The PERE Podcast

This week on The PERE Podcast, focus is turned to Singapore, where a lively docket of PERE Asia keynotes and panels have just concluded. The event saw record attendance across its three days, with some 600 delegates in attendance across the event including institutional investors, managers and advisers.  PERE has been active in tracking perspectives from leading institutions and firms onsite, including analysis on how Adu Dhabi Investment Authority and Australian Retirement Trust are navigating fund investment activity in 2026. For this episode, PERE editor Evelyn Lee’s keynote interview with Starwood Capital Group president Jonathan Pollack takes center stage. Pollack is a primary driver of the manager’s overarching strategy and daily business operations, and as PERE reported in a September 2025 cover story, he is also the chosen successor to Starwood founder and chief executive officer Barry Sternlicht.  Pollack covers a broad range of topics, all spanning from his first year in as the operational overseer for Starwood. The firm is angling to work more closely with insurance capital partners; continue clean-up and related asset management work linked to Starwood’s $7 billion take-private of ESR Group in 2025; and take a more cloud computing-centric tack to its data center investment pipeline. All this is under the backdrop of global geopolitical issues, which are expected to force financial market participants to recalibrate for US policy as military escalations take place in Iran and select neighboring countries.

This episode is sponsored by Knight Frank and Reed Smith Back leverage has emerged from the shadows to have its moment in the sun. Not long ago, taking on debt to partly fund loans was a practice frowned upon by many European investors and borrowers. But today, it is increasingly used and accepted. In this special episode of The PERE Podcast, Jess Qureshi, an associate in Knight Frank’s capital advisory team, and Josh Hughes, a partner at law firm Reed Smith, review the use of back leverage in European real estate finance. How does it work? Who is using it and why? And what are the risks and rewards involved? Jess lays out the results of Knight Frank’s latest research on the space, which reveals how extensive European lenders’ employment of back leverage has become. Meanwhile, Josh analyzes the technicalities of structuring loan-on-loan and repo line arrangements in the most effective manner. The pair emphasize the crucial importance of alignment between alternative lenders and their back leverage providers. While it involves increased risk, the pair conclude that using back leverage creates more liquidity for borrowers because it enables lenders to originate more loans while juicing the return on capital achievable for investors in real estate credit markets.

We return to the familiar territory of real estate investment trust take-private deals this week, as host Randy Plavajka uncovers how private real estate managers aiming to capitalize on listed market dislocations may face a reshaped landscape as REIT market health gradually returns. Even as take-private efforts are actively launched this week – such as an agreement between Affinius Capital and Vista Hill Partners to take Veris Residential REIT private in a deal valued at $3.4 billion – the outlook ahead for similar opportunities could shift, as some market analysts suggest. Joining Randy from London are Jonathan Brasse, PEI’s editor-in-chief, real estate, and Sarah Marx, reporter at PERE Deals, who bring in recent commentary and prior-year data on REIT take-private deals to cast more light on the factors set to impact future opportunities in the space. Changes in valuation processes, increasingly available dry powder for listed real estate businesses and updated private-side scaling initiatives are all expected to reconfigure how private managers target take-private deals in the next cycle of the real estate market. The team is joined by Matthew Norris, head of real estate securities at Gravis, later in the episode. His firm, a regular commentator on REIT capital markets activity, sees more signs of inflection in today’s market, including public-to-public mergers, valuation reconsiderations, and the potential return of steadier initial public offerings throughout REIT categories.

The PERE Podcast heads to Las Vegas this week as host McKenna Leavens breaks down one of the splashiest capital markets moves of the year: Blackstone’s planned $3.05 billion CMBS refinancing of The Cosmopolitan. The deal taps into powerful forces shaping today’s credit landscape, from the growing appetite for top-tier hospitality assets to the resilience of destination markets in a post-pandemic environment.  Joining McKenna in New York are PERE Credit deputy editor Randy Plavajka and PERE Credit senior reporter Shihao Feng, who unpack why this transaction is resonating so strongly in today’s lending market. The team traces the long-running attraction of institutional capital to Las Vegas, dating back in modern markets to the billions in hospitality trades made in 2020 and 2021, and why that conviction is now spilling over onto the debt side. They also explore Blackstone’s deep footprint in the market.   From the surge in securitized refinancing activity to the growing role of SASB structures and the rise of C-PACE as a flexible capital tool, the episode digs into how Vegas has become a proving ground for refinancing activity heading further into 2026. Later in the episode, listen as founder and managing partner of Brighton Capital Advisors, Michael Cohen, shares how The Cosmo refinancing ranks within today’s CMBS landscape and what it signals for hospitality financing more broadly. 

This episode looks at the relationship between artificial intelligence risk and private real estate investing. Major firms including Amazon, Meta, Google and Microsoft are projected to spend approximately $650 billion on AI and related infrastructure. Amazon alone says it intends to spend $200 billion on AI, chips, robotics and satellites. Will these plans prove to be sustainable long-term strategies, or is this a sign of a bubble? How an AI-driven correction could impact institutional private real estate – in terms of capital flows, asset pricing and demand assumptions – is a pertinent question. This is especially the case in light of the industry's push into the data center sector, both in the US and Europe, across equity and debt strategies. But the impact of a correction would not necessarily stop there. This week, we ask Goodwin Gaw for his perspectives on the subject. Listen as the co-founder and chairman of Gaw Capital Partners, one of Asia's most prominent private real estate managers, addresses how investors might position themselves to capture AI-related growth while remaining defensive against cyclical volatility. For real estate, data centers may be the most obvious way to ride the AI wave. But they’re not without risk. If sentiment shifts or capital tightens, that part of the market could feel it first. What may emerge instead is a two-pronged approach to investing: doubling down on the fundamentals of necessity-driven assets on one end, and high-conviction luxury and lifestyle assets on the other. Gaw says this is a moment for the industry to stay nimble, to anticipate disruption and to be firmly on the front foot. This episode is an excerpt from a wider interview between Gaw and Jonathan Brasse, PEI Group's real estate editor-in-chief. The discussion was recorded as part of a webinar for PERE Network members, designed to share insights emerging from PERE's Advisory Board conversations.

This episode is sponsored by AllianceBernstein European real estate is entering a new phase, with values reset, interest rates stabilising and investors adjusting to a world where ultra-low borrowing costs are no longer the norm. In this episode of The PERE Podcast, Clark Coffee, chief investment officer of AllianceBernstein’s European commercial real estate debt business, discusses why this shift is changing the balance between equity and debt investing and why downside protection has become paramount. He notes that one challenge in today’s environment is trying to understand what assets might be worth if business plans fail or markets shift – a task made more urgent by rapid changes driven by AI, remote working and evolving real estate use. Against this backdrop, Coffee sees European real estate debt becoming more popular among investors as a secure source of income. To read more about European real estate debt, check out the latest deals in Real Estate Capital Europe's lending database

The rapidly institutionalizing industrial outdoor storage sector is back in the spotlight this week thanks to an agreement struck by Brookfield Asset Management to take real estate investment trust Peakstone Realty private for $1.2 billion in cash. The deal marks a dramatic return to the IOS space for Brookfield, which sold a portfolio of IOS properties it had aggregated in the US for $277 million a year ago, and highlights investors’ growing conviction for a hot subsector of the broader industrial market. With that mega-deal setting the tone, The PERE Podcast takes a deep dive into the industrial outdoor storage market – including the most basic question: What actually constitutes IOS? What is driving investors’ and fund managers’ aggressive pursuit of scale in the fragmented sector? And what do their varying approaches suggest about the outlook for the category? Host Greg Dool sits with PERE Credit deputy editor Randy Plavajka and PERE Deals reporter McKenna Leavens to discuss all of these questions and more. Later in the episode, we hear from Price Booker, chief investment officer at Maryland-based manager and industrial outdoor storage specialist Realterm, for his perspective on the risks, opportunities and growing investable market associated with IOS strategies. Citations: Brookfield takes Peakstone private in $1.2bn deal - PERE Deals Realterm reels in €470m for second European IOS fund - PERE

If you're a regular listener, tell us what you think. We are currently inviting feedback via this survey as we seek to improve our podcast output. We would love to hear your feedback on what you enjoy about these weekly episodes and to better understand what we can improve.  Show notes The oil-rich economies of the Middle East’s Gulf Cooperation Council have long been essential capital sources for private real estate managers, with the region well-represented among the largest institutional investors in the asset class globally. But for a growing number of firms, Middle-East real estate is now emerging as a destination for capital deployment too. On the latest episode of The PERE Podcast, we discuss how economic diversification, growth forecasts, regulatory reforms and relative isolation from tariff volatility have prompted several international asset managers to launch or commit to strategies targeting the region over the past year, including Gaw Capital, Blackstone, Brookfield Asset Management, SC Capital Partners and Rava Partners, among others. But investment in the region comes with its own unique risks, as exemplified this week by news that Saudi Arabia is scaling back previously outlined plans for several ambitious development projects, including the futuristic city known as 'The Line.' Do depressed oil prices, tightening liquidity conditions and continued geopolitical concerns represent a threat to these institutional plays targeting the region? Or are more firms likely to join the rush undeterred? Host Greg Dool sits with PERE’s EMEA editor Charlotte D’Souza and PEI Group’s real estate editor-in-chief Jonathan Brasse to break it all down. Later in the episode, Brasse sits down with Ghada Sousou, managing partner of executive search firm Sousou Partners, which last year formed a dedicated capital advisory business focused on connecting private fund managers with Saudi Arabian institutional capital. Further reading: PERE's Full-Year 2025 Fundraising Report PERE's Global Investor 100 ranking Saudi Arabia to scale back Neom megaproject - The Financial Times Blackstone forms $5bn Gulf logistics venture Gaw Capital's Middle Eastern promises Hillhouse's Rava debuts in Gulf with school platform

Net-lease strategies have long occupied a distinct niche of the broader commercial real estate market as a stable, low-risk, long-term inflation hedge. But after a string of billion-dollar deals involving some of the world’s largest private real estate firms, the net-lease sector is anything but boring. On this episode of The PERE Podcast, host Greg Dool sits with PEI’s real estate editor-in-chief Jonathan Brasse and PERE Deals reporter McKenna Leavens to discuss the latest high-profile capital formation event: a $1.5 billion logistics joint venture between Singaporean wealth fund GIC and Realty Income, the largest listed US net-lease REIT. Listen as the team discusses several unique aspects of the deal, including its role in the ongoing convergence of public and private real estate portfolios, as well as the precedent set by GIC’s previous push into the US net-lease sector with a $15 billion privatization of STORE Capital three years ago. We also shine a spotlight on net-lease strategies generally: what they are, how they work and why they are an area of growing conviction for private real estate investors. Later in the episode, we are joined by Scott Merkle, managing director at sale-leaseback and M&A advisory firm SLB Capital Advisors, who shares his own informed perspective on the net-lease sector and what market participants can expect there in the year ahead. If you're a regular listener, tell us what you think. We are currently inviting feedback via this survey as we seek to improve our podcast output. We would love to hear your feedback on what you enjoy about these weekly episodes and to better understand what we can improve. 

On this week’s episode, the team turns to the ultimate barometer for institutional appetites toward private real estate: fundraising volumes. The release of PERE’s full-year 2025 fundraising report earlier this week brought news of a long-awaited rebound in capital formation in the asset class after some challenging years. But what is really behind the recovery, and what does it suggest about where things are headed in 2026?  Listen in as host McKenna Leavens is joined by PERE editor Evelyn Lee and PERE Americas editor Greg Dool to break down the overarching takeaways – including that fundraising volumes climbed nearly 30 percent year on year to mark the first annual increase since 2021 – as well as some of the more complex stories beneath the year's big stories.   The episode explores the outsized role played by mega-managers, the resurgence of opportunistic strategies, divergent regional outlooks, the data center effect and why fundraising timelines continue to stretch to new record highs.  Later in the show, listeners will hear from Ryan Cotton, head of real estate at Boston-based Bain Capital, who has a fresh perspective on the topic after recently closing his firm’s third flagship real estate fund on $3.4 billion in commitments.  If you're a regular listener, tell us what you think. We are currently inviting feedback via this survey as we seek to improve our podcast output. We would love to hear your feedback on what you enjoy about these weekly episodes and to better understand what we can improve. 

For the year’s first episode of The PERE Podcast, the team lays out some of the major themes likely to impact the private equity real estate market over the next 12 months.   Join co-host Lucy Scott, PERE editor Evelyn Lee and PEI real estate editor-in-chief Jonathan Brasse as they look at how geopolitical turbulence continues to unsettle the real estate industry as its re-opens after the holiday break. The team also digs into how financial disruption caused by the bursting of an AI bubble could overshadow optimism. In addition, hear from David Steinbach, global chief investment officer at Hines, as he chats with co-host Greg Dool about his expectations for the year ahead, including his forecasts for dealmaking and capital deployment. If you're a regular listener, tell us what you think. We are currently inviting feedback via this survey as we seek to improve our podcast output. We would love to hear your feedback on what you enjoy about these weekly episodes and to better understand what we can improve. 

For the year’s final episode of The PERE Podcast – and the second installment of our two-part year-end series – the team is closing out 2025 with a look back at the investors, managers and themes that reshaped the private equity real estate market over the last 12 months.   Co-host McKenna Leavens is joined by PERE editor Evelyn Lee and PERE Deals editor Guelda Voien to unpack the biggest stories of 2025, from major M&A activity and headline-grabbing deals to the unique ways market participants found opportunities in a volatile and capital-constrained world.  The conversation explores the surprises that emerged as some sectors gained momentum and drove investors back into action, and the stories that resonated most with readers throughout 2025. The team also reflects on a milestone for PERE Deals, marking its first full year as a standalone publication, and its coverage of a noticeable pickup in capital deployment in the year’s second half.  Looking ahead, the editors share their perspectives on whether fundraising conditions are set to improve, the outlook for continued M&A activity and where investors are likely to place their bets as the calendar flips to 2026.  In case you missed it: Catch up on last week’s episode recapping the biggest themes in real estate debt here.

As the year draws to a close, we will spend the next two weeks breaking down the top private real estate headlines from 2025, as well as the trends that defined market activity. Next week, equity is in the spotlight. This week, the team is zeroing-in on debt, the engine room of the industry. Lucy Scott sits down with PEI real estate debt gurus Daniel Cunningham, editor of Real Estate Capital Europe, and Samantha Rowan, editor of PERE Credit, to discuss the best-read content of the year, the standout themes and their takes on what these stories tell us about the forces shaping the European and US credit markets. The team also give their insights on how these themes will play out in 2026. Will competition, a defining feature of the debt markets today, intensify? And if so, where will lenders go to deploy capital and find fresh ways to stay competitive? The team also breaks down the topic of back leverage lending – one of the biggest stories this year – and looks at how this theme might evolve as more lenders seek to use the tool in Europe.

Lending activity is ramping up in European real estate markets amid rising appetite from banks and alternative lenders alike – even as a limited number of investment deals to finance creates intense competition for opportunities. That is just one of the takeaways from affiliate title Real Estate Capital Europe’s annual Active Lenders report, an exclusive compendium of 64 of the continent’s busiest real estate debt providers through the year’s first three quarters. On this episode, host Greg Dool chats with Real Estate Capital Europe editor Daniel Cunningham and senior reporter Silvia Saccardi for a dive into the key findings, including the fact that this year’s list indicates a resurgence among traditional banks in addition to their alternative counterparts. Later in the episode, we hear directly from one of those Active Lenders, Leumi UK’s head of property finance Peter Clayton, for his perspective on the list and what it suggests about where the market is headed in 2026.

This episode discusses ICG’s retrenchment from Asia, following a line of western managers doing the same. We also speak to Gaw Capital, chairman of Goodwin Gaw, about his views on the current trend and the firm’s own renewed focus on the region. Last week, PERE revealed plans by Intermediate Capital Group to shut down its Asia real estate business. The London-based firm, which manages approximately $7 billion of real estate assets, only expanded into the region three years ago.   Its withdrawal follows a number of private real estate investment management businesses and investors announcing similar plans, a trend of deglobalization being driven by geopolitical forces. While this is occurring generally, the impact of deglobalization on Asia is especially pronounced. Other recent examples of western managers backing away from the east include AEW, which has halted its flagship regional fund series, and the Ontario Teachers’ Pension Plan, which has disbanded its Asia real estate team.   Discussing these issues with The PERE Podcast host Lucy Scott is PERE’s Asia senior reporter Christie Ou. Listen as they dissect the trend, starting with Ou’s reporting on ICG’s plans.   PERE’s editor-in-chief Jonathan Brasse also calls upon Goodwin Gaw, co-founder and chairman of Hong Kong-based private real estate manager Gaw Capital, to share his views.   He tells PERE: “The days of financial engineering trumping local knowledge are over”, adding how managers with deep local knowledge and presences are best equipped to prevail given how wider forces have reshaped the opportunities in private real estate markets. Gaw also reflects on his own firm’s decision to stop offering more institutional products in western markets as part of a strategy to retrench to Asia.

Transaction activity has at last been picking up in the private real estate market after a multi-year slowdown. But one area that has stayed consistently busy has been the dealmaking environment for property fund managers themselves. A string of deals dating back to last year has seen fundraisers band together to boost their assets under management, diversify their client offerings and seek to capture a greater share of capital from an increasingly disparate set of global investors and capital sources. One trend that has emerged of late has involved several manager stake sales that fit a similar paradigm: Large Japanese corporations, often with ties to the hefty investment arms of major insurance businesses, acquiring US- or Europe-based asset managers with sizeable real estate exposure. From last week’s PERE exclusive on insurer Tokio Marine buying a majority stake in US real estate debt fund manager ACORE Capital, to Mitsui Sumitomo announcing the purchase of an 18 percent stake in Barings, to Mitsubishi Estate buying a majority stake in London-based Patron Capital – a deal which officially closed in the last week – and multiple other deals this year, one thing is clear: Japanese buyers represent a cohort of investors with serious appetite for private asset managers with inroads in the Americas and Europe. Is it a trend? What is driving the activity? And what does it portend for the managers being acquired, the consolidators doing the acquiring, and those positioning themselves as the next targets? The latest episode of The PERE Podcast highlights several of these deals, with host Greg Dool in conversation with PERE editor Evelyn Lee and senior reporter Harrison Connery. Later in the episode, we also hear from Patron founder Keith Breslauer for an update on his firm’s transition to Mitsubishi ownership and whether the market can expect to see additional similar deals moving forward.

This episode is sponsored by Manulife Investment Management As new industries evolve and accelerate, new opportunities are constantly arising for institutional investors in the private real assets space. It isn’t always easy, however, for managers to grasp hold of these opportunities. As assets like data centers have become investable in recent years, managers have found that they need to devote time and effort to understand the dynamics around these unfamiliar assets. And the private markets industry has occasionally been guilty of obsessing over which labels to apply to emerging assets. This is the first episode of our Private Markets 2030 podcast miniseries, part of PEI Group’s wider initiative exploring how private markets are evolving as we enter the decade’s second half. Across the series, we unpack how managers can adapt, attract capital and deliver performance in an increasingly complex market. Joining us are three guests from Manulife Investment Management: Erin Patterson, global co-head of research and strategy; Maggie Coleman, the firm’s chief investment officer for real estate equity and co-head of global portfolio management; and John Anderson, global head of corporate finance and infrastructure. They discuss how multi-product managers have an advantage in expanding into new opportunity sets and argue that a multi-product approach offers obvious benefits around diversification, while allowing managers the flexibility to pivot into new opportunity sets.

A recurring theme in real estate private equity this year has been the proliferation of capital into so-called “niche” or alternative property types beyond the traditionally institutionalized sectors such as office, retail, industrial, multifamily residential or hotels. But while much attention has been paid to the emergence of segments including data centers, student accommodations or outdoor storage, another area of rising conviction among both institutional investors and their asset managers is affordable housing – particularly in the US, where mounting supply shortages have evolved into what most observers describe as a crisis. Increasingly, private market investors want to be a part of the solution, and a growing cohort of asset managers are devising ways to address the problem while also creating strong opportunities for risk-adjusted returns. On this episode, co-host Greg Dool is joined by PERE Credit editor Samantha Rowan and PERE Deals editor Guelda Voien for a look at why affordable housing is increasingly viewed as a strong match for institutional investment portfolios and the managers hoping to capture those allocations. We also hear from Alicia Glen, founder of New York-based private equity firm MSquared, which is currently raising its second impact-focused essential housing fund, in conversation with PERE Podcast co-host McKenna Leavens. Further reading: PERE: MSquared’s Glen: ‘We need to do things differently’ in affordable housing PERE: CIM Group holds first close on debut fund focused on US affordability crisis PERE Credit: Mamdani win underscores need for affordable, middle-income housing National Association of Realtors: First-time home buyer share falls to historic low of 21%, median age rises to 40 American South Capital Partners announces $60 million first close of its third affordable housing fund Federal Reserve Bank of New York: 2025 Case Study on Managers of Multifamily Affordable Housing Private Investment Vehicles

In this episode, host McKenna Leavens sits down with Jonathan Brasse, PERE editor-in-chief, and Evelyn Lee, PERE editor, to unpack the optimism circulating at PERE Network’s 20th annual America Forum, held earlier this week in New York City. The flagship event brought together a record-breaking number of industry leaders and investors across the private real estate landscape. “Palpable optimism” is the way Brasse described the feeling in the air. Listen as he relays the growing confidence among participants that the worst of the capital markets dislocation is over. The podcast reflects on key themes contributing to a positive mood, including the expectation of a rebound in transaction activity and the growing prevalence of core risk-return strategies. Development is also becoming a talking point. Listeners will also hear from Jesse Hom, chief investment officer of real assets and head of real estate credit at Blue Owl, who joined a panel discussing signs of a strong recovery in the market. But there were also notable degrees of skepticism, as Lee explains. Despite improving supply-demand dynamics, there are still uncertainties around long-term interest rates, rising inflation and government deficits, leading some to feel the industry is not yet out of the woods. Read also: PSP, La Caisse explore recalibration of property portfolios  

In this episode, host Greg Dool sits down with Jonathan Brasse, PERE's real estate editor-in-chief, for a deep dive into one of the biggest forces transforming the private markets landscape: manager consolidation. The discussion explores why private market managers across asset classes are acquiring or partnering with other businesses in a bid to scale up, and what that means for investors and the markets they serve. The conversation hinges on the release of PEI Group's Private Markets 2030, a series that takes a look at the major forces shaping the alternative assets industry. Listen as Dool and Brasse unpack the shifts fuelling consolidation. Among increasing demands for diversification and transparency, they focus on a major change in the sources of capital that support managers. For three decades, private markets have been fuelled by institutional investors. But as these institutions reach target allocations, two other sources of capital – private wealth and insurance capital – have emerged, with both the appetite for private market exposure and the means to access it.