Smart Agency Masterclass with Jason Swenk: Podcast for Digital Marketing Agencies

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you thinking about expanding your agency through acquisitions? Buying another firm can be one of the fastest ways to scale, but only if you choose the right partners and nail the cultural fit. Otherwise, growth can quickly turn into chaos. Today's featured guest has been through five acquisitions, each one teaching her a different (and sometimes painful) lesson about what truly makes a merger succeed. In this episode, she opens up about her biggest acquisition missteps, the cultural mismatches that nearly derailed integrations, forecasting errors she didn't see coming, and the identity challenges that arise when two teams collide. Kimberly Eberl is the Founder and CEO of The Motion Agency, a full service marketing and communications shop with offices in Chicago, Cincinnati, and Nashville. While the agency offers everything from creative to content, it is unusually strong in public relations with roughly 20 PR pros on staff. Kimberly has completed five acquisitions, navigated the cultural and financial highs and lows of M&A, and grown Motion into one of the most respected independent agencies in the Chicago market. In this episode, we'll discuss: When acquisitions help agencies scale—and when they backfire. Lessons learned from five agency acquisitions. Why agency owners often misjudge valuation and earnouts. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. From Fired Account Director to Agency Founder Kimberly jokes that she is one of those founders who got fired into entrepreneurship. At her previous agency, the account director role was undefined and impossible to succeed in. The revolving door should have been a clue. She lasted a year before being let go and scrambling to figure out her next move. With no grand plan, she fell into freelancing in 2006. The economy was healthy. The demand came fast. And pretty quickly she reached that moment every accidental agency owner hits. Either say no to work or hire help. She chose to hire. That early decision set the tone for the next decade. Instead of trying to do it all herself, she leaned into building a team and letting the business grow past her personal capacity. Outgrowing a Single-Service Model: Moving Beyond One Specialty Kimberly started as a PR pro. That focus worked for a while, but eventually she noticed how much money she was leaving on the table. Clients wanted websites, creative, content, and she was constantly referring the work away. The big shift happened when she decided to expand beyond PR and bring more capabilities in-house. This meant hiring outside her comfort zone and learning how to oversee work she could not personally do. That decision opened the door to real growth. Many agency owners get stuck right there. They stay in their one specialty because it is safe. Kimberly pushed through that discomfort and built a service mix clients actually wanted. The Reality of Acquiring Another Agency: Lessons from 5 Acquisitions Kimberly opted to add these new services through acquisitions. So far, she has completed five and every one had a different lesson. Her first major acquisition was bold. She bought an agency twice the size of her own. Financially and emotionally, it was a lot. Looking back, she admits she may not do a deal that large again, especially in a specialty she did not personally understand. But she also learned that size does not determine complexity. A one-person agency with contractors had just as many integration headaches as a larger shop. What mattered most was agency culture. Some deals looked perfect on paper but fell apart because the values, expectations, and behaviors did not align. One deal in particular was financially great and culturally awful. She kept one client from that acquisition. Another deal was financially terrible but culturally perfect. Years later, most of those staff members are still with her. Her biggest warning: never ignore cultural red flags during the courting phase. Take time to hang out with the sellers, how they operate, and experience their company's culture. Go to dinner, Travel together. You'll notice small behaviors (snapping over minor problems, chronic lateness, lack of transparency) that won't disappear after the contract is signed. Valuation Mistakes That Kill Good Deals Kimberly also dove into how she approaches valuations and why so many sellers get this part wrong. She focuses on future performance, realistic forecasts, and removing costs that will not continue after the sale. She also pushes back on inflated projections. If an owner claims revenue will double, the earnout should reflect that. Big promises are fine, but they should come with big accountability. One agency she walked away from wanted a valuation equal to twice their gross revenue. They were using cash-based accounting and ignoring profitability. It was an immediate red flag. Kimberly's advice to owners is simple. Build a business that is sellable even if you never plan to sell. Get your financials clean. Use accrual accounting. And be realistic about your numbers. Leadership, Loyalty, and the Hardest Skill — Letting Go As the agency scaled, leadership challenges became just as complex as financial ones. Kimberly admits she is confused about why she is the largest woman-owned agency in Chicago at only seventy people. She is proud of the title, but she wonders why more women are not reaching similar scale. There are no differences in capability, but many female founders still hit a ceiling often tied to loyalty, delegation, or difficulty letting people go. Some owners, especially women, treat their team like family and struggle to make hard decisions around performance. She admitted she has been loyal to a fault at times and is working on finding a healthy balance. Agencies function more like all star sports teams. The roster changes every year. People get promoted, moved, or sometimes released. That does not mean you failed. It means you are adapting so the team as a whole can win. Kimberly is even working on building hobbies outside her agency because she noticed how much of her identity was tied to work. It is a relatable struggle for founders who have poured years into their companies. AI Changes the Work, Not the Need for Agencies Let's be clear, agencies are not going away because of AI. Kimberly certainly doesn't believe that. She treats AI like an intern. Helpful. Fast. But still needing quality control, creativity, and leadership. Clients still want real relationships. They want someone who understands context and nuance. Agencies serving tech-savvy individuals will feel churn from AI, but agencies serving plumbers, service-based businesses, and non marketers will be fine. These clients want to stay in their lane and hire experts for everything else. Marketing evolves, but agencies survive because the business model adapts. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What do you do when a business partnership fails? Do you try to engineer the perfect agreement so the exit is clean, or focus on alignment long before anyone signs anything? The truth is, most agency partnerships fail because owners rush into them without slowing down to see the cracks. Preparing for the worst is not pessimistic. It is how you protect the business you are trying to build. Today's featured guest has gone through failed starts, broken agency partnerships, and overcommitting his time as the owner for fear of losing opportunities. He'll unpack 25 years of wins, mistakes, and hard earned clarity, from building his agency and how the biggest breakthroughs came from leadership shifts rather than marketing tactics. Andy Crestodina is the co founder of Orbit Media, a Chicago based web development and optimization agency approaching its 25th year in business. Orbit has grown to a team of fifty five and more than eight million in annual revenue. Andy is also one of the most respected voices in content marketing, with millions of readers, hundreds of speaking engagements each year, and a reputation for teaching real strategy instead of recycled tactics. In this episode, we'll discuss: Slow, organic for consistent agency growth. What a failed agency partnership can cost you. The hire that gives an agency founder their time back. Learning when "yes" becomes the problem. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. How Slow, Organic Growth Built a 25-Year Agency Andy was working as an IT recruiter in the nineties and found himself bored at his day job. He didn't get to build anything in that position and he had a lot of ideation urging him to do something else. Luckily, the internet offered him that chance. He could build a website and channel his creative energy through that side project. But could he do it full time? He had no resume and no portfolio to present to a potential employer. He realized it was easier to get a client to take a chance on him than it was to convince an employer to hire him. So he and a high school friend started building sites. The first partnership failed fast and then the second attempt grew slowly, quietly, and steadily for 25 years. The secret was not paid ads or cold outreach. It was content. Consistent publishing, useful insights, and a commitment to organic channels long before that became mainstream advice. When Agency Partnerships Go Wrong and What It Really Costs There are many stories of successful partnerships in the agency world, but overall the disaster stories are much more common. As Jason says, you either know the bad partner or you are the bad partner. Andy lived through one of the toughest versions of that story. He had three partners for a while. One of them ran an unprofitable department. Responsibilities were unclear. Values were not aligned. And when it came time to clean up the mess, a poorly written shareholder agreement became a bigger problem than the partner himself. Andy had to mortgage his home and personally lend the company money to buy out the partner. The agreement used the wrong valuation formula. The partner dragged his feet and what should have been a difficult but clean process turned into a long, expensive, emotionally draining separation. Looking back, Andy says something most founders never admit. A handshake would have been better than the shareholder agreement they had. The real mistakes came earlier: saying yes to a partner who did not share the same values, not slowing down long enough to evaluate the deal, and being hungry for growth and ignoring misalignment. The Leadership Hire That Gave the Founder His Time Back Around this time of misalignment between partners was when a long time client turned management consultant stepped in. He saw tension inside the partner group, so he moved to do a 360 review and surfaced the problems that no one wanted to say out loud. Andy was quick to spot that he would be a great addition to the agency, and so eventually, he became the CEO. That single hire changed everything. Andy was doing all the sales and marketing. Meetings all day. Proposals all night. Burning energy on tasks someone else should have owned years earlier. Once his new CEO came on board, he built systems, built a sales process, hired strategists to handle qualification and scoping. Suddenly Andy had 20 hours a week of his life back. He poured that time into content and went right into work. He doubled publishing frequency, launched a conference, wrote a book, held monthly live events, shot videos. The brand exploded. Their reach multiplied. The inbound engine went from effective to unstoppable. This is the founder shift so many agency owners avoid. Letting go. Delegating the work that drains you. Investing your best energy into the work that grows the company, not the work that maintains it. Saying Yes, Saying No, and Protecting Your Energy Andy admits he still overcommits. He still says yes to speaking engagements because he loves the stage and it generates leads, even though the constant travel wears him down. This is something many agency owners have to face. You may want the brand, speaking gigs and reach. But you also want to protect your energy so you do not turn into the hero who disappoints people when they finally meet you. At some point, you have to choose where your yes goes. Andy chose articles, newsletters, LinkedIn, webinars, a conference, and in person events. He let go of podcasting. He narrowed his focus so he could go deeper. That discipline, more than any tactic, is what keeps his inbound engine healthy 25 years later. The Tension Between Culture and Profit How do you balance loyalty to your team with the need for profit and EBITDA? Andy is still trying to figure this out. His team has an average tenure of eight years. Some team members have been there twenty. Andy cares deeply about them and their families. But agencies face moments when bonuses, salaries, utilization, and capacity collide. Where doing right by people and doing right for the business feel like competing priorities. There is no perfect answer. But there is a direction. Take care of your people first. Trust them to help you solve the profit problems. Fix leaks. Raise rates. Tighten scope. Operate like owners. And when the agency wins, let your team win with you. Culture breaks agencies faster than anything else. Profit can be fixed. Culture cannot be patched over. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What would you do if the merger you believed would change everything suddenly collapsed? Agency owners often dream of the big exit: the acquisition, the payday, the validation. But if you've been in this industry long enough, you know the story rarely goes as planned. Today's guest lived through the dot-com boom, a merger gone sideways, a rare "un-merger," and multiple reinventions across three decades. Today's featured guest is an agency owner who lived through the dot com boom, a merger gone sideways, an unmerger (a rare event), and multiple reinventions over three decades. He'll talk about his journey and the lessons he's gained in resilience, clarity, and what it means to build a business that lasts. Tom Snyder is the founder and CEO of Trivera, a Milwaukee-based agency that originally launched in 1996 under the name Website Solutions. He got his start back when tables ruled the web, Netscape Navigator was leading the browser war, and you had to explain to clients what the internet even was. Tom's agency grew quickly through the dot com boom, became part of an early multi-agency rollup, unmerged after the dot com crash, and later rebuilt itself around strategic services, recurring revenue, and emerging technologies. Thirty years later, he has seen nearly every high and low this industry can deliver and has the scars and wisdom to match. In this episode, we'll discuss: The roll up that seemed like a dream and the subsequent meltdown. The rare chance to unmerger. Learning to adapt to new technologies. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. The Early Days of the Web: A Front Row Seat to Digital History Tom got into websites before most people even understood what a web browser was. He recalls visiting a friend in 1995 who showed him a website for a local jeweler. The fact that someone in Milwaukee could suddenly sell jewelry to anyone in the world blew his mind. That spark soon became Website Solutions, a one-man shop in his duplex basement that grew into a million-dollar agency within three years. These early days were defined by scrappiness. There were no WordPress installs, no Mailchimp, no Shopify. Agencies wrote their own CMS platforms, email tools, and ecommerce systems. For years, Trivera worked on project-based engagements. Sell a website. Build it. Launch it. Then hunt for the next one. It created a revenue roller coaster that made it hard to grow. Then the breakthrough came when someone asked a simple question: Why are you not offering annual retained services? Once they shifted the model, everything changed. Retainers gave them predictable cash flow, stability during downturns, and the ability to build deeper, longer-term partnerships. Inside the Dot-Com Boom and the Rollup That Promised Millions By the late nineties, agency rollups were happening everywhere. Big groups on the West Coast were buying smaller shops at high valuations, promising stock payouts that would multiply as the group grew. Tom's agency was acquired by one of these rollups. The offer was attractive: $1 million in stock with the expectation that it could balloon into ten million within a couple of years. For Tom, this was more than a payday. It felt like a way to secure better opportunities for his team. Higher salaries, better benefits, more resources. All the things agency owners often think a larger parent company can provide. But as the ink dried on the deal, the dot com crash hit. Internal battles erupted among the agency owners inside the rollup. Some wanted to scale fast and sell. Others were emotionally attached to their agencies and resisted change. As the economy collapsed, so did the plan. When an Agency Merger Falls Apart Tom describes the internal environment as chaos. Agencies within the rollup started blaming one another for the downturn. Some owners viewed Tom's Midwest operation as a weak link and argued it was a mistake to acquire them. Then came the breaking point. At a Las Vegas meeting that was supposed to chart a path forward, Tom learned that he would lose control of his agency. His wife, who served as CFO, would be dismissed. His team would report to another agency owner. This happened on September 10th. The next morning, as they sat in their hotel room trying to process what to do, the news broke that planes had hit the World Trade Center. The world changed, and so did their priorities. In that moment of clarity, they made the decision to walk away and unmerge. How a Rare Un-Merge Saved the Agency Unmerging from an agency rollup almost never happens. But because the rollup was already fracturing, the leadership was surprisingly open to it. They returned most of the shares, let Tom keep a small portion, and released the original agency name. From there, Tom and his wife rebuilt everything from scratch under a new identity. Although it felt like the right decision to make, they were still exiting what was still a financially stable operation to start from scratch, which was a scary but necessary step to take. They brainstormed names that felt Greek or Latin until they arrived at Trivera. The name itself was available only because the previous owner had just let the domain lapse. It felt like a small sign that starting over was the right move. This reset allowed Tom to build the agency the right way. No irrational exuberance, burn rates, or pressure to sell. Just strong culture, smart financial discipline, and an eye on durable business fundamentals. How Adapting to New Technology Helped Survive in Crisis After the dot com crash, new technologies created fresh opportunities. SEO, email marketing, mobile, and social opened new revenue streams that helped Trivera rebound each time the economy dipped. Tom noticed a pattern. Every downturn was followed by a brand new marketing wave that rewarded the agencies willing to embrace it early. One of the most pivotal moments came during the 2009 recession. The agency had lost clients, payroll was tight, and they needed a breakthrough. Everyone was asking about social media at the time, so Tom and his team built an event called Social Media University. They hustled for two months and ended up selling 400 tickets. The sales and sponsorship revenue kept their payroll alive and catapulted them into a new service category. Events like this do more than create revenue. They cement authority, give an agency a story in the market, and in Tom's case, it opened doors to new clients and positioned them for the next evolution of the agency. Letting Go of Comparison to Stay Focused on the Journey Despite the wins, Tom admits there were years he compared his agency to others and wondered why they scaled or sold faster, especially some that got the tools from his very social media event. It is easy to feel behind when you see competitors raising money, getting acquired, or shouting big revenue numbers. However, there's very little one can actually know about other agency's purchase deals. These stories are incomplete. You never know what the real terms were. You never know the headaches behind the scenes. And you definitely never know if they actually took money home. Success in the agency world is rarely a straight line. It is more often a messy, winding path filled with reinventions, hard conversations, and moments when you question everything. So agency owners struggling and watching others reach new milestones should remind themselves that longevity comes from resilience, not a perfect upward curve. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training As a user, do you still use search engines or have completely defaulted to AI? How will this shift reshape the agency world? How will ads work when people are only getting the one answer they need? Most agency owners are still treating SEO like it's 2012 — optimizing keywords, buying backlinks, and praying to the Google gods. But search has already changed. People are asking AI for answers, not Googling for links. And if you want your agency or your personal brand to stay visible in this new era, the rules are completely different. Today's featured guest will unpack the shift from SEO to AEO and why most businesses are invisible to AI without even realizing it. Kasim Aslam is one of the world's leading voices on Answer Engine Optimization. He runs one of the largest AEO communities and leads a six person research team that has analyzed millions of AI citations to understand how large language models choose their sources. He is also the author of The AEO Blueprint and the founder of multiple companies, including a staffing agency, a mastermind, and AEO.co. Kasim has spent the past year deep in the trenches studying how AI crawlers gather, filter, and prioritize information. When it comes to AEO, nobody has more real data. In this episode, we'll discuss: SEO is over. Understanding AEO. Why brands may get lost in LLMs. The quiet Google change that just changed everything in AI citations. The future of ads. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Why SEO Is No Longer Enough: The Rise of Answer Engine Optimization (AEO) To understand Answer Engine Optimization, we must first understand that, despite what some agencies may be saying, it is not the same as SEO. Traditional search engines prioritize links. That is why entire industries exist around buying them. In the world of LLMs, backlinks barely matter. The number one ranking factor for AI citations is schema markup. And only 12.4% of websites have clean, validated schema. In other words, nearly 90% of brands are invisible to AI crawlers, regardless of how strong their SEO is. Schema isn't just another optimization tactic. It is the visibility layer. It is the metadata that helps LLMs understand and categorize your content. If your schema is broken or missing, AI cannot reference you even if your content is excellent. This is the equivalent of having a beautiful storefront on a street no one can find. The second key is social mentions. In the same way SEO relied on links, AEO relies on people talking about you. For instance, a TikTok comment from someone in the agency industry saying Jason Swenk is their go-to agency guy counts as an authority signal. LLMs weigh these human mentions heavily. Finally, a lot of the nuances on AEO are changing every day, but Kasim has learned that the real key is building authority, long-form content. That along with clear schema and personal brand is the future of staying in the conversation. Why Personal Authority Beats Brand Authority in AI Search One of the biggest shifts Kasim highlights is that answer engines prefer individuals. A person can write a book, earn a PhD, share opinions, create content, develop mastery, and build authority in a way brands cannot. That means generalists are in trouble. If your expertise is scattered, AI won't know how to classify you and won't choose you as an authoritative answer. Meanwhile, someone who goes deep in a single topic becomes the preferred answer. It is a shift away from corporate brand authority and toward personal authority. Authority is not spread across a company anymore. It sits with people. Agencies that hide behind a brand name will lose visibility. Personal brands that plant a flag will win. For agency owners, this is huge. You do not need a bigger brand. You need clear expertise tied to a real person. This is exactly why Jason positions all the Agency Mastery content around him. Personalities thrive. Brands get lost. Where LLMs Get Their Data (and Why That Just Changed Overnight) Kasim's research revealed that 21 percent of all AI citations once came from Reddit. YouTube followed at 18.8 percent. These platforms had deep context and raw human conversation, which LLMs love. Then Google quietly changed everything. Twenty two days before the interview, Google cut off 90% of the internet from AI crawlers by reducing search results from hundreds to ten. Because LLMs rely on deep search results (not the top ten), reducing the searchable depth limits the information AI can access - removing platforms like Reddit from the AI training pipeline. AI tools rely heavily on these deeper results for nuance. By limiting access, Google essentially removed Reddit and other community based sites from the AI food chain. This change sent shockwaves through stock prices and visibility, and most people never noticed. Google is protecting the content needed to train AI because only two organizations truly own the global knowledge graph: Google and Amazon. OpenAI and the rest are crawling, not casing, the internet, which means they operate at a major disadvantage. Google is playing statecraft. And according to Kasim, Google will win the AI race. The Rise of Screenless Search and Voice-Driven Results According to Kasim, we are quickly moving toward a screenless world. Eric Schmidt has said the screenless future is years away, not decades. And the younger generation is already there. Over 55 percent of people under 25 use voice instead of text. Voice queries require different markup, structure, and formatting, and only 0.3 percent of websites use voice schema. Meanwhile, 65 percent of all searches end in zero clicks. People are asking, getting an answer, and moving on. That number does not even include the people who have stopped using search altogether and have already shifted to answer engines. This means your future website is not for your audience. It is for AI. Kasim is rebuilding his personal site in Notion because he believes CSS-light, simple, stripped down sites will perform better for AI ingestion. We are entering a world where content is created for machines first and humans last. How Google Gemini Is Rewriting the Future of Advertising Here is a wild data point. When Kasim set up new Chromebooks for his kids, he discovered the default search engine was not Google. It was Gemini. Google owns Chrome. Google owns Chromebooks. Yet they replaced its primary revenue driver on its own device with a product that currently has no ads. This tells you where the company is headed. They are rebuilding a new knowledge graph optimized for answer engines, while competitors still reply on the old search-oriented graph. And the future ad model will be nothing like what agencies grew up on. If one answer becomes the default experience, where do ads go? How are they shown? What are users willing to tolerate? And will businesses have to give away deep content to earn visibility the same way early YouTubers and bloggers did? These questions will reshape the entire lead generation ecosystem. Data, Moats, and the K-Shaped Economy The people who win in this new world are those who own data. Not tool access or workflows. Data. Custom GPTs, custom models, and proprietary knowledge bases become your moat. We are entering a K-shaped economy. Twenty percent of people and businesses will become unstoppable because their productivity will outpace demand. Eighty percent will fall to zero. The middle disappears. That means agency owners must adapt, evolve, and lean into deep expertise. Vibe coding (the rapid, exploratory use of AI tools) and no code platforms are accelerating this divide. Kasim's team recreated a software that normally costs ten thousand a year in a weekend. Entire SaaS categories are about to be wiped out. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Have you ever felt like enterprise clients were running your agency instead of the other way around? Buried in endless proposals no one reads, forced into rushed timelines, or watching your margins shrink every time a project drags out? Today's featured guest opens up about how he broke out of that exhausting cycle. Instead of over-delivering just to keep big clients happy, and seeing little return, he made the bold decision to focus on smaller, more committed clients who were ultimately more profitable and easier to build long-term relationships with. He'll share what he learned about sustainable growth, including why productizing your services sounds great in theory but can actually become counterproductive when it only happens externally. He'll also explain the sales shift that changed everything: offering a low-risk, "foot-in-the-door" engagement that qualifies prospects, builds trust, and creates a smooth path into deeper service offerings. Charlie Clark is the founder of Minty Digital, a boutique SEO agency focused on travel and lifestyle brands that originally launched in Barcelona and now operates from London. In this conversation, he'll break down the mindset, systems, and strategy needed to stop chasing validation from big brands and instead build a business where profitability, alignment, and respect come first. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why mid-market clients deliver higher profits than enterprise. How internal productization increases efficiency by 3X. How clear pricing transforms the sales cycle. How AI forced a new level of adaptability in SEO agencies. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. From Struggling Freelancer to Sustainable Agency Growth After a short stint in an agency at age 22, Charlie tried to go solo before realizing he didn't yet know how to grow a business. He assumed he could do it on his own and quickly learned he wasn't ready yet. Instead of quitting, he got a job as a Digital Marketing Manager, where he could make mistakes, learn operations, and understand what actually works inside a business. Moving to Barcelona created the perfect environment for momentum. His one-month stay turned into ten years after he landed several clients within weeks. His first retainer was €500 a month, which he laughs about now, but he admits it took years before he learned how to price correctly and move away from low-margin retainers. Those early years were full of trial and error, but the big breakthrough was realizing that charging more wasn't always the key to profit. Charging smarter was. Real Profit Lives in the Middle, Not the Top One of the strongest lessons Charlie learned was that bigger retainers did not equal bigger profit. Working with enterprise clients, he saw they could easily squeeze margins, the team would end up over-delivering, and on top of it all, payment terms were a nightmare. After years, he realized these clients often cost the agency money when the team over-delivered just to keep them happy. By contrast, the clients who had been with him since the early days, the ones paying between three and six thousand per month, were the most profitable and the most loyal. They bought the same deliverables. They stayed for years. And they matched the agency's internal processes beautifully. Once he realized this, he moved to intentionally pursuing that sweet spot. Not the five figure monthly retainers or the cut rate ones. The predictable, operationally aligned middle where the team can deliver consistently and profitably. For Charlie, this changed everything from sales cycle speed to team alignment to lifetime value. Internal Productization: The System that 3X Efficiency Many agencies think productization means selling rigid packages that make you look less strategic. Charlie took the opposite approach. Internally, his team adopted highly productized systems, templates, and SOPs. They knew exactly what to do for a three thousand dollar client versus a six thousand dollar one, and how much effort each one required. Externally, the offer still looked consultative and customized. Clients saw a broad range of what could be included, but the delivery stayed tight behind the scenes. This improved profitability, gave the team clarity, and dramatically sped up onboarding. The biggest win? It eliminated the "start from scratch every time" problem that slows agencies down and kills margins. How Clear Pricing Transforms the Sales Cycle Before productization, Charlie would spend hours on proposals that often got ghosted. Once he added transparent pricing, clear expectations, and prequalification to the website, the right clients were self-selecting before the call even happened. By the time he spoke with them, they understood the price and the structure. Now he closes clients on the call or even through a single WhatsApp message. This is the power of clarity. It shortens cycles, reduces friction, and saves enormous amounts of time for a lean team. However, transparent pricing attracts budget mismatches, so Jason recommends removing pricing from agency's websites and switching to triage calls and the Foot-In-The-Door model. At the end of the day, there are a thousand ways to create a better sales process. What matters is that it filters, qualifies, and positions you as the advisor. Why a Paid Discovery Offer Builds Trust and Prevents Ghosting Both Charlie and Jason agree that a small, paid upfront engagement solves the biggest challenge in agency sales. Trust. SEO agencies in particular fight an uphill battle here. The barrier to entry is low. There are thousands of one-person shops. Many prospects have been burned before. A small paid engagement builds confidence, shows value quickly, and prevents ghosting. The Foot-in-the-Door offer should be simple, done live with the client, and designed to build the relationship. Not overloaded with deliverables that overwhelm the client and make them feel uneducated. When done right, it leads naturally into a larger project and then a retainer. Charlie's Kickstart product functions the same way. For eight hundred dollars, clients get quick wins and clarity. It works because it gives prospects a safe way to test the relationship and because it positions the agency as a trusted advisor instead of a vendor chasing a proposal. How AI Forced a New Level of Adaptability in SEO Agencies Charlie admitted that two years ago he felt bored with SEO. Then AI exploded. Search interfaces changed. Clicks shifted. And suddenly the industry was moving faster than ever. For many agencies, this uncertainty created fear. For Charlie, it sparked energy. He leaned back in, started speaking at events, ran experiments on AI search, and brought a fresh curiosity back to himself and his team. He described the past year as a sink-or-swim moment for agencies. The ones who coasted struggled. The ones who adapted thrived. Lean teams with solid systems could move faster and deliver more value. In his words, being nimble is now a competitive advantage. Figuring out AI reignited his passion in the business but it was far too much to tackle alone. This is why agency owners should have a community to lean on to try to figure out changes in the industry. Your network will determine your speed of growth. Agency owners who surround themselves with peers sharing what works and what fails will survive the next wave of industry change. The ones who go alone will struggle. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Why do clients keep asking for deliverables they don't actually need? How to get them to focus on the outcome instead of the task list? Every agency owner has had clients show up asking for a website, SEO, or a million social posts, when what they actually need is something much deeper: more leads, more profit, more time back, and a business they're proud of again. Today's featured guest broke down how he built an 11-year-old shop that delivers exactly that. We dig into why small businesses really hire agencies, why "selling SEO" is a trap, and how simplifying complex work can make your agency more profitable, more trusted, and a hell of a lot easier to run. Nico Biggi, Founder of The Gorilla Agency a full-service Oregon digital agency that helps small businesses achieve their marketing goals. After applying to 31 agencies and hearing absolutely nothing back, he decided if no one would hire him, he'd simply build the place he wished existed. Eleven years later, his agency helps small businesses fall in love with their companies again by delivering marketing that feels personal, purposeful, and rooted in truth—not hype. In this interview, we'll discuss: Why clients don't want SEO and what small business are really buying. How radical simplicity makes agencies more profitable. Walking away from big clients to make your agency stronger. How AI is changing client expectations. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Why Clients Don't Actually Want SEO (And What They're Really Buying from Agencies) Nico knows why his clients first reach out and he understands that, in reality, no one wants SEO. No one wants a website. No one wants a content calendar. What they want is for their phone to ring. They want predictable revenue and to stop feeling behind. Basically, they want a business that finally looks and performs the way they imagined when they started it. Hence, when Nico sits with a new client, he doesn't take their request at face value. He keeps pulling the thread: Why do you want that? What are you really trying to fix? What's happening behind the scenes that made you reach out today? By the time he gets to the core problem, the tactical service almost never matches the thing they originally asked for. And that's where trust is built—showing clients the real path to their desired outcome, not the task list they think they need. As he puts it: Services are the toolkit. Outcomes are the reason you pick up the tools. How Radical Simplicity Makes Agencies More Profitable and Improves Client Trust During client meetings, Nico strives to strip away the complexity agencies tend to hide behind. Clients don't want a masterclass in keyword density or a dissertation-length PDF they'll never read. They want clarity. To him, the best operators and the best salespeople think like teachers. Teachers take complicated ideas and make them accessible. They speak in a way a fifth grader can understand, because simplicity builds confidence, and confidence builds buy-in. Inside his own agency, this shows up in the way he trains his team. No silos. No "not my job." Everyone learns how every part of the system works, from content, SEO, design, dev, and strategy. That shared understanding creates respect, efficiency, and a culture where no one feels like they're building in the dark. Everyone in his team is taught that no one is above anyone and they're all running the machine together. It's a mindset that creates accountability among the team and helps the client understand exactly what they're paying for. Why Saying No to Big Clients Can Make Your Agency Stronger Every agency owner has a moment where the "big" client forces them to rethink everything. For Nico, it was early on, when a client offered him more money than he even asked for ($10k a month) and three months later, he fired the client. On paper, it was a dream account. In practice, it drained the team, misaligned with their process, and became the catalyst for rebuilding the agency from the ground up. He spent two years refining every process—on-page and off-page SEO, content creation, design systems, communication workflows—all centered around one thing: making sure clients always know where their money is going and how it's working. Most agencies duct-tape their operations when things get messy instead of rebuilding the underlying, broken system. Nico rebuilt his foundation truly believing that all business owners need is for someone to create systems, truly listen to them, and help them articulate what they do for their clients. Authenticity Converts (And Your Clients Need Your Help to Show It) Nico's wife unknowingly became the perfect case study for modern buyer behavior. Before choosing anything (restaurants, local services, events) she checks: Reviews Menus FAQs Photos Location Details User experience Credibility That's what most customers are doing, and the standard Nico sets for his clients. He wants to work with businesses that engage with clients and answer their questions, show their work with real photos, tell compelling stories, show proof, have a clean, intuitive website. If it doesn't pass what Nico calls "the wife test" — if a business doesn't have clear answers, real photos, social proof, strong UX, and transparent information — it doesn't ship. And the same goes for exclusivity: Nico refuses to work with two companies in the same industry and service area. He wants to make one the best, not compete against himself for small wins. How AI Is Changing Client Expectations and Why It Won't Replace Agencies Nico sees AI from both angles: the opportunity and the threat. On one hand, AI makes clients think everything should be instant and $500. He's already had clients send him AI-generated instructions like they're firing off tasks to a robot. The danger isn't AI itself but rather clients misunderstanding what real strategy, design, content, and user experience actually require. But the other side is where he sees massive upside. AI removes the repetitive, thankless tasks that bog agencies down. It gives teams more room to think, solve, and create. It lets agencies deliver more value, not less, if they use it correctly. AI doesn't replace strategy and, more importantly, it doesn't replace the human connection that actually closes deals. Your network is your edge. Tools evolve but human trust, real expertise, and the ability to guide clients through complexity—that doesn't. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Would you ever walk away from a "dream job" to start over from scratch? And if you've spent years building a career inside big brands, does it ever feel like it might be too late to launch your own agency? Most people talk about leaving their corporate job to chase something bigger. Very few actually do it, and even fewer jump without a parachute. Today's featured guest is one of those rare ones. After nearly two decades leading social, content, and influencer teams for household brands, he walked away from his so called dream job to start his own shop without any safety net. Today, he calls himself a brand guy who happens to own an agency. Eric Gray is the owner of Maverick Content Studio, a twelve person, social-first agency for Fortune 500 brands. After a long and successful career in corporate, where he spent eighteen years building high performing social and content teams for companies like Universal Parks & Resorts, Eric realized he did not want the future he saw in front of him. He left Universal with two months of savings and zero clients. His story is a blueprint for leaders wondering whether to leave corporate and build something of their own Today his team works with brands like Advent Health, Winn-Dixie, and Travel + Leisure, helping them build audience, loyalty, and relevance through social-first content. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why target Fortune 500 brands? Why most agencies fail at building their own brand. Leaning on the power of personal brands. The hardest challenge of growing a young agency. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Walking Away from the Corporate Dream Job At age forty-one, Eric had success on paper but a growing dissatisfaction in real life. He was leading big teams, holding a prestigious role, and doing work others envied. But he felt stuck inside a corporate machine that limited purpose and impact. Although he's thankful for the time he spent in that world, he didn't believe he was living his full purpose inside an organization with lots of bureaucracy. With the support of his family and his pastor, Eric decided he didn't want to get to his later years wishing he had taken more risks and took the jump to find out what could happen if he bet on himself. Leaving was messy, scary, and absolutely not the playbook move. No freelancing ramp up. No contracted clients. It was no tidy transition. Yet he trusted that his experience and network would open the next chapter. Looking back, it did. Why Target Fortune 500 Brands? Most new agency founders start small. Eric went in the opposite direction. He targeted enterprise brands from day one because that is where his expertise lived. He had already built the blueprint inside Universal Parks & Resorts and believed he could help other brands treat social as more than an afterthought. Eric knew many enterprise brands still underinvest in social. They focus on one big campaign or hero asset while ignoring the loyalty and connection that is built through consistent storytelling. His agency's entire model revolves around what he calls the connection strategy. It is the belief that brands win when they create emotional relevance around the stories customers already care about. Furthermore, large brands have large scopes, which also means you do not need forty clients. You just need the right five. That became a core advantage as they started growing. Building the Early Client List Through Relationships Eric did not cold call or blast DMs. He leaned into what he had spent years building. A strong network with strong relationships. Most of their early clients came from people who had worked with Eric before, or from friends of those people inside other major brands. Big companies talk to each other more than you think. This doesn't mean it was easy for them. They still have a lot of work to do to break through. But if you invest in your network before you need it, it becomes your biggest shortcut when you step into entrepreneurship. Why Most Agencies Fail at Building Their Own Brand But Eric points out that almost no agencies truly build their own brand. They hide behind their walls and hope referrals save them. Others talk about themselves, focusing mainly on their people, process, and portfolio. Meanwhile they tell clients to produce consistent content, invest in story, and build an audience. When Eric launched Maverick, he refused to be another guy who leaves a corporate job and posts the generic LinkedIn announcement. He started building his personal brand alongside the agency's brand from day one, and worked with his wife to make his agency look and feel much larger than its actual humble beginnings from their home offce. Perception matters if you want to enter rooms above your weight class. The Power of a Personal Brand Eric leaned into his background in sports radio and launched the Radical Content podcast. Within a few months he secured major guests like the former CMO of Chick-fil-A, the head of digital for NASCAR, and leaders from Crocs and other major brands. Those interviews became relationships. Those relationships became visibility. And that visibility opened doors for the agency. The agency's channels became secondary to Eric's personal channels. Not because the company brand did not matter, but because personal brand builds trust faster than corporate messaging. Systems, Volume, and Practicing What You Preach Eric put serious resources into his content system. It started rough, with a single producer who did not fully work out. But it evolved into an eight person content ecosystem producing weekly episodes, daily clips, statics, and text posts. He treats his own brand as the test kitchen for the strategies they deploy for clients. When you do that, the content feels authentic and the results are real. For him, if you stay in the background and don't talk about who you are and what you do, you're losing valuable opportunities to build your audience. You should be the guinea pig for everything you sell. The Hardest Challenge of Growing a Young Agency Two types of struggles hit new founders: agency struggles and the first time entrepreneur struggles. On the agency side, Eric is unrelenting on talent. He will not hire someone just because they have experience. Their standards are high, which means the search takes longer. Orlando is growing but not a major market for high level social and content talent. They once received nine hundred applicants for a creative director role. On the founder side, the hardest challenge is mental. Building a company that feeds twelve families is a heavy responsibility. The expectations you have for where you think you should be often do not match where you actually are. That gap can mess with your head. Eric uses a list of personal non negotiables to stay mentally sharp: hard morning workouts, time with faith, reading goals daily, taking short breaks during the day, reviewing priorities, and going to bed on time. The last one is the hardest for him. But like most discipline problems, skipping the basics is usually what leads to feeling off. Why Agency Entrepreneurship Requires a Long Game Mindset For Eric, entrepreneurship is staring the hard thing in the face and moving forward anyway, which is where his non-negotiables come in. For his part, Jason has always treated entrepreneurship as a game. Sometimes you do everything right and still get hit with a bad roll of the dice. The goal is not perfection. It is persistence. The memories you keep are rarely the easy seasons. They are the nights you and your team fought through the hard stuff. For this reason, his advice for agency owners is to have fun along the way. Don't wait until your kids are grown or your agency is sold to live. Make the journey the part you enjoy. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What if growth doesn't make things easier but actually just raises the stakes? Agency life looks glamorous from the outside, but the real growth usually starts in the messy middle. Today's featured guest just wanted to build something of her own, but quickly learned that growth means the challenges get harder, instead of easier, and that your client and team retention will always be the best measures of success, since it means you've managed to build a business that has a real impact on clients and a culture people never want to leave. She'll share the pressure she felt as the agency got bigger, how she learned to celebrate the little wins, and how she built a culture that has truly worked as a strategic advantage. Elyse Lupin is the president and founder of Elysium Marketing Group, a full-service agency specializing in food and franchise marketing. With more than a decade of running the business, she has scaled from a new mom charging a thousand bucks for her first client to leading a well known, franchise-focused marketing team recognized for expertise, execution, and a culture clients genuinely enjoy working with. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why growth gets harder as your agency scales. 2 metrics that actually predict agency success. How culture became her agency's competitive advantage. The importance of letting go instead of babysitting tasks. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. How Mentoring Can Be the Push You Need Elyse started her agency during what most people would consider the absolute worst time to make a career change. She had a newborn, a mortgage, and a job that drained her every morning as she left her child in daycare. That friction reached a breaking point. A mentor tossed out traditional job options, but Elyse surprised even herself when she said, "I just want to start my own thing." Instead of talking her out of it, that mentor became her first client. It's one of those decisions you look back on and realize how thin the line is between staying stuck and building something you love. In the early days, she charged way too little, as nearly all agency owners do for those first engagements. But like she said, ignorance can be a gift. When you are early and scrappy, you move fast and celebrate every small win because you have no idea what's coming next. Why Growth Gets Harder, Not Easier After eleven years, Elyse said she was shocked by how the difficulty of running an agency evolves. Things do get easier in some ways, but each stage comes with a new complexity level. As the agency grew, so did the pressure to hire better people, keep up quality, retain clients, and juggle new demands that never existed in the early days. You go from hands-on fulfillment to team building to culture shaping to visionary leadership. Each level is a different skill set and none of it is simple. Scaling is not a victory lap. It is a longer, more strategic version of the same game you started with: solve the next problem without losing momentum. For Elyse, it's all about stopping to celebrate the little wins and let herself enjoy watching her team crush new challenges. 2 Metrics That Predict Agency Success: Client and Team Retention A lot of agency owners fall into the trap of measuring success by employee count or top line revenue. Elyse prefers to track retention. She considers it far more meaningful. Clients only stick around if they are getting results and some of her clients have been with her agency since the beginning. Employee retention matters just as much, because no amount of growth means anything if the team delivering the work is burning out or bailing. Even during COVID, when most of their food clients disappeared overnight, Elyse's agency found a way to pivot into B2B, protect the team, and still grow. Not at the same pace, but still upward. That speaks to culture, resilience, and leadership. In the end, what really matters is how happy you are in the business, whether or not your team is happy, and how profitable the business actually is. These are the things that will guarantee you stay in business and not start to resent it. How Culture Becomes an Agency's Competitive Advantage Elyse's agency has a spirit week. costume day. concert tshirt day. team jersey day. They joke about team members hearing her excitement through the office walls. But behind the fun is something serious. A happy team performs better, stays longer, and delivers higher quality work. She also implemented rituals that reinforce positivity and growth. Every Friday on remote days, they kick off with Wins of the Week. Team members spotlight others who went above and beyond, which forces everyone to pause and recognize progress. Then there is Elysium Advancement, a bi-weekly internal training where someone teaches a new AI tool or system. It keeps the whole agency sharp without overwhelming everyone with the nonstop flood of new tech. Finding the Balance Between a Remote and In-Person Team Elyse's agency is in office Monday through Thursday and remote on Fridays. She believes their productivity is higher together, especially since half the business is design focused. Instead of 15 email threads, they solve problems in 30 second conversations. Some teams thrive remote. Others thrive together. The important thing is knowing which one your agency needs. For them, an in-person environment helps them move faster and design better. Letting Go: Building Leaders Instead of Babysitting Tasks Most agency founders struggle with this. Elyse has built three strong department heads who now own their areas. Sure, she still has a hand in more than she probably should, but the structure is finally allowing her to think bigger instead of babysitting tasks. She also knows what her team would tell her to stop doing. Being too loud in the office. Which, as problems go, is one of the funnier ones. The Power of Picking a Niche Years ago, Elyse heard this very podcast's advice about niching down and resisted it. Like most agency owners, she felt her client base was too broad to narrow down. After COVID, she finally made the leap and put a stake in the ground around franchise marketing. She got her Certified Franchise Executive credential, doubled down on franchising events, and made franchise marketing a core part of the brand. And the decision paid off immediately. Franchise systems want a partner who understands their world, their FDDs, their local store marketing needs, and their complexity. Her agency became that partner. And with that clarity came authority, opportunity, and recognition. Niching did not reduce her client pool. It strengthened her position and made her easier to hire. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training AI is changing the agency landscape faster than most owners can keep up with. Tools are popping up daily, clients are asking if rates should drop, and your team is either fired up or freaked out. Today's featured guest talks about what it takes to build an agency that thrives in a world obsessed with shiny new tech, where the edge is not more tools. It is better leadership, human connection, and an incubator mindset that keeps them ahead without drowning in the noise. Michael Davern is the CEO of Incept, an AI-enhanced, digital-first agency that has been around for a decade. Today, his agency blends automation, machine learning, and human-centered strategy to help enterprise clients grow with clarity and smart execution. He is an early adopter who still believes the real edge is human connection and wants to encourage agency owners to really think about who should lead. In this episode, we'll discuss: AI-enhanced vs. AI-first: what actually creates agency value. Leading an agency through rapid AI change. Why human-first agencies win in the long run. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Evolving from a Specific Niche to a Full Service Agency Before agency life, Michael spent years in corporate America and even longer in the music industry as an artist development rep. That career went up in flames when the label collapsed and no one got paid. After a brief return to corporate, he approached his now business partner with an idea to sell text message marketing, and suddenly he was an entrepreneur learning the agency game the hard way. Early on he chased small business clients with $49 starter packages and cheesy platinum tiers. Nobody wanted it. The market did not understand text marketing yet and the value was unclear. Everything changed when an enterprise vendor in the Medicare insurance space let them into their workflow. Overnight texting became a revenue driver. That win opened the door to more enterprise relationships and pushed them to expand far beyond their original niche. What started as a simple vendor relationship ballooned into a full service digital agency. With time, growth came from necessity and opportunity, not a master plan. Michael admits they were often too early to the game, but that curiosity and experimentation kept them alive long enough to get good. AI-Enhanced vs. AI-First: What Actually Creates Agency Value Plenty of agencies slap "AI-first" on their website. Michael prefers to say "AI-enhanced" since "AI-first" implies handing the keys to robots or machines. That is not what his agency does. Instead they use AI to enhance execution. They were early with automation, early with machine learning through the IBM Watson test program, and early with programmatic bidding when DSPs were still new. Those experiments shaped how they work today. Now, they use all this knowledge to save money, time, and drive better results for clients. Clients are not paying for prompts or tools. AI lets the team save time, move faster, and stay in the lab testing new options without drowning in busywork. In Michael's view, agencies are not competing on deliverables anymore. They are competing on thinking. Navigating the AI Gold Rush Without Losing Your Mind There is a tool for everything now and most of them promise the world and deliver nothing. Michael believes the real threat is not AI taking jobs. It is crappy tools cluttering decision making and distracting agency owners from what matters. To keep his team sharp, he sets an AI budget for every employee at his agency. Everyone is encouraged to experiment, explore, and bring ideas back to the incubator. On Fridays, they compare notes. What worked. What flopped. What needs more testing. That culture of curiosity is what keeps them out in front rather than scrambling to catch up. Leadership in the Age of Rapid Change Nineteen months ago, Michael made a call. The company was going all in on AI enhancement. He sat the team down and said, "This is where we are heading." If anyone was uncomfortable, they could talk privately or get help transitioning to a different job. Not one person left. Clarity breeds confidence. When owners waffle or delay, their team feels it. When owners point the ship and support the crew, people dig in. Michael's team embraced experimentation because they were given structure, purpose, and room to contribute. And because of that leadership, his agency now runs on flat rate pricing tied to outcomes. They killed the old hourly model and their clients love them for it. Human-First Agencies Always Win the Long Game When was the last time you met in person with any of your top five clients? That's the type of effort they'll remember. Michael's team meets every top client in person at least quarterly. Their average client lifetime is just under seven years, which is unheard of when the industry average is barely over a year. Real relationships create real retention. When you have shared a meal, a drink, and actual time together, you are not just a vendor. You are a partner. And partners do not get replaced by the next AI First agency trying to undercut your price. The real advantage for your agency will be transparency and the ability to provide a personalized service. AI will give you more time to work on strategy, but you still have to offer the best client experience you can. Ultimately, clients are paying for more brain and less execution, "and doesn't everyone want that?" Michael asks. Choosing the Right Clients and Protecting Your Sanity Another theme Michael returns to is knowing when to say no. Early on, every agency chases whales. The bigger the better. Then you land one and realize it might sink the whole boat. Maturity is learning to pass on the wrong fish or hand them off to someone who is better built for it. Agencies do not need hundreds of clients. They need the right fraction of the market that values what they do. When you protect your focus, your retention goes up and your stress goes down. Michael's agency grows steadily because they stack clients instead of scrambling to replace them. The only clients they lose are the ones who stop paying their bills. Building a Culture of Innovation Without Burning Out Agencies talk a big game about innovation, but most owners are stuck riding a bike with square wheels and they refuse to get off, Michael says. This is the trap most agency owners fall into. They are too busy to innovate, too stuck to delegate, and too overwhelmed to lead. For him, the answer is simple. Get off the bike. Set the direction, and build the space for experimentation, because the future is coming whether you want it or not. Who Should Lead AI Inside an Agency Who should lead experimentation when the owner is overwhelmed? Michael believes someone has to claim the role, plant a stake, and move. At his agency, he oversees the incubator, but several team members drive the work. Your lead developer will experiment with different tools than your creative director. Your strategist will explore different workflows than your media buyer. Give them a budget. Give them a purpose. Give them ownership. The biggest mistake is waiting for someone else to figure it out. Agencies that delay will be crushed by owners who are willing to get to work and figure this technology out. Follow your curiosity. For agency owners stepping into that role, Michael suggests absorbing everything you can and staying curious. And for those who are further down in the ladder but still want to lead experimentation with new technologies: speak up and volunteer. If you're in a culture where that experimentation is not embraced, then maybe it's time to leave. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training If your inbound pipeline dries up tomorrow, do you have a channel that can refill it on demand? Every agency owner needs at least one reliable way to attract new leads when things slow down. Today's guest doubled down on a podcast as his inbound engine, and it paid off big. But launching your first episode is just the beginning. The real growth comes from getting your ideal clients as guests, creating a conversation that builds connection (not just content), and staying consistent long enough to earn momentum. He'll break down how to find the right niche, build authority through partnerships, and turn podcasting into a powerful inbound system that keeps quality leads coming in on autopilot. Chase Clymer is the co-founder of Electric Eye, a Shopify Plus partner agency specializing in conversion rate optimization (CRO) and e-commerce growth strategy. Since 2016, he and his team have been helping direct-to-consumer brands optimize their digital storefronts to drive measurable results. Beyond his client work, Chase also hosts the Honest Ecommerce podcast, where he interviews founders and shares unfiltered lessons on what it takes to grow an online brand. In this episode, we'll discuss: On his strategic partnership with Shopify. Podcasting as a business development engine. The key to consistently booking great guests. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. From Touring Musician to E-Commerce Marketer Before entering the agency world, Chase was a touring musician in a pop punk band. The road life didn't pay the bills, so he began experimenting with photography, design, and digital marketing, all skills that eventually laid the foundation for his agency. Towards the end of his music career, Chase's future co-founder Sean approached him with a few freelance projects. They quickly found themselves with six clients, and a lot of questions about taxes, pricing, and structure. The early chaos of being creators first and business owners second forced them to learn fast, especially when it came to how to position themselves, how to deliver results, and ultimately, how to specialize. As Chase puts it, "We realized if you can validate the results you're getting for people, they're going to be happier to pay you." That mindset led them toward e-commerce, where success is measurable and client satisfaction is tied directly to sales metrics. How Strategic Platform Partnerships (Like Shopify) Accelerate Agency Growth One of the biggest accelerators for his agency was its partnership with Shopify. When the agency first started, they were platform-agnostic, working across WordPress and other technologies. But after joining Shopify's Partner Program, Chase and his team found something rare — an actual human on the other end of the email. That support led to event invitations, collaboration opportunities, and eventually a deep specialization that positioned them as trusted experts. Chase credits much of their success to that early alignment. "We just happened to be in the right place at the right time," and the lesson for him was: pick your ecosystem wisely and go all in. He advises other agency owners to double down on one technology or niche rather than trying to be everything to everyone. "If your roof is leaking, you don't hire a general contractor, you hire a roofer," he says. It's the kind of clarity that will help you see real growth. Does this mean you should only aim to partner with Shopify if you're in the ecommerce niche? Not at all. Chase recognizes that part of their success story came from having found Shopify at its early stages. This allowed the agency to grow alongside them and unlock more opportunities. Using a Podcast as a Scalable Inbound Marketing Channel For many agencies, lead generation is an uphill battle. For Chase, it became a creative outlet that turned into a consistent revenue driver. In 2019, he launched his podcast, Honest Ecommerce, as a way to avoid writing blogs. But over time, it became a cornerstone of his agency's inbound and relationship strategy. Chase now uses the podcast to connect with ideal clients by inviting them on as guests. Instead of cold outreach, he reaches out on LinkedIn to CEOs of brands he admires, offering them a platform to share their stories. That invitation often leads to partnerships, friendships, and often clients. "You're not starting off on your back foot," he explains. "You're building a genuine relationship." Chase also uses the podcast to gain access to industry events. With a media pass, he's able to attend conferences, host panels, and meet prospects in person. Once relationships are formed, his back-end systems, from automated follow-up emails to segmented nurture lists, keep his agency top of mind until the timing aligns for collaboration. Proven Outreach Strategies to Book High-Value Podcast Guests When Chase comes across a brand doing something interesting, he doesn't pitch them services. Instead of positioning himself as another agency trying to sell, he looks to position himself as a platform offering value first. Once a potential guest accepts, Chase sets up a short 15-minute pre-interview call that he personally conducts. He uses this session to walk them through what to expect, answer any questions, and — most importantly — build rapport. As he puts it, "More time in the paint (more reps) makes the second conversation a lot easier." That small investment of time pays off, turning what could be a stiff Q&A into a relaxed, real conversation when recording day comes. This pre-call also helps him assess whether the guest is a fit for his audience and gently coach less experienced founders on how to tell their story in an engaging way. Then, before the episode goes live, he'll sometimes nudge guests to check out a few existing episodes from Honest Ecommerce. This helps them get familiar with the tone and flow of his show. Ultimately, the goal for Chase is always to create a cool piece of content. Anything else that may come from the relationship is a bonus. Why Consistency Is the Real Growth Lever in Podcast Lead Generation Chase believes all agency owners who are serious about making their business a success need to start building the inbound channels that produce on-demand leads. In his case, starting the podcast was the move that changed everything for his agency. However, podcasting will take time to produce results and requires consistency. Many business owners start a podcast and then give up after a couple of months. Publishing your first episode is only the beginning. What follows is a commitment to showing up week after week. "That is half the battle," he says. Podcasting, like SEO, compounds over time. The relationships built and the authority earned don't pay off instantly, but when they do, they create an inbound machine that's difficult to replicate. Pro Tip: Chase also believes podcasting can be a great tool in staying top of mind for clients and being a better strategic partner. He even does bonus episodes with partners and has a separate newsletter for partners he sends once a month with news of what the agency has been up to (attending a conference, launching a new website, etc). It usually produces at least a few referrals. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training If you're one of the many owners concerned that AI will end the agency model, what are you doing to stay relevant? How are you building lasting relationships that help clients see your value beyond executing tasks? Artificial intelligence, automation, and enterprise-level change have everyone in the agency world wondering what's next. However, agencies have managed to stay relevant with past technological disruptions and the answer has always been: you need to adapt. Today's featured guest has scaled his business through seven iterations for over fourteen years by being willing to adapt to change, and the AI era is no exception. He'll unpack how agencies can stay relevant when technology, data, and client expectations are evolving faster than ever. He also talks about the importance of partnership-based client relationships and why soft skills (not just smart systems) are the real differentiator in the next decade. Ben Childs is the President of Digital Reach, a full-stack B2B marketing consultancy serving SaaS, cybersecurity, AI, and data-driven technology clients. With deep expertise in paid media, SEO, RevOps, and digital experience, Ben's team helps enterprise companies integrate their marketing, data, and operations to drive real revenue growth. Since launching in 2011, Digital Reach has evolved through multiple "versions" as it adapted to the changing marketing landscape, becoming one of the most respected players in modern B2B marketing. In this episode, we'll discuss: The soft skills edge that outperforms AI. Why you should start running toward the problem. The power of in-person connections in a remote-forward industry. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. How Agencies Can Stay Relevant in AI Revolution At a recent Ad Week event, Ben heard a fellow agency leader predict that all agencies would be "dead in two years" because of AI. Her point: enterprise companies are developing their own language models and internal data systems, cutting agencies out of the picture. Ben does admit this is true. However, his outlook is more optimistic, seeing several possible solutions. Should agencies be partnering with third-party data providers? Should they adjust their skill set? In his view, the need for strategic expertise and technical problem-solving won't disappear anytime soon. The agencies that thrive will be those who adapt to new tools while deepening their human value—helping clients navigate complexity, not just execute tasks. "The reality," Ben explains, "is that hiring people to help you solve hard problems isn't going away. Business is always changing, and that's a huge opportunity for agency owners willing to think and integrate, not panic." Why Soft Skills Outperform AI in the Agency World As agencies evolve, the differentiator isn't going to be who can use AI faster, it's who can understand and support people better. When it comes to enterprise clients, marketing execution has become table stakes. What truly sets a great agency apart is the ability to navigate organizational politics, manage internal friction, and act as a trusted advisor inside complex companies. "We're armchair psychologists half the time," he laughs. "Our clients know we're good at SEO or paid media. What they really need is someone who helps them get things approved, makes their life easier, and has their back when things get tough." Soft problems will never go away and, Ben argues, may even increase in value when the execution problems potentially become commoditized. Agencies that ignore human connection will lose, just like traditional firms that refused to go digital twenty years ago. In the end, the "people part" never goes out of style. Adapting Your Agency: Lessons from 7 Business Iterations Ben started Digital Reach in 2011 using his grandmother's dresser as a desk and charging $200 a month for Google Ads management. Since then, the agency has reinvented itself seven times—each evolution aligning to new markets, services, and technologies. From scrappy freelancer to B2B consultancy, Ben's philosophy has stayed the same: build, learn, and change before you're forced to. "We're on Digital Reach 7.0 in 14 years," he says. "We'll probably hit version 12.0 in the next ten. You can't just ride your old business idea into Valhalla. Some people will always be better at adapting, and that will never change." WhyPartnership (Not Performance) Determines Client Retention When agencies talk about "partnership," it often sounds like marketing fluff. But Ben explains that true partnership is built on trust and reliability, not just metrics. Most clients don't fire agencies because of poor performance; they leave because of broken trust, poor communication, or lack of understanding. "When clients say, 'You don't get our business,' that's when numbers start to matter," Ben explains. "If they can't trust you when things go wrong, you're done." Ben understands that helping clients solve internal problems like procurement delays or team politics can do more to build loyalty than a great campaign. Running toward the problem, taking ownership, and communicating transparently are the fastest ways to strengthen relationships that last across multiple companies. Build Client Trust Fast by Running Toward the Problem Other than delivering results and making your clients' lives easier, Ben believes another powerful way to build trust is not being afraid to admit your mistakes and being quick to fix them. Honesty builds staying power. When agencies take responsibility for missteps and present a clear plan for fixing them, clients respond with respect, not resentment. Do not avoid the problem. In fact, you should run towards the problem and face the situation head on. You'll get more benefit of the doubt from clients with this attitude. Ben's team once led a client call with bad news—the metrics were down. Instead of hiding it, they explained what went wrong, what they learned, and how they'd adjust. "The client was ready to run through a wall for us after that," he says. "They loved that we owned it." The Power of In-Person Connection in a Remote-Forward Industry As agencies lean more into remote work, Ben calls for agencies to make an effort to meet with clients in person: "In-person will always be in vogue." It'll help your clients understand who you are, rather than just staring at your picture on Zoom, and trying to form a true connection. He encourages owners to set a clear revenue threshold for when to invest in face-to-face meetings—whether that's a kickoff, annual review, or shared conference. When clients meet you over pizza and a drink, it transforms the relationship from vendor to partner. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Is your agency growing fast but still running without the right structure or leadership team to sustain that growth? If too many people are reporting directly to you, it's a clear sign you've outgrown your current setup. But building that next layer of leadership isn't as simple as promoting your top performers. Without a clear strategy, those well-intentioned promotions can backfire, causing confusion, turnover, and setbacks that stall your agency's momentum. Today's featured guest learned that lesson firsthand. After experiencing a year of costly turnover caused by the wrong management moves, he came away with a better understanding of what real leadership development looks like. In this episode, he'll share what it takes to scale beyond seven figures, the mistakes that nearly derailed his agency's growth, and the key shifts that helped him build a stronger, more sustainable business. Brandon Rost is the founder and CEO of be Marketing, a Pennsylvania-based advertising agency that helps brands grow through creative, digital, and media strategies. Over the past decade and a half, Brandon has built his agency from a solo operation into a multi-million-dollar powerhouse by focusing on relationships, resourcefulness, and relentless problem-solving. He's proof that you don't need to have all the answers when you start, just the willingness to figure it out along the way. In this episode, we'll discuss: How to reinvest profits strategically to scale your agency sustainably. Why promoting top performers doesn't already create effective leaders. The KPI's and systems that improved profit and cash flow. The mindset shift that turns fast growth into longterm success. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Why Being Resourceful Is the Key to Building an Agency Brandon didn't plan on running an agency. At the time, he was managing social media for a corporate job and bartending on the side when a PR firm owner offered him a shot at managing her clients' social accounts. What started as ten small accounts quickly snowballed into a full-time business. Like most early-stage entrepreneurs, he had no idea what he was doing at first. He sent invoices in Word documents, figured out HR and finance on the fly, and said "yes" to every opportunity—then learned how to deliver later. It wasn't glamorous, but it worked. That resourcefulness became his superpower. As anyone who has grown a business can tell you, success comes from resourcefulness - not knowing everything. You don't have to know everything right now. Just figure it out and make it work. Scaling Up: Investing Every Dollar Back In the Agency For the first few years, Brandon kept bartending to cover his bills and put every dollar the agency made back into growth. That discipline gave him the runway to build a real company without debt or short-term panic. He hired his first part-time employee within a year, went full-time around year two, and hit seven figures by year four in 2014. However, crossing the million-dollar mark didn't come with confetti and fireworks. It came with more responsibility, more moving parts, and a steeper learning curve. "Everyone thinks hitting a million feels different," Brandon said. "It doesn't. It just brings on more work." Instead of waiting for that milestone to magically change things, focus on building the right foundation so the business can continue to grow without you doing everything. Make it a point to continue to delegate part of that workload every quarter, and after a couple of years, you'll find you've gotten your freedom back. Learning to Lead and Let Go: Building a Leadership Team Brandon learned the hard way that leading people requires a completely different skill set than landing clients. As the agency grew, he at one point had seventeen people reporting to him and eventually realized it just wasn't sustainable. It was the right moment to create different positions that would oversee different departments. However, his strategy was flawed at first; "We elevated people just to elevate them," he said. "And it set us back a year." He never stopped to ask whether or not those employees were ready or even suited for management roles. As a result, they dealt with a year of turnover followed by slowly getting back on track. The lesson for Brandon was: put the right people in the right seats, and don't assume your best technician wants to—or should—manage others. Leadership isn't a promotion; it's a whole new role. Knowing Your Numbers and Turning Chaos Into Profitability Once the business hit its stride, Brandon turned his focus to profitability. He shared how the agency once got caught in a dangerous cash flow loop of collecting Google ad payments for clients and effectively becoming a bank instead of a marketing firm. After untangling that, his team started tracking key KPIs more closely: AGI (Agency Gross Income) in the 55–60% range Net profit around 10–12% Payroll around 33% of AGI By simplifying operations and separating client media costs from agency revenue, they stabilized cash flow and built a healthier margin. Simply put, what you measure improves and, for Brandon, that meant finally treating the numbers as a steering wheel instead of a rearview mirror. Sales: The Last Most Agency Owners Are Ready to Hang Up Even after 15 years, Brandon still handles most of the sales himself. It's something he admits he should've delegated earlier, but building a sales team isn't as easy as hiring a "radio guy" and hoping they sell. After two failed attempts, Brandon realized the problem wasn't the salespeople but rather the lack of systems. Now, the new plan is to support the team with brand marketing, create a "sales tackle box" full of proven client stories, and build repeatable processes for outreach, follow-up, and closing. You'll always be the best salesperson until you document what's in your head. With the right structure and stories in place, a sales team can finally scale what made the founder successful in the first place. What Scaling Fast Taught Him About Patience and Culture Looking back, Brandon said the biggest surprise was how much patience real growth takes—and how easy it is to lose sight of culture while scaling fast. Whether it was figuring out HR policies, managing team dynamics, or setting boundaries for office events, every new level came with a new layer of learning. He now focuses on balance: growing deliberately, empowering leaders, and making sure the culture that got them here doesn't get lost along the way. "We've learned to grow smarter, not faster," he said. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How do you ensure the highest possible retention levels at your agency? What reasons do you give employees to stay and develop their careers at your agency? Today's featured guest hires fresh talent right out of college. People his team can train into the sort of workers who grow with the agency. However, young talent tends to be ambitious and likely to move on quickly to the next opportunity. To boost retention, he has created a growth path for employees that are a right fit with the agency. He'll break down how he's learned to hire intentionally and build a culture that grows people as fast as profits. McKay Salisbury is the founder and CEO of FiveStar Commerce, an eCommerce agency based in Orem, Utah. His team manages Amazon, Walmart, and Target Plus accounts for over 450 brands annually. What started as a freelancing side hustle on Upwork has grown into a full-service agency focused on team development, in-person collaboration, and steady internal promotion. In this episode, we'll discuss: How to hire and retain young talent in a competitive market. Why in-person culture drives faster growth and better retention. The career path strategy that turns entry-level hires into future leaders. How to build systems that grow people as fast as profits. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Growing his Freelancer Gigs to a Thriving Amazon Agency McKay's journey began while working at a small Amazon marketing firm, when he started freelancing on Upwork to make a little extra money. Within six months, his freelance income reached half of his salary, and he decided to go all in. Moving into his sister's basement, McKay began full-time freelancing, which quickly evolved into his own agency. Within the first month after quitting his job, he was already matching his old salary. McKay's early days were lean, but the momentum from focusing entirely on client work set the foundation for future growth. Hiring Early and Building Support Systems McKay's first hire came just a month into freelancing full-time. It was a part-time assistant he had previously worked with. That decision to delegate quickly accelerated FiveStar Commerce's capacity. Within five months, he added his first full-time project manager and opened a physical office. Unlike many agency owners who chase remote freedom, McKay found that in-person collaboration gave him structure, focus, and culture. For him, separation between work and home drives productivity. Just like he had learned in college, where studying at the library helped him focus, McKay found it much easier to create great work and culture working in-person. The physical office became the heartbeat of FiveStar Commerce's growth, helping employees feel part of something bigger and creating accountability that can be hard to replicate remotely. Why In-Person Work Still Wins for Training and Culture When it came time to really build his team beyond just a few employees, McKay found it was either difficult or expensive to find the right talent with experience in his particular niche. It wasn't an option for an agency just starting out, so he leaned on investing time on training young talent. It made sense cost wise, and location wise, given they are near two large universities, which provided a supply of fresh talent eager to learn. To make this approach work, the agency had to adapt its environment to support constant learning. A central part of this is their in-person operations, since McKay noticed that even the smallest physical arrangements, like which direction desks faced, could impact how quickly new hires learned and that having trainers nearby reduced hesitation and built confidence. He also observed that remote employees tended to "float away" after 6–12 months. While remote setups can work for certain roles, McKay found that building culture, energy, and loyalty thrive best face-to-face. This philosophy shaped his agency's identity and helped retain young, ambitious team members eager for mentorship. Designing Career Paths that Retain Talent Beyond intentional training, this strategy worked because he paired it with a clear path for career progression. Every employee starts as a generalist learning all aspects of Amazon management, from ads to design to optimization. After 6–12 months, they move into project management roles, and the top performers advance to senior project manager positions. Each promotion comes with a pay increases - typically around $10,000 per year - which keeps employees motivated and invested in long-term growth. This proved to be a great way to increase retention, which is one of the biggest challenges for growing agencies. As McKay puts it, "If you're not giving people a reason to grow, LinkedIn will." Personality Over Experience: Hiring for Potential When hiring fresh graduates, how can you gauge whether or not they'll be a good fit in the long run? McKay looks for personality traits that predict leadership potential—confidence, communication skills, and curiosity. The interview process focuses on how candidates carry themselves, not just what's on their resume. Those who communicate clearly and think proactively tend to rise fastest. This approach ensures that every new hire is a potential project manager within a year or two. McKay views entry-level roles not as long-term positions but as training grounds for leadership. By prioritizing culture fit and growth mindset, he's been able to maintain consistent quality while scaling quickly. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How are you preparing your clients to start thinking about AI as part of their SEO strategy? Are you educating them on what they can expect now that the landscape is changing with AI optimization? As an agency, you should be starting these conversations because you can be sure your clients are already thinking about AI, even if they still don't understand its applications for how clients will get to their content. Artificial intelligence isn't just changing how people find information, it's rewriting the rules of search altogether. Today's featured guest is already running AI audits for his clients; he thinks all agency owners should be doing this. He'll unpack what AI optimization really means for agencies, marketers, and business owners who've lived and breathed SEO for decades. Vishal Mahida is the Director of Digital Marketing at E2M Solutions, where he helps over 100 agencies scale their SEO and digital marketing operations. With a 40+ person team specializing in SEO, PPC, and operations support, Vishal works directly with agencies on systems that drive measurable growth and keep them ahead of major shifts in the industry. In this episode, we'll discuss: SEO vs. AI Optimization No, SEO is not dead, so your website still matters. Preparing your agency and clients for AI search. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio The Difference Between SEO and AI Optimization There's a lot of buzz around how AI has come to change and maybe even replace SEO. Vishal clarifies that AI optimization isn't replacing SEO, it's expanding it. Traditional SEO focused primarily on optimizing for Google rankings, keywords, and backlinks. The goal was to get traffic from search results. But as Vishal explains, the modern search landscape has fragmented. Users are now searching on multiple platforms including ChatGPT, Perplexity, and Claude, not just Google. This shift means brands must move beyond "ranking on Google" and focus on being visible wherever their audience searches for information. Whether someone asks ChatGPT for "the best roofers in Austin" or Google's AI mode for "running shoes under $5,000," AI systems are gathering and summarizing information across multiple sources in real time, including social platforms like Reddit, Quora, and LinkedIn. Think about it as building a multimedia visibility strategy and ensuring your brand, expertise, and answers exist across platforms that large language models (LLMs) pull from. "You're not optimizing for one search engine anymore," he says. "You're optimizing for how the internet talks about you." Why Your Website Still Matters in the AI Era Will websites become irrelevant if AI answers everything for users? According to Vishal, websites won't disappear, they'll evolve. Think of them as your source of truth rather than your traffic generator. When AI summarizes answers for users, it still references real content and authoritative sources. So, your website remains essential for credibility, events, and conversion, even if fewer users arrive there through traditional search. For instance, if someone asks ChatGPT about agency growth events in Austin, and you've mentioned your event across social media, your website, and podcasts, AI will likely include it in the results. "That's how people find you now," Vishal agrees. "Not just through search but through signals from every platform." Of course, you should still think about the content you're putting out on your website. Are you answering the questions that people are asking? Or you just optimizing for the keywords. Optimizing for the keywords won't work. People will ask LLMs questions and if you're already answering them on your content there are more chances that AI results will find you and list your website. Redefining Reporting and KPIs for Agencies One of the biggest challenges agencies face is explaining to clients why organic traffic might be dropping even as visibility increases. Why? Traditional SEO metrics no longer tell the whole story. So how to report back? Basically, you'll need to educate clients and start measuring mentions, citations, and referrals coming from AI platforms. Vishal suggests tracking LLM bot hits in server logs and monitoring whether AI crawlers are visiting key pages. These indicators reveal your brand's visibility in AI-generated results. While raw traffic might decline, the quality of leads and conversions often improves. "You might get fewer leads," he says, "but they'll be more qualified, because AI searchers are deeper in their intent." Leads from AI chats tend to be more serious buyers who have already researched their problems. The shift, then, isn't a loss but rather an opportunity to educate clients on new performance indicators that reflect where users actually search today. Preparing Your Agency and Clients for AI Search When it comes to optimizing for AI, Vishal recommends a hybrid approach: combine solid technical SEO fundamentals with a new layer of AI-readiness. This includes making sure your site is clean, crawlable, and structured properly, while also ensuring your brand has visibility across other platforms. At E2M, Vishal's team runs AI search audits to check how often their clients' brands appear in LLM answers. They even query ChatGPT and Perplexity directly to see what those systems say about them and their competitors. From there, they reverse-engineer visibility by identifying which platforms, podcasts, or publications help brands get cited more often by AI. Mentions on Reddit, Quora, and podcasts count, even if they're not linked, because they help build trust signals that LLMs detect. Agencies, Vishal says, can sell these as AI search audits, AI content audits, or full AI optimization packages — new recurring revenue streams that build on their SEO expertise. The Human Edge in an AI-Driven World Agencies can't afford to be "order takers" who wait for clients to bring up AI. If your clients are asking about AI before you bring it up, you're already behind. Instead, agencies should position themselves as trusted advisors who help clients navigate the shift confidently. So go to your clients and start those conversations, or you WILL be replaced by AI. At the end of the day, people still want connection, which is why both Jason and Vishal agree that AI will never replace the human element and the strategy, empathy, and creativity that come from real human connection. People will always want someone that can help guide them through the new marketing trends. As Vishal puts it, "Business owners don't have time to learn all this. They want someone they trust to handle it." AI might make average easier, but connection, data, and network will always be your edge. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Is innovation truly at the center of your agency operations? Not just what you offer clients, but in how you operate? With AI raising expectations faster than most agencies can adapt, investing in innovation isn't optional anymore. It's how you build client trust, stay ahead of disruption, and keep your edge. Today's featured guest unpacks his journey from leading the award-winning agency T3 to launching Superstep Capital, a private equity firm investing exclusively in agency and technology-service businesses. His insights cut through the noise on innovation, leadership, and how to stay ahead of the next big shift. Ben Gaddis still calls himself agency guy. After more than a decade building T3 into one of the nation's leading digital agencies, serving clients like UPS, 7-Eleven, and JP Morgan Chase he sold the company and launched Superstep Central, a private equity firm investing in agencies and tech service businesses. When he sold T3 to a private-equity group, he didn't ride off into the sunset. Instead, he crossed over to what he calls "the dark side," founding Superstep Capital. Now, he defines his mission as redefining what private equity looks like in the agency world by partnering with founders to scale the right way. In this episode, we'll discuss: Going all-in on the next wave before clients catch up. Why innovation should be treated as an expectation. Lessons on creating a leadership structure. Why differentiation still wins. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Go All-In on the Next Wave Before Clients Catch Up Ben's family has been running T3 since he was born, so it made sense to him that he'd eventually end up in the agency world. Hence, he started his career working at Omnicom, learning from their biggest competitors, and was around when mobile apps became a thing after the launch of the iPhone. At Omnicom Ben saw how traditional holding companies were too slow to invest in mobile. He didn't hesitate to seize the opportunity that mobile presented. Frustrated, he took over T3 and bet big on the emerging mobile market. That bet paid off with marquee wins and explosive growth, scaling the agency to $50 million in revenue and around 300 employees. His advice for agency owners today echoes that same spirit: burn the boats. You can't half-commit to a new capability and expect to lead it. You can't expect clients to lead you there. If you want to own a new channel, whether it's AI, automation, voice, whatever's next, you have to invest ahead of demand and prove value before anyone asks. If you wait for client demand before you invest, it's already too late. Innovation Isn't a Slogan, It's an Expectation At T3, Ben created a culture where innovation wasn't just encouraged; it was an expectation. So they turned innovation into a measurable habit by creating an "Innovation Match" program where they matched a portion of a client's spend dollar-for-dollar on experimental projects. Clients got to share in the risk and the reward. Those projects became T3's biggest success stories and built a reputation for fearless creativity. T3 chose projects and built roadmaps alongside the clients. turning them into true partners in innovation. The coolest work the agency ever did ended up coming from that program. It even led to another venture project called T3 Ventures, where they invested in c-stage startups. It was all about surrounding his team with people who were doing the newest and coolest stuff and letting their clients see this. It worked much better to show innovation than to just talk about it. Innovation has to live in your budget, not your buzzwords. When your team sees that experimentation is backed by leadership, and even matched financially, they'll start bringing the bold ideas that set you apart. This" Innovation Match" model is a playbook for modern agencies trying to make innovation a repeatable, funded process. Leadership Has to Grow as Fast as the Agency Early on, Ben was a young CEO trying to manage instead of lead. He assumed people could read his mind and execute on his vision. That mistake caused turnover and frustration until he hit pause, clarified T3's mission, and re-aligned around a few focused areas: digital products, loyalty, and CRM. From there, he learned to build leadership in layers. Initially, he brought on a COO, which seemed like the next logical move; however, it wasn't the right cultural fit and complicated everything with the team. It wasn't about what his COO changed, it was how they did it… the entire team rejected this dynamic. Eventually, Ben was able to bring in a COO who simplified instead of complicating. It not only freed Ben to think creatively again and gave the agency room to scale, it gave him back his creative headspace. Agency Structure for Scale: Build Practice Leaders, Not Project Managers The other positive change at his agency was creating the "practice groups". Instead of spreading talent thin across random projects, they paired a portfolio lead with a subject-matter expert. Each duo owned a P&L and growth target. The result was deep expertise, repeatable wins, and new verticals that practically built themselves. Their restaurant and convenience-store niche exploded from 2 clients to 30 in record time. This model solves the scaling paradox of how to grow without sacrificing quality. When your experts own both excellence and profit, growth stops feeling chaotic. The last area they focused on was delivery, fighting to maintain quality as they did the newest thing. In the end, it came down to setting expectations and aligning with clients around what they were bringing to the table. As a result, quality went up. AI, Sales, and What's Next for Agency Growth On the investment side, Ben sees a lot of agencies struggling with hesitation and "no-decision" deals. AI has amplified expectations while compressing margins. Many clients now assume everything can be automated, expecting greater output for less cost. Thankfully, this trend has decreased, as clients were burned by this overreliance on AI. On the other hand, it's clear to Ben that agencies should and must be faster and more efficient, and agencies with a clear understanding of what they do and who they serve are not blindsighted by this new reality. His advice: AI isn't differentiation, it's amplification. The edge comes from how you apply it, not the tools themselves. Know your vertical, know your data, and connect AI to real business outcomes. The agencies that win are the ones that define how AI fits their process - not the other way around. Why Differentiation Still Wins in the AI Era The agencies and individuals winning right now aren't the ones with the fanciest tools or the most automation; they're the ones combining experience, curiosity, and creativity to use AI in smarter ways. Ben shares the story of an account manager who built her own workflows using AI to research verticals, anticipate objections, and walk into client meetings armed with strategic ideas that wowed executives. She wasn't a technologist, she was a strategist who understood her clients deeply and used AI as a force multiplier. That's the real edge in this new era. Tools are accessible to everyone, but insight and application are not. As Ben points out, it's your data, your intuition, and your industry expertise that make AI valuable. AI doesn't replace strategy, it rewards it. The agencies that know their data, their clients, and their niche will always have the edge. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Would you say your agency is truly profitable? Take a closer look and assess its structure, systems, and tools through the lens of business maturity. You may find you're still in the chaos stage, in need of structure and vision. Running an agency often starts with passion and talent, but keeping it running smoothly takes systems, leadership, and a strong operational backbone. This operational maturity doesn't happen overnight. As today's featured guest knows well, it's a process of reflection, restructuring, and relentless improvement. Harv Nagra is the Head of Brand Communications at Scoro and host of The Handbook: The Operations Podcast, where he explores how agencies and consultancies build scalable, profitable operations. As someone who has spent his career at the intersection of creativity, consultancy, and operations, he'll discuss the key stages of agency growth, the pitfalls of immature operations, and the leadership mindset required to scale sustainably. In this episode, we'll discuss: Understanding the agency maturity model. Evolving your agency from chaos to clarity. Growing your leadership to create framework. Data and the path to predictability. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Why Most Agency Founders Aren't Natural Operators Harv has been in the agency space for most of his career, working in marketing and design, and, although he currently works as Brand Communicator for Scoro, he keeps his finger on the pulse of the industry via his podcast The Handbook, where he talks to owners about running great agencies and consultancies. After speaking with so many founders, Harv is aware that operations is often the blind spot for first-time agency owners. They were very good at delivering a service and ended up being an "accidental founder". People start agencies because they're great at marketing, design, or development, not because they planned to manage P&Ls or build operational frameworks. As a result, growth often outpaces structure, and operations fall behind. Early on, these agencies prioritize sales and survival, just trying to land enough business to stay afloat. But as Harv emphasizes, there's a point where founders must transition from doing great work to running a great business. Without operational clarity, even the most talented teams end up winging it, leading to burnout, inefficiency, and missed profit. Understanding the Agency Maturity Model One of Harv's biggest turning points came when his COO introduced him to the concept of a business maturity model. It was an eye-opener. He thought the agency was doing fine, until the framework revealed gaps he didn't even know existed. It showed him that agencies, like people, evolve through stages, from chaotic startups to structured, data-driven organizations. The models vary, but there are usually 5 stages: 1. People challenges 2. process challenges 3. Data and metrics 4. Technology and tools 5. Growth strategy The early stage is where chaos reigns. Processes are tribal, training is informal ("just learn from whoever you sit next to"), and there is no consistent way of working. As the business grows, pockets of best practices emerge, but without unified systems or documentation. The most mature agencies reach a level where processes are standardized, data is reliable, and leaders can make decisions based on insights rather than gut feelings. Unfortunately, only a small percentage of agencies ever get there. From Chaos to Clarity: Building Operational Maturity When Harv stepped into an operations role, his agency was stuck between chaos and maturity. Multiple entities were working in silos with inconsistent tools and workflows. Financial reporting was messy, and onboarding was informal. Everything began to change when they hired a finance director who helped formalize budgeting and systemize financial operations. Together, they redefined how projects were quoted, tracked, and managed, bringing consistency and visibility that had been missing for years. It's a common growing pain for agencies that scale faster than their systems. As Jason recalls, before implementing time tracking, he believed all clients were profitable. The data told a different story: 60% of projects were actually losing money. That realization forced him to fix pricing, reposition the agency, and rethink sales and operations from the ground up. The Leadership Shift: From Fighting Fires to Frameworks Many agency owners reach a ceiling because they're still running their business as they did in the early days. As he moved up the ladder, Harv and his team tried to get the agency's leadership team to realize they were spread too thin, with each senior leader juggling multiple internal roles alongside client work. Once leadership saw the problem, the real work began; creating clarity, documenting systems, and assigning accountability. The key here was clarity, so Harv and this finance director documented everything from budgeting to time tracking, to reporting and resourcing. It was a huge leap in maturity and it consolidated when the founders brought an interim COO who audited operations, restructured the organization, and helped senior leaders focus on strategic leadership instead of firefighting. Finally, there was a clear understanding of where the agency is going, who it serves, and how it operates. Without that, leaders end up managing chaos rather than building growth. Data, Tools, and the Path to Predictability As Harv's agency matured, the next challenge was data and technology. Their systems were outdated, and reporting was cumbersome. Upgrading their tech stack allowed them to collaborate across borders, manage multiple entities, and gain visibility into key metrics like capacity and revenue forecasting. This shift toward being data-driven enabled proactive decision-making instead of reactive problem-solving. Alongside technology, restructuring played a key role. The agency had to make tough decisions about team composition, ensuring the right people were in the right seats. As Harv put it, "Just because someone's been there from the beginning doesn't mean they're the right fit for the next phase." It's a difficult but necessary mindset for sustainable growth. Letting Go — The Hardest Step in Agency Maturity For founders,  growth means letting go. Letting go of old habits, outdated systems, and sometimes even long-time team members. Many owners treat their agency like a baby, and it's a mistake. When leaders cling too tightly, they become the bottleneck. True maturity happens when they can trust the team, delegate decisions, and focus on leading rather than managing. As Harv summarized, agencies should think of themselves less like families and more like sports teams where each player has a role, and the lineup changes as the game evolves. The goal isn't comfort, it's performance. That's what separates agencies that evolve from those that plateau. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How would you go about making acquisitions to accelerate your growth? Would you buy for revenue, culture fit, or client roster? Would you be willing to fire big clients that are holding your agency back? Most agency owners chase growth by saying "yes" to everything, from new services, new clients, and every new opportunity. Today's featured guest built one of the fastest-growing mobile and digital agencies in the world by narrow focusing, firing bad-fit clients, and mastering the art of strategic acquisitions. Today he'll unpack how his agency evolved from a small mobile startup in Tel Aviv to a global digital powerhouse working with brands like Google, Uber, Samsung, and Microsoft. Gilad Bechar is the CEO and founder of Moburst, a mobile-first marketing and digital transformation agency with offices in Tel Aviv, New York, and San Francisco. Since 2013, Moburst has helped startups and Fortune 500s alike scale their reach through creative, data-driven, and tech-forward strategies. Under Gilad's leadership, the agency has raised capital, acquired multiple specialized firms, and built proprietary technology that keeps them ahead of the curve in AI, mobile UX, and cross-platform performance. In this episode, we'll discuss: The similarities between the mobile boom and the new AI era. Raising capital without losing control. Using acquisitions as a growth strategy. The power of saying no and focusing on fit. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. From A Mobile-First Niche Focus to Global Agency Powerhouse When Moburst launched in 2013, the agency world was flooded with "digital experts" who claimed to understand mobile. Most didn't. Gilad noticed that agencies were simply repurposing desktop experiences for smaller screens without real mobile UX thinking, no data-driven optimization, and definitely no understanding of how users behaved differently on apps. That insight became Moburst's edge. Instead of trying to compete as another full-service digital shop, they doubled down on mobile-first marketing. They mastered app store optimization (ASO), performance tracking, and mobile UX design. That focus helped them land early wins with major clients who were desperate for expertise in a fast-changing environment. As Gilad puts it, "When you show big clients that a critical piece of their marketing is being ignored, and you can fix it, that's your entry point." The AI Parallel: Most Agencies Talk, Few Deliver Gilad sees history repeating itself with AI. Just like the early mobile days, everyone's suddenly an "AI expert." But the difference between hype and real expertise shows up fast in a conversation. He believes the proof lies under the hood. Real experts can answer deep implementation questions: which tools integrate best, how to handle data security, and what AI models perform for specific tasks. Pretenders can't. For agencies, this is a reminder that credibility is earned through insight, not jargon. Clients see through the buzzwords. And the ones who don't will eventually learn when the work doesn't deliver. Raising Capital Without Losing Control Unlike most agency founders, Gilad took venture funding, not once, but three times. But he did it differently. Instead of giving away huge equity chunks, Moburst only diluted small percentages (around 6% each round). The investors came to them after seeing how fast their clients were growing. Without that, his agency wouldn't have its current success in the US market and would probably still be a very local agency in Israel. That capital gave him the means to hire a team in New York and then eventually move there to lead that office. It was the start of many new opportunities for the agency, like building internal tech tools that set them apart. It was also the way his team has stayed ahead of the curve from competitors that are not investing in the future and stay too focused on the right here and now. Furthermore, despite having 11 investors, Moburst kept full control. Only one board seat represents all investors, and it can't override the founders' decisions. According to Gilad, that control is what allowed them to make hard but smart moves, like firing clients and cutting costs in 2017 when growth was strong but profitability wasn't. The Hard Reset That Saved the Agency and Restored Profitability In 2017, Moburst was scaling fast but losing money just as quickly. The agency was adding clients and headcount, but without the right systems to manage profitability. At one point, they were bleeding up to $70,000 a month. So Gilad made the tough call: he cut unprofitable clients, reduced staff, and rebuilt the agency around systems that supported healthy margins. "It was brutal," he admits. "We let go of big, well-known clients we loved working with. But it didn't make sense to keep losing money just to say we worked with them." That painful reset worked. By 2018, the agency was profitable again and positioned for sustainable growth. That reset set the stage for their next evolution: acquisitions. How to Use Acquisitions as a Growth Strategy (Not a Gamble) Moburst's acquisition strategy wasn't about buying revenue or chasing vanity growth. It was about buying capabilities that solved their biggest operational gaps. Their first acquisition was a video production studio they had already worked with for over a year. The partnership was strong, the culture aligned, and the collaboration was smooth. So they brought them in-house in 2019 and the agency's offerings instantly expanded. Then they looked at their next biggest outsourced expense: web and app development. So in 2022, they acquired a dev shop after a successful collaboration period. In total, Moburst has made five acquisitions, each one following a simple rule: test first, integrate later. As Gilad says, "We don't buy to solve problems. We buy what already works and multiply it." When asked about whether or not these brands keep their names after acquisition, Gilad says it all depends on their brand authority. If they do great work and have a solid team but their brand isn't as strong, then it's best to just bring it under the Moburst umbrella. In case they do have a strong brand, then they'll just make sure their website reflects they are part of a larger group. How to Structure an Agency Acquisition Deal the Smart Way For agency owners eyeing their own M&A moves, Gilad shared his preferred deal structure. Each acquisition has four key components: Cash upfront - Rewards founders for their hard work. Equity - Gives them a stake in the larger vision. Dividends - Paid yearly so they benefit from the agency's profits. Performance bonuses - Tied to the profitability of their specific business unit. This structure keeps founders motivated and aligned for years to come, without the traditional burnout that comes from rigid earnouts. Everyone wins when growth is sustainable and collaborative. Why Firing Bad Clients Helps Scale Smarter One of the biggest lessons Gilad takes away from journey is the courage to say no: to clients, deals, or directions that don't fit. Agencies often cling to bad accounts out of fear of losing revenue, but simply put, that's a silent killer. If you're not profitable on a client, you're not just breaking even; you're paying for the privilege of overworking your team. Moburst's growth didn't come from doing more — it came from doing what mattered most. By focusing, pruning, and strategically acquiring, Gilad turned a niche mobile startup into a global digital powerhouse. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How are the new technologies and tools shaping the future of agencies? How can you create an agency that outlasts trends? When you've been around for 75 years in the ad world, you've seen it all, from Mad Men, media buying by fax, the rise of the internet, and now, AI. Today's featured guest runs an agency that has been doing full-service marketing since 1950. What's impressive isn't just their longevity but also how they've stayed relevant and human in a business that changes faster than a TikTok trend. Jennifer Spire is the CEO of Preston Spire, an independent Minneapolis-based creative agency that's been helping brands grow with full-service marketing since 1950. She's the agency's fourth CEO, starting in small independent agencies, rising through global holding companies, and bringing both worlds' lessons to how she leads today. That mix of experiences shaped her leadership style grounded in independence, driven by creativity, and fiercely protective of agency culture. In this episode, we'll discuss: Building a culture that lasts seven decades and beyond. Why independence still matters in the agency world. The future of agency talent and AI. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. How One Agency Has Stayed Relevant for 75 Years Preston Spire started as a design shop in 1950 and quickly grew to a full service advertising agency, which differs from what we think of as full service today. Over the decades, it's evolved continuously, reinventing itself with every shift in marketing. Jennifer says the real secret to their longevity is adaptability. "It's really hard to continue to evolve and stay strong, but I think there's a lot to be said for an agency that can evolve and still grow while being relevant." Now they're 25 years away from a century, which is both impressive and humbling, as well as something they want to highlight more. Surprisingly, some advisors have actually told Jennifer it'd be best to not mention their 75-year run, since some might assume a 75-year-old agency should be bigger by now. However, Jennifer has a different perspective. For her, you don't have to be one of the biggest agencies to be better and longevity isn't a weakness but rather proof of resilience and reinvention. From Big Agency Bureaucracy to Small Agency Freedom Before joining Press Inspire, Jennifer spent years inside the machine of large agencies, where shareholder-driven decisions often overshadowed what's best for clients or teams. There, she learned that you don't have to be bigger to be better, a philosophy that now fuels how she runs Press Inspire, as she has chosen to keep it small enough to stay personal but strong enough to compete with anyone. Once she left the big-agency world for an independent shop, Jennifer cut her teeth doing everything from answering phones, assisting on shoots, starting media departments, and running PR. That early experience taught her the one skill every agency leader needs — resourcefulness — something she now encourages young people to develop early in their careers. Her time at big agencies, though, showed her what not to do. "You end up making decisions that are best for shareholders, not clients," she said. "At a smaller agency, I wanted everyone to be able to chart their own path and make decisions that serve both the client and the team." Building an Agency Culture Keeps People for Deacades People stay for decades at Preston, some for 37 years, others 30, and three just recently celebrated 25-year anniversaries. That kind of loyalty is nearly unheard of in today's agency churn cycle. So what's the secret? Balance. Jennifer encourages collaboration between long-time employees and newer hires with fresh perspectives. The agency operates in a hybrid setup, with three days in-office to keep creativity flowing while maintaining flexibility. It's a rhythm that keeps collaboration alive without burning people out. "Being together helps," she said. "That human connection is something you can't replicate over Zoom." Their internal compass is guided by what they call COOP values: Courage, Originality, Openness, and Positivity. The team is encouraged to take risks, fail fast, learn, and keep moving forward. Leading with Clarity: Building Alignment and Growth Paths Jennifer may be CEO, but being at a smaller agency she's not above the grind. She manages operations, oversees HR and finance, and still maintains direct relationships with every major client. That visibility matters because, as she explains, clients need to know leadership is invested in their business. Her team structure also breaks down roles by what percentage of their time is spent leading, managing, or making. This clarity helps people grow without being shoved into management if it's not something they want for their careers. This way, they get to build their unique path within the agency, a key to keeping them happy with their work. Quarterly goals, regular feedback, and individualized growth paths keep everyone aligned and fulfilled — a framework that scales culture without micromanagement. Furthermore, constant feedback, quarterly goals, and individualized growth paths help keep everyone aligned and fulfilled. Why Staying Independent Still Wins for Some Agencies Does a 75-year-old independent agency get offers from the big holding companies? They do, actually; all the time. Jennifer says M&A emails land in her inbox daily. But she's not interested. "We've had serious talks with other agencies," she said, "but we've said no every time. Staying independent is critical to our success." If they sold, they'd probably start making decisions for investors instead of their people and be back in the big agency world she escaped. For Jennifer, independence isn't just about control, it's about protecting the culture that makes their agency different. The freedom to put clients and people first is what keeps the agency thriving. Preparing for the Future: AI's Impact on Agency Talent Jennifer's not blind to the future. She's already planning staffing and financial strategy through 2030, a move that would make most agencies sweat. One question she's wrestling with: how AI will change entry-level roles and career paths. "AI has been an incredible tool and has allowed us to be more efficient," she said. "But if it takes away too much of the junior work, where do mid-level people come from five years from now?" The truth is that the jobs won't vanish, they'll evolve. Junior people using AI can perform at mid-level. Mid-level people can perform like senior leaders. You'll just need fewer of them. Still, Jennifer sees it as a call to action for colleagues and agency leaders alike: train people not just in the AI tools, but in critical thinking, problem solving, creativity, and the human side of marketing. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever wonder how much your agency's growth is limited by staying too broad? Or what could happen if you picked one niche and went all in? Today's featured guest didn't set out to run a food service marketing agency; He followed the opportunities, learned from a few hard lessons selling door-to-door, and eventually discoverd the power of focus. He'll share how niching down, rebranding, and embracing flexibility helped him grow his agency into a specialized agency serving some of the biggest names in food service and the ways in which he and his team refined the agency's positioning. Tyler Smith is the president and owner of Matato, a brand strategy and creative marketing agency focused on food and beverage brands in the food service and "away from home" space. His agency helps those brands reach restaurant operators, chefs, and food service directors with smarter, more intentional marketing. In this episode, we'll discuss: The power of positioning. The difference choosing a niche made for his agency. Flexible selling and empathy in action. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. How Selling Vacuums Led to a Food Service Marketing Agency Tyler laughs about it now, but his first "sales training" involved knocking on doors and demoing carpet cleaners that cost more than most people's first cars. While studying advertising, Tyler was sure he wanted to be a graphic designer or copywriter, and while that door-to-door sales job started as a way earn extra beer money, it ended up being a crash course in marketing psychology. He learned how to capture attention, demonstrate value, and handle rejection — all skills that would later serve him as an agency owner. After college, the 2009 recession hit, and finding a creative job in advertising wasn't easy. So when an agency owner offered him a commission-only sales role, he jumped in. Within a few months, Tyler was closing enough deals to get brought on full-time. Fast forward a decade, and he's now the sole owner of that same agency, rebranded as Matato, now leading a team of specialists helping food brands grow smarter. The Smart Positioning and Rebranding Transformed the Agency When Tyler took full ownership, he knew the agency needed an identity that reflected its niche and direction. The old name didn't quite fit anymore. So he created Matato, a playful twist on "tomato, tomato, potato, potato." It was something memorable, food-related, and (importantly) trademarkable with a clean domain to match. More than a name change, that rebrand was a signal that the agency was doubling down on food service marketing as their core focus. This was a big move for Tyler as he stepped up as the face of the agency. If you can't own your brand, both emotionally and digitally, you can't expect your clients to trust that you'll own theirs. From Generalist to Specialist: Why Niching Down Drives Growth For years, Matato worked with all kinds of B2B and B2C clients. But as they grew, Tyler noticed the most rewarding and most profitable projects were always in food service. So they made the call to go narrow to grow big. That meant focusing on the brands serving restaurants, distributors, and institutions. Tyler's team helps these brands move from a sales-heavy approach to a true marketing strategy, teaching them how to speak to chefs and operators, not just consumers. Now, their content strategy includes things like their annual Food Service Marketing Playbook, a killer lead magnet that doesn't just promote Matato's expertise , it teaches. Some brands use it to DIY their marketing, others see the value and hire the agency. Either way, Tyler's team wins. What Got You Here Won't Get You There Tyler's secret to getting new business in the early days was just "all grind, no strategy." Cold calls, trade shows, follow-ups; just pure hustle. But as the agency matured, that changed. They stopped trying to "do everything" and started refining how they show up. After repositioning more firmly in the food industry, their new game plan is rooted in generosity and authority, giving away insights, teaching the industry, and positioning themselves as the go-to experts for food service brands. Their annual Food Marketing Playbook has gotten them great results, and he has also been dabbling in podcasting, an effort that he admits still lacks consistency. All these changes to the brand and how they approach their audience have been a great way to reinvigorate the business and demonstrates his team understands that you can't just tell people to hire you; you've got to show them why. Empathy and Flexibility: The Secret to Long-Term Client Relationships One of Tyler's biggest lessons when it comes to sales is to stay flexible and empathetic. Instead of rigid packages or pushy closes, he focuses on what the client actually needs and finds ways to make it work. That adaptability has helped him build long-term trust (and some very loyal accounts). Sure, early on it led to a few over-committed budgets and sleepless nights, but over time it became one of Matato's superpowers. Tyler calls it "on-the-fly problem solving", a willingness to adjust, improvise, and make the deal work without losing sight of the big picture. Why Every Specialized Agency Should Start a Podcast Tyler's got deep expertise and connections in his niche. He has noticed podcasting could be the fastest way to build authority and create a content engine without relying on written blogs that no one's reading anymore. It's not just about attention; it's about access. When you interview potential clients and peers in your industry, you're building relationships that open doors. As Jason put it, "It's the number one thing I ever did for my business." How Curiousity Keeps Your Agency Evolving Looking back, Tyler can see that curiosity helped Matato survive and evolve, especially during the pandemic. When food service came to a standstill, his team didn't sit idle. They experimented, collaborated with chefs and influencers, and tested new lead-gen angles. Things are constantly changing and what got you to this point won't get you there. So his message to agency owners is to stay curious and willing to try many things. Otherwise, you'll be doomed to fail.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever looked at your agency's bank account and thought, "We're crushing it!" only to realize two months later that half that cash wasn't really yours yet? Or maybe you've hit that milestone where you start wondering what your agency might be worth if you sold it tomorrow… but your books are a confusing mix of guesswork and gut feelings. Today's featured guest was a finance expert before falling in love with the agency world and has the experience to show how smart financial planning (not just getting more clients) can completely reshape your agency's future. From forecasting and cash flow to the hard truths about selling, this conversation is packed with real-world lessons every agency owner needs to hear. Lacie Edgeman is the partner and co-owner of PrograMetrix, a digital paid media agency that focuses exclusively on programmatic advertising. With a background in finance, she oversees operations and financial strategy. However, like most small-agency leaders, she's worn just about every hat at some point. Her unique blend of financial discipline and operational savvy has helped her agency grow smart, not just fast. In this episode, we'll discuss: The superpower too many agencies ignore. Cash vs. accrual accounting. Why you should always be tracking these two KPIs. How much cash should you keep in the bank? Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. How a Finance Major Became an Agency Owner After earning a finance degree, Lacie joined a digital agency in Austin as a billing coordinator and quickly discovered she loved the chaos. "You either love it or you hate it," she says. "I love the fast pace environment and the fact that it challenges me." That early exposure to how agencies really work, from billing quirks to client chaos, gave her a perspective most creatives never get. By the time she joined PrograMetrix, she wasn't just another partner with ideas; she was the numbers-minded operator who could make sure every big creative idea actually paid off. Forecasting: The Superpower Too Many Agencies Ignore From a finance perspective, Lacie's biggest message for agency owners is to stop running their business off their checking account. "Future planning is where most agencies miss the mark," she says. It's important to review your historical, of course, but Lacie recommends creating a forecast and revisit it quarterly. This way, if you want to add $1 million in take-home revenue, you can map out exactly which KPIs need to move to make that happen.. This is way, if you, for instance, want to add $1 million in take-home revenue, you can map exactly which KPIs need to move to make that happen. That forward focus creates smarter, calmer decisions; especially when things get uncertain. You can't sleep easy until you know what's coming in, what's going out, and how your pipeline will affect cash flow six months from now. Cash vs. Accrual Accounting: How to Stop Fooling Yourself About Profit When Lacie joined PrograMetrix in 2019, one of her first moves was switching from cash accounting to accrual accounting, a game changer for any media agency. Why? Because when you're handling large media budgets, those big lump payments from clients don't actually mean profit. Accrual accounting forces you to recognize revenue when the work is done, not when the check clears. "It's the only way to see what's actually happening," Lacie explains. Otherwise, agencies can get fooled into thinking they're thriving when all they've done is temporarily hold pass-through media dollars. For anyone running paid media, she considers accrual accounting "painful but essential." Furthermore, accrual accounting becomes critical when you're planning to sell your agency. It's not just about cleaner books, it's about protecting your valuation. In cash accounting, all incoming payments hit your revenue the moment they land, even if you haven't delivered the work yet. That can make your agency look healthier than it really is. However, a smart buyer will spot it—and they'll adjust your purchase price down to reflect any undelivered work. If you're serious about eventually selling, move to accrual accounting early so your books reflect true earned revenue. It not only helps you understand your real profitability but also builds trust with future buyers. Building the Right Financial Advisory Team for Your Agency Anyone with prior experience selling a business will probably tell you "if you're planning on selling soon, don't rely solely on a broker". Brokers are financially motivated to close the deal fast, not to get the best terms. Instead, surround yourself with people who don't have skin in the game. Considering that most agency owners probably come from a creative background, Lacie suggests finding financial mentors or advisers who will tell them what they need to hear, not what they want to hear. You don't have to become a QuickBooks expert, but you do need to understand what your financials are saying about the health of your business. 2 KPIs Every Agency Owner Should Track If Lacie were stranded on an island and could only get one napkin of financials, it'd include two numbers: Topline Revenue (excluding media spend) EBITDA (basically your take-home before taxes) EBITDA is very important here, because you can have great revenue but without free flowing funds to invest back in the business, you'll still be a red flag for potential buyers. Those two tell her almost everything about an agency's financial health. "You can only cut costs so far," she says. "At some point, you have to grow the top line strategically." The real game is in balancing both, keeping a clean cost structure while expanding profitable revenue. Owners should also understand adjusted EBITDA, which adjusts for one-off expenses, to get a clearer view of your operational performance. It's something a potential buyer would do any way to get a more accurate picture of your agency's financial health. How Much Cash Should You Keep in Reserve? Ask ten agency owners this question, and you'll get ten answers. Lacie says three months of operating cash is the industry rule of thumb, though she's heard advisers tell sellers to shrink that down to one month before an acquisition. Many would disagree with that advice, but ultimately the right number depends on your risk tolerance and client concentration. If a single client dominates your revenue, then the most important advice would be to secure a line of credit before you need it. Losing a "gorilla client" (one worth more than 20% of your revenue) can wreck cash flow overnight. A credit line buys you breathing room so you don't start saying yes to bad clients just to make payroll. Niching Down Is the Key to Profitability and Valuation For Lacie, niching down was the single best move for PrograMetrix. "When you try to be everything to everyone, you can't scale," she says. Every one-off client that doesn't fit your core offer quietly drains profit and focus. She urges agency owners to ask themselves if they're offering the right services and double down on what they're great at, not just good at. The rule is simple: the more focused you are, the more you can charge. Start by raising prices for new clients and soon the gap between legacy clients and new ones will convince you of the need to raise prices for legacy clients too. One mastermind member added $72,000 in monthly recurring revenue simply by repricing existing clients after niching. Each year, Lacie's team audits their client roster to identify accounts they've outgrown. It's never easy—many are long-time relationships—but letting go of clients who no longer fit is what creates room for bigger, better ones. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.