Claim OwnershipChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie
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In our podcast, we dive deep into metrology, calibration, and proficiency testing bringing you real stories, expert insights, and candid conversations from our 85+ years of combined experience. This isn’t just another technical podcast; we’re here to challenge the status quo, discuss industry changes, and tackle big questions like whether calibration labs are failing to train the next generation or if automation has gone too far. Expect lively discussions, industry leaders as guests, and a little fun along the way. As Howard puts it, “Proficiency testing is checking that transition from theory to application. But what happens when techs are just pushing buttons?” And Chuck adds, “We’re not teaching technicians how to measure anymore—we’re teaching them how to press ‘go.’” Whether we’re reflecting on our journeys—like Howard’s path from Air Force electronics to writing calibration procedures for the NFL—or debating metrology’s future, we promise to keep it engaging, informative, and unfiltered.
24 Episodes
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In this episode, Chuck and Howie welcome Troy Thomas, President of Essco Calibration Laboratory, back to the show, but this time Troy takes the lead and turns the tables on the hosts. Instead of being interviewed, he brings the questions many labs have about proficiency testing and what really happens behind the scenes. Chuck and Howie share their perspective on how artifacts are characterized, how reference values and traceability are established, and why careful handling and clear instructions matter as kits move from lab to lab. Troy adds his experience from the laboratory side, talking about how proficiency testing can uncover small issues that lead to important improvements in processes, training, and measurement practices. The conversation also touches on how the calibration industry continues to evolve, including the growing role of technology and the potential impact of AI tools.
Chuck and Howie hit pause midseason to return to the open, unscripted conversations that launched ChatNAPT. Starting with recent headlines, they dig into responsibility, ethics, and the real-world impact of metrology work—especially how small oversights and complacency can snowball into bigger issues. They also discuss leadership, mentorship, accreditation, and staying engaged for long-term professional growth.Chuck reflects on NAPT’s 30-year milestone and how it grew into a leading proficiency testing provider for the metrology community. The episode closes with a preview of upcoming guests and an invitation for listeners to submit questions and future topic ideas.
In this episode, Chuck and Howie sit down with Stephen Doty to reflect on a career that spans Navy calibration work, pressure and vacuum metrology, accreditation program leadership, and quality management at NASA. Stephen shares what brought him out of retirement and into the metrology lab at Marshall Space Flight Center, and how that environment encourages collaboration, shared best practices, and true partnership with internal customers. The conversation explores the evolution from legacy standards to ISO/IEC 17025, why ongoing education (for both labs and customers) matters, and how contract review and process consistency help prevent “quality blind spots.” They also discuss how accreditation has changed over time, what labs should consider when choosing an accreditation body, and why proficiency testing and interlaboratory comparisons remain essential tools for validating competence and improving measurement performance. The episode wraps with Stephen’s personal path into metrology and practical advice for those entering the field: stay curious, ask questions, and be a sponge for learning.
In this episode, Chuck and Howie welcome Tom Lilly, CEO of Global Cents, to talk about a topic that impacts every accredited lab: document control. Tom shares how regulated organizations manage SOPs, approvals, records retention, and audit readiness and why “if it’s not documented, it didn’t happen” still drives quality. The conversation also covers leadership, lessons from military service, and how AI is being used to improve intelligent automation in documentation workflows while keeping humans in the loop. A must-listen for anyone working in metrology, calibration, quality, or compliance.
In this episode, Chuck and Howie sit down with Patrick Jester, Founder of Blackthorn Consulting Group, to explore his unconventional path through aviation, military service, metrology, law, and leadership. Patrick shares how mentorship, discipline, and a commitment to excellence shaped his career—from Black Hawk helicopters to ISO/IEC 17025 assessments and consulting. The conversation dives into leadership values, ethics versus morals, the importance of integrity in quality systems, and how proficiency testing, training, and accreditation support long-term technical competence. Patrick also reflects on industry mentorship, writing Pillars of Command, and his vision for leadership within the metrology community.
In this episode, Chuck and Howie talk with Jon Sanders, President of Additel Corporation, to uncover how technical curiosity, mentorship, and a people-first mindset shaped his path from Hart Scientific and Fluke to leading a rapidly growing metrology company. Jon shares his perspective on simplifying measurement workflows, using automation and AI in meaningful ways, developing talent from within, and strengthening quality through accreditation and proficiency testing. He also reflects on leadership, industry partnerships, and the value of culture and community in building a successful metrology organization.
In this episode, Chuck and Howie talk with Henry Zumbrun, President and fourth-generation leader of Morehouse Instrument Company, to uncover practical insights you can use to strengthen your own measurement programs—from modernizing processes and applying clear decision rules to reducing risk and improving training. Henry shares how curiosity, mentorship, and hands-on problem-solving can accelerate your expertise, highlights Morehouse’s force measurement guide and 40-week training series as tools to elevate your work, and offers personal reflections on leadership, community, and the company’s long partnership with NAPT.
In this episode, Chuck and Howie sit down with Michael Walsh, former owner of Essco Calibration Laboratory, to trace his journey from a small family business to one of the nation’s most respected calibration labs—now part of Transcat. Michael shares how his father’s work on the Apollo missions inspired Essco’s beginnings, how teamwork and trust fueled its growth, and why investing in young talent is key to the industry’s future. They discuss Essco’s nearly 30-year partnership with NAPT, the company’s lasting impact on metrology, and the importance of community and leadership. Along the way, Michael talks about his passion for golf, sailing, and music, and reflects on what it means to carry forward Essco’s legacy within the Transcat family.
Chuck and Howie continue Season 2 with a deep dive into the evolution of calibration management software with Rhett Price, CEO of IndySoft. From humble beginnings in a small calibration lab to leading one of the industry’s fastest growing software companies, Rhett shares how innovation, teamwork, and customer focus have driven IndySoft’s success.They explore how digital transformation, cloud technology, and data integration are reshaping the future of metrology and what it takes to lead through that change. Along the way, Rhett opens up about the culture he’s built, his passion for music and pinball, and why curiosity is key to leadership.
Chuck and Howie kick off Season 2 with a candid, behind-the-scenes look at how metrology is shifting in today’s world, from industry consolidation and evolving technician training to the never-ending debate around measurement uncertainty. They mix sharp insights with humor and real-world stories, challenging listeners to think about where the field is headed and what it really means to keep precision, integrity, and purpose at the center of our work.This season’s theme spotlights C-level executives who make a real difference in metrology. Across the board, we’re featuring leaders shaping the industry, and we’re looking for more. If you’re a CFO, CEO, COO, CTO, or any other C-suite making an impact, Chuck and Howie want to hear from you!
After 14 episodes of metrology insights, industry banter, and real talk, ChatNAPT closes out Season 1 with a heartfelt and entertaining finale. Chuck and Howie look back on conversations with 11 standout guests, share behind-the-scenes stories, and hint at what’s ahead in Season 2, from C-suite spotlights to metrology-musician jam sessions. They also dive into integrity, risk, and why “buyer beware” isn’t enough in today’s calibration world. As Chuck puts it, “If you don’t solve the problem, you are the problem.”
Episode 13 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie features a sit-down with longtime metrology figure Ted Green, a self-taught electronics enthusiast whose fascination with schematics and gadgets in high school launched a career that’s taken him from military tech school to leading one of the Navy’s premier calibration labs. Now serving as the Technical Manager at the Navy Cal Lab in Seal Beach, Ted reflects on his time at Lowry AFB, his roles at Hughes Aircraft and McDonnell Douglas, and his deep involvement with the Measurement Science Conference. Chuck and Howie also mark World Metrology Day, celebrating 150 years since the Metre Convention and discussing how standardized measurement has fueled progress from early aviation to the space race.
Episode 12 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie dives into a hot-button issue shaking up the calibration world: ethics and integrity. Joined by industry veteran Jeremy Sims, founder of NexusCal and longtime metrology professional, they explore where things go wrong, from pencil-whipped calibrations to inconsistent standards enforcement. Jeremy shares insights from decades of auditing labs, highlighting that integrity issues often stem from either willful neglect or simply not knowing what’s required. With real talk, sharp insights, and a touch of humor, this episode digs into the challenges and responsibilities facing calibration professionals today.
Episode 11 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie features Ryan Egbert, President and founder of Sine Calibration and Sine Certified, talking about the critical need for hands-on training in the metrology field. From military roots to civilian solutions, Ryan shares how his program is helping bridge the gap, especially for transitioning veterans.
Episode 10 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie features metrology veteran Dilip Shah, President at E=mc3 Solutions. With over 45 years of experience, Dilip shares how his fascination with measurements began at the age of seven and evolved into a career marked by industry-shaping contributions. The trio discusses Dilip’s impact on standards, training, and certifications, his philosophy on simplifying technical topics, and why he remains passionate about helping the community. It’s a mix of humor, history, and metrology insights you won’t want to miss.
Episode 9 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie features Troy Thomas, President of Essco, about his unexpected journey into the metrology world—from answering a newspaper ad to leading a successful calibration company. They discuss the changing landscape of talent in the field, the importance of curiosity over credentials, and what makes someone truly excel in metrology. The conversation is full of insights on hiring, growth, training challenges, and even a bit of music talk as the group dreams about forming a calibration band at future conferences.
Episode 8 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie features metrology legend Christopher Grachanen, whose decades-long career spans the U.S. Air Force, NASA, Compaq, and National Instruments. A pioneer in the field, Chris developed the original free Uncertainty Calculator and other widely used tools that transformed calibration labs around the world. He shares stories of innovation, leadership, and his role in launching NAPT, along with surprising passions like playing in bands and hunting for diamonds. Tune in for an inspiring blend of technical insight, industry history, and personal stories from one of metrology’s most influential figures.
Episode 7 of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie features Peter Unger, co-founder of IQEIS and former President & CEO of A2LA. With decades of experience from NIST to building A2LA, Peter shares how the organization got its start, the role of General Motors, and why proficiency testing is essential to lab accreditation. Chuck and Howie reflect on their early days with Peter, discuss global PT challenges, and bust myths about government-led accreditation. A must-listen for anyone in the lab world.
In this sixth episode of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie, we’re looking back at the people, places, and moments that made the first half of our podcast journey so memorable. From trade show floors filled with familiar faces to behind-the-scenes laughs about bourbon preferences and three-wheeled scooters, this episode captures the heart of the metrology community. You’ll hear highlights from recent conversations, lessons learned from the road, and a few personal stories that remind us why precision matters.
In this fifth episode of ChatNAPT with A.I. Chatterbots Chuck & Howie, we are joined by Jim Hewston, Director of Quality and Training at Cross Company and a proud NAPT board member. Jim shares his unique path into the field, starting with his days at NIST and rubbing elbows (and beards) with metrology legends. He brings a fresh perspective from the testing side of the industry and helps explain the key differences between captive and non-captive labs. But before we get technical, Chuck and Howie bond over their beloved (and beleaguered) Chiefs, classic TV like Gunsmoke and Johnny Carson, and the art of No-Shave November. Expect laughs, some serious industry insights, and a few beard-growing tips along the way.
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