Is It My ADHD?

In the first of this 2-parter on autism and ADHD, we established how to two differ, what symptoms they share, and what it feels like to have both, with Char Bailey, the Director of People for Birmingham Pride, writer for DIVA and tireless autism advocate. In this second episode on ASD and ADHD, Char shares the biggest challenges she faces on a daily basis, familial relationships and accountability, where Char’s perspective has turned the whole concept on its head for me. She reveals what her old coping mechanisms were pre-diagnosis, what she’s learnt since being diagnosed and why she’s not bitter about what came before.     In a slight twist on our usual format, we have decided to share YOUR questions with the experts. This week, we ask Dr Jo Steer – a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey and author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women – are BFRBs common in ADHD, and if so, why?   Follow the podcast for the first episode of this 2-part feature with Char, where we discuss her autism diagnosis, what it’s like to have both and how she protects her mental health.  You can find Char on IG @char_bailey_ and here on LinkedIn Follow me here Huge thanks to The Tape Agency for making this two-part special and taking such good care of me.   Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. This podcast is no substitute for professional medical care or diagnosis. In the meantime, you can find more information here: The ADHD Foundation For further reading, try How Not to Fit In by Jess Joy and Charlotte Mia. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The prevalence of ASD is higher in patients with ADHD than in the general population. That said, the research into the dual-diagnosis is still fairly scant (it’s only been recognised as such for about a decade), and of course having both can complicate the identification and treatment of either condition.Both ADHD and ASD can cause heightened sensory issues, defiant behaviours, emotional dysregulation and issues with working memory, processing speed and response inhibition. It’s just that the root cause of those behaviours differ.What’s it like to have both? Do they balance and support each other, or is there a constant tension between the need for routine and repetition and a restlessness that impedes delivery and staying on task?Today, I’m joined by Char Bailey, the Director of People for Birmingham Pride, writer for DIVA and tireless autism advocate, who is now exploring her ADHD.  In this episode – part 1 of 2 - we discuss what it feels like to have both ADHD and ASD, the tensions between the two and how Char strikes a balance by leaning into the driving force. Char shares how the intersections of race, sexuality and neurodivergence have shaped her experience, and describes the ways in which she manages her symptoms so as to protect her mental health. I cannot recommend this episode highly enough, whether you have ASD, ADHD, both or neither – Char is such a force for good in the world and drops so many nuggets of absolute genius here. Follow the podcast for the second episode on autism and ADHD, back with Char to discuss staying positive, accountability, familial relationships and how to navigate this dual diagnosis.  In a slight twist on our usual format, we have decided to share YOUR questions with the experts. This week, we ask Dr Jo Steer – a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey and author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women – how do you feel about self diagnosis, is it valid or dangerous?   You can find Char on IG @char_bailey_ and here on LinkedIn Follow me here Huge thanks to The Tape Agency for making this two-part special and taking such good care of me.   Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. This podcast is no substitute for professional medical care or diagnosis. In the meantime, you can find more information here: The ADHD Foundation Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Whilst it’s true that many people with ADHD are misdiagnosed with depression, it’s important to remember that depression is one of the most common comorbidities of ADHD. The two can absolutely exist in combination, and there is a lot of conjecture that until we tackle ADHD, depression can’t be properly treated. But as Gemma Styles points out, depression doesn’t just disappear the minute you’ve received an ADHD diagnosis.  Gemma Styles is a writer, the host of the Good Influence Podcast and an ambassador for the charity, MQ Mental Health Research. She is a warm and insightful voice in the spaces of mental health, feminism and sustainability, using her platform to drive awareness and action across a variety of issues. She talks very openly about her own mental health, but only recently received a diagnosis of ADHD after years spent dealing with anxiety and depression. In this episode, we talk about what it’s like to have ADHD and depression, and Gemma shares how her ADHD diagnosis represented a shift in how she experienced depression. We explore helpful accountability, the inability to initiate tasks and how those experiences are common to both depression and ADHD. Gemma describes the shame we carry, how the advocacy of family and friends was a game-changer, and we discuss our shared frustration over how unhelpful the ‘ADHD is a superpower’ model can be.  Listeners can use the code LOOPXISITMYADHD for 15% off You can find Gemma at GemmaStyles.com and on Instagram Her podcast, Good Influence is on all podcast platforms  Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

‘What’s the anxiety and what is ADHD?’ I have spent much of the past two years since I was diagnosed trying to work this out. Am I feeling hyper vigilant? Am I over stimulated? Because before being diagnosed with ADHD I had spent years working hard to try and address my anxiety, sometimes successfully but often to no avail whatsoever. Women in particular are often diagnosed with anxiety when they present with ADHD because there are so many shared symptoms and the clinical picture can look quite similar. But we know the two can also co-exist. So, how can people with ADHD better cope with the additional condition of anxiety without them essentially fuelling one another?  Anna Mathur is a psychotherapist and the author of several books, including Know Your Worth. She is also the host of the Therapy Edit Podcast. Anna is well known for delivering calming and compassionate advice for improving one’s mental health, very much by sharing her own experiences as a working mother and someone who has experienced anxiety. She has just recently received a diagnosis of ADHD, and having spent years teaching us about the power of self-compassion and slowing down, post-diagnosis she’s realised how much those tools play into handling her own ADHD traits.  We discuss how sound sensitivity not only led to our respective diagnoses, but has also explained our aversion to swimming pools and some of the more challenging parenting situations. Anna describes what it’s like to parent a neurodivergent child and come to your own diagnosis via theirs, and as one who’s long worked in the mental health space, how feeling so deeply has actually helped in her work as a psychotherapist. We talk about the intersections of health anxiety, hyper vigilance and ADHD, and how gratifying it can be to finally disregard the judgement of others and unmask. Listeners can use the code LOOPXISITMYADHD for 15% off You can find Anna on Instagram, at AnnaMathur.com and TheTherapy Edit podcast, wherever you get your podcasts from. You can also buy Know Your Worth here.  Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode we are delving deeper into parenting with ADHD, looking specifically at what happens when your child also has ADHD. I’ll be sharing this chat with Kate Moryousseff.  Back in series 1 I had a really interesting conversation with Dr Pragya Agarwal about parenting with ADHD. I have received more messages about that episode than any other, and I know it’s something that for many of us is proving to be the most challenging aspect of their ADHD experience. It also became clear how many of you not only have ADHD yourselves but are parenting a child or children with ADHD. Often that’s the way adults receive their diagnosis (you can also refer back to our episode with Caroline Hirons on this front!). So I wanted to delve into one woman’s experience of parenting children with ADHD.  Kate Moryoussef is an EFT and lifestyle coach and host of the ADHD Women’s Well-being podcast. She and her then 9 year old child were diagnosed within weeks of each other in 2020.  Kate and I discuss the additional difficulties of supporting a child with ADHD when you have ADHD yourself and some of the challenging situations that arise on a daily basis. She talks about trying to model healthy coping mechanisms so as to equip them to deal with their own struggles, how important it is to break generational cycles with this genetic condition, and how self awareness is key to understanding how to parent a child with ADHD.  Kate shares the situations she finds most triggering, those she avoids altogether and how to find the balance between being the guide you wish you’d had as a child and letting your child find their own path free from your projections.  Kate also reveals how she’s trying to shake the gendered shame she’s long carried as a woman with ADHD and the difficulties of teaching resilience when you don’t feel resilient yourself.  You can join Kate’s ADHD Women's Wellbeing Collective and find her on the following platforms:  Nosy: www.coachingbykate.me.uk Insta: Kate Moryoussef and ADHD Women's Wellbeing Pod Listen: The ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today I’ll be exploring the fairly new label of Deficient Emotional Self Regulation - the idea that people with ADHD struggle to moderate emotional responses, and I’m sharing this chat with Azryah Harvey.  Emotional dysregulation is notably absent from the criteria for diagnosing ADHD and yet most experts agree it is one of the most common traits of ADHD.  Emotional regulation is after all a part of executive function, something we famously struggle with. Plus, the parts of the brain affected by ADHD are also heavily involved in our emotions, and when you think about the impulsivity often involved, it’s no wonder people with ADHD often experience mood swings, low frustration tolerance, impatience, being quick to anger, aggression, greater emotional excitability, and difficulties around self soothing and letting go.  It’s worth remembering mood disorders can also be a common comorbidity, and so it’s important to differentiate, but for me, emotional dysregulation has definitely played a huge part in my life.  Azryah Harvey is an anti-racism consultant, SEN teacher, presenter, writer and an ambassador of Takeda’s Staring Back at Me campaign raising awareness of the symptoms of ADHD in women and non binary people. She was diagnosed when she was 30.  She shares how her perception of her ‘emotional profile’ has changed since her diagnosis, how confidence plays a part in shedding the shame and how quitting has become a form of regulation for her.  We discuss our experiences of masking emotions as gender norms dictate, and Azryah describes how the intersections of race play into the way others respond to her emotions.  Azryah also reveals how while why she may have struggled herself, she has huge capacity for helping others regulate within her work, first as a SEN teacher connecting with her pupils, and now within her anti-racism work.  You can find Azryah on the following platforms: https://www.azryahsmindmap.com/ https://twitter.com/_azryah  https://www.instagram.com/_azryah/ THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Grief is another area where we’re often left to question, what is the adhd and what is the grief, or I suppose the neurotypical experience of grief. As we tend to process our emotions more intensely, grief can exacerbate adhd symptoms, but also the behaviours such as social withdrawal. A big loss can also be the tipping point for someone with undiagnosed ADHD, proving to be that extra factor that makes masking untenable. But then presenting as someone who is grieving makes it harder of course to find a clear path to an ADHD diagnosis.  Emily Dean is a radio co-host, host Of the Walking the Dog podcast, and author of ‘EVERYONE DIED, SO I GOT A DOG’, which she wrote after losing her sister and both parents within a three year period. She was diagnosed with ADHD a few years ago.  In this episode, Emily shares her experience of grief and we discuss the ways in which ADHD perhaps affected or even steered it. We talk about the intensity of emotions, the self criticism that can add shame to the cocktail of loss and upset, and the part masking plays in grieving with ADHD.  Emily describes the comfort found in her dog, Raymond, and how important the love and support of friends has been in both coping with her grief and living authentically as a woman with ADHD.  Emily also reveals how the next generation of ADHDers has inspired her to be more open about her diagnosis, and the moment that another family stepped in and altered the way she felt grief forever.  You can find Emily on Instagram @emilyrebeccadean, on Frank Skinner’s radio show and on the Walking the Dog podcast, and her book - Everyone Died So I Got a Dog is available on all bookselling platforms.  THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today I’ll be talking about money with Clare Seal aka My Frugal Year. The way we earn, save and spend is inevitably affected by various ADHD traits. Impulsive spending, executive function issues when it comes to cash admin like tax returns, changing direct debits and filing expenses, forgetting to settle bills, neglecting to return the impulsively purchased haul. And budgets - that’s a struggle, isn’t it? To work out and then to stick to? Not to mention the issues surrounding employment. If you made it out of school with enough to get a steady job, a 2008 study found that Employees with ADHD are 30% more likely to have chronic employment issues, 60% more likely to be fired from a job, and three times more likely to quit a job impulsively. Granted it was most likely based on the usual white male case study, but I for one can vouch for the impulsive quitting.  I can also describe so many incidences when I’ve overpaid, underpaid and forgot to pay, when I’ve been charged for a late payment and when I’ve lost cash. Mostly, it’s just frustrating - a stark fear of money generally stops me from big splurges and I’ve now got umpteen alarms reminding me to keep up with money admin. But still, my relationship with money is less than ideal.  Clare Seal is a financial coach and speaker, and author of Five Steps to Financial Well-being, such a game-changing book in terms of how we frame money. She was diagnosed with ADHD this year.  She and I discuss the financial fall out of our ADHD experiences, particularly the vulnerability to marketing and financial systems. We talk about the how the lure of ‘shiny and new’ plays into the self shame of ADHD and the need to reinvent yourself on the regular, and the link between appreciating what you have and paying attention.  Clare cites the need for compassion in the industry and for banks to change their interfaces for neurodivergent people, and in terms of personal accountability, how important it is to identify what you have control over and how to handle the inevitable variables.  How her relationship with money mirrors her relationship with food, and how a show of compassion was the turning point for her in improving her financial well-being, but that progress is never linear.  This episode is FULL. OF. TIPS. Clare is a mine of information.  You can find her on the following platforms: Website Instagram And her book is available here  THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

TW: mentions of depression and anxiety  In the episode, fashion writer, Camille Charriere and I are diving into the idea of oversharing, a hot topic amongst of a lot of those who live with ADHD.  Now, for me this plays into the idea that we’re often considered extra, or too much. Who is to say what is an over share vs some kind of standard share? I despise the idea there are things that should remain unsaid, especially when they so often relate to Women’s health, sexuality and mental health. But I now enjoy the idea that I have the guts to share things other people might think taboo, especially if by sharing I’m busting that taboo in some small way. Still, I’m so aware of that visceral sting when I realise I’ve said something my companion doesn’t like.  But here’s the kicker - more often than not, we’re oversharing to form a connection with people, whilst also dealing with rejection sensitive dysphoria. So essentially a high risk exchange that feels like a social anxiety episode waiting to happen.  Camille Charriere is a fashion writer and consultant, who has made a living out of sharing her life online to over a million followers. But ironically, like me, she has struggled with the fall out from overshare in her personal life. She was diagnosed with ADHD earlier this year.  In this episode, Camille explains how she’s used social media to share only the best bits, while in person, she’s carried shame around the chaos that often lies beyond the image. We talk about how oversharing can lead to toxic friendships, why there’s so much shame attached to it and how a diagnosis can affect the way you talk about your life. She also reveals what led to her diagnosis and how she’s explored the role different online platforms play in the way she chooses to communicate her true self in its wake.  You can find Camille on Instagram at @camillecharriere  and on Tik Tok  THE EXPERT Dr Mohamed Abdelghani is a consultant psychiatrist who specialises in mood disorders and adult ADHD Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today I'm talking about exercise and sport, with model and campaigner, Shareefa J.  ADHD is incredibly common amongst elite athletes, and yet for the majority of sufferers, it makes it doubly hard to perform. I was 37 when it was first suggested I might have ADHD, so I obviously went straight to Google to see what kind of company I was in. I landed on an article about how common ADHD is in elite athletes — Simone Biles, Michael Phelps, Nicola Adams, gymnast Louis Smith, and Shaquille O'Neal are all in the club — and thought that perhaps everyone had been wrong about my diagnosis after all. Because I can NOT enjoy team sports, I can't throw or catch convincingly and I fall over my uncooperative limbs a lot. I struggle to follow instructions and routines, and I have never - not once - got the promised endorphin rush to outweigh the nausea and boredom of running. Years of criticism from PE teachers didn't help, and now I'm torn between wanting to live a long and healthy life, and not wanting to spend a moment of it working out.  Shareefa is one of the people who make me want to keep trying to find my 'thing', though. Shareefa is a model, mental-health campaigner, presenter and body positivity advocate. She was diagnosed with ADHD when she was 24, and shares helpful tips on dealing with the condition on her Instagram feed.  Shareefa shares her top tips for making exercise work for you, taking into account all the challenges ADHD can bring to maintaining a healthy routine. She and I discuss what doesn’t work, too, and discover a shared dislike of school PE.  Shareefa also reveals her secret to making a habit stick, how she feels about exercise today and how her ADHD impacts her sense of self.  You can find Shareefa here. THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

TW: mentions of suicidal ideation, self harm, anxiety, depression and OCD. Today, I’ll be exploring the ins and outs of socialising when you have ADHD, and how Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria might be making you go from riot to retreat mode in a flash. I’ll be sharing this chat with screenwriter and podcast host, Honey Ross.  There are so many dichotomies within an ADHD brain that it can feel as though your sense of identity is constantly shifting. Never more so with me than when it comes to the extravert vs introvert question. I love parties, then I hate them. I am the most fun and then I’m drained and unable to speak. This hasn’t always been the case - after prolonged episodes of social anxiety from age 8 onwards, I lucked out between the age of 17 and 21 seemingly finding my groove as a student. I rarely passed up an opportunity to party and had a lot of friends to richochet between. But even then, RSD was worse than my hangovers, be it because of an all-our rejection or because a friend had looked at me weirdly. Hyper vigilance and some ultra intense self awareness could tip me into just wanting to get the hell out of what was the best place I’d ever been second before. Fast forward 20 years and sometimes I just feel like it’d be easier to stay home?  Screenwriter, co-founder of activism community group, Pink Protest and host of the Body Protest Podcast, Honey Ross was diagnosed with ADHD in 2021. She has spoken about her anxiety and how that kickstarted much of her activism work, but I’ve always seen as as a really sociable soul, usually surrounded by friends and seemingly at home in a crowd. And yet, social anxiety and RSD have impacted the way she socialises for years.  Honey shares how social anxiety and ADHD have impacted her social life for many years, her coping mechanisms and how she’s changed it up since her diagnosis.  We discuss the shame spiral, how to know when to say ‘no’ and when you need to get out and about, and yet another dichotomy of the ADHD life: you get crucial energy from other people and yet so often feel like being alone.  Honey also reveals how she communicates with her friends - a definite gamechanger - and what it’s like to grow up in the public eye when you have ADHD.  You can listen to Honey’s podcast, The Body Protest here THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

** This episode charts the experience of one woman (notably, a scientist) with titration, and is not a substitute for professional guidance or advice. Please consult your doctor before making any changes to your dosage. ** When I was diagnosed in 2021, my psychiatrist immediately prescribed meds. I was initially reluctant because I was in denial to be honest, but then after a while I started to wonder - is this the secret to me finally writing another book? Will I finally be more patient and more chill? Will I be less anxious? Unfortunately I’d never find out because when I tried to transfer care to the NHS with my diagnosis, I was told I didn’t qualify. It’s inordinately difficult to get prescribed meds in some trusts - they’re super expensive and if it’s one of the controlled substances, it requires regular monitoring.  Not only is it understandably tricky to get your hands on those elusive meds, but not all meds suit all patients, so it’s a whole process. And one I can’t really talk about beyond that first road block I experienced.  Emma Goulding is a clinical scientist and a photographer. She began her journey with ADHD meds after her diagnosis in 2021.  In this episode, Emma shares how the titration process works, how to establish a shared care deal with the NHS and how she navigated the experience with her doctor.  She describes how it feels to take meds, the highs, the lows, and the side effects she’s experienced on various doses, as well as the ways in which coaching can help support in combination with meds.  Emma also reveals how she eventually found the ‘sweet spot’ of the perfect blend, and whether or not taking meds really is the difference between night and day for someone struggling with their ADHD.  You can find Emma Goulding at:  emmagoulding.com/journal  On Instagram at @emgo.grows and on various platforms available here  THE EXPERT Dr Mohamed Abdelghani is a consultant psychiatrist who specialises in mood disorders and adult ADHD Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Trigger warning: mentions of suicidal thoughts, drug overdose and disordered eating   Today, we’re exploring late diagnosis and what happens next, with Penny Jarrett – aka @PennyBelle – who was diagnosed in 2017 and now offers coaching and mentoring to people with ADHD.  I get a lot of messages about late diagnosis – how does it work and what does it feel like afterwards? How do meds work and what are the alternatives? Essentially, how do I get diagnosed, and what do I do next?  Penny is a mental health and wellbeing coach who offers a series of ADHD specific sessions online. She is also a writer, mentor and speaker, and an important voice in the ADHD community. She’s all about busting the myths of ADHD and helping people better understand what it’s all about.  In this episode, Penny shares what led her to an ADHD assessment in her 30s, and how it changed her life forever. We discuss how unresolved trauma can ‘double’ the ADHD symptom power, and how Penny is now helping other people find their peace. Penny also shares what it’s like to take medication and how tackling trauma can be the most important step any of us will take in handling a late ADHD diagnosis.  In this episode we also ask the expert, Dr Jo Steer: is it my ADHD, or is it trauma?  You can find Penny on Instagram @pennybelle and via her website   THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women  Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Trigger Warnings: mentions of self-harm, disordered eating, depression, anxiety, suicide, alcohol abuse and addiction.  Today, writer and commentator, Kat Brown and I are going to explore the co-occurring conditions that so often arise with ADHD and ultimately tend to delay diagnosis.  Considering that ADHD is still not widely understood in healthcare and educational settings, it’s not wonder that girls and women are often misdiagnosed with other better known conditions.  The issue is that if the root cause is ADHD, no amount of work, meds or therapy will be able to make meaningful and significant changes until the ADHD is addressed; something Kat and I are only too aware of.  Kat Brown and I met years ago during a shared stint at Glamour Magazine. A journalist and social media editor, Kat is also an in-demand commentator on the subjects she has experienced closely herself, among them ADHD, mental health and childlessness.  In this episode, Kat shares her journey to diagnosis in 2020. She describes the various labels she was given ahead of the moment she first began to suspect it was actually ADHD driving so many of those behaviours.  We discuss how we both picked apart our anxiety and depression to better understand what was really behind our feelings, and how no matter how much work we put into addressing our mental health, it would never quite stick.  Kat also reveals how she’s now investing in herself armed with this deeper understanding, and the new routines she’s slowly developing to address both ADHD and the comorbidities so many of us are prone to.  You can find Kat’s book, No One Talks About This Stuff here and read more of her work here . THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women  Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In today’s episode I’m exploring the topic of education and learning with Vivienne Isebor.  In an ideal world, your school is the first environment in which your ADHD is identified, and that’s done with enough time to make the necessary adaptations so you can reach your full academic and creative potential as a child. Sadly, for girls, this isn’t often the case. We know that girls present differently to boys, and that the clinical picture is still skewed to that stereotype of a manic, distracted boy who’s bouncing off the walls. Girls, in fact, are more likely to present as a daydreamer, inattentive but rarely disruptive; as a result it can often go unnoticed. Of course there are also gender norms that hamper diagnosis, too – girls are more likely to mask to fit in with societal expectations that they be quiet, compliant and studious. I struggled especially with following instructions, anything maths-related and the rudiments of sitting still and listening, but I was also aware of how bad all of that was and so fought every natural instinct to be a ‘good girl’. Vivienne Isebor is a force for good in the ADHD community, and I was bowled over to hear that not only is she an activist, singer, songwriter, spoken word artist, poet and performer, she is also a clinical associate in psychology trainee. She’s back in school and just before we met for this podcast had aced a 5000-word dissertation. She is also the founder and managing director of ADHD Babes, a supportive space for black women and non binary people with ADHD. Vivienne shares the experiences she had as a child in school compared to how she comes to learning today as an adult, why switching from a standard school setting to individualistic higher education can be a huge challenge for someone living with ADHD and how both children and adults can be better supported. Vivienne also reveals the adaptations that have helped her excel in her studies and how she’s chipping away at ableist micro-aggressions with her clinical work.  You can find Vivienne’s game-changing work with ADHD Babes here: @adhdbabes ADHD BABES  And her music here: @vvnsings VV SINGS  Here’s a shortcut to her beautiful sound:  THE EXPERT Dr Jo Steer is a chartered clinical psychologist working with children in Surrey, and the author of Understanding ADHD in Girls and Women  Please note, your first port of call if you think you might have ADHD should be your GP. In the meantime, you can find more information here:  The ADHD Foundation  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices