On with Kara Swisher

Which subpar books actually warrant writing a bad review? Do best sellers usually live up to the hype? And how does our relationship with technology affect the publishing industry? Kara sits down with two of her favorite book critics, Dwight Garner of The New York Times and Becca Rothfeld of The Washington Post, to discuss the best and worst books of 2024.  The trio debates standout books and notable disappointments, the craft of book reviewing, and the best way to experience a great book. They also explore the importance of best-seller lists, how concerned we should be over the rising tide of book censorship, and which books from 2024 could end up becoming forever classics. Books mentioned includes (listed alphabetically): What Are Children For? On Ambivalence and Choice, Anastasia Berg & Rachel Wiseman Boswell’s London Journal 1762-1763 Believe Nothing Until it is Officially Denied: Claud Cockburn and the Invention of Guerrilla Journalism, Patrick Cockburn D'Aulaires’ Book of Greek Myths Carson McCullers: A Life, Mary V. Dearborn You Dreamed of Empires, Álvaro Enrigue James, Percival Everett When the Clock Broke, John Ganz The Upstairs Delicatessen, Dwight Garner Small Rain, Garth Greenwell Lesser Ruins, Mark Haber Alphabetical Diaries, Sheila Heti A Few Words in Defense of Our Country: The Biography of Randy Newman, Robert Hilburn Splinters, Leslie Jamison Howl's Moving Castle, Diana Wynne Jones Creation Lake, Rachel Kushner Liars, Sarah Manguso We Who Wrestle With God, Jordan B. Peterson Intermezzo, Sally Rooney The Extinction of Experience: Being Human in a Disembodied World, Christine Rosen Things Are Too Small, Essays in Praise of Excess, Becca Rothfeld Knife, Salman Rushdie I Heard Her Call My Name, Lucy Sante The Rebel’s Clinic, Adam Schatz The Politics of Cultural Despair, Fritz Stern Hillbilly Elegy, J.D. Vance Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Kara sits down for a live interview with Yann LeCun, an “early AI prophet” and the brains behind the largest open-source large language model in the world. The two discuss the potential dangers that come with open-source models, the massive amounts of money pouring into AI research, and the pros and cons of AI regulation. They also dive into LeCun’s surprisingly spicy social media feeds — unlike a lot of tech employees who toe the HR line, Yann isn’t afraid to say what he thinks of Elon Musk or President-elect Donald Trump. This interview was recorded live at the Johns Hopkins University Bloomberg Center in Washington, DC as part of their Discovery Series. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

RFK Jr. was on the Hill, on Monday, working to persuade senators he’s capable of running the  Department of Health and Human Services and its almost $2 trillion budget. Ever since the news his lawyer has petitioned the federal government to revoke the approval of a polio vaccine broke, that job has gotten a little harder — but it doesn’t mean he won’t get confirmed. And so could a number of other highly unorthodox candidates that Trump plans to nominate for key positions in the HHS. Kara talks to an expert panel to make sense of it all and find these nominations could means for America’s public health policy.  Her guests are: Dr. Zeke Emanuel, Dr. Celine Gounder, and Donald McNeil Jr.  Dr. Emanuel has written and edited 15 books and over 300 scientific articles. He was Chief of the Department of Bioethics at the National Institutes of Health, one of the architects of the Affordable Care Act and he teaches at the University of Pennsylvania. Dr. Celine Gounder is an internist, infectious disease specialist, and epidemiologist, a CBS News Medical Contributor and Editor-at-Large for Public Health at KFF Health News, and she teaches at New York University. Donald McNeil wrote for the New York Times from 1976 to 2021, where he was a health and science reporter and the lead reporter the COVID beat. He won the prestigious John Chancellor Award in 2020 and was on the New York Times team that won the Pulitzer Prize for Public Service in 2021. You can find his latest work on Medium. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Canadian chef Matty Matheson has been a force in the culinary world for over two decades, but the non-foodies of the world recognize him as Neil Fak, the goofy, handyman-come-waiter-in-training on the FX/Hulu hit series The Bear. Aside from being the show’s much-needed comic relief, Matheson is an executive producer and a culinary consultant on set. Matheson first became chef de cuisine in his early 20s and now owns over a dozen restaurants. He also runs an incredibly popular YouTube channel with over 1.5 million subscribers and he’s authored three cookbooks – his latest, Soups, Salads, Sandwiches, came out in October. Kara and Matty talk about the good, bad and ugly of the restaurant industry, why he loves both haute cuisine and homestyle cooking and how his YouTube persona changes when he puts on his chef’s hat. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Representative Ro Khanna represents the wealthiest congressional district in the country, but he wants to show Democrats how to speak to the working class. And perhaps surprisingly, he’s pretty good at it. But although Khanna was one of Bernie Sanders’ co-chairs in 2020, the “progressive capitalist” from Silicon Valley (don’t call him a democratic socialist) also hobnobs with tech titans. Because according to Khanna, the way to reindustrialize and revitalize the economy is by mobilizing both union leaders and tech and industry leaders — and he thinks he can be the one to bring them together.  Kara and Ro discuss everything from the DOGE committee, the killing of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson, and Trump’s threats to jail members of the January 6 committee, AI policy, KOSA, and tech antitrust.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

How will AI agents change the economy and the workforce — and are Americans ready? Salesforce CEO Marc Benioff has some thoughts. After a stellar quarter boosted by the customer resource management company’s new AI autonomous agents, Agentforce, Benioff explains to Kara how employers and employees will be impacted by a new era of digital workers; why he thinks investing tens of billions in AI capital expenditures (like his competitor Microsoft) is a “race to the bottom”; and what he hopes will come from Donald Trump’s Department of Government Efficiency.  Plus: Kara and Marc go another round on “DOGE Master” Elon Musk, and whether it’s still possible for business leaders to still defend their values and workers without fear of political repercussions. They also remember their mutual friend, former YouTube CEO Susan Wojcicki, who died earlier this year. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

How does an ad-based streamer compete with subscription-based models like Netflix, Hulu, Max, and all the rest? By charging nothing. At least that’s what Tubi is doing. And despite being seemingly less prestigious than premium streamers, Tubi is used by millions of Americans and outranks Peacock, Max, Paramount Plus, and Apple TV+ in total viewing time. For those who are fatigued by subscriptions fees and monoculture viewing, Tubi offers an enormous catalog of nostalgia and “newstalgia” movies, hours of bingeable classics, over 250 live channels, plus Tubi originals – all at no cost to viewers. So why aren’t more people talking about it? Kara sits down with Tubi CEO Anjali Sud in this special episode of On presented by e.l.f. Cosmetics to talk about Tubi’s appeal to cord-cutters and cord-nevers; how niche-specific fans help inform Tubi content; why Sud thinks Tubi can democratize storytelling and create space for emerging filmmakers; and how she came to be one of few female CEOs in tech. This interview was taped live at the Whitney Museum in partnership with e.l.f cosmetics as a part of their campaign to increase representation and diversity in boardrooms. Find out more here: https://www.elfbeauty.com/changing-the-board-game/so-many-dicks  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What if the worst fears around AI come true? For Megan Garcia, that’s already happened. In February, after spending months interacting with chatbots created by Character.AI, her 14-year-old son Sewell took his own life. Garcia blames Character.AI, and she is suing them and Google, who she believes significantly contributed to Character.AI’s alleged wrongdoing.  Kara interviews Garcia and Meetali Jain, one of her lawyers and the founder of the Tech Justice Law Project, and they discuss the allegations made by Megan against Character.AI and Google.  When reached for comment, a spokesperson at Character.AI responded with the following statement: We do not comment on pending litigation. We are heartbroken by the tragic loss of one of our users and want to express our deepest condolences to the family. We take the safety of our users very seriously, and our dedicated Trust and Safety team has worked to implement new safety features over the past seven months, including a pop-up directing users to the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline that is triggered by terms of self-harm or suicidal ideation. Our goal is to provide a creative space that is engaging, immersive, and safe. To achieve this, we are creating a fundamentally different experience for users under 18 that prioritizes safety, including reducing the likelihood of encountering sensitive or suggestive content, while preserving their ability to use the platform. As we continue to invest in the platform and the user experience, we are introducing new safety features in addition to the tools already in place that restrict the model and filter the content provided to the user. These include improved detection, response and intervention related to user inputs that violate our Terms or Community Guidelines, as well as a time-spent notification. For more information on these new features as well as other safety and IP moderation updates to the platform, please refer to the Character.AI blog. When reached for comment, Google spokesperson Jose Castaneda responded with the following statement: Our hearts go out to the family during this unimaginably difficult time. Just to clarify, Google and Character AI are completely separate, unrelated companies and Google has never had a role in designing or managing their AI model or technologies, nor have we used them in our products. User safety is a top concern of ours, and that’s why – as has been widely reported – we’ve taken a cautious and responsible approach to developing and rolling out our AI products, with rigorous testing and safety processes. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Nathan Myhrvold likes to challenge conventional wisdom. When the founder and CEO of Intellectual Ventures (and former Chief Technology Officer at Microsoft) isn’t running one of the world’s leading invention businesses, he’s busy doing norm-defying research on topics like dinosaur bone density, asteroid sizing, and the proper way to knead dough. Kara and Nathan talk about everything from AI, politics, nuclear power, and global warming to “splash shots” — photographs of colliding wine glasses. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram/TikTok as @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Happy Thanksgiving, On listeners — today, we’re featuring a special episode of Wiser Than Me with Julia Louis-Dreyfus, one of our favorite podcasts! On Wiser Than Me, Julia shares funny, heartfelt conversations with iconic older women who bring the unapologetic wisdom and confidence that only comes with age. On this episode of Wiser Than Me, Julia chats with 80-year-old tennis pro, activist, and LGBTQ+ icon Billie Jean King. Billie Jean delves into the nature of leadership, visualization, and her long journey towards self-acceptance. Inspired by the sports legend, Julia asks Billie Jean for advice about her niece’s college soccer career, as well as revealing the original spark that lit her own love of sports. Additionally, Julia’s mom, Judy, reflects on her generation's acceptance of societal norms and the transformative power of the feminist movement. To hear more of Wiser Than Me, head to: https://lemonada.lnk.to/wiserthanmefd Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Elon Musk’s social media platform X lost more than 280,000 global users the day after the US presidential election. Meanwhile, sites like Threads from Meta and newcomer Bluesky have seen huge surges in signups. Kara talks to a team of social media experts about the “X-odus”; who is migrating to Threads and Bluesky and why; how those federated protocols (or “fediverse”) differ from X’s algorithmic platform; and if the social media “town square” giving way to a more fragmented communities is a good or bad thing. Guests: Nilay Patel, Editor-in-chief of The Verge and Host of Decoder; New York Times Tech Correspondent Mike Isaac; Wall Street Journal Tech Reporter Alexa Corse. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Lenard McKelvey is a best-selling author, entrepreneur and media mogul, but you probably know him as Charlamagne Tha God: host of The Breakfast Club. It’s an insanely popular and influential radio program that reaches millions of listeners daily. Charlamagne has been behind the microphone for over a decade, and he's not one for playing by the rules of traditional media. In recent years he’s gotten vocal about the state of politics in the US and interviewed a raft of powerful politicians at the helm including former President Obama, President Biden and Vice President Harris. During the 2024 Presidential race, Charlamagne was an unofficial surrogate for the Harris-Walz campaign, but was arguably more effective as an inadvertent messenger for the Trump campaign’s anti-trans advertising.  Much like his approach to hosting, Charlamagne’s world views don’t stay within the lines of our polarized and partisan politics. He’s quick to remark on the faults of both parties and even quicker to call out the liberal media. In this episode, Kara and Charlamagne get into it all:  the importance of meeting people where they are, both in politics and in media; why authenticity matters more than accuracy and how Democrats don’t seem to understand that; what “mainstream media” means in 2024 and the role of “good” journalists; how he felt about getting dragged into a hateful ad for President-elect Trump and how he thinks VP Harris should’ve responded; the line between funny and offensive; and, most importantly, how to seek out joy and happiness through it all.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Jon Chu grew up in Silicon Valley, in the shadow of Apple Park. His father, Chef Chu, still runs his eponymous restaurant there, and Jon worshiped Steve Jobs as a kid. As a teen, he used Apple products to learn how to make movies. Now he directs some of the biggest movies in Hollywood, but his relationship with the tech industry is much more complex.  Kara and Jon discuss his “new view” trilogy: Crazy Rich Asians, In the Heights, and his latest film, Wicked. They unpack his memoir Viewfinder, and Chu explains how growing up in Silicon Valley shaped his understanding of technology — and how the industry’s switch towards data surveillance has changed his relationship with it as an artist.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram/TikTok as @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What role will writers play as we head into a second Trump term? Author, journalist and Howard University professor Ta-Nehisi Coates has some thoughts. The man who has been called “one of the most important writers on the subject of America today” came to the fore during the Obama era as one of the preeminent writers on race, among other things, for his 2014 essay “The Case for Reparations” and his book Between the World and Me, an open letter to his son about growing up as a Black man in America. Kara and Ta-Nehisi discuss how the Democrats lost the “rainbow coalition” in the 2024 election, why America’s “special relationship” with Israel compelled him to rally against Palestinian oppression in his latest book The Message, and why he thinks journalists will need to embrace a new and not-so-safe normal during Trump 2.0. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What does a second Trump presidency mean for America? Kara hosts a panel of experts and reporters to reflect on the results of the election and to find out what we can expect going forward. They discuss the issues that mattered most to voters; what Democrats got wrong; the parts of our democracy that are broken beyond repair; the apparent shift in our country’s sense of self; and the role of social media versus traditional media in the digital age. Guests: Kristen Soltis Anderson, a pollster, founding partner of Echelon Insights, author of The Selfie Vote: Where Millennials are Leading America (And How Republicans Can Keep Up) and a CNN political contributor Isaac Arnsdorf, a national political reporter for The Washington Post and author of Finish What We Started: The MAGA Movement’s Ground War to End Democracy.  Mike Madrid, co-founder of the Lincoln Project, and author of The Latino Century: How America’s Largest Minority is Transforming Democracy Abby Phillip, anchor of CNN NewsNight with Abby Phillip  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram and TikTok @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

President-elect Donald J. Trump has won a resounding victory against Vice President Kamala Harris, and now, the man who promised political retribution and said he may use the military to go after “the enemy within” is headed back to the White House. Only this time, there will be no guardrails — only enablers. In order to understand the threat Trump poses to our democracy, Kara talks to two historians who know a lot about the birth of American democracy and the last time we came close to losing it: Dr. Lindsay Chervinsky and Dr. Timothy Naftali.  Chervinsky is a presidential historian and the executive director of the George Washington Presidential Library. Her newest book is Making the Presidency, John Adams and the Precedents that Forged the Republic. Naftali is a senior research scholar in the Faculty of International and Public Affairs at Columbia University and the former director of the federal Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram/TikTok as @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Elon Musk, the richest man in the world, isn’t on the ballot for the 2024 U.S. election, but he might as well be. Elon has become one of the Trump campaign’s top surrogates, top donors (over $119 million through the America Pac), and controls a main megaphone for pro-Trump propaganda at X. Kara and three other Musk experts discuss Elon’s outsized impact on the election, why Trump has been referring to him as the “Secretary of Cost-Cutting”, and why Musk & his businesses (X, Tesla, SpaceX, Starlink) stand to gain, no matter who wins. Guests: Tim Higgins, The Wall Street Journal columnist and author of Power Play, Tesla, Elon Musk, and the Bet of the Century Zoë Schiffer, director of business and industry at Wired and author of Extremely Hardcore, Inside Elon Musk's Twitter Eva Dou, The Washington Post Tech Policy Reporter Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find Kara on Threads/Instagram @karaswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Lying has always been a part of politics, but in recent years, political lies have come to dominate our elections and their outcomes. Even the notion that facts and truths can be objective and shared across the political divide has been put into question. As we head into a fraught election, Kara speaks with Bill Adair, professor of journalism & public policy at Duke and author of Beyond the Big Lie, and Timothy Snyder, Yale history professor and author of On Freedom, about which party lies more; the role that social media plays in amplifying and spreading falsehoods; why it’s hard to get believers to turn away from the “Big Lie”; and why factuality is a cornerstone of freedom. Plus: Snyder calls The Washington Post’s decision not to endorse a presidential candidate (dictated by owner Jeff Bezos) “anticipatory obedience” to tyranny.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find Kara on Threads/Instagram @karaswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Reid Hoffman isn’t just one of the most influential entrepreneurs and investors in Silicon Valley — he’s also one of the most important mega-donors supporting the Democratic party. A member of the so-called PayPal Mafia, Hoffman is a VC partner at Greylock Ventures and Microsoft board member who co-founded LinkedIn and InflectionAI and was a founding investor in OpenAI. He is one of the leading voices in tech fighting against former President Donald Trump, and he puts his money where his mouth is — which doesn’t always sit well with progressives, and is even more upsetting to former friends, like Elon Musk and Peter Thiel, who have gone full MAGA.   In this live interview at the Masters of Scale Summit, hosted by Hoffman in San Francisco, Kara and Reid discuss everything from the upcoming election, and the business community’s response to Trump, to Elon, Peter Thiel, Lina Khan and artificial intelligence.   Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on Instagram as @onwithkaraswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Has late-night TV passed its peak? Ticket sales for live comedy shows are booming and there’s no shortage of streaming stand-up specials, but the same is hardly true for late-night television. Is it the business model or the divisive nature of political comedy that’s driving viewership down? Either way, hosting a late-night show remains one of the most coveted jobs in comedy, and in this interview, Kara talks to one of the best. Seth Meyers, SNL veteran, host of Late Night with Seth Meyers on NBC, and the host of too many podcasts to name, joins the show to talk about the future of late-night; what he’s learned in 10 years of hosting; the utter lack of diversity in the industry; and what a second Trump presidency could mean for comedians.  Kara and Seth also talk about his new stand-up special “Dad Man Walking,” which premieres on HBO and Max this weekend; how the comic folds his personal life and parenting stories into his acts and what his family thinks of it; why there are so many stand-up specials today; and which streaming platform does it best. Plus, Kara asks Seths about his “manic” content creation and his endeavors into podcasting. “Dad Man Walking” is available on HBO and Max this Saturday October 26, 2024. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find Kara on Threads/Instagram @karaswisher Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices