Invested by Aleph

On this episode of Invested, Michael Eisenberg sits down with Douglas Atkin, former Global Head of Community at Airbnb and author of The Culting of Brands, for a conversation about why people join cults, what that reveals about brands and politics, and how you build something people genuinely belong to. Douglas explains what he found when he set out to study the most extreme forms of belonging — that cult members are almost always ordinary, well-educated, socially capable people, and that they join, stay, and leave for exactly the same reasons as members of brand communities. Michael and Douglas trace that insight from a focus group of teenagers talking about sneakers, to Meetup, to Airbnb — where Douglas spent three and a half weeks interviewing hundreds of hosts and guests and came back with the purpose that still runs the company: create a world where anyone can belong anywhere. He tells the story of what it cost to live that purpose, from taking the Attorney General of New York to court over a subpoena for 15,000 hosts’ data, to giving two non-marketers veto power over a marketing hire, to Airbnb turning away over a million would-be customers who wouldn’t sign its core values. They also go deep on the darker mechanics of belonging: how demonization defines a group and manufactures solidarity, why the far right has run that playbook so effectively, what the decline of religion has to do with the rise of cultic politics, and what Douglas would actually prescribe for the loneliness epidemic. They discuss: Why the people who join cults are completely normal — and why that matters The four Ds of difference, and why a cult is a new idea while a sect is a splinter How demonization creates belonging by defining the in-group and inventing a threat Why brands took over religion’s role, and why politics is now taking over from brands The first golden rule of community: rub your members together until they get sticky Why it takes showing up four times before a community becomes hard to pull apart How Airbnb found “Belong Anywhere” by talking to hundreds of hosts and guests Why a purpose is only real if it costs you something in the short term The New York subpoena fight, and organizing hosts into political activists Core values interviews with veto power, and turning away a million customers The community commitment curve, and how to move people from clicking to face-to-face Why working from home was a bad idea, and what actually treats loneliness Douglas was ‘Global Head of Community’ at Airbnb, on its Leadership Team and was also ‘Architect of Purpose, Culture and Core Values’. He worked at Airbnb from 2012-2017 during its hyper-growth years. He led the development of Airbnb’s Purpose to ‘Create a world where Anyone can Belong Anywhere’. He also led all Community initiatives including grass-roots organizing and Movement-making techniques to mobilize Airbnb Hosts and Guests to take political action that changed laws to recognize home sharing. He was Co-Founder of ‘Peers’, a movement for the Peer-to-Peer economy. Douglas was the author of ‘The Culting of Brands: Turn your Customers into Believers’. He Co-Founded Purpose, an organization that creates Movements, and was on the Board of one of its creations: AllOut, the world’s first and largest LGBTQ rights Movement. He was Partner and Chief Community Officer at Meetup in 2007-8. Prior to all this Community, Purpose and Movement-making stuff he was a Branding expert and Strategic Planner at several leading London and New York firms. Chairman of the U.S. Account Planning Group for three years. If you want to understand community, cults, purpose, culture, movement-making, and why belonging is both the best and the most dangerous thing about human beings — this episode is essential listening. Please rate this episode 5 stars wherever you stream your podcasts! KEY TOPICS  00:00 - Intro 01:25 - “Loyalty Is Dead. Branding Is Over.” 03:49 - The People Who Join Cults Are Normal 06:20 - How Flickr’s Founders Pulled Him Into Tech 08:33 - Why Apple Fans Talk Like Missionaries 11:20 - Cults vs. Sects: The Four Ds of Difference 13:25 - How Demonization Creates Belonging 16:45 - The Far Right’s Demonization Playbook 18:50 - Cultic Politics and the Decline of Religion 24:50 - “Rub Your Members Together Until They Get Sticky” 28:56 - The Breakfast That Led to Airbnb 31:20 - How “Belong Anywhere” Was Born 32:30 - New York Subpoenaed 15,000 Hosts 35:54 - Obama’s Organizers Trained Airbnb Hosts 43:48 - The Interview That Can Veto Your Hire 45:43 - Airbnb Turned Away a Million Customers 47:08 - The “Equal Opportunity Genitalia” Logo 49:05 - Burnt Out at the Top of Hypergrowth 52:12 - Working From Home Was a Disaster 52:34 - The Community Commitment Curve 53:51 - Curing the Loneliness Epidemic 57:58 - 29 Rights, 29 Countries, One Movement 61:19 - The Dark Side of Strong Community RESOURCES Follow Douglas on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/doatkin/ Follow Douglas on X - https://x.com/datkin Read The Culting of Brands - https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/292144/the-culting-of-brands-by-douglas-atkin/ Subscribe to Invested: https://content.aleph.vc/invested Learn more about Aleph: aleph.vc  Sign up for Aleph’s monthly email newsletter: https://newsletter.aleph.vc/ Subscribe to Aleph’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@aleph-vc/ Follow Michael on Twitter: twitter.com/mikeeisenberg Follow Michael on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mieisenberg/ Follow Aleph on Twitter: https://x.com/aleph?s=20  ‍Follow Aleph on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/aleph-vc/ ‍Follow Aleph on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aleph.vc/ CREDITS Executive Producer: Erica Marom  Producer: Sofi Levak, Dalit Merenfeld Video and Editing: Nadav Elovic  Music and Creative Direction: Uri Ar  Content and Editorial: Jackie Goldberg Design: Nimrod Sapir

On this special episode of Invested, Michael Eisenberg pulls together the sharpest AI arguments from the last year of the show and puts them in conversation with one another. You'll hear from Gavin Baker, Sarah Tavel, Micha Kaufman, Elad Raz, Eran Shir, Zach Greenberger and David Magerman - seven investors and founders who disagree about almost everything except the stakes. This is not a group of people arguing over the same set of facts. Because the field is moving so quickly, each of them is describing a different epoch of AI. Compute was supposed to depreciate quickly - instead, demand is growing. Inference wasn't supposed to be profitable - today it is wildly profitable. AI was supposed to be a game for frontier labs only - open source models are now competing with them. And AI was supposed to trigger mass unemployment - the latest numbers suggest the companies going all in on AI are hiring more people, not fewer. From David Magerman calling the financial bubble 10 to 50 times the size of the internet bubble, to Gavin Baker walking through the ROI math on trillions of dollars of GPU spend, to Micha Kaufman arguing that AI gives everyone the same superpowers and therefore gives no one an advantage, to Elad Raz on why the age of compute has replaced the age of energy - this is a fast, honest map of where the debate actually stands. They discuss: Whether AI is a financial bubble - and whether that even matters The $200 billion, $600 billion and now trillion-dollar ROI question on GPU spending What actually improved (and what didn't) between Hopper, Blackwell and Rubin Why inference is gross-margin profitable while model training amortization isn't pretty The employment debate: replacement, augmentation or temporary dislocation What AI does to junior work, mentorship and the pipeline of senior engineers Scaling agent capital instead of human capital - and paying developers to spend tokens Why building a "bridge" the labs will bulldoze is a treacherous strategy Why data and information theory still beat throwing everything into an LLM The unknowable economic returns to superintelligence Why the world moved from fighting over food, to energy, to compute Featured in this episode: Gavin Baker is the Managing Partner and Chief Investment Officer of Atreides Management, LP. Prior to founding Atreides in 2019, Gavin was at Fidelity Investments from 1999 to 2017, most recently as the portfolio manager of the Fidelity OTC Portfolio. Sarah Tavel is a Venture Partner at Benchmark, where she invests in network effect businesses and applications leveraging AI. She was the first female General Partner in Benchmark's history. Prior to Benchmark, Sarah was a General Partner at Greylock Partners, and she joined Pinterest in 2012 after co-leading the Series A investment while at Bessemer Venture Partners. Micha Kaufman is the founder and CEO of Fiverr, the global freelance marketplace that helped define the gig economy. Since launching the platform in 2010, Micha has led Fiverr from a scrappy, bootstrapped startup into a publicly traded company offering millions of services across hundreds of categories. Elad Raz is the Founder and CEO of NextSilicon, a deep-tech company redefining high-performance computing and AI infrastructure. A graduate of the IDF's elite Unit 8200, Elad brings more than 20 years of experience in technology, entrepreneurship and executive leadership. Eran Shir is the Co-Founder, CPO & Chairman at Nexar. He is a serial entrepreneur and investor, and previously served as Entrepreneur in Residence at Aleph. Zach Greenberger is the CEO of Nexar, leading the company's mission to build AI for the physical world using real-world driving data. Prior to Nexar, Zach served as Chief Business Officer at Lyft and held leadership roles at Tesla. Since their episode aired, Nexar and Nauto have agreed to merge, with Zach leading the combined company. David Magerman is a co-founder and Managing Partner at Differential Ventures, a New York-based venture capital fund investing in deep technology companies that help power the data-driven economy. Previously, he spent the entirety of his career at Renaissance Technologies, widely recognized as the world's most successful quantitative hedge fund management company. If you want a clear-eyed view of the bull case, the bubble case, the labor case and the compute case - all in one sitting - this compilation is essential listening. Michael's hope is that you finish it with more questions than answers, and that you go deeper on the full episodes. Please rate this episode 5 stars wherever you stream your podcasts! KEY TOPICS 00:00 - "AI Is a Machine Gun We're Giving Children" 00:43 - Same Topic, Different Epochs 02:10 - How Wrong We All Were a Year Ago 03:12 - A Bubble 10 to 50x the Internet Bubble 03:46 - "OpenAI Isn't a Functioning Business" 03:58 - Hopper to Blackwell: Linear Scaling 04:31 - The Trillion-Dollar ROI Question 05:23 - "I've Never Seen Anything Like This" 06:13 - The Great Employment Debate 07:08 - It's Still the First Inning 07:33 - The Illusion of AI Superpowers 08:51 - Replacing Labor or Augmenting It? 09:13 - What AI Does to Junior Work 09:30 - Scaling Agent Capital, Not Headcount 10:28 - $300 a Day in Tokens Per Developer 12:01 - "We're Going to Bulldoze You" 13:15 - Data Beats Throwing It All Into an LLM 14:12 - Food, Then Energy, Now Compute 14:36 - The Unknowable Returns to Superintelligence 15:22 - More Questions Than Answers RESOURCES Watch the full episode with Gavin Baker - https://www.aleph.vc/content/gavin-baker Watch the full episode with Sarah Tavel - https://www.aleph.vc/content/sarah-tavel Watch the full episode with Micha Kaufman - https://www.aleph.vc/content/micha-kaufman Watch the full episode with Elad Raz - https://www.aleph.vc/content/elad-raz Watch the full episode with Eran Shir & Zach Greenberger - https://www.aleph.vc/content/eran-shir-and-zach-greenberger Watch the full episode with David Magerman - https://www.aleph.vc/content/david-magerman Follow Gavin on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/gavinbaker-portfoliomanager/ Follow Sarah on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahtavel/ Follow Micha on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/michakaufman/ Follow Elad on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/eladraz/ Follow Eran on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/eranshir/ Follow Zach on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/zach-greenberger-a3a3444a/ Follow David on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-magerman-954b25174/ Subscribe to Invested here - https://content.aleph.vc/invested Learn more about Aleph - https://www.aleph.vc/ Sign up for Aleph's monthly email newsletter - https://newsletter.aleph.vc/ Subscribe to our YouTube channel - https://www.youtube.com/@aleph-vc/ Follow Michael on Twitter - https://twitter.com/mikeeisenberg Follow Michael on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/mieisenberg/ Follow Aleph on Twitter - https://x.com/aleph?s=20 Follow Aleph on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/aleph-vc/ Follow Aleph on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/aleph.vc/ CREDITS Executive Producer: Erica Marom  Producer: Sofi Levak, Dalit Merenfeld Video and Editing: Nadav Elovic  Music and Creative Direction: Uri Ar  Content and Editorial: Jackie Goldberg Design: Nimrod Sapir

On this episode of Invested, Michael Eisenberg sits down with Daniel Lubetzky — founder of KIND Snacks, Shark Tank investor, and founder of the Builders Movement — for a wide-ranging conversation about building enduring companies, the values behind them, and using business as a tool to bring divided people together. Daniel shares how KIND grew from a $10,000 idea into a multibillion-dollar brand with only $5 million in primary investment, why he named the company after his father Roman, a Holocaust survivor, and how a decade of failures with his first venture, PeaceWorks, taught him everything he needed to build KIND. He and Michael also go deep on the Middle East, the origins of the “oppressor vs. victim” framework, why good intentions so often produce bad outcomes, and how the Builders Movement is working to equip citizens to solve problems rather than tear each other apart. Drawing on Daniel’s journey from a Jewish school in Mexico City to Stanford Law School to the set of Shark Tank, this episode weaves together entrepreneurship, parenting, resilience, and the conviction that — as Daniel puts it — values create value. They discuss: How KIND grew from $10,000 to a multibillion-dollar company with just $5M in primary investment Why Daniel named the brand after his father, a survivor of the Kovno ghetto and Dachau The decade of failures at PeaceWorks that made KIND possible Why “values are only values when they’re tested and cost you something” Saying no to the zero-sugar fad — and the courage to know what you are not Builders vs. destroyers: the three Ds and the four Cs of a builder’s mindset Why he believes we’re raising a generation without the agency to solve problems What the Abraham Accords prove about challenging conventional wisdom Why he joined Shark Tank full-time — and the deal he thinks could be worth billions Fixing Section 230 and confronting the harms of social media Best known as the founder of KIND Snacks, Daniel is a social entrepreneur whose work spans industries, ideologies, and borders—always rooted in the same mission: to equip people to think flexibly, solve problems creatively, and build durable solutions to our world’s most difficult challenges. Today, through Camino Partners, Daniel and his team of investor-operators back leaders building businesses taking an enduring approach to enhancing consumers’ lives. He is also the founder of Builders, a movement helping people move beyond "us vs. them" mindsets. Builders equips citizens to uncover hidden common ground and build on it – with durable solutions that advance the will of the people. After five seasons as a guest on Shark Tank, Daniel joined the cast full-time in 2024. He is also the author of The New York Times-bestseller Do the KIND Thing. Daniel holds a BA in Economics and International Relations from Trinity University and a JD from Stanford Law School. A proud U.S. citizen who immigrated from Mexico at 16, he enjoys time with his family and a good magic trick. If you want to understand how to build a brand that lasts, why failure is the raw material of success, and what it takes to build bridges in a divided world, this episode is essential viewing. Please rate this episode 5 stars wherever you stream your podcasts! KEY TOPICS  00:00 – A Multibillion-Dollar Brand, No Investment Needed 01:47 – Why He Named It KIND 04:10 – His Father Roman, a Holocaust Survivor 09:19 – Moshe Pupik and the PeaceWorks Years 14:09 – The Night He Bummed a Ride From Michael Dell 17:34 – The Bus Ride That Set His Life’s Mission 20:39 – “I Wear My Failures Proudly” 22:22 – What the Abraham Accords Prove 24:59 – Builders vs. Destroyers 30:17 – Give Every Kid a Different Initial 33:00 – When Good Intentions Go Wrong 37:22 – Values Only Count When They Cost You 39:33 – Saying No to the Zero-Sugar Fad 41:26 – Why He Sold KIND 44:10 – Why He Joined Shark Tank 48:14 – How He Saved Neuro Gum 52:00 – Force-Feeding Manhattan, One Store at a Time 60:29 – Fixing Section 230 & Social Media RESOURCES Follow Daniel on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/daniellubetzky  Subscribe to Invested: https://content.aleph.vc/invested Learn more about Aleph: aleph.vc  Sign up for Aleph’s monthly email newsletter: https://newsletter.aleph.vc/ Subscribe to Aleph’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@aleph-vc/ Follow Michael on Twitter: twitter.com/mikeeisenberg Follow Michael on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mieisenberg/ Follow Aleph on Twitter: https://x.com/aleph?s=20  ‍Follow Aleph on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/aleph-vc/ ‍Follow Aleph on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aleph.vc/ CREDITS Executive Producer: Erica Marom  Producer: Sofi Levak, Dalit Merenfeld Video and Editing: Nadav Elovic  Music and Creative Direction: Uri Ar  Content and Editorial: Jackie Goldberg Design: Nimrod Sapir

On this episode of Invested, Michael Eisenberg sits down with Yuval Ariav, Managing Partner of Symbol, a first-check VC focused on pre-consensus investments in Israel. Yuval also teaches at Columbia University about the intersection of data, business, and society. Before starting to invest, Yuval founded Fundbox, an Israeli fintech unicorn, and headed Product and Engineering for Onavo, an Israeli analytics company backed by Sequoia and acquired by Meta in 2013. In this conversation, Michael and Yuval unpack what it means to invest before the consensus forms - and why the best venture opportunities often look strange, niche, or even wrong at first. They discuss why hot seed rounds can force bad decision-making, how a solo GP builds co-founder-level conviction, and why Symbol wants to become the go-to first-check fund for Israel's weirdest venture opportunities. The conversation goes far beyond venture capital. Yuval and Michael dig into Columbia, academia, social unrest, the collapse of critical thinking, identity politics, and what happens when technology lets money, influence, and opinion compound faster than society can absorb. Yuval also explains why he believes NextSilicon could become "Israel's NVIDIA," why Jiga is attacking a trillion-dollar procurement market most VCs ignore, and how theater production in New York unexpectedly helped him build a better venture network. They discuss: ·       Pre-consensus vs. non-consensus investing ·       Why hot VC rounds can destroy conviction ·       How Symbol backs weird Israeli startups early ·       Columbia, activism, and critical thinking ·       Why media shapes identity ·       How compounding power fuels social unrest ·       Why NextSilicon could become Israel's NVIDIA ·       Jiga and the trillion-dollar invisible procurement market If you want to understand first-check investing, Israeli venture capital, AI infrastructure, compounding social power, and the future of universities, this episode is essential viewing. Please rate this episode 5 stars wherever you stream your podcasts! KEY TOPICS  00:00 - The 12-Hour VC Decision 01:13 - Pre-Consensus vs. Consensus Venture Capital 05:12 - Hot Deals vs. Real Conviction 09:28 - Backing Israel's Weirdest Startups 12:26 - Nearly Buying Symbol.com for $10K 16:29 - Turning Columbia Students Into LPs 19:11 - Theater Production as VC Networking 22:36 - Writing Brutally Short Investment Memos 26:44 - When Compounding Breaks Society 30:16 - Are We Already in Social Unrest? 32:03 - What Really Happened at Columbia 36:34 - Academia's Activist Costume 42:22 - Is Identity Downstream of Media? 50:22 - Could NextSilicon Become Israel's NVIDIA? 54:02 - The Trillion-Dollar Market VCs Ignore RESOURCES Follow Yuval on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yuvalariav/ Subscribe to Invested: https://content.aleph.vc/invested Learn more about Aleph: aleph.vc  Sign up for Aleph’s monthly email newsletter: https://newsletter.aleph.vc/ Subscribe to Aleph’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@aleph-vc/ Follow Michael on Twitter: twitter.com/mikeeisenberg Follow Michael on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mieisenberg/ Follow Aleph on Twitter: https://x.com/aleph?s=20  ‍Follow Aleph on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/aleph-vc/ ‍Follow Aleph on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aleph.vc/ CREDITS Executive Producer: Erica Marom  Producer: Sofi Levak, Myron Shneider, Dalit Merenfeld Video and Editing: Nadav Elovic  Music and Creative Direction: Uri Ar  Content and Editorial: Jackie Goldberg Design: Nimrod Sapir

On this episode of Invested, Michael Eisenberg sits down with Saar Safra, CEO & Co-Founder of Beewise, for a fascinating and urgent conversation about the collapse of bee colonies, the future of food security, and why AI and robotics may be essential to keeping the world fed. Saar explains why bees are a critical input into global agriculture, how the 175-year-old wooden hive became a bottleneck for modern farming, and why Beewise built the BeeHome: a solar-powered robotic hive using computer vision, sensors, AI models, and real-time treatment to protect colonies in the field. Drawing on Saar's background across P2P payments, ad tech, PropTech, Microsoft, and multiple exits, Michael and Saar unpack how a software entrepreneur ended up trying to save bees - and why pollination may be one of the most overlooked infrastructure problems in the global economy. They discuss: ·       Why bee colony collapse threatens the global food supply ·       How pesticides, monoculture, disease, varroa mites, and climate stress are killing colonies ·       How Beewise's AI beekeeper monitors bees and applies treatment automatically ·       Why beekeepers see BeeHome as help, not replacement ·       The hidden world of honey laundering and fake honey ·       Why pollination is becoming a matter of national security ·       How mission-driven technology can lower food costs and improve resilience Saar is CEO & Co-Founder at Beewise and a seasoned entrepreneur. He started his career as a software developer; in 2001 he became CTO of Ad4Ever, which was acquired by aQuantive, where he served as GM & VP of Rich Media. In 2007, aQuantive was acquired by Microsoft, where Saar served as Director of Rich Media Solutions until 2008, when he left to found ActiveBuilding, a pioneer in PropTech. ActiveBuilding was acquired by RealPage in 2013. Across the five companies he founded or joined before Beewise, Saar has had three successful exits. He received his MBA from the Foster School of Business at the University of Washington. If you want to understand how AI, robotics, agriculture, food security, biodiversity, and entrepreneurship intersect - and why saving bees could mean lowering the cost of fruits, vegetables, and coffee - this episode is essential listening. Please rate this episode 5 stars wherever you stream your podcasts! KEY TOPICS  00:00 - 45% of Bee Colonies Die 03:06 - From Microsoft to Bees 06:51 - How Humans Broke Pollination 17:31 - The 175-Year-Old Hive Problem 20:10 - Trucking 200 Million Bees 25:04 - Bee Collapse Threatens Food Supply 29:35 - Pesticides, Disease, and Monoculture 32:47 - The AI Beehive Revolution 33:50 - Large Biological Models for Bees 35:14 - AI Stops Pesticide Poisoning 43:14 - Bees Are National Security 49:04 - Is AI Replacing Beekeepers? 51:17 - No Organic Honey in America 53:49 - The Honey Laundering Scandal 59:12 - Building Through Two Wars RESOURCES Follow Saar on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/saars Subscribe to Invested: https://content.aleph.vc/invested Learn more about Aleph: aleph.vc  Sign up for Aleph’s monthly email newsletter: https://newsletter.aleph.vc/ Subscribe to Aleph’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@aleph-vc/ Follow Michael on Twitter: twitter.com/mikeeisenberg Follow Michael on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mieisenberg/ Follow Aleph on Twitter: https://x.com/aleph?s=20  ‍Follow Aleph on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/aleph-vc/ ‍Follow Aleph on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aleph.vc/ CREDITS Executive Producer: Erica Marom  Producer: Sofi Levak, Myron Shneider, Dalit Merenfeld Video and Editing: Nadav Elovic  Music and Creative Direction: Uri Ar  Content and Editorial: Jackie Goldberg Design: Nimrod Sapir