The Things We Know

What happens when a marriage ends overseas—and coming home with your children isn't simply your decision? In Part Two, Shannon Vavich shares how telling her own story brought other military and defense contractor spouses forward with disturbingly similar experiences. Through her Stranded Spouses Project, she is documenting stories of financial abandonment, isolation, barriers to legal representation, and fears of separation from children. We discuss the Stars and Stripes reporting she helped make happen, her push for congressional scrutiny, and why these families need attention and accountability. Shannon also explains how listeners can help—by supporting her writing, amplifying spouses' stories, and helping women access the resources to advocate for themselves. Content note: Abuse, financial abandonment, and family separation. Connect with Shannon and support her work: Read her memoir and become a paid subscriber on Substack Stranded Spouses Project Stars and Stripes: "When military marriages end overseas, some spouses find there's no easy way home" Instagram Facebook: The Flying Kitchen by Shannon Vavich YouTube: The Flying Kitchen Being seen, heard, believed, and supported can change what a woman believes is possible—and what she can do next. Creating space for that connection is at the heart of our Best Chapter Yet retreats. Our next and last retreat, the Plot Twist Getaway, takes place April 9–11, 2027, at the Crowne Plaza resort in downtown Chandler, Arizona. Join us for meaningful conversation, laughter, reflection, and women supporting one another through whatever comes next. Learn more and register.

Kari first discovered Shannon Vavich in January 2025 through her funny, sharply political videos: a Catholic mother of seven making fabulous meals in full "trad wife" glam, challenging religious hypocrisy and declaring, "But I'm not a fascist." So much has unfolded since then that two episodes barely scratch the surface—so buckle up! In the first of this two-part conversation, Shannon shares her account of the abrupt end of her nearly thirty-year military marriage, returning to Oregon with her three youngest children, and beginning to recognize decades of coercive control and isolation. We explore her creativity, entrepreneurial spirit, and Gutter Catholic community—and how publishing her memoir, The Gutter Catholic Goes Home, brought readers whose paid subscriptions helped her support her children and secure legal representation. It's a harrowing story of discovery, finding her voice, and the community of witnesses helping her move forward. Content note: Coercive control, financial abuse, and family separation. Connect with Shannon and support her work: Read her memoir and become a paid subscriber on Substack Instagram Facebook: The Flying Kitchen by Shannon Vavich YouTube: The Flying Kitchen Stranded Spouses Project: [URL TO COME] Stars and Stripes: "When military marriages end overseas, some spouses find there's no easy way home" Women need places where we can be seen, heard, believed, and supported. That's the heart of our Best Chapter Yet retreats. Join us for our next and last retreat, the Plot Twist Getaway, April 9–11, 2027, at the Crowne Plaza resort in downtown Chandler, Arizona—a weekend of connection, reflection, laughter, and space to consider what you want next. Learn more and register.

When life-changing medical news arrives, the facts are only part of the story. In this deeply personal conversation, Lisa shares her recent early-stage breast cancer diagnosis, and Kari and Lisa sit down with Sara Champie, LCSW—a somatically oriented trauma therapist and BRCA1 carrier whose work explores the intersection of hereditary cancer risk, genetic testing, and developmental trauma. Together, they examine why "she's handling it so well" may not tell the whole story; how a diagnosis can awaken old survival strategies; the complicated grief, uncertainty, and questions of agency that can accompany medical decisions; and what it means to live in the "long middle" of ongoing risk and surveillance. Sara also shares what meaningful emotional support can look like and why it should be a standard part of genetic counseling and high-risk cancer care (see below for Sara's contact info and links to her blog). This conversation reminds us how much it matters to have space to be honest about what we're carrying—and to feel supported without having to appear to have it all together. That's part of what we hope to offer at Best Chapter Yet: The Plot Twist Getaway, April 9–11, 2027, in Chandler, Arizona. Join us for a weekend of connection, laughter, and thoughtful reflection, with room for where you are now and what you want next. We also want to share something honestly: this will likely be our last retreat in this format. After April, we're taking a pause to consider what comes next and how we want to bring this community together. If you've been hoping to join us, we'd love for you to be part of this gathering.Learn more and register today before spaces fill! ~~~~~~~~~~ LEARN MORE about Sara Champie: Sara's website: https://www.sarachampielcsw.com Connect with Sara on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sara-champie-lcsw-14b2a265/ "Moving Past Survival Mode: When Hereditary Cancer Risk Becomes an Invitation": https://thepeak.org/moving-past-survival-mode-when-hereditary-cancer-risk-becomes-an-invitation/ "Genetic Risk Isn't Just Medical Information. It Lives in Memory, Identity and Time": https://www.facingourrisk.org/blog/genetic-risk-isnt-just-medical-information-it-lives-in-memory-identity-and-time Sara on the Transforming Trauma podcast—"Hereditary Cancer Testing: Grief, Identity, and Self-Connection": https://complextraumatrainingcenter.com/transformingtrauma/episode-185/

In this episode of The Things We Know, Kari and Lisa sit down with Dr. Jill Rosenthal, a Harvard and Stanford educated physician turned cancer and mindset coach, to explore what happens after the crisis is over. While treatment may end, the emotional aftermath often lingers in the form of fear, uncertainty, and an identity shaped by life's hardest experiences. Dr. Rosenthal shares why so many women struggle to move beyond survival, how to quiet the "cancer chatter" that keeps them living in fear, and what it means to release an identity built around trauma so they can create a life filled with purpose, joy, and hope. Whether your story includes cancer, caregiving, grief, divorce, or another unexpected life transition, this conversation offers compassionate insight into healing, resilience, and discovering that your best chapter can still be ahead. Connect with Dr. Jill Rosenthal Website: https://drjillrosenthal.com Book: https://invisiblescarsbook.com Email: [email protected] If this conversation has you thinking about what your own next chapter could hold, we'd love to explore that with you in person. Join us April 9–11, 2027, in Chandler, Arizona, for Best Chapter Yet: The Plot Twist Getaway—a weekend of connection, laughter, and space to reconnect with yourself and imagine what comes next. We also want to share something honestly: this will likely be our last retreat in this format. After April, we're taking a pause to consider what comes next and how we want to bring this community together. If you've been hoping to join us, we'd love for you to be part of this gathering. Learn more and join us.

What happens when hiding the truth begins to cost more than telling it? Lisa and Kari talk with licensed marriage and family therapist Krissy Johnson about the emotional weight of secrecy, the ways women can lose themselves inside relationships, and the complicated work of rebuilding self-trust. Drawing from her journey from sex worker to therapist, Krissy brings candor, humor, and hard-earned wisdom to a conversation about shame, desire, difficult stay-or-leave decisions, and the freedom of becoming more fully yourself in midlife.  Learn more about Krissy and In The Life Therapy at https://www.inthelifetherapy.com and https://www.inthelifetherapy.com/intensives.  Listen to Sex, Secrets, & Sass and more from Krissy at https://www.youtube.com/@GenSeXXXers,  Connect/Follow Krissy: https://www.instagram.com/inthelifetherapy https://www.instagram.com/gensexers, and https://www.linkedin.com/in/krissy-johnson-lmft-a283401b6/. What happens when hiding the truth begins to cost more than telling it? Lisa and Kari talk with licensed marriage and family therapist Krissy Johnson about the emotional weight of secrecy, the ways women can lose themselves inside relationships, and the complicated work of rebuilding self-trust. Drawing from her journey from sex worker to therapist, Krissy brings candor, humor, and hard-earned wisdom to a conversation about shame, desire, difficult stay-or-leave decisions, and the freedom of becoming more fully yourself in midlife.  Learn more about Krissy and In The Life Therapy at https://www.inthelifetherapy.com and https://www.inthelifetherapy.com/intensives.  Listen to Sex, Secrets, & Sass and more from Krissy at https://www.youtube.com/@GenSeXXXers,  Connect/Follow Krissy: https://www.instagram.com/inthelifetherapy https://www.instagram.com/gensexers, and https://www.linkedin.com/in/krissy-johnson-lmft-a283401b6/.