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The Art of Sales

Author: Gray Matters

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Welcome to The Art of Sales, by Gray Matters – the podcast that redefines selling.


Sales isn’t just about cold calls and spreadsheets; it’s a craft. We’re here to help you turn selling into a fulfilling pursuit by focusing on empathy, psychology, and truly understanding your audience.


In a fast-changing world of new technologies, evolving buyers, and shifting economies, adapting is key. Whether you’re in sales, running a business, or leading marketing, this podcast will help you embrace change and continuously learn.


No more sales-as-usual. This is The Art of Sales.

14 Episodes
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In this episode of The Art of Sales, Adam is joined by Catherine Allison to unpack why most pitches are won or lost long before the creative idea is judged. Drawing on the What Clients Think survey, Catherine explains why 71 percent of pitches fail due to softer factors like chemistry, confidence and how teams show up in the room. They explore the fine line between confidence and arrogance, why agencies often default to broadcast mode, and how pitching should feel more like a conversation than a performance. Catherine introduces the Gravitas Equation: Knowledge + Purpose + Passion - Anxiety = Gravitas. She explains how this balance helps teams communicate with authority without tipping into ego. From listening properly to understanding your value and being present with clients, this conversation is a reminder that winning business is as much about how you show up as what you show. https://mastertheart.co.uk/
In this episode, Chris Muldoon shares the story behind Punch, the sales and entertainment agency he co-founded after an early entrepreneurial stint in music. He explains how Punch evolved from a sports and entertainment agency into B2B lead generation and sales development, overcoming the challenges of commission-based models by adopting more scalable approaches. Chris reflects on key milestones, including implementing the EOS framework to bring structure and clarity to rapid growth, and navigating the cultural shifts brought on by remote working during COVID-19. He stresses the enduring value of human connection in sales, even as AI and automation reshape the landscape, and outlines Punch’s recent expansion into the U.S. market. Closing with advice for the next generation of salespeople, Chris champions focus, adaptability, and mastering the fundamentals as the keys to long-term success. https://www.punchb2b.com/
In this episode of The Art of Sales, Adam Graham sits down with Eniko Tarkany-Szucs, who leads strategic partnerships at LinkedIn, to explore what selling looks like when trust comes before targets. Eniko shares her career journey from early social media roles into SaaS, sales leadership and partnerships, reflecting on how her approach has softened over time as relationships became the real long game.They unpack why the best sales feels more like theatre than pressure, the importance of reading the room, and how confidence often matters as much as competence, especially for women in sales and tech. The conversation also dives into AI’s growing role in sales, where automation can help and where authenticity still matters most. From partnerships and pitching to culture, confidence and human connection, this episode is a reminder that great sales is rarely about pushing harder, and much more about understanding people better.
2025 review: Agency Sales

2025 review: Agency Sales

2025-12-1811:00:00

In this short end-of-year solo episode of The Art of Sales, Adam reflects on what 2025 really felt like for agencies and founders. Not the highlight reel, but the realities beneath the surface.He touches on familiar themes from the year: longer sales cycles, tighter budgets, plenty of ghosting, and why being busy didn’t always feel secure. Adam also shares a few thoughts on how AI moved from novelty to normal, and why clear thinking and positioning matter more than ever.Looking ahead to 2026, he offers a handful of simple principles for navigating what’s next, with a reminder that clarity, consistency and human trust still win.
This episode of The Art of Sales takes us inside the global rebranding of Jose Cuervo - Adam Graham speaks with Hanisha Kotecha, former Client Chief Officer at Creature London and Aileen Cotter from Proximo Spirits. This conversation explores how the world’s number one tequila set out to shift long-held perceptions and show the spirit’s true versatility. Aileen shares the realities of leading a global brand across markets with very different drinking cultures, legal frameworks and expectations. Hanisha lifts the lid on Creature’s pitch process, how they built trust early, and why strategic clarity mattered more than a single creative idea. Together they unpick what it takes to produce a culturally sensitive, modern campaign rooted in real insight, genuine collaboration and a deep respect for Cuervo’s Mexican provenance. It’s a lesson in partnership, process and the craft behind brand transformation. https://www.moderncitizens.com/ https://proximospirits.com/
In this episode of The Art of Sales, Adam talks with Laura Tannenbaum, CEO of Fabric Social and co-founder of That Lot, the social agency that redefined how brands show up online. Laura shares her journey from journalism to agency life, from local newspapers in Cambridge to building one of the UK’s most culturally tuned-in creative agencies. She reflects on the early days of That Lot, the power of reactivity in social, and the lessons learned from growing an agency from four people to 150 in just a few years. Now leading Fabric, Laura talks about scaling fast but right - protecting culture, championing diversity, and creating an environment where creativity thrives. She opens up about managing ADHD, balancing leadership with parenthood, and redefining what it means to lead with authenticity, empathy, and trust. It’s a conversation about creativity, culture, and the kind of leadership that puts people, not process, at the centre of growth. https://fabricsocial.com/
In this episode of The Art of Sales, Adam sits down with Matthew Isales, founder of Isales Solutions, to explore how structure and systems can transform the way small businesses sell. From earning $4 an hour in a Dominican Republic call centre to running a global sales consultancy, Matthew shares his journey into the world of CRMs, automation, and scalable sales processes. They unpack why most CRMs fail, how to fix broken sales pipelines, and the balance between process and personality in modern selling. Expect practical advice on building sustainable systems using tools like Pipedrive, how AI is reshaping sales efficiency, and why true success still depends on the human touch. Whether you’re a founder still selling on instinct or a sales leader ready to scale, this episode will help you turn your sales chaos into consistency. https://www.isalessolutions.com/
When Smarty Mobile set out to find a new creative partner, they weren’t just looking for great ideas, they were looking for a true collaborator. In this episode of The Art of Sales, Adam speaks with Jamie Elliott, CEO of The Gate, and Sayed Hajamaideen, Head of Brand and Marketing Communications at Smarty Mobile, about the pitch that led to the award-winning “Less Malarkey, More Smarty” campaign. They unpack what made the partnership work from day one, from The Gate’s culture-first approach and data-driven storytelling, to Smarty’s belief in transparency, trust, and creative bravery. You’ll hear how the pitch process was designed around collaboration, why listening is the most underrated sales skill, and how both sides built a relationship strong enough to weather tough conversations and bold ideas. A must-listen for agency leaders, marketers, and anyone who’s ever wanted to understand what makes a winning pitch and a lasting partnership. https://london.thegateworldwide.com/ https://smarty.co.uk/
The Psychology of Pitching

The Psychology of Pitching

2025-10-2749:00:00

Adam Graham sits down with Marcus Elliott Brown, founder of The Great Pitch Company, to explore what really makes a pitch unforgettable. Marcus shares how his background in theatre, sales, and advertising shaped his approach to helping agencies win work, not through tricks or templates, but through authentic human storytelling. They unpack the anatomy of a great pitch, from qualification and preparation to emotional connection and performance. Marcus explains why the best agencies pitch less but win more, how to avoid “resting pitch face”, and the difference between looking hungry and looking desperate. He also offers advice for handling nerves, building confidence, and creating chemistry in both live and virtual pitch settings. The conversation goes beyond tactics, touching on the mental health toll of pitching, the importance of saying no, and why every agency should plan to be not just “great now,” but great forever. If you’ve ever stood in front of a client and tried to sell an idea, this episode is part therapy, part masterclass and proof that pitching, when done well, can be an art form. https://www.thegreatpitchcompany.com/
In this episode, Chris Kemp reflects on his 20-year journey in business development and the founding of Ingenuity, the agency–brand connector he launched at just 25. He shares how early challenges shaped the company’s growth and how strategic acquisitions helped diversify and strengthen its offer. Chris explores the evolution of pitching culture, highlighting the enduring role of creativity, personal relationships, and innovative tactics such as events and PR. He stresses the importance of tailoring approaches to each agency and brand, staying adaptable in a shifting marketing landscape, and building resilience through continuous learning. Looking ahead, Chris discusses Ingenuity’s future ambitions, from potential expansion to leveraging AI and new technologies to maintain a competitive edge. This conversation offers both inspiration and practical lessons from one of the sector’s most experienced business development leaders. https://ingenuitylondon.com/
What does it take to run marketing procurement for one of the world’s biggest brands? In this episode, Rachel Wentzel, former Director of Global Marketing Procurement at Adidas, joins us to unpack how the brand balances creativity, efficiency, and collaboration on a global scale.Rachel shares how Adidas has evolved under CEO Bjørn Gulden’s leadership, why in-house production has grown so rapidly since 2020, and how the brand continues to push for inclusivity and authenticity in every campaign.We dig into how agencies can build stronger relationships with procurement, what really drives partnership decisions, and why the best agencies are the ones that blend cultural insight with operational efficiency. Rachel also offers a rare glimpse into how Adidas approaches innovation, from virtual production and AI to the role of music and emotion in shaping content.If you’ve ever wondered what it takes to get on the radar of a global brand or how procurement can actually be a creative ally, this is worth a listen.
This episode of The Art of Sales features Tom Nation from Sandler, whose career began in hospitality before moving into sales. The conversation highlights how soft skills such as listening, building rapport and reading people remain essential in today’s sales environment.Tom discusses the outdated stereotypes that still damage the image of sales and explains why it should be treated as a professional craft rooted in psychology and trust. He shares how technology, data and AI are reshaping prospecting, but stresses that sales still depends on mindset, coachability and discipline. Prospecting, he argues, doesn’t have to be loved, but it does have to be done.The episode closes with a look at the continued importance of in-person events for building connection and community in a digital-first world.https://go.sandler.com/southwest/
In this episode, agency experts Oli Richards and Ellie Ring unpack what it really takes to win new business in today’s oversupplied, competitive market. They explore how creative and media demands have shifted towards short-term, project-based work, and why agencies need to build distinctive brands and stronger client relationships to cut through. The conversation highlights the importance of rigorous qualifying criteria, chemistry meetings, and confident selectivity when deciding which opportunities to pursue. Oli and Ellie also share practical advice on client retention, empowering agency teams, and making CRM systems work harder. They discuss the rise of entrepreneurial culture within agencies and the growing role of personal branding and social selling. Packed with both strategic insights and actionable tips, this episode offers a fresh perspective on how agencies can stand out, stay resilient, and grow in a challenging environment. https://gray-matters.co/ https://www.bartleboglehegarty.com/ https://saatchi.co.uk/
The Art of Sales
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