LinksModern House: https://www.themodernhouse.com/SummaryIn this conversation, the hosts discuss the challenges of standing out in competitive markets, particularly in the context of product differentiation. They introduce the Cult Products Framework, emphasising the importance of having a revolutionary vision and a unique value proposition. The discussion highlights the significance of niching down and creating a unique customer experience, as well as the balance between growth and maintaining brand integrity.takeawaysYou will always struggle to get people's attention in a crowded market.Standing out requires a unique value proposition.Niche marketing can lead to better market capture.Creating a unique customer experience is essential.Differentiation by design is crucial for success.Modern House exemplifies a successful niche brand.Maintaining brand integrity is challenging as businesses grow.It's important to attract the right customers and repel the wrong ones.The cult products framework simplifies business growth strategies.A strong brand can create a sense of community among customers.
summaryIn this episode, the hosts discuss various topics ranging from the organisation of bookshelves to the intricacies of branding and the recent rebranding of Jaguar. They explore the importance of strategy in branding, the creation of brand narratives, and the balance between creativity and strategic goals. The conversation culminates in a critique of Jaguar's new branding approach, highlighting the potential disconnect between the brand's traditional customer base and its new target audience.takeawaysOrganizing bookshelves can reflect personal style and chaos.Branding requires a clear strategy to be effective.Brand narratives help bring a brand to life.Creativity in branding should align with strategic goals.The transition from strategy to branding is crucial.Understanding the target audience is key in branding.Feedback from clients should guide creative processes.Branding should not alienate existing customers.The balance of aesthetics and functionality is important in design.Rebranding can provoke strong reactions from traditional customers.
🎙️ Does your brand stand out, or is it lost in the pack?In this episode of the Cult Products Podcast, we explore what makes a brand truly effective—and spoiler alert: it’s not about flashy graphics or catchy slogans. We dive into the Blue Ocean Strategy to show you how to make your brand the obvious choice in a crowded market.Key Takeaways:🎮 Learn how Nintendo created a "category of one" and redefined its market.💡 Discover what David Attenborough can teach us about brand storytelling.🖌️ Understand why copying competitors is a dead end—and what to do instead.Whether you're refining your brand or starting fresh, this episode is packed with actionable insights to help you carve out your unique space and grow your start-up.Looking for more tips? Connect with Phill on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/phillbolland/
In this episode, the hosts discuss the intricacies of branding, emphasizing the importance of a well-defined value proposition and understanding target audiences through detailed personas. They explore the challenges of balancing buyer and user personas, and the necessity for brands to remain adaptable in a fast-paced market. The conversation highlights the evolution of branding practices and the need for continuous engagement with brand identity.takeawaysThe first step in branding is defining the value proposition.Clients often want visuals before understanding their brand's strategy.Understanding your target audience is crucial for effective branding.Buyer personas often take precedence over user personas in branding.Branding is an ongoing process that requires regular updates and adaptations.The emotional intelligence aspect of branding is as important as the logical framework.Creating detailed personas can lead to more effective branding strategies.Brands should be seen as living entities that evolve over time.The branding process can be mentally taxing but is essential for clarity.A clear value proposition helps guide the branding process.Chapters00:00 The Importance of Branding Strategy11:48 Understanding Your Target Market19:56 Creating Customer Personas23:08 Understanding Target Personas26:15 Buyer vs. User Personas29:05 Value Proposition Development34:12 Navigating the Competitive Landscape37:09 The Fluid Nature of Branding39:40End
In this episode Phill talks to Finn, the founder of Both &, and discusses the journey of creating a fashion brand specifically designed for trans and non-binary individuals. The discussion covers various themes including the importance of community engagement, the challenges of designing an entirely new approach to clothing ecommerce, becoming a figurehead in the community, and the future of the brand. Finn shares insights on navigating visibility in the fashion industry, the iterative design process, and the importance of building a diverse network. The conversation concludes with his personal reflections for aspiring founders.TakeawaysHow Finn approached redesigning some of the most common design patterns in clothing ecommerce.Design Sprints and extensive design research informed several unique features required to make the web UX work.Community engagement has been crucial in shaping the brand's direction and offerings.Finn founded Both And to address a personal need for better fitting clothing, which helped him keep going throught the tough times.Open-sourcing the brand's tech packs to encourage industry collaboration should make the research project have even more impact beyond Both And.It's not always easy to put yourself out there as a community figurehead but it may be the right thing for your brand.
LinksIn this episode of the Cult Products podcast, host Phill Keaney-Bolland and accountant Dave Sellick delve into the often-overlooked world of accounting and finance for startups. They discuss the emotional journey of founders, the creativity involved in accounting, and the importance of having a trustworthy accountant. Dave shares practical advice for early-stage startups, emphasising the need for financial literacy and the value of having an accountant from day one. The conversation highlights the significance of understanding the emotional and practical aspects of running a business, and how the right financial guidance can lead to better decision-making and overall success.Takeaways:Accounting can be exciting and creative.Founders often start businesses to solve personal pain points.Building a business requires creativity and innovation.Trust is essential when choosing an accountant.Startups should seek financial advice early on.Automating finance processes saves time and improves data quality.Understanding financial information is crucial for business success.The emotional journey of founders impacts their business decisions.Accountants should be collaborative and transparent.Financial literacy is important for all business owners.
In this episode of the Cult Products Podcast, hosts Adam Yaya-Durrant and Alexandra Pointet discuss the challenges and experiences of transitioning from traditional employment to entrepreneurship. They delve into topics such as imposter syndrome, the importance of mentorship, adaptability in roles, and the dynamics of building a team. The conversation emphasizes the need for continuous learning and the inevitability of change in the entrepreneurial journey.takeawaysImposter syndrome is a common challenge for entrepreneurs.Adaptability is crucial when transitioning from employee to entrepreneur.Mentorship can provide invaluable support and guidance.It's important to embrace change and be willing to learn new skills.Building a strong team requires understanding each member's strengths and weaknesses.Financial management is a key aspect of running a business.Establishing a good relationship with an accountant can save money in the long run.Consistency and discipline are essential for self-motivated entrepreneurs.The people element of business can be complex but rewarding.Your role in a startup will evolve and change over time.
In this episode of the Cult Products podcast, host Alexandra Pointet interviews Phill Keaney-Bolland and Adam Yaya-Durrant about their journey in starting and growing their agency, Yaya. They discuss their initial meeting, the challenges they faced in the startup world, the pivotal moments that led them to launch their own business, and the lessons learned along the way. The conversation also touches on the impact of the pandemic on their growth and the importance of continuous learning in entrepreneurship.takeawaysStarting a business is one of the most mentally and physically challenging things you can do.Having a strong partnership is crucial for navigating the ups and downs of entrepreneurship.Emotional support networks are vital in high-pressure environments.The decision to start Yaya was driven by a desire for autonomy and a shared vision.Naming a business can be a challenging yet important process.Milestones in business often come from unexpected moments and decisions.The pandemic presented both challenges and opportunities for growth.Continuous learning is essential for long-term success in business.Building a team is a significant milestone that changes the dynamics of a business.Reflecting on past experiences helps in making informed decisions for the future.Chapters00:00 Introduction and Host Dynamics01:31 The Beginning of a Partnership04:17 Navigating Startup Life10:18 The Decision to Start Yaya16:07Naming the Business and Value Proposition28:10 Defining Value Propositions and Initial Offerings30:34Milestones in Establishing Yaya32:55 Learning Through Experience: Early Challenges and Growth35:59 Key Milestones38:09 Navigating the Pandemic: Challenges and Opportunities42:42 Reflections on Growth: Learning from Mistakes46:19 The Importance of Continuous Learning in Business52:41 Building a Strong Team: The Role of Partnership58:38 Wrap up and goodbyes01:02:23 end
In this episode of the Cult Products podcast, host Phill Keaney-Bolland discusses the evolution of his design agency, Yaya, focusing on the challenges and strategies involved in business growth, client relationships, and lead generation. He reflects on the importance of delivering quality work, the difficulties of scaling sales efforts, and the need for a predictable marketing strategy. Additionally, he emphasizes the significance of personal wellbeing and health in sustaining business success.Delivering good work for clients is essential for growth.Building trust with clients leads to referrals and new opportunities.Scaling sales efforts can create significant pressure on teams.A predictable lead generation system is crucial for business stability.Marketing strategies must be comprehensive and integrated.Creating compelling offers can differentiate a business in a crowded market.Personal health and wellbeing directly impact business performance.Seeking external help can accelerate business growth and learning.Taking breaks and holidays can rejuvenate energy and creativity.Continuous learning and adaptation are key to long-term success.Chapters00:00 Introduction to Yaya and the Podcast02:44 Reflections on Business Growth and Client Relationships09:15 Challenges in Scaling Business Development14:08 Building a Predictable Lead Generation Machine23:18 Creating a Compelling Offer and Marketing Strategy33:44 Personal Wellbeing and Health Focus
In this episode of the Cult Products podcast, host Phill Keaney-Bolland speaks with Natalie Peire, a former co-founder of a startup focused on sexual wellbeing, GASM. They discuss Natalie's journey from personal development to entrepreneurship, the lessons learned from running a startup, the importance of emotional investment, and the dynamics of co-founding a business with a partner. Natalie shares insights on finding the right advice, the significance of prototyping, and the challenges faced in the early stages of a startup. The conversation emphasises the need for clarity in goals, the evolution of branding, and the importance of focusing on specific challenges to achieve success.takeawaysEmotional investment in your business is crucial.Choosing co-founders wisely can make or break a startup.Seek advice from founders a few steps ahead of you.Prototyping helps in visualising and communicating ideas.Focus on one specific challenge to start with.Your brand will evolve as your business grows.Testing and iterating quickly is essential for success.Building a community around your product is important.Don't rush into partnerships without due diligence.Be prepared to pivot based on market feedback.keywordsB2B tech, startup, emotional investment, co-founders, advice, prototyping, sexual wellbeing, entrepreneurship, personal development, lessons learned
SummaryIn this episode of the Cult Products podcast, hosts Phil Keeney-Bolland and Adam Yaya-Durrant are joined by JP, a seasoned expert in B2B tech startups. They discuss the critical importance of value proposition testing before launching a product. JP shares his journey in product development, emphasizing the need for clarity in value propositions and understanding user struggles. The conversation covers the iterative process of testing ideas, the significance of waiting lists, and how to effectively structure interviews for feedback. They also explore the challenges startups face in balancing features with actual value and the necessity of embracing change throughout the development process. The episode concludes with actionable insights for founders looking to validate their ideas and increase their chances of success.Download your free Ai-powered prototyping toolkit: https://cultproducts.yaya.co/downloadApply to our beta program: https://form.typeform.com/to/hohOIRT5Join our community: https://www.skool.com/cult-products-4664
Download your free Ai-powered prototyping toolkit: https://cultproducts.yaya.co/downloadApply to our beta program: https://form.typeform.com/to/hohOIRT5Join our community: https://www.skool.com/cult-products-4664In this episode, Phill and Adam discuss the practical steps required to create a website for a B2B tech startup. They emphasise the importance of not jumping straight into website builders without first defining objectives, value propositions, and brand differentiation. They recommend looking at competitors to gain inspiration and identify common threads. They also discuss the need for a conversion strategy and different conversion points based on the stage of the customer journey. They caution against focusing too much on the bottom of the funnel and not enough on getting people onto the website. Finally, they highlight the importance of defining the site structure and content before using website builder tools. The homepage of a website is not the most important page for attracting new visitors. It mainly serves as a jumping-off point for other pages on the site. The homepage should establish credibility, provide basic information about the company, and direct users to deeper information. Pricing pages are important for customers to determine if they are interested in a product or service. FAQs are useful for SEO and provide answers to common questions. Use cases and industry-specific pages can showcase how a tool or solution is used in different contexts. Comparisons with competitors can help buyers make decisions. Squarespace is a user-friendly tool for building websites, and starting with a template can be a good option for non-designers.keywordswebsite creation, B2B tech startup, objectives, brand differentiation, competitors, conversion strategy, customer journey, site structure, content, homepage, credibility, pricing pages, FAQs, use cases, industry-specific pages, comparisons, Squarespace, templatestakeawaysBefore creating a website, define objectives, value propositions, and brand differentiation.Look at competitors for inspiration and identify common threads.Develop a conversion strategy with different conversion points based on the customer journey.Focus on getting people onto the website, not just the bottom of the funnel.Define the site structure and content before using website builder tools. The homepage is not the most important page for attracting new visitorsPricing pages are important for customers to determine interestFAQs are useful for SEO and provide answers to common questionsUse cases and industry-specific pages showcase how a tool is usedComparisons with competitors help buyers make decisionsSquarespace is a user-friendly tool for building websitesStarting with a template can be a good option for non-designers
Download your free Ai-powered prototyping toolkit: https://cultproducts.yaya.co/downloadApply to our beta program: https://form.typeform.com/to/hohOIRT5Join our community: https://www.skool.com/cult-products-4664Encarta 97: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSaTf_NTq0oCD-ROM: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CD-ROMsummaryIn this conversation, Adam and Phill discuss the importance of starting with a clear strategy and objective when building a website for a B2B tech startup. They caution against simply imitating popular websites like Apple's, as those sites are designed for specific purposes and may not align with the goals of your business. They also advise against relying too heavily on design inspiration from platforms like Dribbble and awards websites, as they often prioritise trends over functionality. Instead, they recommend focusing on the fundamentals of good website design, such as information architecture, conversion strategy, and clear value proposition. In this conversation, Phill and Adam discuss brutalist web design and the importance of focusing on readability and functionality. They explore the guidelines for brutalist web design, such as making content readable on all screens and devices, only using hyperlinks and buttons for clicks, and ensuring that hyperlinks are underlined and buttons look like buttons. They emphasise the need for founders to start with a clear objective and a strong brand identity when building a website. They also highlight the importance of content and brand differentiation in creating a successful website.keywordswebsite design, B2B tech startup, strategy, objective, imitating, Apple website, design inspiration, Dribbble, awards websites, trends, functionality, information architecture, conversion strategy, value proposition, brutalist web design, readability, functionality, guidelines, hyperlinks, buttons, brand identity, content, differentiationtakeawaysStart with a clear strategy and objective when building a website for a B2B tech startup.Avoid imitating popular websites like Apple's, as they are designed for specific purposes and may not align with your business goals.Don't rely too heavily on design inspiration from platforms like Dribbble and awards websites, as they prioritise trends over functionality.Focus on the fundamentals of good website design, such as information architecture, conversion strategy, and clear value proposition. Brutalist web design focuses on readability and functionality, aiming to simplify websites and reduce distractions.Content should be readable on all screens and devices, and only hyperlinks and buttons should respond to clicks.Hyperlinks should be underlined and buttons should look like buttons to maintain an honest and transparent interaction with visitors.Founders should start with a clear objective and a strong brand identity when building a website.Differentiating the brand and creating compelling content are key factors in creating a successful website.
In this episode, the hosts are joined by a special guest, Ben, to discuss the transition from being a subject matter expert to a salesperson in a B2B tech startup. They explore the misconception that sales is a dirty word and discuss the importance of curiosity, empathy, and problem-solving in the sales process. The conversation also touches on the advantages that founders have in sales, the impact of introversion and extroversion on sales ability, and the value of small talk and building relationships. The hosts and guest share their personal experiences and insights on sales and provide practical tips for founders. In this conversation, Ben and Phill discuss imposter syndrome in sales and how to overcome it. They emphasise the importance of investing in training, practicing in safe environments, and believing in oneself and the value of their product. They also highlight the significance of having a clear and compelling value proposition, being authentic, and building trust with customers. They stress the importance of being true to oneself and not trying to universally please everyone. They also discuss the power of giving away value and building relationships, as well as the balance between being likable and knowledgeable in sales conversations.keywordssales, B2B tech startup, subject matter expert, transition, curiosity, empathy, problem-solving, founders, introversion, extroversion, small talk, relationships, practical tips, imposter syndrome, sales, training, practice, value proposition, authenticity, trust, likability, knowledgetakeawaysSales is often seen as a dirty word due to negative experiences and the perception of manipulation, but it can be approached as problem-solving and helping others.Founders have a natural advantage in sales because they have created something of value and can convey their passion and expertise.Introversion or extroversion does not determine sales ability, but being curious, empathetic, and a good listener are key skills for successful salespeople.Building relationships and establishing trust are crucial in the sales process, and small talk can be a valuable tool for engaging with potential customers.Qualifying leads and finding the right fit between the product/service and the customer is essential for successful sales.Sales is about connecting the value proposition with the customer's needs and providing solutions that deliver value. Imposter syndrome is common in sales, especially for those new to the field or pitching a new and untested product.Investing in sales training and practicing in safe environments can help build confidence and overcome imposter syndrome.Believing in oneself and the value of the product is crucial in sales.Having a clear and compelling value proposition is essential for sales success.Being authentic and building trust with customers is more important than trying to universally please everyone.Giving away value and building relationships can lead to sales opportunities.Balancing likability and knowledge is key in sales conversations.
In this episode, Phill and Adam interview Steevan Glover, a marketing consultant and director. They discuss the importance of focusing on the outcome and value that your product or service provides, rather than just the features. They also emphasise the need to target specific customer segments and avoid wasting time on customers who are not a good fit. They discuss the importance of having a clear brand message and story, and the need to iterate and adapt as the business evolves. They also touch on the role of influencers and the importance of having a human face for the company. In this conversation, Steevan Glover, Phill Keaney-Bolland, and Adam Yaya-Durrant discuss the importance of having a figurehead for a brand and the potential challenges that come with it. They also explore the role of websites in B2B tech startups and the need for a clear objective and conversion points. The conversation concludes with a discussion on the value of networking events and the importance of being innovative and subversive in a crowded marketplace.Key takeawaysFocus on the outcome and value that your product or service provides, rather than just the features.Target specific customer segments and avoid wasting time on customers who are not a good fit.Have a clear brand message and story, and be willing to iterate and adapt as the business evolves.Consider the role of influencers and the importance of having a human face for the company. Having a figurehead for a brand can be both positive and negative, as it can attract attention and inspire, but it can also limit scalability and create dependency.Websites for B2B tech startups should have a clear objective and focus on conversion points, whether it's generating leads or providing credibility.Networking events can be valuable for building relationships and generating leads, but it's important to choose the right events and add value to them.In a crowded marketplace, being innovative and subversive can help a startup stand out and attract attention.The early years of a startup are the most crucial for being adventurous and differentiating from competitors.
In this episode, Adam and Phil emphasize the need for a clear value proposition and the importance of generating leads before diving into product development. In this conversation, the hosts discuss the importance of leveraging personal networks and referrals in the early stages of a business. They emphasize the need to be strategic and organized in reaching out to contacts and maintaining relationships. The hosts also share their experiences with imposter syndrome and the transition from being an employee to a salesperson.Generating leads is crucial for every business and should be part of product development.A clear value proposition is essential in attracting customers and should be tested and refined.The need for branding and websites varies depending on the business and its target audience.Strategies and approaches may change as businesses learn and evolve. Leverage personal networks and referrals in the early stages of a businessBe strategic and organized in reaching out to contactsMaintain relationships with clients and contactsOvercome imposter syndrome and transition to a salesperson mindsetUse case studies and testimonials to generate leads and referrals
In this episode of the Cult Products podcast, Phil and Adam discuss the process of product design and prototyping for B2B tech start-up founders. They emphasize the importance of understanding the problem space and the needs of the users before developing a product. They also highlight the value of creating prototypes and testing them with users to iterate and improve the product. The conversation touches on the role of designers in setting the direction and concept of the product, as well as empowering developers to make design decisions. They also discuss the benefits of rough prototyping and the limitations of tools like auto layout in stifling creativity. They emphasize the value of low-fidelity prototypes and the advantage that founders have in designing the initial version of an interface. They also highlight the role of AI tools in enhancing productivity and speeding up the prototyping process. The conversation concludes with a discussion on the importance of qualitative user testing and the limitations of AI in capturing the nuances and context of human interaction.Links Download your free Ai-powered prototyping toolkit: https://cultproducts.yaya.co/downloadApply to our beta program: https://form.typeform.com/to/hohOIRT5Join our community: https://www.skool.com/cult-products-4664TakeawaysUnderstand the problem space and the needs of the users before developing a product.Create prototypes and test them with users to iterate and improve the product.Designers play a role in setting the direction and concept of the product, as well as empowering developers to make design decisions.Rough prototyping allows for quick exploration of ideas and creativity.Tools like auto layout can be useful for scaling products, but may stifle creativity in the early stages. Low-fidelity prototypes are valuable in the early stages of product development as they allow for quick iteration and testing of ideas.Founders have an advantage in designing the initial version of an interface because they understand the idea and can be unshackled by design constraints.AI tools can enhance productivity and speed up the prototyping process, but they currently lack the depth and nuances that human interaction provides.Qualitative user testing, combined with prototyping, is the most effective way to gather meaningful feedback and insights.The product development process should be approached as a science experiment, with continuous iteration, testing, and learning.
SummaryIn this episode, Adam and Phill are joined by Roland Gurney from Treacle for a live critique of the Cult Products proposition and initial website. They discuss their new proposition and the target audience for their program with Roland. They talk about the importance of understanding the target customer and narrowing down the focus. They also discuss the challenges of repositioning a business and the need for a clear and concise message. The guest suggests a three-step approach to the program and emphasises the importance of simplicity and structure. They also discuss the different options and calls to action for potential customers. In this conversation, Roland Gurney provides valuable insights and suggestions for the Cult Products program. They discuss the value of offering a sequential three-step program, the balance between talking about customer problems and product details, and the importance of being the face of the brand. They also explore the concept of being Marmite, or polarising, in order to stand out in a crowded market. Overall, the conversation emphasises the need for clarity, differentiation, and authenticity in building a successful business.TakeawaysUnderstanding the target customer is fundamental to creating a specific and effective brand.Narrowing down the focus and choosing a niche market can make marketing and sales conversations easier.When repositioning a business, it's important to have a clear and concise message that clearly communicates the value proposition.A three-step approach can provide structure and simplicity to a program or offering.Offering different options and calls to action can cater to different customer needs and preferences. Offering a sequential three-step program can provide a clear and effective solution to customer problems.Balancing the discussion of customer problems and product details is crucial in marketing and communication.Being the face of the brand can create a human connection and build trust with customers.Being Marmite, or polarising, can help a business stand out in a crowded market and attract the right audience.Clarity, differentiation, and authenticity are key elements in building a successful business.
Links Download your free Ai-powered prototyping toolkitApply to our beta programJoin our communityWatch this episode on YouTubeCan you name the Marvel theme tune?System Of A Down and Eminem tracks mentioned A Clockwork OrangeSummaryIn this conversation, Phill and Adam discuss their new product and the community they are building around it. They talk about the importance of targeting a specific audience and creating a niche in the market. They also mention the value of personas in designing a brand and understanding the needs of the target audience. They share their vision of helping startup founders and providing them with resources and support. Overall, they are excited about the potential impact of their new product and the opportunity to work with passionate and talented individuals. In this conversation, Phill and Adam discuss the importance of building a community and being transparent in the early stages of a startup. They emphasise the need to generate leads and prove demand for a product before fully developing it. They also talk about the challenges of marketing and promoting their business, and the importance of being authentic and true to their brand. They highlight the shift in networking and team dynamics in the post-COVID world, and the need for founders to have a presence and be influencers in their industry.TakeawaysTargeting a specific audience and creating a niche in the market is important for success.Personas are valuable in designing a brand and understanding the needs of the target audience.Building a community of passionate and talented individuals can provide valuable resources and support.The new product aims to help startup founders and provide them with the tools and guidance they need. Building a community and being transparent in the early stages of a startup is crucial for success.Generating leads and proving demand for a product should be prioritised before fully developing it.Marketing and promoting a business requires authenticity and being true to the brand.Founders need to have a presence and be influencers in their industry to attract customers and talent.Networking and team dynamics have shifted in the post-COVID world, requiring new approaches to building relationships.
Links Download your free Ai-powered prototyping toolkitApply to our beta programJoin our communityWatch this episode on YouTubeSummaryIn this episode, Phill and Adam discuss why you can't be both a B2B and B2C business. They emphasise the importance of focusing on a single specific customer persona and delivering value to that target market. They also highlight the need for a clear and compelling value proposition that clearly communicates what the business does and the value it provides. Additionally, they discuss the concept of high brand moments, which are the elements of a brand that add uniqueness and emotional appeal to a product or service. TakeawaysYou can't be both a B2B and B2C business simultaneously.Focus on a specific customer persona and deliver value to that target market.Develop a clear and compelling value proposition that communicates what the business does and the value it provides.Create high brand moments to add uniqueness and emotional appeal to a product or service.Pick just one persona and build a brand strategy around it.00:00 Intros and welcome back02:14 Can you be B2B and B2C?11:15 The importance of value propositions19:11 “Tech powered consultancies” vs “Tech businesses supported by consulting”28:20 High brand moments and the magic of them33:47 Up next and thanks for listening