Liquid Death. Haley also dives into the neuroscience behind laughter, explaining how it primes audiences for connection and recall.Beyond the creative side, she reveals how empathy, autonomy and trust fuel Party Land’s remote office set-up – and why comedy is as much about mindset as it is about craft.It’s an inspiring lesson in leading with conviction, creating a new category and finding joy in the serious business of marketing. HIGHLIGHTS:[01:57] Funny as a superpower[04:05] Making the case for comedy[11:08] Owning creative outcomes[13:17] The art of pushing just enough[16:23] Authenticity at work[17:46] Freedom and liberation[25:11] Finding the right people [29:51] Behind the laughter[33:29] The biggest risk in advertising [38:23] Leading with joy and convictionMORE ABOUT HALEY:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/hihaleyhunterWebsite: partyland.coHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn:  linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Site: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Market of One If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential. Visit codefinery.com/dq

In a first for the show, today we have not one but two guests – Jaime Robinson and Lisa Clunie, co-founders of the creative agency JOAN, born in NYC and now smashing it in London and Berlin too. Jaime and Lisa reveal how they’re blending the rigour of classic brand building with the pace and energy of modern culture. They share why they believe now is a golden age of creativity, how disruption is reshaping the talent model and what it means to modernise brands.You’ll hear their take on what makes a great client–agency fit, why conviction matters more than buzzwords, and how AI and reverse mentorship could define the next generation of creative leaders. It’s an authentic, optimistic conversation that captures the spirit of JOAN: bold, human and unapologetically modern.HIGHLIGHTS:[02:04] Joan's legendary beginnings[06:56] Building timeless brands[09:27] Firing clients that don’t fit[13:59] Audience-first creativity in action[16:17] Into a golden age[19:21] An alchemy of strengths[24:33] Wisdom meets the machine[26:03] The power of shared mentorship[30:36] Pitches as creative playgrounds[34:18] A new industrial revolutionMORE ABOUT JAIME & LISA:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/hellojaimerobinsonLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/lisaclunieWebsite: joancreative.comHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn:  linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Site: codefinery.comBook: Market of OneMentioned in this episode:Market of One If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Today’s guest is Andrew Swinand, CEO of Inspired Thinking Group, a PE-backed and AI-enabled content business that is scaling faster than most in our industry. With two decades at Publicis, including running Leo Burnett and leading creative in the US, Andrew brings a rare dual perspective on both the creative and operational sides of the business.He shares why the HoldCo.s are trapped in the classic Innovator’s Dilemma and how AI is reshaping the economics of content production. But far from AI replacing creativity, Andrew explains why operational AI is actually paving the way for a new creative renaissance.From automating tens of thousands of assets, to rethinking how talent and technology combine, Andrew cuts through the noise to offer a clear view of the pressures and possibilities facing agencies today.HIGHLIGHTS[01:54] Taking the entrepreneurial path[04:32] Why AI won’t replace creativity[07:53] Blockers to agency innovation[13:37] Delivering scale and speed[17:53] Fear, uncertainty and hype[23:46] Generative AI's real limits[25:18] A new creative renaissance[30:48] Leading with honesty[32:37] Embracing humanityMORE ABOUT ANDREW:LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/andrewswinandWebsite: inspiredthinking.groupHOST SOCIALS:LinkedIn:  linkedin.com/in/robinbonnTwitter: twitter.com/robonnMORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:Site: codefinery.comBook: Market of One