Divergent Conversations

Living through uncertain times as a neurodivergent person can feel overwhelming, with the world constantly shifting and the weight of global and personal challenges piling up. In moments like these, knowing how to show up, preserve your energy, and find a sense of agency can be both confusing and crucial.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss navigating overwhelm, advocacy, and community involvement during times of societal upheaval. They explore the emotional reality of living through constant crises, the unique stressors for neurodivergent individuals, and how to find paths toward meaningful resistance, connection, and hope—even when capacity feels low. Together, they share candid reflections about balancing activism, self-preservation, content creation, and the ongoing work of staying regulated and connected.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain insight into managing overwhelm and advocacy as a neurodivergent person, including how to channel nervous system arousal into meaningful action, avoid shame-based paralysis, and find sustainable ways of resisting and contributing.Hear real-life examples and coping strategies for regulating your nervous system amidst media overload, doomscrolling, and the nonstop news cycle, with practical suggestions for curating content and sustaining your energy.Join a vulnerable, validating conversation about the challenges of showing up authentically as a neurodivergent creator and community member, especially when the world's demands feel impossible—plus, hear updates about the podcast’s evolving approach to sustainability and intentionality.If you’ve been questioning how to take care of yourself while also caring about the world, or need reminders that community and connection are possible even in hard times, this conversation will offer solidarity, hope, and practical support.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors:✨ Neurodivergent Insights Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: 

Neuroimmune systems often intertwine with chronic health and neurodivergence, leaving neurodivergent individuals grappling with things like energy management, chronic fatigue, or other long-term health conditions.In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, talk with Dr. Mel Houser, an Autistic family physician, about the intricate dynamics of chronic health, energy management, and the often-overlooked connection between neuroimmune systems and neurodivergence.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a deeper understanding of post-exertional malaise (PEM) and how recognizing one's limits can help in avoiding the debilitating crash that often follows overexertion.Using real-life experiences, understand the systemic challenges faced by neurodivergent individuals within a traditional healthcare model, highlighting the importance of self-advocacy and community support.Discover practical strategies and tools from Dr. Houser on identifying environmental triggers and making manageable adjustments to improve health, particularly for autistic and ADHD adults.As you navigate your own healthcare journey, remember to honor your limits, seek out community, and advocate for the care you deserve.DISCLAIMER: This episode is not intended as medical advice.More about Dr. Mel Houser:Dr. Mel Houser (she/they) is an Autistic family physician with a clinical focus on providing primary care for neurodivergent patients across the lifespan. She is the Founder and Executive Director of All Brains Belong VT, a nonprofit 501(c)(3) organization in Montpelier, Vermont that uses universal design principles to provide neurodiversity-affirming medical care, social connection opportunities for all ages, and neurodiversity-related educational training. At age 37, Dr. Houser was diagnosed as autistic, ADHD, dyspraxic, dyslexic, and dyscalculic. She is also the parent of an autistic 6-year-old, who is her guru of so many keys to the universe.Website: allbrainsbelong.orgGet Connected: allbrainsbelong.org/get-connectedClinician Resources: allbrainsbelong.org/clinician-resourcesInstagram: @allbrainsbelongvtBateman Horne Center Website: batemanhornecenter.orgCheck out All Brains Belong’s project: Everything is Connected to Everything: Improving the Healthcare of Autistic & ADHD Adults provides health education resources to support people with this constellation of intertwined conditions, as well as strategies for discussing the project with medical providers. There is also a Clinician Guide with a combination of evidence-based practice and the lived experiences of more than 100 Autistic and

ADHD and Autistic burnout can feel like an endless cycle of overwhelm, exhaustion, and frustration—especially for those who live at the intersection of both identities. Many AuDHD individuals struggle to distinguish between ADHD burnout and autistic burnout, but understanding their overlap and unique challenges is crucial to finding compassionate, practical ways to support our mental health.In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the unique qualities of AuDHD burnout. They reflect on their own lived experiences, explore the differences and intersections between ADHD and Autistic burnout, discuss why traditional accommodations often fall short, and share insight on how burnout can lead to shame, depression, and executive function collapse. Through vulnerable storytelling, tangible metaphors, and thoughtful humor, they invite listeners to rethink both self-care and community support in navigating burnout.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain clarity on the nuances between ADHD burnout, Autistic burnout, and their combined impact for AuDHD burnout—plus learn why academic literature often overlooks the lived reality of those with dual neurotypes.Hear relatable and honest discussions about executive dysfunction, shame spirals, depression risk, and the paradox of needing energy to recover from exhaustion, especially within the context of daily life and work.Take away practical frameworks and metaphors (including animal critter analogies and the “burnout city”) that offer new language for self-understanding, along with concrete ideas for future-proofing your life against burnout as an AuDHD individual.If you’re navigating the relentless push-pull of ADHD and Autistic traits, or supporting someone who is, this conversation will help you feel seen and provide tools for building more resilient self-care. Listen now for validation, empathy, and practical insight on surviving—and even softening—the cycle of AuDHD burnout.ResourcesNeurodivergent Insights Autistic Masking Workbook: neurodivergentinsights.com/autistic-maskingNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource)Divergent Conversations Podcast Episodes:Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (

Neurodivergent individuals often find mental health topics like OCD, autism, and ADHD intertwined in ways that can complicate their personal narratives and self-identity.In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss with Brittany Goff, an LCSW, the Clinical Director at Zen Psychological Center, and an instructor at the Cognitive Behavioral Institute, about the critical intersections of OCD, autism, and ADHD, their impact on well-being, and the use of I-CBT in the treatment of OCD for neurodivergent individuals.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Understand how sensory discrepancies can lead to the development of obsessive stories, particularly for autistic individuals, and how inference-based cognitive-behavioral therapy (I-CBT) offers a tailored approach to counteract these doubts.Discover the unique challenges and strategies for neurodivergent individuals, including those with undiagnosed autism or ADHD, in managing OCD symptoms and building self-trust through a neuro-affirmative lens.Learn about the intersection of personal experiences, vulnerable self-themes, and logical reasoning with OCD, and how neurodivergent traits such as hyperempathy and rejection sensitivity influence the creation of obsessive narratives.As you reflect on this episode, consider how your sensory experiences and neurodivergent traits affect your perception of reality and self-trust, as well as how I-CBT can offer tools and strategies to foster a stronger sense of certainty and understanding in your daily life.DISCLAIMER: I-CBT is currently only evidence-based for OCD.More about Brittany:Brittany Goff is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker and the Clinical Director at Zen Psychological Center, a neuroaffirming OCD practice in Maryland. Additionally, she serves as an Instructor at the Cognitive Behavioral Institute, where she provides continuing education in Inference-based Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (I-CBT) for OCD. She authored the first-ever I-CBT workbook and was one of the first adopters of I-CBT in the United States. She is the first clinician to offer I-CBT training specifically tailored for individuals with Autism and ADHD, a neuroaffirming approach to treating OCD.For those wanting to learn more about Inference-based, Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, visit the following two Facebook groups:I-CBT & Neurodivergence: For licensed therapists, graduate students, researchers, and occupational therapists to discuss the application of I-CBT. Free Resources will be shared for use with clients.I-CBT & Neurodivergence Community: A supportive space for all individuals to connect and share experiences. Free resources, games, and worksheets are accessible to those wanting to apply I-CBT with the help of an I-CBT provider.If you’re interested in deepening your understanding, you can find Brittany Goff’s I-CBT training below, which focuses on resolving the OCD doubt. This fidelity of the model helps you teach your clients how to break free from the obsessive thinking patterns that create convincing narratives of doubt.Trainings in I-CBT: icbtonlinelearning.comIf you are interested in learning how to adapt I-CBT for neurodivergence join the waitlist here and you will be notified when the training is released:

As a gifted, BIPOC individual, it can be uniquely challenging to navigate day-to-day experiences and find meaningful connections, especially prior to the discovery of giftedness.In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, along with Sheldon Gay, an entrepreneur, podcast host, and the Vice-Chair of the neurodivergent-affirming non-profit, Umbrella US, discuss his unique perspective on being seen beneath our social masks, the societal impact of intellectual identity as a BIPOC human, and his personal self-discovery journey of giftedness.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Discover the complexities and societal pressures of intellectual identity and how they shape interactions and self-perception, as well as the struggle to find genuine connections while managing unique cognitive abilities.Gain a deeper understanding of the unique challenges faced by gifted individuals, especially within marginalized communities. Learn about the burden of expectations, code-switching as a gifted black man, and the journey of self-acceptance.Learn about Sheldon Gay's perspective on navigating biases in professional spaces, the importance of authenticity, and the impact of self-trust and empathy in both personal and professional settings.As you explore the depths of your own identity and capabilities, remember the importance of self-trust and creating spaces where you can be your authentic self. Reflect on how societal expectations may have influenced your journey and seek communities that celebrate your unique experiences and perspectives.More about Sheldon:Sheldon Gay is an entrepreneur with a background in engineering and creating memorable customer experiences. He's worked in various fields, including healthcare, nonprofits, and education-technology. In addition to growing multiple businesses, he is currently the Vice-Chair of the neurodivergent-affirming non-profit, Umbrella US. As a Black man who discovered later in life that he’s neurodivergent, he sees the world from a different angle than most. Due to his unique perspective, he knows all too well how it feels to be “the only one” in a room. After intense self-discovery work in his early 40s, he found answers to life-long questions and received freedom from burdens he'd carried since he was a child. Now, he uses his experiences to help others embrace their true selves and release their burdens as well. Sheldon helps his audiences become curious about their minds, combat loneliness through community, and experience peace and joy through authenticity.Website: sheldongayisbugn.comSocial Media: @imustbebugn and @imustbebugn.bsky.social————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️

Grieving the loss of a beloved pet or navigating collective trauma can feel overwhelming, especially for neurodivergent individuals who experience heightened attachment and sensitivity. This episode highlights the raw realities of grief, loss, and emotional processing, and explores the complexities unique to neurodivergent wellness journeys.In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the challenges of navigating grief—particularly pet loss—while managing the heightened sensitivities and emotional intensity common among Autistic and ADHD adults. They talk about how grief impacts daily life, the importance of ritual, attunement in relationships, the role of animal companionship, and how the neurodivergent experience can complicate or intensify the grieving process.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Understand the unique ways neurodivergent grief manifests, including sensory and attachment factors, and gather validation for experiences that may not be widely recognized or understood by neurotypical circles.Learn pragmatic strategies for processing grief—including rituals, attunement with supportive friends, setting boundaries, and balancing self-compassion with the demands of social expectations.Explore the intersection of collective trauma, emotional wellness, and coping in a world full of ongoing stressors, with candid advice on when to lean into hard feelings and when to step back for necessary self-preservation.For individuals navigating loss, especially through a neurodivergent lens, this episode offers insight, solidarity, and practical support. Remember that honoring your unique grief journey is vital—and that connection, self-compassion, and community are essential parts of healing.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane

Prioritizing wellness and authentic connection is essential for neurodivergent individuals, especially during times of low energy or change. This episode highlights how embracing interdependence, rest, and honest communication can support deeper well-being and resilience within both friendships and professional collaborations.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, candidly discuss what led them to take a break from the podcast and how that pause deepened their understanding of self-care, boundaries, and the value of neurodivergent connection. Together, they share personal experiences of attachment wounds, rupture and repair, community building, and new season plans—without guest speakers, focusing on honest, relatable conversations between friends and colleagues.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Discover a realistic and neurodivergent-affirming approach to wellness that acknowledges low energy periods, demand avoidance, and the vital importance of community and interdependence.Learn practical tools for navigating and repairing relationship ruptures, including how to get beneath content-driven arguments to the underlying attachment needs and emotions.Find validation and actionable self-care frameworks, from balancing self-soothing with self-nourishment to reimagining community as “mile deep, inch wide”—especially relevant in the current climate of heightened stress and activism.While reflecting on your own wellness and connections, consider how you might honor your needs for both rest and community support. Listen to this episode for an open, compassionate look at what real, sustainable neurodivergent wellness can look like.Articles and essays mentioned in this podcast: Dr. Neff’s article on rupture repair (written shortly after the experience discussed in this episode): https://neurodivergentinsights.com/rupture-repairIdentity Development Model Article (also discussed in this episode): https://neurodivergentinsights.substack.com/p/neurodivergent-identity-arcsTwo Forms of Self-Care by Dr. Daniel Wendler: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/two-forms-self-careDivergent Conversations Underground (a space to continue and deepen the conversation together)Divergent Conversations Underground: If you’d like to go deeper with us this season, we’re excited to stretch into more nuanced, searching conversations in community. https://divergentconversations.substack.com————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️

Living with perpetual Autistic burnout can feel like navigating a world that’s always just a little too overwhelming, exhausting, or out of sync. For neurodivergent people, teasing apart burnout from depression and understanding how chronic sensory and emotional overload shapes daily life is not just challenging but key for self-advocacy and well-being.In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the lived experience of Autistic burnout. They share personal stories about perpetual exhaustion, reflect on the nuances that differentiate Autistic burnout from depression, and illustrate how life stressors, health challenges, and environmental demands converge to create what they jokingly call “perpetual sensory hell.” With humor and candor, they explore how burnout can signal deeper misalignment and the importance of understanding personal triggers, as well as highlight why these conversations matter so much for late-identified Autistic adults.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain clarity on the difference between Autistic burnout and depression through real-life examples and practical markers—vital for anyone navigating neurodivergent mental health.Hear validating stories about sensory struggles, task exhaustion, and the havoc that chronic burnout can wreak, along with the role of major life changes, masking, and health conditions.Pick up concrete advice for recognizing your own burnout triggers, interpreting external and internal signals, and beginning to build a more resilient, neurodivergent-affirming life.If you’re navigating burnout or are curious about what “Autistic burnout” really means, this episode offers honest validation, practical wisdom, and a sense of solidarity. Discover how being seen and understood can be the first step out of perpetual burnout.ResourcesNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesDivergent Conversations Podcast Episodes:Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (divergentpod.com/2)Episode 47: Autistic Burnout (Part 2): A Deep Dive Into The Diversity of Burnout (divergentpod.com/47)————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️

Burnout isn’t just about exhaustion—it’s a sensory experience that can leave neurodivergent people feeling stretched to the breaking point. When every sound, smell, or texture feels overwhelming, how do we navigate recovery and build resilience in a world that rarely slows down?In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the connection between sensory processing and autistic burnout. They share candid reflections on their personal burnout cycles, explore how sensory overwhelm shapes emotional and cognitive well-being, and highlight the critical need for understanding individual sensory profiles. This conversation unpacks the realities of living through burnout—including the constant to-do lists, the elusive pursuit of “just right” sensory environments, and the importance of community support—while providing practical strategies for recovery and prevention.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Discover how sensory overload and sensory needs play a major role in burnout for Autistic and ADHD people, and pick up strategies for managing sensory overwhelm even when "rest" isn’t an option.Hear honest, relatable insights from Patrick and Megan Anna about identifying sensory triggers, living with constant overwhelm, and unlearning narratives around "not being content"—plus the validating realization that everyone’s sensory profile and needs are truly unique.Get practical tools to help you map your own sensory landscape, communicate your needs, and take actionable steps toward burnout recovery and prevention—grounded in real-life experiences and evidence-based wisdom.If you’re feeling stretched thin by sensory and emotional demands, this episode is designed to help you understand why and start reclaiming what makes you feel safe, soothed, and genuinely well.ResourcesNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource): neurodivergentinsights.notion.site/Boundary-Statements-17da17a4bb8b80c9a45dc8ff9c651725Sensory ChecklistsSensory Preferences: neurodivergentinsights.com/sensory-preferences-the-complete-checklistSensory...

The journey to understanding and integrating a later-in-life neurodivergent identity is often filled with relief, confusion, pride, growth, and other complex emotions—all woven together in a unique, personal arc.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the “neurodivergent identity arc”—a model that explores how people move from the state of not knowing they are neurodivergent to full integration into their identity. Drawing on Dr. Neff’s recent article, their own lived experiences, and patterns observed within neurodivergent communities, Patrick and Megan Anna unpack each stage’s challenges, risks, and transformative moments.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a nuanced understanding of the four phases many neurodivergent adults cycle through—from pre-encounter to integration. Hear how these arcs differ based on privilege, intersectionality, and support needs.Listen to deeply honest, relatable storytelling as both hosts openly share their own journeys with masking, diagnosis, community pride, and the tricky process of reconciling privilege with disability. Their vulnerability makes the conversation both illuminating and affirming.Discover practical insights on moving through identity formation at your own pace—including common pitfalls and growth points—and why showing yourself compassion for “wherever you are” matters more than fitting into a perfect idea of thriving.Whether you’re newly discovering your neurodivergent identity, feeling pride in community, or working toward greater self-acceptance, this episode offers an empathetic roadmap—and a reminder that your process is valid. Get insights about living, learning, and integrating neurodivergent identity in a complex world.Check out Dr. Neff’s Article on Neurodivergent Identity Arcs: neurodivergentinsights.substack.com/p/neurodivergent-identity-arcs————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps...

Content Warning: This episode talks about suicide and may be triggering. If you're in crisis or feeling unsafe, please reach out to a crisis line or local resources. We have provided some below.Suicidal ideation and risk are common among neurodivergent people, and talking openly about suicidality is hard, especially in a society where honesty about these thoughts is often met with fear, stigma, or misunderstanding. Navigating life with suicidal ideation can be an isolating experience, but knowing you're not alone and having resources and strategies at hand can make a life-saving difference.In this episode, Dr. Megan Anna Neff and Patrick Casale, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss suicidality in neurodivergent communities. They share personal stories, break down the spectrum from passive ideation to crisis, discuss the shortcomings of traditional mental health support systems, and offer practical tools for safety planning, reducing risk, and finding hope.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a clear, relatable understanding of the difference between chronic and acute suicidal ideation, including the nuanced ways this shows up for neurodivergent people.Learn practical and accessible tools: how to create a personalized safety plan, what “means reduction” really involves, and how to identify red flags in yourself or loved ones, all explained with sensitivity and real-world insight.Find validation and connection from hearing honest, stigma-free conversations about suicidality from mental health professionals who genuinely get it, and discover resources, grounding strategies, and hope for weathering difficult moments.If you or someone you care about has ever felt overwhelmed by thoughts of not wanting to exist, this episode offers education, real talk, and actionable strategies. Listen for life-affirming insight and ways to help yourself or others stay safe, seen, and supported.ResourcesFree Workbook by Neurodivergent Insights: neurodivergentinsights.com/free/the-neurodivergent-adapted-safety-planFor a list of US and International Crises Lines (including non-carceral lines): neurodivergentinsights.com/neurodivergent-crises-supportNational Mental Health Hotline: 988lifeline.orgInternational Association for Suicide Prevention: iasp.info/suicidalthoughtsCrisis Call Center: hopeline-nc.orgSeekHealing (North Carolina, USA): seekhealing.orgInternationalU.K.: Samaritans 116 123li...

The phrase "everyone’s a little bit ADHD" is coming up more and more lately—but for those who are genuinely ADHD, this can feel dismissive and invalidating. In a world speeding up with constant distractions and increasing demands, society has begun to blur the lines with what the actual difference is between experiencing ADHD traits and living with ADHD as a neurotype.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the nuance behind “everyone's a little bit ADHD.” They unpack the social myths around distraction, impulsivity, and executive functioning in today’s society, share their own stories of late ADHD diagnosis, and reflect on the dangers of minimizing real challenges faced by ADHDers. With candid conversation, they differentiate between ADHD traits and diagnosis, explore the impact of undiagnosed ADHD, and discuss why oversimplification can be harmful.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Learn the difference between ADHD traits that many may experience in a fast-paced world—and the lived disability of ADHD that involves real, sometimes dangerous, daily challenges.Hear personal stories from Patrick and Dr. Neff about late-in-life discovery, navigating shame and grief, and unpacking impulsivity, masking, and complicated relationships.Understand why phrases like “everyone’s a little bit ADHD” can be minimizing, and discover the real-world impact of misdiagnosis, missed support, and the need for greater societal awareness.If you’re curious about ADHD traits in non-ADHDers, or you want to better understand the real experiences of ADHDers, this episode offers insight into the “ADHD for everyone” myth.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on...

Hearing "everyone is a little bit Autistic" can feel invalidating and diminish the distinct experiences of Autistic individuals. These comments, often rooted in misunderstanding or attempted empathy, reveal how language shapes—and sometimes distorts—public understanding of Autism.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the common phrase and idea that “everyone is a little bit Autistic.” They explore why this phrase is so prevalent, the intentions and real impacts behind such statements, and the crucial differences between having “Autistic traits” and living with the full Autistic experience. You’ll hear honest stories about disclosure, invalidation, and what “context sensitivity” really means in identifying Autism—and why language matters when advocating for neurodivergent needs.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a deeper understanding of why the phrase “everyone is a little bit Autistic” can be harmful, and get clear language for differentiating between having Autistic traits and being Autistic.Hear personal reflections from Patrick and Megan Anna on invalidation, masking, disclosure in professional and personal life, and what it’s like to receive common microaggressions—even from therapists and family members.Explore what truly defines the Autistic experience, including insightful discussion of “context sensitivity” as a key factor in proper identification, and how this impacts access to support, accommodations, and authentic self-acceptance.This conversation helps to unpack the phrase “everyone is a little Autistic,” and explores the difference between possessing “Autistic traits” and living with the unique neurological, sensory, and social realities of Autism.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane helps with day-to-day...

Struggling with being labeled "lazy" or "unmotivated" as someone with ADHD can fuel deep shame and misunderstanding. These stereotypes overlook the real challenges and complexities neurodivergent people face every day, especially when it comes to executive functioning and self-worth.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the pervasive myth that ADHD is simply about lack of motivation or laziness. Through candid discussion, they explore the realities of inconsistent motivation, the role of shame and internalized ableism, the overlap and differences between ADHD and Autism, and their own personal experiences managing daily life, self-care, and executive functioning struggles.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain real insight into why ADHDers often internalize harmful labels and what’s actually happening neurologically and emotionally beneath the surface of "laziness" or "lack of motivation."Hear honest stories from Patrick and Megan Anna about managing shame, tackling everyday executive functioning challenges, and embracing self-compassion as a neurodivergent adult.Explore how living with both ADHD and Autism can shape self-understanding, coping strategies, and the ongoing negotiation between passion, energy, and daily life demands.If you’ve ever wrestled with shame or frustration over "simple" tasks, or if you want to better understand the ADHD experience beyond stereotypes, this episode will help you rethink what motivation really looks like and why you’re not alone.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on the care you give. Jane was built with clients in mind, too. With online booking and secure online appointments (telehealth),...

Challenging the stigma that ADHD and Autism are linked to intelligence is critical for fostering self-acceptance and equity in neurodivergent communities. Myths about intellectual ability not only misunderstand neurodiversity but also perpetuate harmful stereotypes and barriers to support.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the pervasive myths about intelligence and neurodivergence—including the misconception that you “can’t be smart and have ADHD,” or that all Autistic people are either intellectually disabled or savants. Through candid discussion and personal stories, they unpack the nuanced reality that ADHD and Autism span the entire intellectual spectrum, delve into how executive functioning struggles are misinterpreted as lack of intelligence or ability, and explore the intersectional impacts of racial bias and systemic injustice for neurodivergent children in schools and society.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Dispel damaging myths about intelligence, success, and neurodivergence by hearing frank conversations about how stereotypes harm both diagnosis and self-esteem for ADHDers and Autistic people.Gain a deeper understanding of intersectionality—learn how race, environment, and access to support shape outcomes for neurodivergent individuals, especially in educational and legal systems.Find validation and practical encouragement: whether you’ve struggled with shame, self-doubt, or dropped out of jobs or school, this episode reminds you that your intelligence and potential are not defined by neurotypical success metrics.This episode invites you to challenge stereotypes about intelligence in relation to ADHD and Autism and embrace the full spectrum of neurodivergent experience.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane...

The language we use to describe Autistic experiences can shape not only how we see ourselves, but how our needs are understood—or overlooked—by others.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the topic of functioning labels in Autistic spaces. Through direct exploration of their own journeys, they unpack the reasons behind the prevalence of labels like “high” or “low” functioning, discuss the roots in societal values around productivity and worth, and offer thoughtful alternatives such as support-needs-based language. They also reflect on the challenges of unlearning internalized ableism, fostering compassion for different arcs of discovery, and addressing community tensions in regards to Autistic people with varying support needs.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain clarity on why functioning labels are widely criticized and how they fail to capture the lived realities of Autistic people—especially when support needs, communication, and daily functioning can vary and intersect in complex ways.Hear candid discussion about the emotional impact of language—how shame, internalized ableism, and gatekeeping in neurodivergent spaces can affect community, self-advocacy, and the willingness to seek help.Discover practical, affirming alternatives to functioning labels and why evolving our language helps build more inclusive, supportive, and respectful Autistic and neurodivergent communities.If you’ve ever wondered about the impact of functioning labels or struggled with finding the “right” language to describe your or your loved ones’ experiences, this episode will challenge, encourage, and inform you about language, identity, and what it means to create more supportive Autistic spaces.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on the care you give. Jane was built with clients in mind, too. With online booking and secure online appointments (telehealth),

Autistic people are often stereotyped as uninterested in social connection, but the reality is far more nuanced, and longing for connection can coexist with the need for isolation or sensory protection. Understanding your own capacity and motivation for relationships isn’t just helpful, it’s often a key part of self-acceptance.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the misconception that Autistic people don’t want connection. They talk about the nuances of social motivation, energy, and capacity; share candid stories about their own friendship, relational differences, and how the neurodivergent community feels different than neurotypical interaction; and offer insight into parallel play, the importance of rhythmic attunement, and what actually makes friendship feel sustainable and authentic.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Challenge myths and stereotypes about Autistic social motivation and capacity — this conversation provides context, nuance, and real-life examples from Patrick and Megan Anna’s own experiences.Discover what makes neurodivergent connections uniquely rewarding (and sometimes difficult), including honest reflections on friendship maintenance, the metaphor of “cactus” versus “Venus flytrap” personalities, and the power of finding your rhythm with others.Learn ways to build and sustain relationships that honor your needs, including adaptive strategies for digital, parallel, and deep connections—and why unmasking and attunement matter in making friendship work.If you’ve ever wrestled with wanting connection but feeling like social energy is limited—or if you’re searching for friendships that honor your neurodivergent rhythms—this episode is full of empathy, insight, and practical ideas. Deepen your understanding of what authentic connection looks like and how to find it in your own life.Additional LearningTo explore more about relationships, cross-neurotype dynamics, and navigating communication differences, check out these Neurodivergent Insights articles:The Double Empathy Problem: neurodivergentinsights.com/the-double-empathy-problemCross-Neurotype Communication: neurodivergentinsights.com/object-based-vs-social-based-conversationsObject-Based vs. Social-Based Conversations: neurodivergentinsights.com/object-based-vs-social-based-conversations————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join

Navigating the transition from education to the workplace is challenging for anyone, but neurodivergent individuals face unique barriers, from inaccessible application processes to the pressure of masking during interviews and employment. Understanding what actually helps—and hinders—neurodivergent people thrive at work is crucial for both job-seekers and employers who want truly inclusive environments.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the real-life hurdles and opportunities that come with entering the workforce as a neurodivergent person. They reflect on their own post-college job searches, discuss the emotional and executive functioning demands of interviews, and consider why standard hiring practices can be so exclusionary. The conversation also features guest Jan Coplan from Landmark College, who shares insights about equipping students with learning differences for meaningful employment, and highlights actionable ways employers can create neuro-inclusive workplaces.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain honest, neurodivergent perspectives on the struggles of job applications, interviewing, and workplace social dynamics—plus hear practical strategies for advocating for your own needs at work.Learn about innovative recruitment and onboarding practices from Landmark College’s Jan Coplan, and discover specific, low-cost accommodations employers can make for a genuinely accessible workplace.Explore thoughtful discussions on disclosure, masking, intuition in hiring, and the emotional impact of workplace culture—all with a focus on what actually helps neurodivergent people succeed long-term.This episode offers both real-world stories and actionable advice on transitioning from higher education to the workplace as a neurodivergent person, as well as advice for creating professional spaces where everyone can show up authentically. Learn how small shifts can make a big difference in supporting neurodiversity in education and at work.More about Jan:Jan Coplan, M.Ed., has more than 28 years of experience in the field of education and has been a career counselor for the past eleven years. She is currently the Senior Director of Employer Relations and Career Connections at Landmark College in Putney, Vermont, an institution exclusively for students who learn differently, including dyslexia, ADHD, or autism.Jan is passionately committed to creating greater awareness of the advantages individuals with learning differences bring to the workplace. In the last several years, she has been a contributing author to research published in this realm. During her ten years at Landmark College, she has worked to increase the number of professional work experiences for neurodivergent individuals both locally and nationwide, including placements at Hasbro, JP Morgan Chase, Microsoft, SAP, EY, Prudential, CAI Neurodiverse Solutions, Equinix, Tufts Point 32 Health, and Dell Technologies. She played an instrumental role in Landmark College becoming the first Neurodiversity Hub (a collaborative to create employment opportunities for neurodivergent students) in the United States.Affiliations:National Association of Colleges and Employers (NACE)Cooperative Education and Internship AssociationNational Career Development AssociationNeurodiversity HubDisability INCollege Autism NetworkLandmark College is seeking employers interested in hiring their students to join their upcoming Career Fair on 10/22/2025. Learn about Landmark College’s Career Support: landmark.edu/academics/career-connectionsJan’s LinkedIn: a...

Discovering you're Autistic or ADHD as an adult can turn your whole sense of self upside down. Navigating the emotional aftermath—wondering, "Am I still me?"—often brings up more questions than answers, and can feel both destabilizing and deeply transformative.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the post-diagnosis identity spiral that so many neurodivergent people encounter. They break down the emotional complexities of life after self-discovery or diagnosis, exploring questions of authenticity, the role of masking, the impact of imposter syndrome, and how claiming a neurodivergent identity can shift relationships, careers, and even self-advocacy.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Unpack how coming to terms with an Autism or ADHD diagnosis can impact your sense of self, relationships, career, and community—plus, get insight into navigating the uncertainty and self-doubt that often arise after discovery.Learn why it’s common to experience imposter syndrome, emotional overwhelm, and a desire to "map" every experience to a diagnosis—and how to find reassurance and clarity in the midst of this complexity.Hear Patrick and Megan Anna’s honest reflections on their own journeys, including how health events, career changes, and intersecting identities complicate (and enrich) the process of integrating a new neurodivergent identity.If you’re asking yourself who you are after discovering you’re neurodivergent—or supporting someone through this kind of identity spiral—this episode offers validation, practical insights, and the reminder that you’re not alone on this journey.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane✨ Jane:Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves. Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on the care you give. Jane was built with clients in mind, too. With online booking and secure online appointments (telehealth), your care stays accessible and easy to keep up with.To learn more about Jane, a...

Discovering you’re ADHD later in life can be a profound and disorienting experience—especially when it means re-examining your relationships, identity, and even your sense of self. For many ADHD adults, the post-diagnosis journey brings unique challenges and unexpected waves of both relief and shame.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the post-discovery experience of ADHD, both independent of or including an Autism diagnosis, exploring how ADHD can impact self-perception, partnerships, and daily living. Drawing from their own stories and clinical expertise, Patrick and Megan Anna reflect on internalized ableism, common misconceptions, relationship dynamics, and the emotionally complex reality of integrating an Autistic and ADHD (AuDHD) identity.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a compassionate, firsthand perspective on the emotional aftermath of discovering you’re ADHD as an adult—including how shame, self-acceptance, and relief can intermingle in unexpected ways.Understand the nuanced impact of ADHD traits on relationships, from struggles with contentment and impulsivity to the important role of neurotype-informed partnership accommodations.Hear honest discussion about the societal framing of ADHD and Autism for AuDHDers, internalized stigma, and the lifelong process of making peace with the challenging (and sometimes conflicting) aspects of a dual-neurotype identity.If you’re navigating your own late-in-life ADHD discovery—or supporting someone who is—this episode offers insight, validation, and real talk about what it means to live and grow as an ADHD adult.————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsor: Landmark College Success Center & Jane✨ Landmark College Success CenterLandmark College Success Center, located in San Mateo, California, provides academic support, executive function coaching, and transition-to-college skills training for neurodiverse learners, both in-person and online. A subsidiary of Landmark College (