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Mormon Stories Podcast

Author: Dr. John Dehlin

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Mormon Stories Podcast is an attempt to build understanding between and about Mormons through the telling of stories in both audio and video formats.
2010 Episodes
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Join us as Matthew Harris returns to discuss Gordon B. Hinckley's efforts to address lingering racism in the church, the push to remove Bruce R. McConkie's Mormon Doctrine from shelves, and members' calls for an apology for the church's past racism. We also explore Elder Holland's attempts to rebrand these doctrines as "folklore," the continuation of racist teachings by BYU professors like Randy Bott, and the creation of the Gospel Topics Essays. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Today we are interviewing the creators of the new movie Heretic, staring Hugh Grant. Heretic is a horror film about two Mormon sister missionaries who meet a man named Mr. Reed (Grant) who ensnares them in a deadly game of cat and mouse while locked in his house. Scott Beck and Bryan Woods are an American filmmaking duo who also directed A Quiet Place and Nightlight. Today they are going to answer questions about what inspired them to create the film, what messages they wanted to share, and how they wanted the film to impact their viewers. This is an episode you wont want to miss! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In this heartfelt conversation, Fran Grover shares her journey through life within and beyond Mormonism, from her early upbringing in an orthodox Mormon family to navigating grief, identity, and faith. She opens up about losing her sister, grappling with religious expectations, and experiencing deep personal and spiritual shifts while pursuing law school and marriage. Topics covered include the complexities of a mixed-faith marriage, her evolving views on agency, motherhood, and partnership, and the challenges of leaving the Church. This discussion dives into mental health, deconstructing religious beliefs, and finding empowerment by trusting oneself. Join us as she reflects on rebuilding her identity, embracing uncertainty, and choosing authenticity. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Join us today as we meet again with historian Matt Harris to discuss his new book “Second Class Saints: Black Mormons and the Struggle for Racial Equality.” Matt Harris talks about the relationship between the Church and the John Birch Society and how the church changed its mind on supporting the Martin Luther King holiday. Additionally, Harris discusses how the harmful teachings of Bruce R. McConkie’s book “Mormon Doctrine” lived on even after his death. Professors Eugene England and Steven Epperson were pushed out of BYU for their more liberal views. How the Strengthening the Church Members Committee keeps these members in check. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Join us for an in-depth interview with Andrew Fish as he shares his story of adoption, faith, and self-discovery. Andrew reflects on his family's journey, from his parents’ struggle to adopt, to his biological mother's decision to place him for adoption, and his upbringing within the Mormon Church. He also discusses the impact of religious expectations, his mission experiences, and his journey of reconciling his personal beliefs with his upbringing. Throughout this heartfelt conversation, Andrew opens up about his eventual decision to leave the Church, reconnect with his biological family, and navigate acceptance and understanding within his adoptive family. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
The priesthood and temple ban began when Brigham Young learned that Black Saints were marrying white women, fearing interracial marriage. When the ban was finally lifted it was only with the caveat that they continued to warn the members against interracial marriage. Church members have received mixed messages since then, with warnings against interracial marriage still found on the Church's website and in manuals. How should members make sense of these conflicting messages? Today, we're joined by Matt Harris and Summur-Rayn to discuss this topic. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In this episode, we interview Laurie Lee Hall, a former bishop, stake president, and temple designer for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who later came out as transgender while serving as a Stake President. Laurie shares her journey of growing up with a gender identity that didn’t match how she felt, her experiences on a church mission, and attending Affirmation for LGBTQ+ Latter-day Saints. She also discusses her work designing temples, her struggles with the 2015 Exclusion Policy for children of gay couples, her excommunication, and the church’s evolving policies on transgender individuals. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In this episode, we join Matt Harris to discuss the aftermath of lifting the priesthood and temple ban in the LDS Church. We explore how Bruce R. McConkie's account of the revelation was embellished and the damage control efforts by top church leaders. We also examine President Kimball's controversial remarks about Native Americans and his later regret over those comments. This discussion focuses on chapter eight of Matt Harris’ book, "Second Class Saints." We are thrilled to announce that we have reached our donation goal to compensate Dr. Matt Harris for his contributions to this series. We sincerely thank everyone who supported this effort. While the goal to pay Matt has been met, producing this series incurred significant costs for the Open Stories Foundation. If you find value in this content and want to help cover these expenses and support future productions, we encourage you to donate at https://www.mormonstories.org/donate/ Your generosity makes a difference—thank you! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In this compelling episode, Rian Anderson unites with her mother, Jen, to share their powerful journey of faith and family. While Rian served her Mormon mission, her entire family left the church. Jen is here to tell her side of the story. Jen shares about how her mother battled with cancer while she was in High School and after marriage Jen’s husband struggled with pornography. As a former Relief Society President, Scout Leader, and member of the Stake Young Women’s Presidency, Jen also reflects on her experiences with church leadership and the inequalities she witnessed. The conversation touches on her son coming out as gay and the impact of her decision to leave the church on Rian's mission. Join them as they candidly discuss their stories and the complexities of their faith journey. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
What were the events and who were the key characters that led to the lifting of the priesthood and temple ban for black people? In this episode Matt Harris will answer those questions. Rumors have gone around that the ban was lifted due to the IRS threatening to take away their tax exempt status, or because of the lawsuits involving the NAACP, etc. Matt Harris puts many of these rumors to rest and answers the real reason why (and how) the ban was lifted. We are thrilled to announce that we have reached our donation goal to compensate Dr. Matt Harris for his contributions to this series. We sincerely thank everyone who supported this effort. While the goal to pay Matt has been met, producing this series incurred significant costs for the Open Stories Foundation. If you find value in this content and want to help cover these expenses and support future productions, we encourage you to donate at https://www.mormonstories.org/donate/ Your generosity makes a difference—thank you! Purchase Matt Harris' book here! “Second Class Saints” by Matt Harris https://www.amazon.com/Second-Class-Saints-Mormons-Struggle-Equality/dp/019769571X/ Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Join Gerardo and Hayley Rawle (from the Girl's Camp podcast) as they dive into the journey of sisters Lexi and Sydney, who both joined the Mormon church in their pre-teens in Ohio. Sydney, an LGBTQ+ ally, shares her mission experience in Bolivia and her challenges with dating in the Young Single Adult Ward. After questioning her faith during the pandemic, she found herself grappling with her advocacy for LGBTQ+ rights. Meanwhile, Lexi discusses her mission in California, where she faced mental health struggles, including undiagnosed bipolar disorder and a companion with alarming ideations. Discover how a priesthood blessing empowered her to step away from the church. Don’t miss this insightful discussion on faith, identity, and personal growth! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In this gripping third installment of our series, we dive deep into the Book of Mormon to unravel the true meaning of the cursed “Skin of Blackness." Are recent apologetic theories—claiming it's just paint, dark coats, or tattoos—offering genuine insights, or are they merely attempts to gloss over the text's troubling implications? Join us as we confront these arguments head-on and question whether we should trust the prophets or the apologists. Don’t miss this eye-opening discussion! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In this special episode, we're thrilled to welcome Meg Campbell as we tackle the question: Can there be a healthy Mormon/exMormon divorce? Meg reflects on her journey of feeling constrained by church expectations and how her relationship shifted with the pressure of a Mormon Temple marriage. She shares vital dos and don’ts for navigating divorce, insights on dating afterward, and ways to support others through their divorce experiences. Join Julia, Margi, and John Dehlin for this important discussion! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Join us as we dive into a thought-provoking discussion with Sandra Tanner about Brian Hales' recent video addressing the challenges raised in the CES Letter regarding polygamy. Hales controversially claims that Joseph Smith did not engage in sexual relations with his polyandrous wives (his wives who were already married). We'll explore key topics, including biblical support for polygamy, Emma Smith seeking divorce due to polygamy, the possibility of Joseph sending men on missions to marry their wives, and individuals trying to deny that Joseph ever lived polygamy. Don't miss this insightful conversation on the complexities of polygamy and its historical context! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Michelle Clyde shares her journey of faith transition within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Growing up in Springville, Utah, she became more progressive in her views after her friend started the first gay-straight alliance in Utah Valley. Despite serving as a temple worker and in the Relief Society presidency, Michelle struggled with her experiences in the temple and her mental health. She opens up about her challenges during her mission in Taiwan, her journey through depression, and her evolving understanding of the church's history. Join us as Michelle reads from her journal and reveals the pivotal moments that led her to question her beliefs. Don’t miss this insightful discussion! Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
In today's video, we dive into the protests at BYU during the 1970s, including threats from black activists and government pressure to increase diversity in hiring and recruitment. We'll also discuss a shocking incident during a basketball game where a Molotov cocktail was thrown into the crowd, narrowly missing the BYU sports announcer. The church's response to these threats (mostly fabricated by the Birch Society) included heightened security measures, with snipers stationed on the Mormon Tabernacle during General Conference. Joining us is Dr. Darron Smith to discuss Matt Harris’ new book, Second Class Saints. Don't miss this thought-provoking conversation! We are thrilled to announce that we have reached our donation goal to compensate Dr. Matt Harris for his contributions to this series. We sincerely thank everyone who supported this effort. While the goal to pay Matt has been met, producing this series incurred significant costs for the Open Stories Foundation. If you find value in this content and want to help cover these expenses and support future productions, we encourage you to donate at https://www.mormonstories.org/donate/ Your generosity makes a difference—thank you! Purchase Matt Harris’ book, Second-Class Saints: Black Mormons and the Struggle for Racial Equality Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
Nemo the Mormon was recently summoned to a Disciplinary Council by his local church leaders in Oxford, England. While his Membership Council letter was vague on the exact reasons why this council is being held, he has some pretty good guesses. He recently went on LADBible and flew down to America to speak at the McKinney, Texas City Council. Nemo has also been a staple in the LDS Discussions series and hosts his own channel where he focuses primarily on the statements and remarks of current LDS leaders to determine the truthfulness of those statements. Additionally, recently leaked training material indicates that President Oaks is pushing Mormon leaders to conduct more of these Disciplinary Councils. Our hearts go out to Nemo during this difficult time and we ask for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to do better. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
We are back again for part three to discuss episodes six, seven and eight of Hulu’s new hit docuseries The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. Does Mormonism produce a certain type of husband? Does it create a certain type of wife? How does Mormonism influence the connection, equality, and other aspects of marriages? Join us as we discuss these questions with Alyssa Witbeck,, Hayley Rawle and John and Gerardo. To watch the new show on Hulu visit here. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
We are joined today by attorney Kolby Reddish to discuss the recent updates in the James Huntsman case against the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Huntsman claimed the Church misused funds, alleging fraud and is seeking the return of millions of dollars of his voluntary contributions. This case could have national implications on how religious organizations use the voluntary contributions they receive from their members, and could impact how educational institutions and non-profits solicit voluntary contributions and invest some of those contributions for future use. Join us today as we discuss this groundbreaking case! For the full oral argument visit here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds0mK4pJ9YQ Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
An oral argument at the tenth circuit was brought forth today in the case of Gaddy vs. The Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The argument is that the church hid its true history and that it lied about its use of tithing funds. The church representative made some shocking statements in both of these regards. Join us today as we discuss the arguments with attorney Kolby Reddish. Show Notes YouTube Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors! Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today: One-time or recurring donation through Donorbox Support us on Patreon PayPal Venmo Our Platforms: YouTube Patreon Spotify Apple Podcasts Contact us:MormonStories@gmail.comPO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117 Social Media: Insta: @mormstories TikTok: @mormonstoriespodcast Join the Discord
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Comments (55)

Christine Brevick

plz don't have Jukia speak, she is so fast just sounds like chicken screeching.

Oct 11th
Reply

WildHeart

Julia missed her calling as an Auctioneer. 😊

May 26th
Reply

WildHeart

I just wanted to chime in about the comments about John having a "Mormon voice" because he's understanding and not loud or boisterous.. and yet I've regularly heard him read comments of listeners telling him to calm down or quiet down. I know this is not the subject of the episode but I can't help but notice that the advice to "shush" come from mostly or only female guests and listeners. Imagine if a man was to tell a woman host to water herself down a bit. Just be you, John. Don't tone it down.

Apr 25th
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WildHeart

While this episode was interesting, I realized early on how speedy Julia speaks and I couldn't help but me more fascinated and curious by that than anything else haha. Is her part being sped up to 1.75x speed by chance? Serious question. Great episode and research though.

Jan 10th
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Janette Jones

This podcast episode is so much BS! That's coming from a Nigerian born African American Christian, living in Ca and a daughter-in-law of LDS followers. There's a whole lot of not calling a thing a thing going on (hint: LDS racism & people pleasing). And the revelation that the Nigerians was ignored for years but once the Nigerian-Biafran war broke out, it must have been a revelation which excuses the mormons from evangelizing the "lost" in Nigeria? Yeah whatever!😂🤨

Nov 18th
Reply

Laura Taylor

Why is it unfortunate that anyone thinks conspiratorial , John? A conspiracy is simply two or more people plotting to deceive at least one other person. Another word for that is open-minded. Is that not why you parted ways with the LDS Church and why you embarked on a mission to expose their lies; their conspiracy to deceive?

Nov 12th
Reply

Loretta P

it took me 5 or 6 days to make it through all this. it was just so heavy. I can't imagine living through it. Jodi is a demon.

Sep 18th
Reply (1)

Trino Carrera

One..

May 5th
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Trino Carrera

Funny, this LDS splinter group practice of drawing up a hit list. Obe thinks of the LeBarons as well as the Laffertys and Lori.

May 5th
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Jen Anderson

The blood is on the heads of the leaders of the mormon church. They knew these extremists groups are thriving and they stay silent. Shame on them all. if there is a hell, they belong there.

May 2nd
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Rob Greer

I have had a completely different experience regarding the church and getting financial help. We live in Queen Creek, AZ and my wife broke her leg several years ago literally a week before our new insurance policies set in. We wracked up more than $10,000 in bills. We told the bishop, he made a phone call, and the next week he told us to send him bills totally $5,000. Those were promptly paid without any fuss whatsoever.

Mar 21st
Reply

Sally Williams

I have to say thar I was so impressed with this bishop and the way this episode was handled. It always sounds so mind-blowing when you hear this out loud. I live in Draper Utah and needed assistance when my husband lost his job. The church makes it extremely difficult to get assistance. Also, our area implemented the self-reliance program, and it is very humiliated and dehumanizing to ask for assistance. Last year, I was in an auxiliary presidency and attended a training on self-reliance. I wanted to vomit. In one of the most affluent areas in Utah. So I am so proud of this bishop for speaking out.

Mar 20th
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Trino Carrera

I believe in Hebrew Pele El, would be a wonder or miracle of God..El being God.

Jan 21st
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Alison Watkins Spencer

this was my first shelf breaker. shawn McCraney's utah show before 2010.

Oct 26th
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Kyla Wiser

My day was made, having Kara back on MS. Yay!!!!

May 4th
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Alexandra Treen

I listened to both episodes, and I’m glad they are happy together, but man - so much hurt and pain caused by these two, and not a lot of remorse (or at least it didn’t seem that way to me). Unfortunately I think they both come off a little narcissistic. Just the fact that he worked his feelings out with Elizabeth between the two of them, before approaching his wife. He should have come to HER with those feelings from the beginning. Instead he had the security of having processed it, lived with it, and having made the decision all before including his wife in the process. Really sad and obviously shows the lack of togetherness there. And when you asked what he wanted to say to his kids, it was all “me, me, me” and no sorry, and seemingly no understanding for what his actions put them through. Likewise, Elizabeth seems to be only worried about how everything has affected her. She’s still dealing with the outcome of her decision to lie to his ex wife. The statement was clear that she hurt

Mar 25th
Reply

Kyla Wiser

Let's have a spicy Cara always!!!!!

Feb 18th
Reply

MysticMermaid

the quote mentioned from Marlin Jensen about the church losing their best and brightest... so he's saying those that stay are not the brightest and not the best... 😅 yikes

Feb 14th
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Robin Hubert

all bullshit

Jan 9th
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Stephanie Johnson Aerakis

worst episode I have ever listened to. Clearly this man had an agenda. You unfortunately discredited yourself by having him on here. I have been part of this community for 5 years now and never once have I heard the stories he is clamming. You should have done your research before you had him on here...

Oct 22nd
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