Claim OwnershipHer Kajal Won't Smudge
Subscribed: 5Played: 83
Subscribe
© 2025 HKWS
Description
Her Kajal Won't Smudge is a podcast about South Asian women who are pushing back on desi social norms through art, content, dance, music, film, and more.
We ask every guest: What does feminism mean to you? In South Asian spaces, the word “feminist” is still linked to promiscuity, selfishness or a rejection of family values. We want to unpack that.
Our guests remind us that feminism isn’t one thing. It’s a way to be your fuller self, have voice, choice, and power in a culture obsessed with “what will people say?”
Social norms aren’t fixed. We create them, which means we can rewrite them too.
30 Episodes
Reverse
In this episode, Shana is in conversation with renowned Bharatanatyam dancer, Mythili Prakash. Bharatanatyam is one of India’s oldest dance forms. Through distinctive hand gestures, movements and facial expressiveness, its dancers convey ancient stories from Hindu texts. In performing these stories, we also perpetuate patriarchal social norms about a woman and a goddess’ place. Mythili’s choreography probes these norms, rewriting ancient stories and writing new ones in which women are represented in their full humanity and without the need for a pedestal. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website.www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @mythiliprakash on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Zara Suhail Mannan is Shana’s guest on this week’s episode of Her Kajal Won’t Smudge. Zara studied English at Yale University. After Yale, she could have sought out the best-paying corporate job she could have found, but instead Zara returned to Pakistan to teach at an all-boys underprivileged school. By day, she taught, presenting as a man, and mentored young boys and, by night, she was one-half of a glittery, sparkly, pop band called Mystical Shayari. It all came to a head when Mystical Shayiri did a photoshoot, glammed up, in front of a monument to the founder of Pakistan, Quaid-e-Azam Mohammed Ali Jinnah. Next came online trolling, death threats, arrest, TV shaming and more. But what Zara has won in the process is truly a testament to the force that she is. Let’s just say, she set the record straight about what it means to be a Pakistani and she continues to live this activism through Kitab Ghar, a public library truly open to all. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Our guest this week is Kirat Assi, a popular radio personality who was catfished over a nine year period. What began as a long-distance friendship with Bobby Jandu, a man she knew through her tight-knew community, turned into a controlling and coercive relationship that took over Kirat’s life. Kirat never met the man she spent countless hours chatting with because that Bobby simply did not exist. His identity had been stolen. To our absolute surprise, the catfisher turned out to be Kirat’s closest confidante during this entire ordeal, her own female cousin. We might just be the only podcast that delves deep into the social norms that shape this story. Was Kirat gullible? Or could this have happened to any one of us, with the right/wrong circumstances? Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Read more about Kirat’s story on her website. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Shana is joined by Tracy Vadakumchery, who goes by the moniker “Bad Indian Therapist”. As an Indian-American therapist, Tracy wants us to unpack what it means to be a “good desi”. Her clients are South Asian Americans who are struggling with desi social norms and expectations and beauty standards. For most of us, self-criticism is natural. We judge ourselves against log kya kehenge (what will people say), model minority myth and idealized perfection. Tracy helps us see that by people-pleasing, living in guilt and shame, our mental health is under constant attack. She empathizes with our lived experience, because it has been hers too, and she wants us to know that our authentic inner voice can co-exist in harmony with our culture and community. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @thebadindiantherapist on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Award winning visual artist and photographer Ashfika Rahman chronicles the stories of the marginalized who get written out of history. In this episode, Shana asks Ashfika about how she came to be an artist, what inspires her to document the lives of Bangladeshi disappeared and survivors of rape and how these stories reflect the lives of women all across South Asia. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @ashfikarahman47 on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh, Saakshi Samant Editorial Assistance: Meghna Gulati Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Anonymous visual artist, Princess Pea features this week on Her Kajal Won’t Smudge. Shana asks Princess Pea about her iconic headgear - a giant anime-like helmet that creates a safe space for Princess Pea and the women who become part of her practice. This headgear is not a mask and it is not about hiding from the male gaze. It is about much much more than that; it is about self-awareness and authenticity. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @princesspeaindia on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Award-winning science journalist and author, Angela Saini joins Shana on this episode to discuss The Patriarchs, a book which asks the bold and important question: how did men come to rule? Shana asks Angela if we live in a patriarchal world because it is our biological destiny, if religion has created gender stereotypes that persist to this day and if there ever was a golden age when women were in charge. Angela and Shana also talk about desi mothers-in-law and how they have come to be part of the patriarchy. Angela’s book delves into what is the root cause of patriarchy and what she finds is so eye-opening that you will see both history and the present differently. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @angeladsaini on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
Trigger Warning: This episode contains mentions of self-harm and violence against women. Listener discretion is advised. Actress and activist Jameela Jamil joins Shana to talk about body positivity, the “experiment” of social media, how the diet industry preys on women’s insecurities around body image and Jameela’s own struggles with beauty standards. They also talk about “female perfectionism”, a paradigm that locks women of all ages in the belief that perfectionism is the only standard of success. Anything less is failure. Jameela sees herself as a “feminist in progress” and she accepts her mistakes, openly admits them and shows herself compassion. Another big topic they hit upon is toxic masculinity, how we got here and the role and responsibility women have to help men do better. Shana and Jameela do not see eye to eye on this, but this is a podcast that gives space to a range of feminisms. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @jameelajamil on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
On this episode, Shana talks to investigative journalist, Suddaf Chaudry, about her reporting in South Asia and in war torn countries, her time in Afghanistan and how the lives of Afghani women have been impacted by Taliban rule since the withdrawal of US troops in 2021. Suddaf also shares how, growing up, she was inspired to become a journalist by the incredible female journalists she watched on TV. Suddaf reminds us how very important it is to have female representation in all walks of life and how the present erasure of Afghani women in public has future repercussions for what young Afghani girls and women will imagine as possible for themselves. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Read more of Suddaf’s work on www.suddafchaudry.com. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Saakshi Samant, Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
This week, Shana is joined by photographer and artist, Habiba Nowrose. Habiba breaks down her photo series ‘Concealed’ and ‘Life of Venus’, which visually depict the many ways women are expected to conform to society’s expectations to such an extent that they feel lost, even to themselves. Habiba describes some of her photographs in this episode, you can see them here. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @habiba_nowrose_photography on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Saakshi Samant, Quoyina Ghosh Editorial Assistance: Meghna Gulati Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
In this episode, Shana chats with model and Instagram creator, Sobia Ameen. Sobia shares how she ended up on the cover of Harper’s Bazaar India even though she’s an architect by training. Sobia talks about beauty standards and her activism around topics like menstrual shame and sexual assault, both of which are very personal to her. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @sobia93 on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Saakshi Samant, Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
This week, Shana is joined by the Indian Urdu poet and activist Sabika Abbas Naqvi. Sabika paints a picture of her home and neighbourhood in Lucknow, India, and her deep connection to both that is reflected in her work. She talks about reclaiming male-dominated poetry spaces as a woman, how her poetry is a tool of resistance against oppression. Sabika recites her poem, Maadari Zabaane (Mother Tongues) in this episode. You can read the English translation of the poem here. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow Sabika (@boltiaurat) on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Saakshi Samant, Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
In this episode of Her Kajal Won’t Smudge, Shana is in conversation with Pakistani-Canadian filmmaker Zarrar Kahn. Zarrar talks to Shana about his award-winning horror film ‘In Flames’ which captures, you guessed it, the horrors of patriarchy as told through the lives of the protagonists, a mother and daughter. In Flames conveys the daily experiences of life in a patriarchal society and even though this film is set in Pakistan, its message is a universal one. Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @kahn.zarrar on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Saakshi Samant, Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
On this first episode of season 3 of Her Kajal Won’t Smudge, Shana is joined by the queen of Pakistani pop music – Meesha Shafi. In 2018, Meesha spoke out publicly about the sexual harassment she endured at the hands of a popular actor. Time Magazine described this moment as having sparked Pakistan’s #MeToo movement. In this candid conversation, Meesha shares what it means to live with her decision to speak out and how her music is an expression of her reflective self-journey. The woman we meet is courageous, vulnerable and so completely authentic. Meesha talks about the music videos for her songs Amrit and Hot Mango Chutney Sauce. You can watch them here: Amrit Hot Mango Chutney Sauce Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com. Follow @meesha.shafi on Instagram. CREDITS: Host and Creative Director: Shana Head of Visual Design: Minal Jadeja Visual Designers: Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde This is a Maed in India production Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar Junior Producer: Saakshi Samant, Quoyina Ghosh Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram, Nihar Temkar
In this episode, Shana is in conversation with Bangladeshi women’s rights activist and poet, Sadaf Saaz. Sadaf talks about her journey from the UK to Bangladesh and how she found her feminism along the way, the strides made by the Bangladeshi feminist movement, the role of female garment workers in changing attitudes about a woman’s place in society and Sadaf’s poetry, which has been a constant in her life. Sadaf and Shana also discuss an issue close to Sadaf’s heart, the plight of the Birangona, the hundreds of thousands of women who were victims of sexual violence at the hands of the Pakistani army during the 1971 war. While the stories and records of the Birangona have been systematically erased and covered up by both the Bangladeshi and Pakistani governments, it is the feminists on both sides who continue to acknowledge, remember and build bridges.
Follow Sadaf on X @SadafSaaz.
Follow us on Instagram @herkajalwontsmudge and check out our website www.herkajalwontsmudge.com.
CREDITS:
Host and Creative Director: Shana
This is a Maed in India production
Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas
Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome
Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar
Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram
Visual Design & Social Media: Minal Jadeja, Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde
In this episode, Shana speaks with award-winning actor, director and producer, Sarmad Khoosat, the first male guest on Her Kajal Won’t Smudge.
In this conversation, Shana and Sarmad talk about Zindagi Tamasha (“Circus of Life”), a movie directed and produced by Sarmad. It was Pakistan’s submission for the 93rd Oscars but it has never had a theatrical release in Pakistan.
Sarmad shares his thoughts on the controversy around Zindagi Tamasha, how men and women are both limited by social norms and the public’s heartfelt response to the intolerance Zindagi Tamasha has faced.
Plus they discuss the influence Saadat Hasan Manto, the writer, has had on Sarmad’s life.
Follow Sarmad on Instagram @sarmadkhoosat.
CREDITS:
Host and Creative Director: Shana
This is a Maed in India production
Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas
Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome
Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar
Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram
Visual Design & Social Media: Minal Jadeja, Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde
In this episode, Shana is in conversation with Kate Manne (philosopher, associate professor at Cornell University and author of Down Girl and Entitled) and Urna Chakrabarty (graduate student at Cornell University) to ask: why is there so much violence against women in South Asia? This is a question discussed by many academics and multilateral agencies and it is a source of daily concern for desi women who navigate everyday life under threat of violence. Contrary to our preconceived notion that crimes against women are random, Kate and Urna provide a very different perspective. They decode the systemic nature of violence against women and draw out the ‘logic of misogyny’ which perpetuates sexist, gendered roles through the threat of violence and victim-shaming.
Follow Kate on X @kate_manne.
CREDITS:
Host and Creative Director: Shana
This is a Maed in India production
Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas
Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome
Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar, Nikkethana Kamal
Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram
Visual Design & Social Media: Minal Jadeja, Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde
In this episode, Shana talks to Surabhi Yadav, the creator of Women At Leisure, an Instagram account filled with 7 years of pictures and videos of women simply at leisure - having a cup of chai, climbing a tree, playing football. For Surabhi, time is a feminist issue, which lays bare the many oppressions of caste, class and the invisibility of women’s work.
They also discuss the backstory about how Women at Leisure came to be. After Surabhi’s mother, Basanti, passed away, Surabhi set out to keep her memory alive by asking aunts and her mother’s friends to share her stories. The person they described in story after story was a funny prankster, adjectives that did not come to mind when Surabhi thought of her mother. Who was her mother, when she was not busy managing a large family? This inspired Surabhi to create Women at Leisure as a kind of ongoing conversation with her mother. This conversation led Shana to also share why she created Her Kajal Won’t Smudge. The similarities in Surabhi and Shana’s journeys are a reflection of just how life brings two people together in ways that can be so unexpected and yet so in harmony.
Follow Women At Leisure @women_at_leisure on Instagram.
CREDITS:
Host and Creative Director: Shana
This is a Maed in India production
Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas
Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome
Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar
Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram
Visual Design & Social Media: Minal Jadeja, Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde
In this episode, Shana is in conversation with visual artist, illustrator and graphic designer, Mira Malhotra. Mira runs Studio Kohl, a design studio with a very recognisable visual style and a roster of clients that are big name brands, corporations and charities. What makes Mira such a compelling and unique designer is that her feminism is ever present in all she does. Shana asks Mira about the origins of her feminism and how it came to be such a natural extension of her life and work, personal and professional.
Follow Mira @kokumkohla and Studio Kohl @studiokohlindia on Instagram.
CREDITS:
Host and Creative Director: Shana
This is a Maed in India production
Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas
Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome
Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar
Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram
Visual Design & Social Media: Minal Jadeja, Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde
In this episode, Shana is in conversation with visual and performance artist, Amber Arifeen. Amber’s art looks at life through women’s eyes, giving insight into how women navigate the world. Take, for example, women and physical safety. Even if it might differ in degree depending on where women live, all women, around the world, can relate to this concept. Amber’s art shows just how this fear of violence against women restricts our freedom and full enjoyment of public spaces, including nature. The wonder of Amber’s art is that by making visible women’s invisible life experiences, Amber creates space for dialogue with society at large.
Follow Amber on Instagram @amber_arifeen
CREDITS:
Host and Creative Director: Shana
This is a Maed in India production
Head of Production: Mae Mariyam Thomas
Project Manager: Shaun Fanthome
Producer: Ruchi Sawardekar, Nikkethana Kamal
Sound Editor & Mix Engineer: Kartik Kulkarni, Lakshman Parsuram
Visual Design & Social Media: Minal Jadeja, Akshat Agarwal, Shaumik Kanvinde
Comments
Download from Google Play
Download from App Store
United States