The Hollow Bunny Leadership Podcast

Former police chiefs Kristen Ziman and Sylvia Moir get real about leadership, hypocrisy, and why everyone has a built-in radar for "rules for thee, but not for me." Mixing candid stories – from paying personal parking tickets to calling out line-cutters at the Hollywood Bowl – they explore the fine line between legitimate job perks and pure entitlement. Ultimately, the hosts lay out practical guardrails for keeping your credibility intact: make sure privileges belong to the position rather than the person, keep trusted "truth-tellers" around, and always be the first one seen following your own rules.

Sometimes the pre-show chat goes on so long that we have enough for an entire podcast. And sometimes we're up against a deadline. Both of those things happened this week, so please enjoy the random, meandering conversation with Kristen, Sylvia, and Producer Ted. They talk about KZ & Syl's recent trip to California, the culture of tipping, and whether or not it's ok for men to pee sitting down. It's a whole lot of nothing but a whole lot of fun – we hope you enjoy this episode.

In Episode 78 of the Hollow Bunny Leadership Podcast, former police chiefs Kristen Ziman and Sylvia Moir dive into the middle of leadership decisions and what happens when radical ideas hit unexpected wobbles. Kristen shares a story from her time as a police lieutenant, where giving officers the autonomy to choose their assignments based on their passions led to a massive 300% increase in performance – until an external disruption caused a temporary dip, giving an opportunity for a critical commander to push back. Reflecting on organizational trust, workplace autonomy, and leading without ego, Kristen and Sylvia dissect the crucial boundary between principle and pride, offering a masterclass on how leaders can navigate self-doubt, stay anchored to their core mission, and avoid handing their judgment over to their loudest critics (or their own pride).

Episode 77, “Never Purchase Loyalty,” explores how leaders can create unhealthy loyalty by bonding with employees over shared grievances, especially complaints about other leaders. Kristin and Sylvia discuss why shared negativity can create a quick sense of connection, but also why that loyalty is conditional: if someone becomes loyal because you validate their complaints, they may turn on you when you eventually challenge them, set a boundary, or hold them accountable. They emphasize the difference between acknowledging someone's experience and endorsing their conclusions, encouraging leaders to listen carefully, ask what actually happened, take legitimate concerns seriously and redirect people toward resolving issues with the person involved. The episode also turns the mirror on leaders themselves, warning against enjoying the feeling of being the person everyone comes to complain to. The larger message is that trust should be built by making truth safe, even when it's complicated—not by using someone else's grievance to make them feel closer to you.

For Episode 76 of the Hollow Bunny Leadership Podcast, Kristen and Sylvia got out of the studio and onto a stage in California, where they recorded a live episode during the RISE conference. In front of an audience of women in policing, they went back to the beginning – sharing the story of how they met, explaining what "hollow bunny" means, and revisiting some of the stories and lessons that have shaped the podcast over the past four years. For longtime listeners, there’s something pretty great about hearing some of those stories again, this time with a live audience reacting along with them. And for anyone new to the podcast, it’s a chance to get to know Kristen and Sylvia and understand what the Hollow Bunny is all about without having to start at Episode 1. The live setting also gave the conversation a different energy and made for a particularly powerful episode for women working in the profession.