Going Rogue

Jill welcomes Law Roach, the visionary stylist who transformed Zendaya into a fashion icon. As the first Black stylist to top the Hollywood Reporter's power list and win the CFDA's Inaugural Stylist Award, Law traces his evolution from Chicago's South Side to founding Deliciously Vintage to becoming one of fashion's most influential voices. He reveals the psychology driving his distinctive styling approach, explains his revolutionary concept of method dressing, and shares the personal mantras that fuel his work. Discover how his partnership with Zendaya began, the strategies he used to overcome industry gatekeeping, and why he believes magazines remain essential to a stylist's success. Law's philosophy on confidence and his rule-breaking approach to fashion offer a masterclass in reshaping an industry. Jill’s conversation captures the vision and legacy of a stylist who fundamentally changed the game. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill welcomes a pioneering hair artist whose work has shaped the industry for almost forty years. Julien d'Ys has graced the pages of Vogue, styled iconic supermodels, and showcased his artistry at the Met Costume Institute in New York. Celebrated for transcending conventional boundaries, Julien has elevated hair into an art form that fuses fantasy, historical references, and sculptural vision. Julien reflects on his creative path, his partnerships with legendary photographers including Steven Meisel, Irving Penn, and Peter Lindbergh, and the artistic influences spanning surrealism, history, and pure imagination that fuel his work. He discusses his approach to beauty and creativity, the formative experiences that shaped his career, and his unforgettable contributions to fashion's most iconic moments. Click HERE for a searchable who's who on this episode Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill chats with Drew Elliot, the visionary cultural architect who transformed entertainment media from the inside out. From his roots as an entertainment-obsessed kid in Indiana to becoming the creative force who popularized "Break the Internet" and turned it into a cultural phenomenon, Drew's journey is a masterclass in cultural disruption. Explore Drew's groundbreaking tenure at Paper Magazine, where he orchestrated iconic moments with A-list celebrities that helped define digital culture. He shares the philosophy behind his success: surrounding himself with geniuses, demolishing creative boundaries, and cultivating an inclusive environment where the next generation of talent can thrive. Drew shares his insights into innovation, creativity, and what it really takes to shape culture in the digital age. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill chats with renowned makeup artist and CEO Gucci Westman. Gucci shares her journey from her unique upbringing on a California ashram to becoming one of Hollywood's most sought-after makeup artists, working with directors like David Lynch and Michael Bay. They discuss her breakthrough into high-fashion covers and editorial spreads, a pivotal move propelled by Grace Coddington, and her successful leap into entrepreneurship with the launch of her clean luxury beauty brand, Westman Atelier. Join them as they reminisce about memorable celebrity shoots, the evolution of the fashion and beauty industry, and Gucci's passion for creating high-performance, skincare-infused makeup. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill welcomes the always charming Brian Coats, affectionately known as "the boy in the closet," for an intimate conversation about his remarkable journey through fashion's most prestigious corridors. Brian's fashion odyssey began in 1996 as an assistant at Vogue Magazine, where he commanded the legendary fashion closet and collaborated with the incomparable Andre Leon Talley. Together, they unpack colorful behind-the-scenes tales from those formative years, from the infamous closet smoking incident to the daily choreography of managing fashion's most coveted archive, a central hub of activity and competition for the editorial and styling teams. The story reaches back even further, to six-year-old Brian in North Carolina, mesmerized by Elsa Klensch's CNN style segments, a moment that ignited a lifelong passion. He recounts his unwavering determination to reach Parsons School of Design and the pivotal realization that his destiny lay in editorial styling rather than design. In 2000, Brian transitioned to GQ, where he honed his craft as a fashion editor for 13 years before embracing the freelance world. He candidly discusses the adjustment, from overpreparing for his first independent shoot to navigating an industry landscape without a magazine masthead behind his name. The conversation turns to Brian's current work styling high-profile magazine spreads, advertising campaigns, and celebrities, including his continued partnership with Jimmy Fallon. Jill and Brian examine the contrasts between Vogue and GQ cultures, the art of juggling competing demands and personalities, and surviving fashion's relentless pace. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE

Step into the world of Billy Norwich in this second part of an intimate and expansive conversation with Jill. Billy reflects on his career spanning decades, including his work as a gossip columnist for the New York Daily News and the New York Post, and his editorial roles at Vogue and other prestigious publications. As someone uniquely positioned at the intersection of old New York and new New York society, Billy shares fascinating encounters with figures ranging from Mrs. Astor to Malcolm Forbes, offering a rare perspective on the evolution of high society. Hear about his personal anecdotes involving colorful characters like Donald Trump, Kim Kardashian, and John F. Kennedy Jr., and get a glimpse into the changing landscape of journalism and fashion. Billy shares heartfelt stories, including his experiences with significant figures like Liz Smith and Evelyn Lauder, and opens up about his deep, enduring friendship with Anna Wintour that has shaped both his personal and professional life. He discusses his novels 'Learning to Drive' and 'My Mrs. Brown,' navigating relationships, the impact of life events on his work, and finding meaning in the objects and memories that surround him. This part continues a thoughtful exploration of legacy, memory, and storytelling, offering unique insights from a man who has witnessed the transformation of New York's social fabric and continues to find joy and purpose in his journey. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE

Jill sits down with the incomparable Billy Norwich for an intimate conversation about his remarkable 40-year reign chronicling New York society, from dishing gossip at the Daily News and Post to his glamorous two decades shaping stories at Vogue. Billy spills on his storytelling philosophy, shaped by Anna Wintour's advice to "edit your life" and his personal theory of the "anthropology of style." The conversation takes a very personal turn as Billy opens up about losing his father at nine and mother by nineteen. These heartbreaking losses could have destroyed him but instead deepened his determination. He found his chosen family among industry powerhouses like the iconic gossip columnist Liz Smith, who didn't just mentor him—she masterminded his transformation from Billy Goldberg to Billy Norwich, a reinvention that still stirs complex emotions. Billy shares unforgettable stories, from his exclusive scoop on Caroline Kennedy's engagement to surviving the cutthroat world of high-stakes fashion events and A-list encounters. His insider perspective reveals the artful dance between professional curiosity and personal discretion that made him the trusted confidant of New York's elite. Through candid anecdotes and hard-earned wisdom, this intimate conversation paints a portrait of New York society while sharing Billy's personal journey of resilience and reinvention. Whether you're interested in gossip journalism's inner workings, New York’s high society dynamics, or one man's story of finding family and purpose after profound loss, you won't want to miss this unguarded exchange. For a who's who of everyone mentioned in this episode CLICK HERE Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling

Jill sits down with renowned makeup artist Dick Page, whose rebellious approach to beauty has left an indelible mark on fashion's visual landscape. Known for his mantra that "makeup should be fun, not a chore," Dick shares his unconventional philosophy that sees makeup as a creative canvas rather than a corrective tool. Dick opens up about his unexpected beginnings—from fascination with the varying shades of red he observed working in a slaughterhouse as a teenager, to his journey through London's photo processing labs in the early '90s before landing in New York. Without formal training but armed with determination, he began collaborating with legendary photographers like Juergen Teller and Corinne Day, eventually catching the eye of Calvin Klein. Through candid conversation, Dick reflects on the pivotal relationships that shaped his career. Working alongside Melanie Ward, David Sims, and Kate Moss, and developing close collaborations with photographers Jamie Hawkesworth, Inez & Vinoodh, and Bruce Weber. He reveals why he prefers natural light, dismisses mood boards, and embraces the collaborative spirit that defines his work. At the heart of Dick's philosophy is an appreciation for makeup's ephemeral nature. "Makeup is ephemeral...the beauty of it, the freedom of it, is that it doesn't last," he explains, embracing a Zen-like acceptance of impermanence that challenges an industry often obsessed with perfection. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE

Jill sits down with her friend and colleague Edward Barsamian to explore his fascinating decade-long journey through fashion media. Edward shares stories from his impressive career path, starting as a style director at Vogue where he closely followed airport looks and red carpet appearances of stars like Amal Clooney and Zoe Kravitz, then moving into the digital world of celebrity fashion coverage. The conversation covers Edward's early Vogue years, his time at Gilt Group and The New York Times Style Magazine, and his return to Vogue in a major digital position. Edward recounts his experiences at glamorous events like the Golden Globes and Met Gala, where he interviewed celebrities and helped drive the digital transformation of fashion reporting. He reflects on the changing landscape of fashion media while sharing behind-the-scenes moments with high-profile figures including Kim Kardashian, Rihanna, and Kendall Jenner. Later, as Edward moved to Victoria Beckham, he opens up about the unique challenges of bringing a brand's voice to life across digital channels. This episode delivers practical career insights, observations on fashion's evolution, and solid advice for newcomers to the field. Perfect for fashion lovers and anyone interested in breaking into the industry. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill sits with Christiaan, the legendary hairstylist who has shaped the beauty industry for over five decades. Known for creating iconic looks including Debbie Harry's signature shag and Grace Jones' striking flat top, Christiaan is also credited with inventing the revolutionary undercut years before it became mainstream. His distinguished career includes collaborations with renowned photographers Arthur Elgort, Peter Lindbergh, Richard Avedon, Irving Penn, and Mario Testino, while styling supermodels Naomi Campbell, Christy Turlington, and Linda Evangelista for leading publications like Vogue and Harper's Bazaar. Christiaan's remarkable journey began in a small Dutch village, working in his father's barbershop, and led him through military service in the Marines to eventually becoming creative director at Bergdorf Goodman. His path to success was marked by pivotal moments and chance encounters that opened doors to working with influential fashion editors including Polly Mellon and Phyllis Posnick. The precision and discipline learned during his military service proved instrumental in developing his meticulous approach to hair artistry. In this candid conversation, Christiaan discusses the evolution of beauty standards, his philosophy of prioritizing client comfort over fleeting trends, and his experiences working with fashion icons who revolutionized the industry. He offers insights into the creative process behind his most memorable work and reflects on how his approach to hair styling has contributed to changing perceptions of beauty and self-expression. The episode provides a comprehensive look at a career that has not only created stunning visual moments but has fundamentally influenced how we understand hair as an art form. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE

Jill sits down with legendary photographer Mark Seliger to hear how he went from small-town Amarillo, Texas, to defining rock and roll imagery for an entire generation. As Rolling Stone's chief photographer for a decade, Mark shot an incredible 188 covers and opens up about his tricks for catching those real, unguarded moments that make his photos so striking. He talks about making the leap to New York City in 1984, the photographer friends who helped him along the way, and landing those career-defining Rolling Stone gigs. You'll hear about his iconic shots including Kurt Cobain's final portraits and Jerry Seinfeld's Wizard of Oz farewell, plus when he took his talent to Condé Nast, where he worked with bigger budgets and was able to bring his vision to a wider audience. Mark shares stories from shoots with everyone from Barack Obama to the Dalai Lama, breaking down how he finds that vulnerable, authentic moment in each person. He also drops some solid advice for photographers just starting out. It's a captivating dive into the stories and skills behind some truly legendary images. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill welcomes Karla Martínez de Salas, the Editor-in-Chief of Vogue Mexico and Vogue Latin America. Karla’s illustrious fashion journey began at Vogue as a fashion assistant at American Vogue in 2002. Today, she holds a prominent position at the helm of Vogue's Latin American editions. Karla shares her experiences growing up in a bicultural environment in El Paso, Texas, and how her fascination with fashion and journalism started at a young age. She discusses the differences between Vogue Mexico and Vogue Latin America, including the logistical and cultural variations they navigate each month. Karla also reflects on her time at various fashion institutions, from her internships to working at The New York Times Style Magazine and Interview Magazine. She sheds light on the importance of representation and diversity, notably her achievement of featuring the first indigenous woman on the cover of Vogue. Throughout the discussion, Karla emphasizes the vital role of family support, hard work, and staying grounded, even while managing an expansive career and raising her twins. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Grace Coddington doesn't just style pictures, she builds worlds. In this rare and unfiltered conversation, the legendary creative director sits down with Jill and longtime friend Karen Mulligan to talk about the images that defined her and the ones that almost broke her. From her early modeling days and Beatrix Miller's British Vogue to the Anna Wintour era in New York, Grace reflects on a career shaped by instinct, irreverence, and one very iconic hairdo. She revisits the chaos of the Wizard of Oz shoot with Keira Knightley, the comic genius of Ben Stiller's Funny Face spoof, and the time Sean “Diddy” Combs and Kate Moss tested her patience (and her vision) on set. She goes deep on her collaborations with Steven Klein, Peter Lindbergh, and Annie Leibovitz, breaking down the creative friction, trust, and unspoken language behind some of Vogue's most unforgettable fashion stories. Now in her "post-Vogue" chapter, Grace opens up about drawing, pottery, Louis Vuitton, and why she'll never stop telling stories through style. This is Grace Coddington like you've never heard her: intimate, hilarious, and still rogue after all these years. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill visits with Mark Healy, an experienced editor and writer recognized for his sharp insights into media influence and power dynamics. Together, Jill and Mark reminisce about their days at Condé Nast during what many regard as the company's golden age. They reflect on Condé Nast's unmistakable company ethos, from its unwritten codes of conduct like elevator silence to the subtle markers of hierarchy and achievement. They also trace Mark's career trajectory beginning with his early role at Playboy through his transformative work at Details and GQ, where he helped reshape both magazines' identities. Mark shares how Details positioned itself as GQ's rebellious counterpart, embracing a grittier, more youthful aesthetic. They delve into major industry transformations, particularly how digital media and the shift from model-focused to celebrity-driven covers revolutionized publishing. Following his Condé Nast years, Mark describes his transition to Men's Journal and subsequent projects, stressing how vital flexibility has become in today's media environment. Mark explains his latest project, 'The Nasty,' a short oral history podcast of Condé Nast through candid interviews with former staffers. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.

Jill is joined by Mary Howard, a renowned set and production designer celebrated for crafting captivating, detailed environments for top fashion photographers. Mary traces her unconventional path from junior tennis player and art student in New Orleans to working alongside industry legends like Annie Leibovitz, Steven Meisel, and Steven Klein. She reveals her creative methodology for bringing conceptual visions to life in three dimensions, emphasizing how every small element matters in her designs. Mary reflects on formative experiences building elaborate Mardi Gras floats and working on the Macy's Thanksgiving Parade, which developed her production expertise. She recounts standout Vogue projects including the Edith Wharton series, Romeo and Juliet shoot, and a 'Shape of Water'-inspired shoot featuring Mia Goth, describing the complexities of coordinating intricate sets alongside animals and props. Looking ahead, Mary weighs in on how AI might reshape set design while offering guidance to newcomers in the field, stressing the value of flexibility, modesty, and genuine enthusiasm for the craft. Follow on Instagram and Threads at @goingrogue.podcast and @jilldemling Follow on Bluesky Follow on TikTok Send us your questions or comments by calling us at 518-21-ROGUE Going Rogue is produced by Jill Demling and Maddie Kelly, who also serves as our social media director. Matty Rosenberg is the executive producer Be sure to follow Going Rogue on your favorite podcast platform. Going Rogue is part of the Radio Free Rhinecliff media network.