Clemenz With a ”Z” Podcast

In this episode of We Were In a Cult?, I sit down with Stef, a fellow “Kingdom kid” who grew up inside the ICOC to explore what it was like to be born into a system where church wasn’t just something you attended, but the entire framework for how you understood God, authority, obedience, and belonging. This conversation isn’t about sensationalism or tearing people down. It’s about memory. It’s about untangling fear from faith. It’s about what happens when reverence and anxiety get braided together in childhood and what it takes, as adults, to slowly learn how to trust our own voices again. Whether you were part of the ICOC, the ICC, another high-control church environment, or you’re simply curious about what that world felt like from the inside, this episode is an honest window into that experience. If you are a member, were a member, or know someone who was a member of the ICOC or ICC and would like to share your story about life in and out of the church, I’d love to hear from you. Together, we can continue exploring the question, “We were in a cult?” and perhaps find some healing along the way. You can reach me via email at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com, or send me a DM on Instagram at the Clemenz With a Z podcast page. If you want to support the podcast financially, you can head over to ClemenzWithAZ.com, there’s a merch store there with shirts, stickers, all kinds of stuff. You can also donate directly through the GoFundMe, the link’s in the show notes. Every bit goes a long way in helping me keep these conversations going. And if you’re looking for something a little more regular, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Disillusioned & Deconstructing. That’s where I share short reflections, devotionals, and some extra behind-the-scenes thoughts that don’t always make it onto the podcast. And of course, the best way you can support the show is by subscribing, rating, and leaving a review wherever you listen to podcasts. Share it with a friend, post it on your socials, drop it in a group chat, it all helps more than you know. This podcast keeps going because of listeners like you showing up, engaging, and passing it on. So thank you for being here, for listening, and for being part of this messy middle with me. Until next time, take care of yourselves, and each other.

What does it mean to grow up inside something that calls itself the Kingdom of God? In this episode, I reflect on what it was like to be a “Kingdom kid” born into the International Churches of Christ, shaped by its language, boundaries, fears, and promises from my earliest memories. This isn’t a takedown. It’s an honest look at safety, identity, fear of being “out,” and the long process of learning to trust myself again after realizing the place that formed me wasn’t what I thought it was. If you grew up in a high-control church environment or if you’ve ever had to untangle your identity from the system that raised you, this conversation is for you. We weren’t crazy. We were kids. If something in this conversation resonated with you especially if you were part of the ICOC, or you were what we called a “Kingdom kid” I’d really love to hear from you. Tell me where you’re at. Tell me how you’re healing. Tell me what this journey has looked like for you. You can email me at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com, or send me a DM over on Instagram at @clemenzwithazpodcast. And if you’d ever want to share your story more publicly maybe as part of the "We Were in a Cult?" series here on the podcast let’s talk. These stories matter. And I think there’s a lot of us still untangling what this all meant. If you want to support the podcast financially, you can head over to ClemenzWithAZ.com, there’s a merch store there with shirts, stickers, all kinds of stuff. You can also donate directly through the GoFundMe, the link’s in the show notes. Every bit goes a long way in helping me keep these conversations going. And if you’re looking for something a little more regular, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Disillusioned & Deconstructing. That’s where I share short reflections, devotionals, and some extra behind-the-scenes thoughts that don’t always make it onto the podcast. And of course, the best way you can support the show is by subscribing, rating, and leaving a review wherever you listen to podcasts. Share it with a friend, post it on your socials, drop it in a group chat, it all helps more than you know. This podcast keeps going because of listeners like you showing up, engaging, and passing it on. So thank you for being here, for listening, and for being part of this messy middle with me. We weren’t crazy. We were kids. Until next time—take care of yourselves, and each other.

In this episode, I wrestle with a claim I’ve been seeing more and more in Christian spaces: that “gentle parenting” is not the same as “godly parenting” and that starting from empathy or believing kids are inherently good is somehow dangerous or unbiblical. Instead of turning this into another parenting culture war, I slow the conversation down. I explore what gentle parenting actually is, what people mean when they talk about godly or gospel-centered parenting, and why these two ideas keep getting pitted against each other. Drawing from my own experience as a parent, a former teacher, and someone shaped by fear-based faith, I push back on the either/or mindset and make the case for a more honest, relational approach to raising kids, one rooted in love, empathy, consistency, boundaries, and the humility to admit we’re all still learning as we go. If anything in this episode resonated with you and you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

What's up y'all! In this episode, I explore the growing tendency within evangelical church culture to confuse critique with persecution and why that confusion can be so damaging. This conversation grew out of a recent church experience, a sermon that reframed fear as rebellion, and my own attempt to engage in private, thoughtful dialogue that never quite materialized. Drawing from personal experience, theology, and lived impact, I reflect on what happens when churches prioritize defensiveness over listening, certainty over curiosity, and ego over humility. This isn’t an attack on the church, but an honest examination of how faith communities can lose their capacity for dialogue, and why reclaiming that capacity matters for real healing, growth, and care. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

In this episode of Clemenz With a “Z,” I’m not talking about co-sleeping or parenting techniques as much as I’m talking about access:  who gets it, when, and what we teach our kids about belonging long before they have words for it. Sparked by two very confident but completely opposite Christian takes on kids sleeping in the bed, this episode moves past certainty and into something more human: fear at 2 a.m., Hot Wheels offered as currency for closeness, the exhaustion of real parenting, and the quiet ways children learn whether love is conditional or not. Hot Wheels at 2 A.M. is a reflection on presence before principle, discernment over formulas, and what it means to raise kids and build families without outsourcing our humanity. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

Lately, I’ve been struck by how many of our religious conversations seem to turn into debates that leave us more divided, more entrenched, and more certain, but not more understanding. In this episode, I explore the idea that the problem might not be our disagreements, but the questions we’ve been trained to ask in the first place. Looking at the way Jesus consistently redirected the conversations people wanted to have, this episode reflects on how faith has become more about camps and certainty than curiosity and connection and what might change if we learned to ask better questions instead. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

We live in a world of constant noise and increasingly, our churches mirror it. In this episode, I reflect on what happens when worship never pauses, when silence feels unwelcome, and when space is something we’re quick to fill. This isn’t a critique of music or emotion, but an exploration of why silence matters, in church and in everyday life. Drawing on personal experience and a poem that helped name what I was feeling, Let It Breathe is an invitation to notice how much noise we carry, and to consider what might heal, clarify, and return to us if we made a little more room for space. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

I'm Back! After an intentional pause, this episode is a return, a re-orientation, and an honest reflection on why this podcast exists and where it’s going. What began years ago as conversations about masculinity and fatherhood has grown alongside me into something deeper, a space to unlearn, feel, rethink what we were told, and become whole. This episode is about remembering the “why,” honoring the evolution, and inviting you into the next chapter of Clemenz With a "Z" wherever you find yourself in your own becoming. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

Sometimes the hardest seasons are the ones that make us. In this episode, I share a story I’ve never told publicly, the moment everything I’d worked for almost came undone during my student teaching. What started as a field trip turned into one of the most difficult and defining chapters of my life. Through betrayal, uncertainty, and months of fighting to graduate, I discovered something I didn’t know I had: the ability to stand up, to keep going, and to find strength in the middle of conflict. Drawing from A Million Miles in a Thousand Years and the timeless Hero’s Journey, this episode explores how our greatest struggles often become the very things that shape us, and how, as the comedian Katt Williams once said, that’s what every hero of every story has in common. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

We love verses like Jeremiah 29:11.  You know, the ones that promise a future and a hope. They’re comforting, clean, easy to print on a mug or a graduation card. But what happens when life doesn’t match the verse? When the “plan” falls apart and the promises feel hollow? In this episode, Coffee Mug Theology, I talk about how we’ve turned ancient words of exile and endurance into quick-fix slogans, and what gets lost in translation when we do. This one’s about loss, anger, meaning, and what it really means to find faith when the plan stops working. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

We grow up on stories that tell us life is about slaying the dragon and winning the prize. Disney fairytales, men’s groups, even church slogans repeat the same script: the battle is always “out there.” But Joseph Campbell flipped the story, reminding us that the real dragon is within, and the way forward isn’t conquest, it’s following your bliss. In this episode, I wrestle with what that actually means for men, fathers, and anyone trying to move beyond sea-level living. We’ll talk about shallow scripts, quiet desperation, and the deeper kind of dragon-slaying that leads not to prizes, but to presence, aliveness, and depth. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotions for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

In this episode, I step into the shadows with Marvel’s Thunderbolts, a story of misfits, scars, and the power of presence. From Sentry’s battle with the Void to Yelena’s moment of recognition, the film raises a question we all wrestle with: what do we do with the darkness inside of us? Some days we try to bury it, some days we stare right into it, and some days we need someone else to remind us we don’t have to face it alone. Along the way, I reflect on Robin Williams, both the roles he played and the quiet, compassionate ways he showed up for others in real life and on Jesus, who never rushed people out of their pain but entered it with them. Together, they remind us that empathy doesn’t mean fixing or rushing the darkness away. It means staying. It means naming the shadow without shame. And sometimes, it means discovering that our misfit-ness, our scars, and even our Voids might be the very places where healing begins. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

What do you do when the world feels too heavy? When you're tired, discouraged, or just numb from the noise? If you're me… you watch America’s Got Talent Golden Buzzer moments on YouTube. And you cry. Every time. In this episode, I’m sharing a surprising ritual that’s become one of the most healing parts of my life. We’ll talk about how a talent show, yes, a talent show has become a space for emotional release, joy, defiant hope, and sacred connection. We’ll explore the deeper psychological and spiritual reasons why these moments hit so hard, why they make so many of us weep, and what they reveal about our deepest longings: to be seen, to be celebrated, and to belong. This episode is a love letter to awe. A confetti-covered sermon. And a reminder that joy is not weakness, it’s resistance. If you’ve ever cried during a viral audition clip, this one’s for you. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

Sometimes a song finds you when you need it most. I had never heard Wrabel’s “The Village” until I stumbled across a dance group performing to it on Britain’s Got Talent. What started as a quick break from writing turned into something deeper, a mirror for the world we’re living in right now. The song, originally written for the trans community, echoed wider truths as I watched dancers of all different backgrounds embody it on stage. And it left me with a haunting thought I can’t shake: there’s something wrong with the village. In this episode, I sit with that lyric, wrestle with what it means for us today, and ask where we go from here. If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

This episode started as a response to something I heard on a Christian podcast about God’s discipline. The words weren’t new, I’ve heard the same script my whole life, but they brought back memories of how deeply this theology shaped me. Growing up, I learned to see every disappointment and setback as punishment, every “no” as God disciplining me. What really grabbed me, though, was how seamlessly the hosts moved from talking about God’s discipline to how they plan to spank their child, as if one naturally flowed into the other. That hit me hard, because I know the damage that both of those messages can cause. In this episode, I share why spanking doesn’t produce wisdom but only breeds domestication, what scripture actually means when it talks about “the rod,” and why a God of love can’t be confused with a God of fear. At the heart of it all is this question: what kind of legacy do we want to leave? One rooted in control, or one rooted in trust and love? If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

In this episode, I sit with the words of Thomas Merton, an American Trappist monk, writer, and mystic whose reflections on faith, identity, and community continue to resonate decades after his death. Merton warns against what he calls “the heresy of individualism,” the temptation to define ourselves only by what we’re not, to build our lives on separation and judgment. His challenge struck me deeply, because I’ve lived that temptation:  shrinking myself, building an island of “no,” and cutting myself off from connection. In this conversation, I explore what it means to move off the island, to see others as mirrors, and to rediscover the breath of the Spirit by starting with yes. If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

I was on a plane recently watching the new Bob Dylan movie when a scene with Pete Seeger stopped me in my tracks. Why in the world would a folk singer be in court over a song? That moment opened up a hidden history I had never been taught: “This Land Is Your Land” wasn’t just a patriotic anthem, it was a protest. And it made me start to see a bigger pattern. We do this all the time. We take prophets, revolutionaries, artists, even Jesus himself, and we sanitize them. We file down the edges until all that’s left is a safe version that won’t disrupt us. In this episode, I want to ask: what do we lose when we do that? And what might happen if we went searching for the verses, the voices, the truths that were cut out? If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

This episode started with a reel:  Two pastors, loud and confident, claiming they were standing in the footsteps of Jesus by resisting culture and government control. And while I disagreed with their message, something deeper stirred in me. Because I’ve heard that same level of certainty on the other side too, in the progressive voices I often align with. And honestly? I’ve heard it in myself. So the question that kept echoing wasn’t just “Who’s right?” it was “Is that even the right question anymore?” In this episode, I explore the danger of certainty, the ways we all use scripture to back ourselves up, and the spiritual cost of needing to always be right. But more than that, I ask: Is any of this moving us closer to something good? Something more free, more human, more like Jesus? If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

In a world where everyone seems to be talking past each other,  online, in politics, and even in the church, what would it look like to slow down and actually see the person in front of us? In this episode, I explore the word sonder, the realization that every person you encounter is living a life as vivid and complex as your own and how Jesus embodied that in every interaction. From the woman caught in adultery to Zacchaeus to the bleeding woman, Jesus saw the human before the problem, the wound before the wrong. I also wrestle with my own struggle to do the same, especially in a culture addicted to clicks, likes, and quick takes. This isn’t just about changing the way we speak to others. It’s about challenging ourselves to speak from a place that sees, honors, and values the humanity of the person right in front of us. If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.

Episode 200! I can’t quite believe we’ve reached this point: two hundred conversations, stories, and reflections shared with you. And for this milestone, I wanted to talk about something that’s been weaving through all of them: the power of metaphor. From Iron Man’s first suit to the parables of Jesus, from Joseph Campbell’s wisdom to Pete Holmes’ “finger and moon,” metaphors shape how we see the world and ourselves. In this episode of Clemenz With a “Z”, I explore why we need metaphors, how they sneak past our defenses to speak to the heart, and what happens when we mistake the metaphor for the thing itself. Along the way, I connect modern myths like Marvel movies to ancient scripture, and even take a surprising detour into The Lord of the Rings to unpack Smeagol’s haunting transformation into Gollum. Whether it’s a shepherd, a superhero, or a hobbit clutching his “precious,” these stories are pointing us toward something bigger, if we’re willing to look past the finger and see the moon. If this episode meant something to you, I’d love it if you’d take a second to like, subscribe, and leave a review, it really helps more people find the show. If you would like to reach out to me you can drop me a line at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or drop a DM at the clemenz with a "Z" instagram page.   You can head over to https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 every bit helps. And if you’re looking for more reflection, honesty, and spiritual wrestling, check out my Substack: Devotionals for the Deconstructing & Disillusioned, it’s a space for people who still have soul, but no longer fit in the boxes they were handed. Thanks for being here.