Cults and the Culting of America

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, Daniella sits down with political scientist Thomas Kelly to revisit one of the most foundational ideas in cult studies: cognitive dissonance. Their conversation centers on Leon Festinger's famous book When Prophecy Fails, which is often cited to explain why cult members double down on beliefs after predictions don't come true. Thomas walks through his research uncovering serious methodological and ethical problems with that original study, arguing that the historical record actually shows the opposite of what Festinger claimed. Rather than reinforcing belief, failed prophecy most often leads to attrition, disillusionment, and collapse. Together, Daniella and Thomas explore why this misunderstanding has shaped decades of cult research, how survivor voices were sidelined during the "cult wars," and why failed prophecies tend to wound groups far more than scholars once believed. The discussion expands into broader questions about coercive control, survivor testimony, ethical research methods, media involvement, and why people want prophecies to come true. The episode ultimately challenges listeners to rethink how we explain belief, persistence, and exit in high-control groups—and to be more skeptical of tidy psychological theories that ignore lived experience. Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways When Prophecy Fails is deeply flawed and misrepresents what actually happened in Dorothy Martin's UFO cult. Historical evidence shows most groups do not grow stronger after failed prophecy; they fracture or dissolve. Festinger and his team interfered with the group they were studying, compromising the research. Cognitive dissonance as a concept does not stand or fall on this study, but the case should no longer be used as proof of belief "doubling down." Survivor voices were largely ignored during the development of cult scholarship, especially during the cult wars. Failed prophecy outcomes depend heavily on whether the prophecy is tied to a single charismatic authority or a broader interpretive framework (like scripture). Media attention played a significant role in shaping the cult's behavior before and after the prophecy failed. People in cults often want the prophecy to come true—it represents hope, purpose, and meaning. Coercive control is better understood through tactics and dynamics than rigid definitions of "cult." Studying real-world "natural experiments" may offer better insight into belief and compliance than lab psychology studies. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Cognitive Dissonance and Cults 01:21 Exploring 'When Prophecy Fails' and Its Implications 03:27 Critique of Festinger's Research and Methodology 06:28 Key Figures in the Study and Their Influence 07:56 Patterns in Cult Behavior and Promises of Space Travel 09:43 Failed Prophecies and Group Survival 10:56 Qualitative vs. Quantitative Research in Cult Studies 13:19 Ethical Considerations in Cult Research 17:55 The Complexity of Defining Cults 20:48 Cognitive Dissonance: Current Perspectives and Future Directions 27:44 The Quest for Belief: Cults and Prophecy 29:11 Media Influence on Cult Dynamics 30:31 After the Prophecy: Coping with Disappointment 32:24 The Psychology of Hope and Belief 34:06 Cognitive Dissonance: Understanding Belief Systems 36:59 Rethinking Cognitive Dissonance Studies 39:54 The Complexity of Cult Membership 43:44 Humanizing Cult Experiences 45:56 Personal Reflections on Cults and Immunity 51:14 Future Directions in Cult Research

In this episode, guest Ara Jade shares her seven-year experience inside a high-control religious group adjacent to the Hebrew Israelite movement, known as the Israel of God. She recounts how she was drawn in through family influence, biblical study practices, and a strong sense of community, only to later encounter manipulation, racism-based doctrine, misogyny, surveillance, fear tactics, and emotional control. Ara describes specific red flags, including purity rules for women, the weaponization of Black identity, pressure to obey male authority, and her arranged-like marriage. She explains how her awakening unfolded through personal losses, marital betrayal, and finally being dismissed by leadership when seeking protection. Ara concludes with thoughtful advice for people questioning their involvement in high-control groups, emphasizing listening to intuition, seeking outside perspectives, asking hard questions, and being gentle with oneself during the process of leaving and grieving. Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways The Israel of God mirrored Hebrew Israelite theology but distanced itself publicly while maintaining similar doctrines. Black identity and biblical narratives were used to create belonging while simultaneously controlling members. Fear-based teachings (hell, end times, impurity) played a key role in keeping members obedient. Women were subjected to strict purity laws, gender hierarchy, and were often treated as property for marriage. The community structure relied heavily on surveillance, gossip, and punitive social consequences. Ara experienced pressure to marry men she did not choose, reflecting the group's patriarchal control. Her father leaving the group, her grandmother passing away, and her husband's infidelity created a tipping point. Church leaders minimized abuse, discouraged outside help, and expected spiritual authority over personal safety. Leaving the group resulted in shunning but also clarity and relief. Ara encourages listeners to trust gut feelings, seek outside information, and allow themselves compassion while exiting. Missing aspects of the community after leaving is normal and part of healing. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Ara Jade's Journey 03:08 Understanding Hebrew Israelites and Their Beliefs 05:43 Ara's Experience with the Israel of God 08:33 Initial Attraction and Community Building 11:12 Red Flags and Cognitive Dissonance 13:56 The Weaponization of Fear and Control 16:30 Identity Stripping and Community Dynamics 18:54 The Role of Forgiveness in Manipulation 27:14 The Toxic Environment of the Cult 29:50 Questioning Beliefs and Doctrines 35:02 The Impact of Relationships and Marriage 39:32 Realizations and Leaving the Cult 46:12 Advice for Others in Similar Situations Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann

This episode of Cults and the Culting of America features guest Emily Hulen, a massage therapist and trauma coach who grew up in Christian Science and later navigated additional cult-like environments. Emily describes the core beliefs of Christian Science — including the denial of physical reality, rejection of medical care, and heavy reliance on prayer as a means of erasing mortal experience. She shares harrowing examples of untreated medical issues in her family and her own childhood injuries and illnesses that went unaddressed. Emily traces her early cognitive dissonance, beginning around age ten, as she started comparing Christian Science ideas with Greek mythology and noticing inconsistencies. Her family's reaction to her questioning led to increased control, isolation, and punishment. She also explains overlapping dynamics of a family cult, with her mother acting as a controlling, narcissistic leader. Emily describes eventually leaving home, the challenges of early adulthood, and the emergence of PTSD symptoms in her romantic relationship. The episode highlights her healing journey through therapy modalities including CBT, DBT, IFS (Internal Family Systems), EMDR, and somatic work. Emily emphasizes how trauma shows up physically, how therapy helped her reclaim a sense of self, and how she now helps others through trauma-informed bodywork and coaching. Daniella and Scott connect Emily's experiences to broader patterns across cults and high-control systems (including the military), highlighting shared mechanisms such as intense rhetoric, personal blame, dissociation, and thought-terminating clichés. The episode closes with information about Emily's work and her perspective on reclaiming identity after trauma. Emily's Links: https://www.holisticechoes.com Contact: emily@holisticechoes.com Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd KEY TAKEAWAYS Christian Science denies physical reality, framing illness, injury, and even death as illusions created by "mortal mind." Medical neglect is common within the group; Emily and her family suffered severe, untreated medical conditions as a result. Prayer functions as a "window cleaning" practice — not communicating with God, but reaffirming perfection and denying suffering. Children are taught to dissociate from physical experiences, creating lifelong structural dissociation patterns. Emily began questioning the belief system around age ten, aided by secular homeschooling materials and internet access. Her family reacted with increased control, isolation, and policing of thought, including banning books and restricting time outdoors. Emily's home also functioned as a family cult, with her mother exerting authoritarian control and exploiting her children's labor. Leaving her parents' home sparked PTSD symptoms, especially around conflict, anger, and household dynamics. Trauma responses mirror old patterns, such as scanning for danger, over-responsibility, flinching, or misinterpreting neutral situations as threats. Therapy — particularly IFS, EMDR, and somatic modalities — helped Emily repair trauma by meeting unmet needs and separating past from present. Cult survivors often struggle with self-trust, identity, and fears of being seen as "frauds." Daniella and Scott note that cult dynamics and military culture share structural similarities, including high pressure, emotional suppression, and elevated rhetoric. Healing involves reclaiming agency, challenging old wiring, and recognizing one's worth and capability. Emily now helps others through trauma-focused bodywork and coaching, emphasizing that expertise can come from lived experience and extensive independent study. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Background of Emily Hulen 01:55 Understanding Christian Science and Its Impact 05:36 Personal Experiences with Medical Neglect 09:24 Dissociation and Cult Ideology 11:14 Red Flags and Awakening 16:02 Family Dynamics and Leaving the Cult 20:49 The Decline of Christian Science 26:40 Reflections on Healing and Moving Forward 28:28 The Impact of Medical Neglect in Cults 30:44 Healing from Cult Trauma 35:08 Navigating Relationships Post-Cult 39:44 Therapeutic Journeys and Self-Discovery 44:52 Integrating Past Trauma into Present Life 49:29 The Role of Education and Expertise in Healing Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann

In this episode, Dr. Cynthia Brown discusses her journey in women's health and fertility, emphasizing the importance of understanding these topics beyond conventional medicine. The conversation explores the Maha movement and its impact on women's health, cultural perspectives on pregnancy and motherhood, and the dangers of extreme birthing practices. The discussion also touches on the romanticization of pain in motherhood, the need for community support in parenting, and the intersection of gender and medical care. Dr. Brown highlights the boy crisis and the influence of cult mentality on health choices, advocating for transparency in women's health discussions to empower women and improve outcomes. Dr. Cyntia's Links https://www.kopelahealth.com/ https://www.tiktok.com/@drcyntiabrownfertility https://www.threads.com/@dr.cyntiabrown Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Takeaways Dr. Cynthia Brown emphasizes the importance of understanding women's health beyond conventional medicine. The Maha movement often leads to misinformation about health and fertility. Cultural beliefs significantly influence perceptions of pregnancy and motherhood. Extreme birthing practices can pose serious risks to mothers and babies. Pain and suffering are often romanticized in discussions about motherhood. Community support is crucial for effective parenting and mental health. The boy crisis highlights the need for better understanding of young men's issues. Cults often promote a distrust of medical care, impacting health choices. Transparency in women's health discussions can empower better decision-making. The conversation around parenting must include discussions about systemic issues. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Women's Health and Personal Journey 02:32 The Maha Movement and Its Impact on Women's Health 05:29 Cultural Perspectives on Pregnancy and Motherhood 08:20 The Dangers of Extreme Birthing Practices 11:19 The Role of Pain and Suffering in Motherhood 14:13 The Intersection of Personal Experience and Medical Advocacy 16:58 The Systemic Issues in Maternal Health 19:42 Community Support and the Modern Parenting Crisis 22:36 The Cult of Suffering and Perfectionism 25:14 The Search for Answers in a Complex Medical Landscape 28:14 Conclusion: Balancing Traditional and Alternative Approaches 34:59 The Culture of Pain and Control 38:14 Toxic Masculinity and Medical Care 41:46 The Skinny White Woman Concept 46:25 Cults, Children, and Control 50:18 The Boy Crisis and Gender Dynamics 55:20 Raising Good Children in a Troubling World Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann  

Content Warnings: Sexual assault and child sexual abuse Sex trafficking and the Epstein list Cult dynamics, coercive control, and brainwashing White supremacy, racism, xenophobia, and fascism Historical violence, genocide, Nazism, U.S. colonial atrocities, police violence Political extremism, MAGA, Trump administration actions Death, including anticipated death of a political figure Domestic extremism, ICE raids, and militarized responses Cult-related childhood trauma and labor camp environments In this episode Daniella ("Knitting Cult Lady") and historian Amanda Nelson dive into the deep historical currents beneath modern American politics, arguing that the chaos of the Trump era isn't unprecedented but deeply rooted in American history. They examine how panic, white exceptionalism, and a lack of historical education shape public reactions to authoritarian behavior. The conversation highlights parallels between MAGA and cult structures, emphasizing how "mission collapse" (such as the refusal to release the Epstein documents) destabilizes the movement. They explore how white Americans often misunderstand authoritarianism because they have been insulated from state violence, and how whiteness itself is a tool that can be used both to maintain oppressive systems and to dismantle them. They discuss protest strategy, noting that mass participation by everyday "normies"—especially white women—has historically been one of the few things authoritarian regimes respond to, even during Nazi Germany. The two discuss the limits of political institutions, the psychology of cult disengagement, and the likelihood that Trump himself will avoid legal accountability. They explore whether JD Vance would be "worse," ultimately concluding he would be more strategic but less chaotically dangerous. The episode closes with reflections on justice, narcissism, and the strange, painful reality that cult leaders often die unpunished, even as their followers suffer. Amanda's Links: tiktok instagram threads youtube facebook Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways Panic feels productive but is politically ineffective; organized, sustained action is what matters. White American panic often reflects unfamiliarity with state violence experienced by others. U.S. authoritarianism has deep historical precedents, not just recent ones. Americans default to Nazi comparisons due to limited education and universal patterns of authoritarianism. National exceptionalism is a major red flag for cult-like thinking. White women have historically not shown up in protest movements despite their cultural protection and organizing power. Regimes often back down when "normies," especially white women, show up en masse to protest. MAGA operates like a cult with a charismatic leader, transcendent mission, and predictable collapse pattern. Trump's refusal to release the Epstein files broke the core promise of "drain the swamp," damaging the movement's internal stability. People rarely leave cults with dramatic awakenings; exits are quiet and painful. White women can use their social protection to shield more vulnerable groups during protests. The U.S. population size and armed citizenry make totalitarian consolidation unstable and unsustainable. JD Vance would be strategically dangerous but less chaotic and impulsive than Trump. Cult leaders often avoid punishment; public anticipation of their downfall may be its own form of consequence. The patriarchy is deeply entrenched, but mass exposure of crimes (like Epstein files) could destabilize political power. Lack of historical literacy prevents people from recognizing authoritarian patterns. "Normie-led" protests are historically what end authoritarian pushes. The MAGA movement is fracturing due to mission collapse and internal contradictions. The conversation emphasizes harm reduction rather than fantasies of quick political salvation. Mass organization, not despair, is the path to meaningful opposition. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to American History and Culture 02:48 Understanding Panic and Historical Precedents 05:52 The Role of Race and Identity in American History 08:32 The Puritans and American Exceptionalism 11:28 Xenophobia and the American Identity 14:06 Protests and the Role of White Women 17:10 The Complexity of American Values 19:55 Cults, Authoritarianism, and American Politics 22:46 The Power of Collective Action 25:45 Conclusion and Call to Action 29:42 The Role of White Allies in Activism 34:03 The Power of Collective Action 36:45 The Epstein List and Its Implications 41:26 The Dichotomy of Child Protection in America 47:47 Political Perspectives on Leadership Changes Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann

Content Warning: This episode contains discussions of religious and institutional abuse, child abuse, disordered eating, family estrangement, mental illness, trauma recovery, and medication withdrawal. Listener discretion is advised. In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, hosts Dr. Scot Loyd and Daniella Mestyanek Young speak with Beth Granger, author of Born and RAZED: Surviving the Cult Was Only Half the Battle. Beth shares her experience growing up at Grenville Christian College, a Canadian boarding school later revealed to be a religious cult connected to the Community of Jesus. She describes the systematic control, emotional and physical abuse, and the long process of recovery and rediscovery that followed her escape. The conversation dives into the complexities of grief, family estrangement, and the enduring impact of coercive religious systems. Beth also discusses her role as a representative plaintiff in a landmark class-action lawsuit against the institution, and how advocacy, writing, and community have shaped her healing. The episode ends with a reflective discussion about deconstruction, the search for meaning after leaving high-control groups, and what it means to "live with it" as an adult survivor. Disclaimer: This conversation is for educational and storytelling purposes only. It is not medical, legal, or therapeutic advice. If you or someone you know is struggling, resources are available: National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI): 1-800-950-6264 Crisis Text Line: Text HOME to 741741 (US) National Eating Disorders Association Helpline: 1-800-931-2237 Beth's Book:  Amazon Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Religious abuse can hide in plain sight: Grenville Christian College operated for decades as a "prestigious" Anglican school while functioning as a coercive cult. Systemic control dismantled family bonds: Children were separated from parents, spied upon, and punished under the guise of spiritual discipline. Recovery is lifelong: Leaving a cult is only the beginning—true healing often unfolds over decades. Grief is complex for survivors: Survivors grieve not only their past but also the version of themselves and families they never got to fully have. Weaponized religion causes lasting harm: Faith can be used as a tool of control, and rebuilding a healthy spiritual or secular identity takes time. Community resilience matters: The class-action lawsuit gave survivors both validation and voice, setting legal precedent in Canada. Art and storytelling as healing: Beth's memoir and Daniella's creative work illustrate how expression can help survivors reclaim their narratives. Ambiguity is part of recovery: Many survivors find peace not in certainty, but in learning to live with doubt. Intergenerational healing is possible: Rebuilding family connection and emotional fluency can break the cycle of silence. Living with it: Healing doesn't erase trauma—it integrates it into a fuller, more authentic life. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Cult Experiences 01:39 Beth Granger's Journey as a Cult Survivor 03:02 Life Inside the Cult: A Personal Account 05:16 Surviving and Recovering from Cult Life 10:17 The Importance of Recovery Narratives 11:27 The Breaking Point: Realizations and Escape 18:44 Grief and Loss After Leaving the Cult 24:43 Navigating Faith and Doubt Post-Cult 26:37 Navigating Personal Beliefs and Cult Influence 31:30 The Role of Music in Healing and Identity 37:36 Grief and Family Dynamics Post-Cult 40:59 Community Resilience Against Coercive Organizations 47:54 The Impact of Trauma and the Journey to Healing Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann  

In this special episode, Daniella Mestyanek Young ("Knitting Cult Lady") speaks with Dr. Bryan Pitts, Assistant Director of UCLA's Latin American Institute, about the Brazilian military dictatorship (1964–1985) and how studying Brazil's political history can help Americans understand current threats to democracy. They compare U.S. and Brazilian political systems, the cultural myths that obscure inequality (the "American Dream" vs. Brazil's "racial democracy"), and the interplay between religion, class, and authoritarianism. The discussion explores how political elites, class structures, and the military shaped Brazil's dictatorship and its fall, how the U.S. normalizes corruption through legality, and why Americans struggle to recognize creeping authoritarianism. The episode ends with reflections on community resilience, the dangers of individualism, and lessons from Brazil on defending democracy. Dr. Pitts' Book: Amazon Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autographed: Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok Patreon Instagram Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways  U.S. comparisons to Nazi Germany miss nuances—Latin American dictatorships, especially Brazil's, offer more relevant parallels. Brazil's 1964 coup was not purely CIA-driven but enabled by U.S. encouragement and anti-communist ideology. The Brazilian dictatorship's fall was driven by local politicians regaining influence and citizens mobilizing for democracy. Brazil's political class and military were both hereditary systems that reinforced inequality and control. Corruption in Brazil was often criminalized campaign funding—whereas in the U.S., "legal corruption" (e.g., Citizens United) plays a similar role. National myths—America's "classless society" and Brazil's "racial democracy"—mask systemic inequality and prevent honest reckoning. Daniella and Bryan compare cult structures to political systems: authoritarian control thrives on isolation, hierarchy, and sacred assumptions. Bureaucracy and decentralization (local politics, paperwork, institutional rules) often protect democracy better than charismatic leadership. The Brazilian opposition's shift from abstract "save democracy" rhetoric to focusing on people's material needs (poverty, inequality) was pivotal to defeating authoritarianism. Americans may not recognize creeping dictatorship because they lack collective memory of one; Brazil's experience offers a warning and a roadmap. The U.S. military's apolitical stance may protect against coups but limits civic intervention when democracy erodes. Building community and mutual aid networks is crucial as a counter to isolation and authoritarian individualism. Both guests reflect on how growing up in cults or authoritarian systems gave them insight into manipulation, obedience, and ideological rigidity. Authoritarianism can appear on the left or right; unquestioning certainty is itself cult-like. Brazilians unified quickly to defend democracy after Bolsonaro's attempted coup—contrasting sharply with U.S. responses after January 6th. Americans over-trust institutions and underestimate the need for civic defense of democracy. Brazil's "relative democracy" under dictatorship reveals how regimes justify authoritarian control in the name of "protection." Structural inequality, not individual failure, drives poverty—an insight both guests developed from missionary childhoods. Both guests emphasize that understanding other nations' histories is vital to preventing tyranny at home. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to the Conversation 02:18 Personal Backgrounds and Cultural Insights 11:40 Understanding Brazil's Military Dictatorship 18:33 The Role of the Political Elite in Brazil 24:25 Class and Military Dynamics in Brazil and the US 29:06 Sacred Assumptions and the American Dream 30:28 The Decline of the American Dream 31:41 Comparing Dictatorships: The U.S. and Latin America 35:07 Cultural Diversity and National Identity 38:37 Birthright Citizenship and Its Implications 42:48 Political Maneuvering During Dictatorship 52:04 Lessons from Brazil's Political History 55:03 The Role of Community in Political Change 56:01 Introduction to Authoritarianism and Democracy 58:33 The Role of Institutions in Protecting Democracy 01:01:36 Military's Role in American Politics 01:04:22 Cult Dynamics in Military and Academia 01:07:19 Experiences of Extremism and Authoritarianism 01:10:15 The Importance of Community and Resistance Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, Daniella Mestyanek Young (aka Knitting Cult Lady) speaks with Chicago educator and social work student Jamal Bruce about his experiences teaching, navigating race and identity, and how her memoir Uncultured influenced his career pivot from education to social work. Their conversation explores how America's educational and social systems function as cult-like institutions that condition compliance, suppress individuality, and reflect deeper cultural hierarchies. Together, they draw parallels between trauma survival, masking behaviors, racial inequity, and the ways storytelling can challenge systemic norms. They also discuss how white privilege manifests in subtle daily ways, the importance of listening across difference, and the transformative power of reading beyond one's own identity. Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autograph:  Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok, Patreon, Instagram  Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways: Jamal Bruce, a Black high school teacher in Chicago, found Uncultured profoundly validating and inspiring, prompting his shift toward social work. Daniella and Jamal discuss how schools often mirror cult-like systems that demand conformity and suppress individuality. Both highlight how trauma survivors often overachieve as a coping mechanism—seeking safety in perfection and compliance. Educators of color are more likely to "see" marginalized students and advocate for them because of shared systemic experiences. The U.S. educational model has roots in Puritan indoctrination and continues to prioritize obedience over humanity. White privilege shows up in small, everyday ways—like who gets questioned, believed, or celebrated for multilingualism. The conversation emphasizes the need to believe marginalized voices rather than debate their experiences. Daniella reflects on how publishing, like education, gatekeeps whose stories are told and deemed "marketable." Both guests stress reading broadly and engaging with diverse perspectives as a way to dismantle bias and foster empathy. Uncultured demonstrates how personal trauma can illuminate collective social conditioning, inviting broader discussions of power, race, and belonging. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Uncultured Perspectives 02:41 The Role of Educators in Social Change 05:26 Personal Stories of Advocacy and Support 08:19 The Cult-like Nature of Education 11:20 Navigating Identity and Trauma in Education 14:10 The Intersection of Race and Education 16:44 The Impact of Trauma on Academic Performance 19:35 The Complexity of Privilege and Identity 22:33 The Need for Authenticity in Education 25:27 Conclusion: Shared Experiences and Collective Growth 29:03 Finding Your Audience in Storytelling 30:25 Relating Through Shared Emotions 32:33 Understanding Different Perspectives 34:53 The Importance of Believing Experiences 37:32 Recognizing Privilege in Society 40:32 Bilingualism and Perceptions of Intelligence 44:06 Challenging Gender and Racial Stereotypes 48:18 The Journey of Deconstructing Worldviews 51:06 The Power of Diverse Narratives Produced by Haley Phillips, Lizy Freudmann, and Meghan Picmann

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, Daniella and Scot talk with brother-sister filmmakers Rebecca and Pete Davis, co-directors of the documentary Join or Die. The film explores the steep decline in civic engagement across America and how rebuilding community is the antidote to the loneliness, polarization, and manipulation that make people vulnerable to cults. Together, they discuss the connection between isolation and extremism, how everyday community life has eroded over decades, and why showing up for local action is both a civic duty and a personal safeguard against coercive control. From Bowling Alone to the "cult of media," this conversation challenges listeners to ask one question: What am I doing alone that I could be doing together? Pete and Rebecca's Links: Website Movie Daniella's Links: Preorder for Culting of America: The Culting of America PRE-SALE (SHIPS BY JANUARY 20, 2026) – Knitting Cult Lady Go Fund Me for Culting of America: https://tr.ee/fldwYRFTJI Daniella Mestyanek Young's book:  From Bookshop.org Uncultured Autograph:  Connect with Daniella on social media  TikTok, Patreon, Instagram  Youtube Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities 💡 Key Takeaways The ultimate inoculation against bad community is good community. 43% of Americans report belonging to zero community groups — a sign of deep civic decline. Cults exploit the human need for belonging that isolation leaves unmet. Healthy communities build "social capital" — the foundation of both democracy and resilience. Television, air conditioning, and social media each contributed to the privatization of daily life. Online groups offer connection but lack the embodied care of local, face-to-face relationships. "Civic reforestation" starts small — hosting a club, joining a group, showing up in person. Conflict isn't bad; learning to have it well is a democratic skill. Attention is power — Americans spend about 10 hours a day consuming media instead of creating community. Every movement in history began with about 1% of people showing up. Cult-proof your life by diversifying your relationships and commitments. Start where you are: know your neighbors, host a screening, join something local. Chapters 00:00 – Welcome & Introductions 02:00 – Why We Need Good Communities 04:00 – Isolation as a Weapon 05:30 – A 75-Year Decline in Connection 09:00 – Democracy and Social Fabric 12:00 – Air Conditioning, Modernity, and Lost Stoops 14:00 – What Are You Doing Alone That You Could Be Doing Together? 17:00 – From Online to Embodied Community 19:00 – The Cult of Media & Attention Theft 22:00 – Mono-Focus and Cult Vulnerability 26:00 – Why We Have Fewer Friends Now 30:00 – Learning the Lost Art of Organizing 33:00 – Lessons from History 36:00 – Conflict Is Good in a Democracy 40:00 – How to Watch or Host "Join or Die" 42:00 – Showing Up: The Real Inoculation 45:00 – Closing Reflections Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann  

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, hosts Scot Loyd and Daniella Mestyanek Young unpack Secretary of War Pete Hegseth's recent dystopian-sounding address to military leadership, examining it through the lens of cult psychology, gendered standards, and authoritarian control. Daniella dissects how "standards" and "professionalism" in the military are tools to maintain patriarchal and racial hierarchies, using examples like grooming policies and "gender-neutral" male standards. She argues that rhetoric like Hegseth's is part of a broader movement toward Christian nationalism and toxic militarized masculinity, dubbing it the "Mojo Dojo Casa Military." Together, they explore whether the U.S. military could ever be used against American citizens, why cult-like obedience structures are dangerous, and how individual ethics, diversity, and generational change make full-scale authoritarian control unlikely. The conversation then shifts toward Scot's new book, The God That I Was Given: Looking for Faith After Losing My Religion. Daniella and Scot discuss faith deconstruction, privilege, and how to hold space for both pride in one's past and critical honesty about harm. They reflect on storytelling, accountability, and how both military and religious institutions reward conformity and punish introspection. Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities 🔑 Key Takeaways "Standards" are culturally constructed — often used to uphold existing power structures under the guise of objectivity. "Gender neutral" usually means "male" — erasing femininity and reinforcing patriarchal norms. Hegseth's rhetoric reflects toxic masculinity, racial dog whistles, and authoritarian nostalgia for a "Department of War." Military culture mirrors cult structures, but its guiding "cult" is loyalty to the Constitution — not to any single leader. Younger service members (Millennials & Gen Z) are reshaping the culture toward diversity, empathy, and critical thinking. Brainwashing tactics from abusive systems and cults were deliberately baked into modern military training. Deconstruction is not destruction — you can be proud of aspects of your experience while acknowledging systemic harm. Both hosts connect cult dynamics across institutions — religion, the military, and politics all rely on controlling narratives. Writing memoirs like Uncultured and The God That I Was Given provides a model for honest reflection that includes both pride and pain. Truth-telling invites criticism, but it's vital for cultural healing and understanding. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to the Podcast and Guests 00:53 Military Standards and Gender Equality 03:43 Rhetoric and Leadership in the Military 06:29 Concerns Over Military Use Against Citizens 09:21 Basic Training and Military Culture 12:08 The Role of Experience in Military Leadership 14:54 Political Rhetoric and Military Professionalism 17:51 Diversity in the Military and Its Implications 20:39 Public Perception and Military Loyalty 23:23 Historical Context of Military Orders 26:09 Conclusion and Future Implications 28:18 Generational Perspectives in the Military 32:50 The Culting of America: A Deeper Dive 37:16 Navigating Privilege and Perspective 41:48 The Complexity of Faith and Deconstruction 47:06 The Power of Storytelling and Truth 54:22 Closing Thoughts on Diversity and Listening Produced by Haley Phillips, Meghan Picmann, and Lizy Freudmann

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, hosts Daniella Mestyanek Young and Scot Loyd welcome Dr. Jo, a veterinarian from New Orleans, to explore the surprising overlaps between veterinary medicine and cultic dynamics. The conversation highlights how overwork, guilt, and moral injury can act as control mechanisms in "helping professions" like veterinary care—mirroring high-demand group tactics. Dr. Jo discusses the emotional toll of her work, including the constant oscillation between joy (new puppies) and grief (euthanasia), the high suicide rate among veterinarians, and the systemic lack of self-care built into the profession. Daniella connects these patterns to her broader analysis of institutional cultures that exploit compassion, while Scot reflects on similar burnout dynamics from his time as a pastor. The trio also dives into capitalism's role in normalizing self-sacrifice, the ethics of euthanasia, empathy toward animals and humans, and the need for structural—not just individual—change to protect caregivers from exploitation. The episode ends with a reminder: veterinarians are humans too, carrying invisible emotional burdens. Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities 💡 Key Takeaways Veterinary medicine shares cult-like traits such as overwork as virtue, guilt-based control, and moral self-sacrifice. Emotional compartmentalization is required—vets may euthanize a long-time patient then pivot to a joyful new-pet visit minutes later. The suicide rate among veterinarians is alarmingly high, often tied to compassion fatigue and systemic overextension. Capitalism reinforces burnout, framing constant labor and self-denial as moral goodness. Many vets struggle to find balance between client care and self-care, often skipping breaks or feeling guilty for resting. COVID-19 worsened burnout by increasing pet ownership while reducing staff capacity. Financial misconceptions persist: veterinary procedures are costly but still drastically cheaper than equivalent human care. Euthanasia ethics are complex—vets must navigate between mercy, owner intent, and lack of viable alternatives. Empathy erosion in cults and capitalism parallels how systems dehumanize caregivers and animals alike. Real solutions require institutional change, not just resilience training for individuals. Simple kindness from clients can profoundly impact veterinary workers' wellbeing. Professional roles and uniforms can dehumanize caregivers—remembering their humanity matters. Helping professions often attract perfectionists and empaths, making them more vulnerable to exploitation. Both hosts link these patterns to broader social "meta-cults"—capitalism, productivity culture, and religious ideology. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Rapture Day 01:09 Meet the Veterinarian: Jo's Journey 03:09 Cults and Veterinary Medicine: Unlikely Parallels 05:21 Expectations vs. Reality in Veterinary Medicine 08:34 The Emotional Toll of Veterinary Practice 11:13 Navigating Client Relationships and Misinformation 15:14 Cults and Empathy: A Unique Perspective 18:41 The Ethics of Pet Ownership and Care 21:10 Coping Mechanisms in Veterinary Medicine 25:00 Community Support and the Burden of Service 28:09 The Burnout Epidemic in Veterinary Medicine 30:18 Understanding the Costs of Veterinary Care 35:28 Quality of Life Conversations with Pet Owners 43:28 Self-Care and Avoiding Burnout in Veterinary Practice 49:08 The Human Side of Veterinary Medicine Produced by Haley Phillips

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, hosts Daniela Mestyanek Young and Scot Loyd welcome musician and activist Candi Carpenter. The conversation dives into parallels between growing up in evangelical Christianity and high-control cult environments, with both Daniela and Candi sharing deeply personal stories. Candi discusses their upbringing as a pastor's kid in a gospel family band, the ways purity culture and religious control shaped their identity, and their long deconstruction journey. They reflect on how music, satire, and community have helped them reclaim their voice and selfhood after years of suppression. The discussion touches on the loneliness of cult childhoods, the psychological effects of being taught constant fear of sin and hell, and how neurodivergence (autism, OCD) made them especially vulnerable to indoctrination. Humor and satire emerge as powerful tools of resistance—whether in music videos mocking political figures or in Daniela's plans for a "cult baby musical." The episode closes with reflections on healing, therapy, medication, and the importance of building authentic community beyond transactional, conversion-driven relationships. Candi's Links:  Spotify  Apple Music Youtube  Tiktok Instagram Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways Parallel Journeys: Both Daniela and Candi grew up under strict religious control, with performance and purity culture shaping much of their childhood. Music as Survival: Candi uses songwriting to process trauma, reclaim identity, and connect with others who share similar experiences. Deconstruction & Identity: Their exit from evangelicalism was gradual, involving moments of perspective shift (like viewing church rituals through outsiders' eyes) and self-discovery (embracing their non-binary identity). Neurodivergence & Cults: Autism and OCD traits made Candi especially susceptible to religious rules, scrupulosity, and fear-based control. Purity Culture & Harm: Conversations highlighted how purity teachings overlap with exploitation, creating damaging relationships with sex, self, and others. Satire as Activism: Through bold political satire (like their "American God" video), Candi critiques extremism and authoritarianism with humor. Community After Cults: Online spaces like Candi's Discord "Candyland" provide connection and solidarity for those who once felt isolated. Healing Tools: Therapy, finding the right medication, and embracing joy (from late-night milkshakes to creative play) are key in recovery. Unmasking & Authenticity: A central theme is moving from masking and people-pleasing (ingrained by cult culture) toward living authentically without fear of rejection. Shared Mission: Both Daniela and Candi see their art—books, music, satire, musicals—as ways to expose control systems, build resilience, and help others heal. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Candi Carpenter and Cult Themes 02:51 Exploring the Impact of Cults on Identity 05:31 Deconstructing Religious Upbringing and Its Effects 08:38 The Role of Music in Healing and Community 11:19 Navigating Personal Trauma and Artistic Expression 14:07 The Intersection of Humor and Activism 17:23 Political Satire and the Role of Artists 20:03 Embracing Individuality and Non-Binary Identity 22:54 The Future of Music and Activism 25:44 Conclusion and Reflections on Fear and Anger 30:42 The Journey of Healing and Self-Discovery 34:23 Navigating Relationships Beyond Cults 37:16 The Struggle with People-Pleasing 40:21 Embracing Authenticity and Self-Acceptance 44:45 The Role of Therapy and Medication in Healing 49:37 Creating Art as a Means of Expression Produced by Haley Phillips

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, hosts Scot Loyd and Daniella Mestyanek Young ("the Knitting Cult Lady") interview Ruwan, a former member of OneTaste, a so-called "orgasm cult" centered around female sexuality and human connection. Ruwan recounts his two years in the organization, explaining how he was drawn in by its promises of intimacy and meaning, but soon became entangled in manipulation, labor exploitation, and coercive sales tactics. The discussion highlights parallels between OneTaste and other coercive groups, including the use of sex as recruitment, redefining language to control members' worldview, punishing dissent, and demanding lifelong commitment. Ruwan also reflects on the psychological toll of leaving, the social shunning he endured, and how indoctrination made it difficult to criticize the leader. The episode closes with reflections on cult dynamics, the dangers of committing one's life to a group or ideology, and Ruwan's upcoming memoir that ties his personal journey to OneTaste's recent criminal convictions. Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways Sex as a recruitment tool: OneTaste initially used sexuality to attract members but retained them through promises of connection, meaning, and personal growth. Labor exploitation: Members often worked for extremely low wages (e.g., $2/hour) under the belief that they were serving a higher cause. Manipulation through language: Words like orgasm were redefined to mean progressively broader and more spiritual concepts, fostering a worldview unique to the group. High performer recruitment: Contrary to stereotypes, cults often seek intelligent, articulate, and passionate individuals who can recruit others effectively. Isolation tactics: Practices like banning "collusion" (sharing doubts) kept members from validating each other's concerns. Dissenters were shunned or vilified. Commitment pressure: Members were pushed to "commit their lives" by giving up finances, autonomy, or public loyalty, often under threat of rejection. Good cop/bad cop dynamics: Leaders or lieutenants alternated between affection and criticism to manipulate compliance. False empowerment: Despite its branding as a female empowerment movement, OneTaste remained patriarchal and exploitative, especially of young women. Leader protection: The founder avoided blame by delegating harsh decisions, maintaining a "halo effect" that made criticism difficult. Leaving costs: Exiting meant social exile, loss of community, and pressure to humiliate oneself in order to be accepted back. Parallels to other systems: Comparisons were drawn to military indoctrination, religious cults, NXIVM, and Scientology, showing shared patterns of control. Human vulnerability: Cults thrive by appealing to universal desires—belonging, meaning, and devotion to a higher purpose—while exploiting them for control. Chapters 00:00 Isolation and Emotional Turmoil in Cults 33:10 The Legal Consequences of Cult Activities 36:09 The Dynamics of Power and Gender in Cults 39:01 Reflections on Cult Experiences and Future Directions Produced By Haley Phillips

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, hosts Daniella Mestyanek Young and Scot Loyd welcome Sydney, a member of the Cult Book Club, to share her personal story of growing up in the shadow of a multigenerational cult. Sydney recounts her family's involvement with the commune Christ Circle in the 1970s–80s, her experience being homeschooled in a high-control, secrecy-driven environment, and the lingering effects of trauma passed down through generations. She reflects on estranging from her mother, the challenges of being the "cycle breaker" in her family, and how medical neglect, secrecy, and MAGA ideology compounded dysfunction. Sydney shares her diagnosis with POTS, her healing journey, and how reading Daniella's book gave her the language to process her past. The conversation highlights themes of secrecy, performance versus authenticity, generational trauma, and the courage it takes to leave and heal. The episode closes with Sydney reading a moving reflection addressed to "cycle breakers," emphasizing the exhausting but vital work of stopping harmful patterns and choosing a different path for future generations. Sydney's Podcast:  Spotify Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways Secrecy as a control tactic: Families and cults often weaponize secrecy to hide abuse and dysfunction. Generational trauma: Even those who didn't grow up directly in the cult carry the impact of their family's involvement. Cycle breaking: Refusing to pass trauma down to children requires conscious effort, vulnerability, and immense energy. Medical neglect in cults: Distrust of healthcare often leads to undiagnosed or untreated conditions, deepening harm. Authenticity vs. performance: Survivors reclaim agency by refusing to be "shiny showpieces" and instead choosing authentic lives. Empowerment through language: Finding words to describe trauma and control systems is a crucial step in healing. Healing through community: Safe environments, supportive partners, and shared survivor stories provide tools for recovery. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Culting and Personal Stories 01:56 Sydney's Journey: Growing Up in a High Control Environment 04:25 The Impact of Secrecy in Cults 10:21 Family Dynamics and Dysfunction 12:16 Breaking the Cycle of Trauma 18:34 Responsibility of the Cycle Breaker 20:41 Navigating Medical Denials and Personal Growth 23:18 Breaking Free from Toxic Relationships 25:56 The Impact of Cults on Parenting and Family Dynamics 30:13 Authenticity vs. Performance in Cult Environments 33:29 Finding Safety and Healing in New Relationships 35:51 The Journey of a Cycle Breaker Produced by Haley Phillips  

This episode of Cults and the Culting of America features guest Jess M. (aka White Mess Express), a former nurse, alongside hosts Daniella Mestyanek Young and Scot Loyd. The conversation explores how the U.S. healthcare system—particularly nursing—resembles a cult in its culture, practices, and systemic issues. Jess describes the hierarchical "rite of passage" culture in nursing (e.g., new nurses being called "baby nurses" and forced through hazing-like experiences). They highlight systemic contradictions: nurses are told to always be learning but punished for questioning authority, encouraged to self-sacrifice at the expense of their own health, and held individually responsible for systemic failures. The discussion broadens to the U.S. healthcare system as a whole—its prioritization of profit over care, its inequities toward marginalized groups, and the emotional toll on providers and patients alike. Daniella and Scot connect these patterns to cult dynamics: degradation rituals, infantilization, blind obedience, toxic positivity, and punishment for dissent. Jess shares personal experiences of disillusionment: discovering nursing's promises of stability and meaning were hollow, dealing with disability from the physical demands of the work, and grieving the loss of identity and purpose after leaving the profession. They emphasize the need for gratitude toward frontline staff, patient self-advocacy, and systemic change. The episode closes with encouragement: while healthcare workers may feel trapped in a "cult of medicine," deconstructing the experience allows them to reclaim their skills and narratives. Jess also shares where listeners can follow their ongoing work on TikTok and other platforms. Jess's Links:  linktree Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways Nursing culture as a "cult": Hierarchical structure with forced rites of passage ("baby nurse" system). Bullying, hazing, and degradation rituals normalize suffering. Emotional suppression is enforced—nurses must "put on a nurse face." Constant demand for self-sacrifice, often leading to burnout or worse. Systemic contradictions: Nurses are told to always be learning, but punished for questioning authority. Healthcare talks about being "systemic" but punishes individuals for systemic failures. Promises of good pay, benefits, and flexibility often clash with reality (mandatory overtime, long shifts, poor work-life balance). Healthcare as a profit-driven business: U.S. healthcare prioritizes money over patient wellbeing. Marginalized groups bear the brunt—Black and brown people, unhoused individuals, women, the poor. Providers often have no say in pricing or systemic policies. Impact on patients and providers: Patients face bankruptcy, neglect, or dismissal of their concerns. Providers internalize a culture of silence, mistrust, and emotional suppression. Many healthcare workers avoid seeking care themselves due to stigma or normalization of suffering. Breaking out of the "cult": Leaving healthcare can feel like grief or loss of identity. Gratitude from patients can be more meaningful than institutional rewards ("pizza party" culture). Patients can advocate for themselves by remembering they are the experts on their own bodies. Deconstructing cult-like systems allows survivors to reclaim and repurpose their skills and experiences. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to the Healthcare System's Cult-like Nature 02:53 The Hierarchical Structure in Nursing 05:43 Systemic Issues in Healthcare 08:35 The Role of Nurses vs. Doctors 11:23 Healthcare as a Business 14:29 The Impact of Privilege on Healthcare Access 17:29 Experiences with Vulnerable Patients 20:20 Expectations vs. Reality in Nursing 23:28 Emotional Toll of Nursing and Military Service 28:08 Navigating Emotions in Healthcare 31:02 The Patient Experience: A Nurse's Perspective 33:45 The Reality of Nursing: Expectations vs. Reality 37:47 The Cult of Healthcare: A Critical Examination 47:34 Self-Advocacy in Healthcare: Empowering Patients 50:33 The Grieving Process of Leaving Healthcare Produced by Haley Phillips

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, Scot Loyd joins Haley while Daniela is away on her book tour. The conversation centers on Scot's forthcoming memoir The God I Was Given: Looking for Faith After Losing My Religion, which blends personal memoir with philosophical and scholarly reflections on growing up in the United Pentecostal Church (UPC). Scot discusses the creative and emotional risks of releasing such a personal work, particularly the fear of being misunderstood or dismissed by current UPC members. He shares vivid stories from his childhood in rural Arkansas, shaped by his religious grandmother's influence and the paradox of being raised under a strong female matriarch within a patriarchal religious system. The discussion explores masculinity, gender socialization, identity loss after leaving a high-control religion, and the role of storytelling in fostering empathy and understanding. Scot emphasizes that leaving the church cost him his core identity as a "Pentecostal preacher," but also gave him the opportunity to discover and cultivate other talents. Throughout, Scot and Haley highlight the need for nuance in conversations about faith, deconstruction, and human identity, advocating for a broader cultural shift toward allowing multiple ways of being without harm. Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's Socials TikTok:  @thescotloyd Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways Book Launch & Themes: Scot's book is a hybrid of memoir and analysis, examining his upbringing in the UPC and the philosophical implications of faith, identity, and place. Fear of Misunderstanding: He worries readers—especially current UPC members—may not engage with the book's nuance, expecting it to be more condemning than it is. Nuance Over Binary Thinking: Scot stresses that his church experience included both positive and harmful elements, and that faith should be open to scrutiny. Matriarch in a Patriarchal World: His grandmother wielded significant influence despite strict religious rules limiting women's roles, creating a confusing model of gender for Scot. Masculinity & Socialization: Haley and Scot discuss how men raised as "choosers" in patriarchal contexts may struggle with rejection, and how rigid gender roles harm everyone. Loss of Identity After Leaving: Exiting the UPC meant losing his defining role as a preacher, forcing a reevaluation of self and purpose. Storytelling as Healing: Scot sees storytelling as a vital tool for empathy and connection, more impactful than sermons or lectures. Values as Identity Anchor: Both discuss grounding identity in values rather than rigid self-concepts to avoid spirals and allow personal growth. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Book Announcement 03:27 Fears and Expectations of a New Author 11:25 The Influence of Geography on Faith 20:04 Navigating Patriarchy and Matriarchy 29:25 Masculinity and the Burden of Choice 31:30 The Burden of Expectations 37:48 Navigating Identity and Masculinity 43:09 The Power of Storytelling in Healing 46:34 The Cost of Leaving a Religious Identity 54:35 Values Over Identity: A New Perspective Produced by Haley Phillips

In this episode, Scott Loyd interviews the creators and a performer from Sunday Brunch: The Musical, a new theatrical work that humorously explores cult dynamics through a family brunch gone spectacularly wrong. While cult expert and regular host Daniella Mestyanek Young is absent due to technical difficulties, she sends in praise for the team's viral "cult song," noting how deeply it resonated with survivor experiences. Guests Ernie Bird (composer/co-writer), Rachel Abramon (lyricist/co-writer), and Gabrielle Filloux (performer) delve into the creative origins, songwriting process, and comedic construction of the show. Originally written during a jobless winter break as a fun project between friends, Sunday Brunch grew into a layered musical exploring dysfunction, privilege, and the absurdities of cult logic—all grounded in levity and genuine empathy. Their viral charm song features an escalating back-and-forth between two characters trying to one-up each other's trauma—with one repeatedly revealing that every family member is, in fact, in a cult. The group discusses the delicate balance of comedy and respect, how cult themes naturally wove into the narrative, and how they may expand the story into a larger universe featuring the three-headed bear deity and warring cults. The episode also explores broader insights into cult dynamics, including the "meta-cults" of capitalism, white supremacy, and toxic workplace culture. Each guest shares personal brushes with high-control environments, even if not officially in cults, reinforcing the pervasiveness of coercive systems in everyday life. Keep up with the Musical:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/sundaybrunchthemusical/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@erniebored Ernie's site: https://imerniebird.com Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's TikTok @thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Takeaways 🥞 Sunday Brunch is about more than brunch: What began as a casual writing experiment became a thoughtful and absurdist musical that explores cult dynamics through comedy. 🎶 The "Cult Song" hit a nerve: The viral charm song resonated deeply with survivors—especially its honest portrayal of how absurd (and painful) cult logic can be when juxtaposed with "normal" life. 🎭 Comedy with respect: The team imposed structural rules (e.g., every chorus must mention the cult) that challenged them to find humor without mocking trauma—highlighting the difficulty and importance of "punching up." 🧠 Art can offer catharsis: Humor becomes a vehicle for emotional release, empathy, and representation of marginalized experiences—including those of cult survivors. 🐻 There's lore now?! The writers accidentally created rich backstory (e.g., cult wars, a three-headed bear god, a waitress married to a cult leader) and are considering a spin-off musical set fully inside the cult. 💬 Cult experiences exist on a spectrum: Even without direct cult involvement, all guests reflected on how systems—like oppressive workplaces or nationalist ideologies—can mimic cult behavior. ❤️ Creative partnerships matter: Ernie and Rachel's deep friendship and comedic trust allowed for bold, weird, and eventually impactful storytelling. 📢 Support artists: Follow Sunday Brunch: The Musical on Instagram and TikTok [@sundaybrunchthemusical], and look out for their official demos coming soon to Spotify. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Sunday Brunch Musical 02:59 The Creative Process Behind Sunday Brunch 05:54 Character Development and Song Composition 08:56 Exploring Themes of Cults in the Musical 12:05 Comedy in Musical Theater 15:10 Personal Experiences with Cults 17:57 The Role of Art and Comedy in Society 21:09 Future Projects and Aspirations 24:01 Conclusion and Call to Action Produced by Haley Phillips

This episode of Cults and the Culting of America features guest Kelvin, a political scientist and community organizer, in a deep dive on whether capitalism functions as a cult and how overlapping systems like patriarchy, white supremacy, and religion have historically reinforced each other. The hosts, Scot and Daniella, explore the evolution of these frameworks—from European colonialism and the doctrine of discovery to modern American politics—and discuss how these systemic beliefs sustain cult-like behaviors in society. The conversation covers the historical hijacking of Christianity, education as a control mechanism, the cult of Americanism, and the psychological and political strategies that uphold oppressive systems. The episode closes with an optimistic note about generational shifts, the decline of white supremacist capitalism, and practical advice on grassroots activism. Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's TikTok @thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities 🔑 Key Takeaways Capitalism as a Social Framework (Not Just Economics) Capitalism is more than markets; it's a way of being that shapes education, infrastructure, and social values. Systems like schooling and urban planning are designed to sustain capitalist efficiency, not holistic human development. The "Cult of Americanism" American identity was built on the fusion of capitalism, patriarchy, and white supremacy, forming a powerful social order. These ideologies served as tools to consolidate and distribute power, functioning like a macro-level cult. Religion as a Tool of Oppression Early Christianity advocated communalism and equity, but the Roman Empire co-opted it into a hierarchical system for control. Similar hijacking occurs today: religious rhetoric justifies policies that maintain systemic inequality. Historical Continuity of Control From feudal Europe's restricted education to modern book bans and anti-CRT measures, elites have always used education to control narratives. Missionary work historically served as an agent of colonialism, reinforcing white supremacist dominance. Cult Dynamics in Modern Politics Donald Trump leveraged pre-existing ideological "mini cults" into a cult of personality. Fear-mongering and disinformation perpetuate obedience, especially among poor whites who vote against their own interests. Intersection of Racism, Class, and Patriarchy Patriarchy incentivizes Black men's alignment with conservative politics despite racial oppression, framing it as access to power. Economic myths—like the American Dream—sustain loyalty to capitalist structures even among those it exploits. Signs of Systemic Decline Demographic shifts and younger generations' progressive values suggest that white supremacist capitalism is in "death throes." Cults collapse when they lose control of youth—an encouraging sign for future equity. Action Step for Listeners "Find something you care about and show up where it's happening." Collective action grows when individuals commit to causes aligned with their values. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Book Launch 03:02 Exploring Capitalism as a Social Framework 05:44 Cults and Cultural Frameworks 08:51 The Cult of Americanism 11:50 Racism and Colonialism in America 14:52 The Evolution of Christianity and Power 17:50 Missionaries and Colonialism 20:59 The Arrogance of White Supremacy 23:45 Closing Thoughts on Education and Power 29:12 The Role of Education in Society 31:21 Questioning Authority and Personal Experiences 35:09 The Impact of Capitalism and White Supremacy 39:13 The Illusion of the American Dream 43:52 The Death Throes of White Supremacy and Capitalism 48:55 Shifts in Political Support Among Black Men 53:25 Hope for the Future and Community Engagement Produced by Haley Phillips  

In this revealing and emotionally rich episode of Cults and the Culting of America, Cynthia Williams joins hosts Scot Loyd and Daniella Mestyanek Young to unpack her journey through—and out of—the United Pentecostal Church International (UPCI). Cynthia shares how, like many others, she once believed that her local church was different. The rules were strict, yes, but they felt spiritually justified—until the cracks began to show. As Cynthia puts it, the realization came slowly: "I think it's probably just in the last two years… that I finally was like, wait a minute, I think I was in a cult." That moment of clarity is a turning point in the episode, as the conversation explores how UPCI and similar groups protect themselves through plausible deniability. "Not my church," people say—oblivious or unwilling to confront the broader systemic harm. Cynthia describes how Bible college exposed her to both a deeper version of indoctrination and—paradoxically—the seeds of her exit. Through theology classes and critical thinking challenges, she began questioning the very doctrines that once gave her purpose. The episode also dives into her experience witnessing the tragic death of a teenage girl at Bible school—a loss that the church quickly co-opted into a martyrdom narrative, silencing Cynthia's voice and rewriting the truth. Alongside moments of grief and spiritual disillusionment, the hosts discuss cult tactics like toxic positivity, spiritual bypassing, gendered control, and the recurring pattern of falling into other high-control environments even after leaving religion. From the military to corporate America, Cynthia's story traces how these systems echo one another—and how healing requires naming those echoes for what they are. With warmth, honesty, and shared survivor wisdom, this episode is a candid look at what it means to say, "Maybe it was my church after all." Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: Knitting Cult Lady Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's TikTok @thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Key Take-Aways 🚩 On Cult Dynamics in UPCI: Rules varied by pastor but enforced absolute obedience, reinforcing the illusion of autonomy while maintaining tight control. Women were subjected to extreme modesty standards, with the specifics often shifting—creating confusion and deep internalization of shame and obedience. Plausible deniability ("not my church") was used to disguise systemic problems across UPCI. 👩‍🦰 On Gender & Power: Women in UPCI were expected to be either angelic "saints" or demonized "Jezebels"—no in-between. Women showing independence or intellect were often ostracized or tightly policed. Cynthia's racial identity and outsider status gave her marginal freedom to step outside strict gender molds—but also made her invisible in some ways. 🧠 On Deconstruction & Identity: Bible school inadvertently helped Cynthia develop critical thinking, ultimately aiding her exit. Leaving the group meant not just losing community, but also certainty, purpose, and a framework for meaning. Like many ex-cult members, Cynthia found herself repeatedly drawn to similarly high-control environments even after leaving UPCI. 💥 On Trauma & Abuse: The murder of a student Cynthia mentored was mishandled by the church, which spun the event into a martyrdom narrative—silencing Cynthia and distorting the truth. This cover-up became a breaking point, highlighting the institution's willingness to exploit tragedy for control and propaganda. Cynthia shares how old coping strategies like breaking into church songs still emerge under stress—signs of deep conditioning and dissociation. 🧵 On Community & Healing: A strong, emotionally safe partnership is key in Cynthia's healing journey. Daniella highlights the concept of being an "invisible immigrant"—growing up in an insular religious world without cultural references or grounding in the outside world. They celebrate the comfort and solidarity found in the "ex-cult sisterhood"—a chosen family of people who get it. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Cult Experiences 03:10 Personal Journeys in the United Pentecostal Church 06:01 Expectations and Restrictions for Women 08:46 Identifying Cult-like Behaviors 11:54 The Role of Education in Cult Awareness 15:05 Navigating Gender Dynamics in Cults 17:45 The Impact of Nostalgia and Shared Experiences 20:59 Emotional Healing and Reflection 23:57 Coping with Life After Leaving a Cult 30:20 Revisiting Trauma and Dissociation 31:55 Toxic Positivity in High-Control Groups 34:14 Tragedy and Manipulation: The Church's Narrative 39:40 The Impact of Violence on Faith Communities 43:23 Identity Crisis After Leaving the Cult 50:07 Life After the Cult: Finding New Paths Produced by Haley Phillips

In this episode of Cults and the Culting of America, host Scot Loyd and Daniella Mestyanek-Young (KnittingCultLady) sit down with Hilary Giovale—a ninth-generation settler living among Indigenous communities in Northern Arizona. Hilary opens up about her journey from segregation to engaging deeply with Native communities, emphasizing how re-education and personal healing can unravel the lasting wounds of colonialism. Hilary discusses the trauma inflicted by Indigenous boarding schools and the persistent impact of white supremacy on both marginalized communities and white culture. By practicing ancestral reverence and focusing on actionable reparations—like supporting sacred landscape protection and Indigenous-led initiatives—Hilary and her guests illustrate the transformative power of honest dialogue and community-based healing. For more on Hilary's work, listeners are encouraged to visit her website, GoodRelative.com. Hilary's Links:  Her Book: Becoming a Good Relative  Guide to Making a Personal Reparations Plan An Indigenous Peoples History of the United States, by Roxanne Dunbar-Ortiz My Grandmother's Hands: Racialized Trauma and the Pathway to Mending Our Hearts and Bodies, by Resmaa Menakem Reclaiming Our Indigenous European Roots, by Lyla June Johnston Listeners can donate to the Native American Boarding School Healing Coalition to support the continued research and documentation Daniella's Links: You can read all about my story in my book, Uncultured-- buy signed copies here. https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured   For more info on me: Patreon: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Cult book Clubs (Advanced AND Memoirs) Annual Membership: https://bit.ly/YTPLanding Get an autographed copy of my book, Uncultured: https://bit.ly/SignedUncultured Get my book, Uncultured, from Bookshop.org: https://bit.ly/4g1Ufw8 Daniella's Tiktok: https://bit.ly/4bwvNC0 Instagram:  https://bit.ly/4ePAOFK / daniellamyoung_  Unamerican video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/YTVideoBook Secret Practice video book (on Patreon): https://bit.ly/3ZswGY8 Other Podcasts Daniella's other podcast: Hey White Women Scot's TikTok @thescotloyd Haley's Tiktok @nuancedmasculinities Takeaways Transformative Re-education: Hilary shares her journey from a segregated existence to building respectful relationships with Indigenous communities. Boarding School Trauma: The discussion highlights the deep and enduring pain caused by Indigenous boarding schools and their impact on cultural identity. Confronting White Supremacy: The conversation emphasizes the need to recognize and dismantle the harmful legacy of white supremacy, both for marginalized people and within white culture itself. Humility and Listening: Hilary stresses the importance of approaching new communities with genuine curiosity, humility, and a readiness to learn rather than impose. Ancestral Healing Practices: The practice of ancestral reverence—such as maintaining an ancestor altar—is offered as a powerful tool for personal and collective healing. Community-Based Action: The episode underlines the significance of supporting sacred landscape protection, Indigenous-led initiatives, and creating personal reparations plans as crucial steps toward healing. Produced by Haley Phillips