On with Kara Swisher

In the year since President Trump won re-election, in part, by capitalizing on sitdowns on friendly podcasts, Democrats have been looking for their own answer to the so-called “manosphere.” One of the top contenders has emerged from a very unlikely place: bright red Oklahoma. That’s where Jennifer Welch and Angie “Pumps” Sullivan started their hit show, “I’ve Had It.” They’ve interviewed some of the biggest names on the left side of the political spectrum, like former President Obama, New York Mayor-elect Zohran Mamdani, and Vermont Independent Sen. Bernie Sanders. Welch in particular has gone viral for testy exchanges with former Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel and New Jersey Sen. Cory Booker.  Kara and Jennifer talk about what it was like to be a liberal atheist in the Bible Belt, why Jeniffer finds centrist Democrats more frustrating than MAGA, and why she’s skeptical about Georgia Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene’s recent break with Trump. They also talk about what Democrats get wrong about red states like Oklahoma, and what she thinks the party needs to do to appeal to voters outside the coasts and big cities.  Please note: The original interview for this episode was taped Friday morning, before Greene announced her decision to resign from Congress in January and Mandani met with Trump. We taped a second interview on Saturday morning to get Jennifer’s reaction to the news.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Political commentator Scott Jennings has been called the “conservative explaining Red America to CNN viewers.” As the in-house Republican on CNN’s NewsNight With Abby Phillips debate panels, he often acts as a de facto Trump spokesman at the table. Jennings has been in Republican politics for more than two decades. In the mid-aughts he worked as a Special Assistant to President George W. Bush, and later advised Kentucky Senator Mitch McConnell in multiple campaigns. Jennings was openly critical of President Trump before and during his first term, especially after the January 6th attacks. But in his new book, A Revolution of Common Sense: How Donald Trump Stormed Washington and Fought for Western Civilization, Jennings argues that Donald Trump’s second term is not just a political comeback, but a transformation of the presidency itself. Kara and Scott spar about the Epstein files, discuss what they mean for the MAGA movement, and whether Trump’s policies are really “common sense.” Plus, how Scott turned into a MAGA man and why he likes being the odd-Republican-out at CNN. Note to listeners: This is an extended version of the episode that was originally published on Thursday, November 20th. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In “The American Revolution,” a new six-part docuseries airing on PBS this week, filmmakers Ken Burns and Sarah Botstein take a deep look at the American Revolutionary War and the years before and after. They debunk many of the idealized myths we tell ourselves about the country’s founding and the complex motivations of the men who championed independence. At once critical and patriotic, it examines America’s history in ways the Trump administration would rather paper over. Kara, Ken and Sarah talk about the ways George Washington was both a deeply flawed man and integral to American victory in the war, how enslaved African Americans looked to the British for hope of freedom, and why it’s unfair to paint all Loyalists to the British Crown as traitors. They also talk about why there’s still a lot of reasons to find hope in America’s origin story today.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Nobel laureate Geoffrey Hinton, known as one of the “godfathers of AI” for his pioneering work in deep learning and neural networks, joins Kara to discuss the technology he helped create — and how to mitigate the existential risks it poses.  Hinton explains both the short- and long-term dangers he sees in the rapid rise of artificial intelligence, from its potential to undermine democracy to the existential threat of machines surpassing human intelligence. He offers a thoughtful, complex perspective on how to craft national and international policies to keep AI in check and weighs in on whether the  AI bubble is about to burst. Plus: why your mom might be the best model for creating a safe AI. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Futures designer Nick Foster spent decades helping tech companies create products many of us didn’t even know we wanted. As the head of design at Google X — a.k.a. Alphabet’s “Moonshot Factory,” which is now known simply as “X” — he led teams working on brain-controlled computer interfaces, intelligent robotics, and even neighborhood-level nuclear fusion. He also designed emerging technologies for Apple, Sony, Nokia and Dyson. But in his debut book, “Could, Should, Might, Don’t: How We Think About the Future,” Foster argues for a more measured approach to thinking about big disruptive technology, like A.I. Kara and Nick talk about the pitfalls of the current AI hype cycle, why executives need to think critically about how everyday people are using AI, and how companies can more thoughtfully adopt the technology. They also talk about Foster’s argument that all of us need to take a more “mundane” approach to thinking about AI and the future.  This episode was recorded live at Smartsheet ENGAGE 2025 in Seattle.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Under President Trump, the Department of Justice’s long-standing mission to uphold the law “without fear or favor” has been turned on its head. Attorney General Pam Bondi has followed Trump’s directives to target his political enemies and help his allies. But in their new book, Injustice: How Politics and Fear Vanquished America’s Justice Department, investigative journalists Carol Leonnig and Aaron Davis show that the erosion of the DOJ’s independence began long before Trump’s second term. Kara speaks to Leonnig, MSNBC senior investigative reporter, bestselling author and five-time Pulitzer Prize winner, about how internal pressure campaigns in Trump 1.0 prevailed, despite the noble intentions of prosecutors; the many red flags that were missed by the FBI ahead of the January 6th Capitol attack; the stubborn bravery of unsung heroes in the National Archives Department during the Biden administration; and how the DOJ’s loss of political independence will impact the country. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Scott Galloway has spent the last few years ringing the alarm about how boys and young men are falling behind. Galloway, a marketing professor at New York University, best-selling author, and Kara’s ‘Pivot’ co-host, says his concern stems from the fact that he can relate to their problems. As a young boy raised by a single mom, Scott struggled in school, didn’t have many friends, and barely got into college. But he went on to found several successful marketing firms, make millions, and raise two sons of his own. He shares his story — and his own advice on how to be a good man — in his new book, “Notes on Being a Man.” Kara and Scott talk about how the Trump campaign was able to win over young men with its regressive version of masculinity, why he thinks we need to re-embrace young men’s horniness, and why more men need to step up as mentors. They also talk about Scott’s difficult relationship with his late father, and the ways he’s trying to be a better father to his sons.  Check out our sponsor Smartsheet here! Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When Patagonia founder Yvon Chouinard first got into business, all he wanted to do was make better equipment for himself and his fellow “dirtbags.” Over 50 years, he built Patagonia into a global outdoor retailer with a sustainable mission and ensured that the company’s profits will go toward protecting the environment for years to come. In his latest book, “Dirtbag Billionaire. How Yvon Chouinard Built Patagonia, Made A Fortune, and Gave it All Away,” New York Times reporter David Gelles chronicles how Chouinard set new industry standards for sustainable production and charitable giving. Kara talks with Gelles about how Chouinard’s version of conscious capitalism compares with that of tech billionaires, what to make of shifting US corporate environmental and social responsibility, and how artificial intelligence could affect the climate in the future. Want to see Kara and Scott Galloway live on the Pivot Tour November 8th-14th? Limited tickets are still available at PivotTour.com.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

From an early age, writer, director, and producer Judd Apatow has been obsessed with comedy. What started as a quest to interview comedians for his high school radio station ultimately evolved into one of the most prolific careers in Hollywood today, with hits like “The 40 Year Old Virgin,” “Knocked Up,” and “Anchorman.” Now, Apatow is looking backwards. His new book, “Comedy Nerd,” is a visual memoir of his decades in the business, working with a who's who of the biggest names in comedy.  Kara and Judd talk about how he reimagined the genre of raunchy, R-rated comedies about stunted adolescence; what he got right about American masculinity in the mid-and-late 2000s; and his recent pivot to making documentaries about some of the greatest comedians of the modern era. They also discuss whether AI can be funny and the ways politics is shaping comedy right now.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When the Department of Justice has to investigate politically sensitive matters, those investigations are typically handled by outside prosecutors known as Special Counsels: independent investigators given the freedom to unearth the dirtiest dirt against executive branch officials, including the president.  Kara speaks with CNN senior legal analyst, former prosecutor, and best-selling author Elie Honig about his latest book, When You Come at the King: Inside DOJ’s Pursuit of the President, from Nixon to Trump. They discuss the history of the DOJ’s independent investigations, the Trump administration’s current (and mostly successful) attempts to weaponize the DOJ, the Supreme Court’s presidential immunity ruling, and recommendations for fixing the system. Want to see Kara and Scott Galloway live during the Pivot Tour November 8th-14th? There are still limited tickets available. Go to PivotTour.com for details. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In the wake of President Trump’s return to the White House, independent Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders spent months crisscrossing the nation rallying huge crowds in red and blue states during his Fighting Oligarchy tour. His new book, “Fight Oligarchy,” is an extension of those rallies and also serves as a blueprint for how everyday Americans can push back against the deep-pocketed forces shaping politics today. But at 84 years old, the two-time presidential candidate is also looking to the future of the progressive movement he helped build.  Kara and Sen. Sanders talk about his headline speech at this weekend’s No King’s rally in Washington, D.C.; the corrosive effects he thinks billionaire donors have on the Democratic Party; and the ongoing government shutdown. They also chat about how he’s getting involved early in next year’s midterm elections to help boost progressive candidates — both Democrats and independents like him — in races across the country.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Will artificial intelligence be a job creator or a job destroyer? Who will be most affected — and how long will the AI revolution in employment take?  Futurist Martin Ford and economist Betsey Stevenson join Kara to unpack the realities behind the AI hype. They explore the impact of artificial intelligence on the future of work, from the fate of blue-collar jobs amid advancing robotics to the government’s role in helping workers navigate this new era. They also dive into ideas like universal basic income and a digital dividend, and examine how AI could redefine our economy, society, and the role work plays in a meaningful life. Martin Ford is the founder of a software development firm and the author of four books, including the New York Times bestselling Rise of the Robots: Technology and the Threat of a Jobless Future. Betsey Stevenson was the chief economist of the US Department of Labor from 2010 to 2011, and then served on the Council of Economic Advisors from 2013 to 2015. She's a professor of Public Policy and Economics at the University of Michigan and serves on the executive committee of the American Economic Association. Register for Smartsheet Engage here! Want to see Kara and Scott Galloway live during the Pivot Tour November 8th-14th? Get tickets and details at PivotTour.com.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Former Vice President Kamala Harris joined Kara to talk about her new book, “107 Days,” in front of a packed house at the Warner Theatre in Washington, D.C. They discussed President Trump’s weaponization of the Justice Department, the tech industry’s rightward shift, and how to combat Trump’s march toward autocracy in an age of disinformation, blatant power plays, and political exhaustion. Want to see Kara and Scott Galloway live during the Pivot Tour November 8th-14th? Get tickets and details at PivotTour.com.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Acclaimed researcher, podcaster and best-selling author Brené Brown joins Kara to unpack her vision of leadership, as outlined in her latest book, "Strong Ground." They discuss the dangers of "power over" leadership, why courage and vulnerability are essential traits for real leadership, and how turbulent times can pave the way for bad leadership. They also explore the impact of AI on human connection and the challenges faced by leaders in navigating a world of uncertainty and paradox. Brown shares her research on the self-conscious effects of shame and humiliation, and both she and Kara reflect on the qualities of effective and ethical leadership. Want to see Kara and Scott Galloway live during the Pivot Tour November 8th-14th? Get tickets and details at PivotTour.com.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In the late 80s and early 90s, makeup artist Bobbi Brown made a name for herself by pioneering a more natural look long before it became the dominant trend. She eventually turned her side hustle selling lipstick out of her house in suburban New Jersey into a billion-dollar eponymous makeup brand that changed the beauty industry. But her unceremonious exit from parent company Esteé Lauder, with approximately four years left on a 25-year noncompete clause, stripped her of the company she had built over decades and sidelined her from the industry.  Now in her 60s, Brown has started over with a new makeup line called Jones Road, and she’s telling her story in a memoir, “Still Bobbi: A Master Class in Resilience and Reinvention.”  Kara and Brown talk about how she changed the makeup industry and founded a second successful company, plus where she sees the beauty industry headed in the era of influencers and social media.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Universities have been in the crosshairs of the White House since President Trump took office — and Princeton University president Christopher Eisgruber is one of a handful of college administrators who have spoken out against it.  Kara speaks to the Eisgruber about his new book, Terms of Respect: How Colleges Get Free Speech Right, and right-wing attacks on universities that come under the guise of free speech, including from the late conservative activist Charlie Kirk and his organization Turning Point USA. They discuss why some campus leaders have fought against (and others have complied) with the Trump administration’s investigations into allegations of antisemitism and demands to overhaul diversity programs in college admissions and hiring. And they talk about the long-term impacts of losing academic freedom on the reputation and success of US higher education, the economy and society as a whole.  Please note: this interview was recorded on Monday September 29th, before President Trump said his administration was nearing a deal with Harvard while it also began a process called debarment that could allow it to bar the university from future federal grants.  Want to see Kara (and Scott Galloway) live on the Pivot Tour November 8th - 14th? Find tickets and details at PivotTour.com.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

At age 67, Sen. Tina Smith (D, MN) is doing something that’s still rather rare for senators: retiring at a relatively young age, after just one full term in office. Smith’s open Senate seat is one of five Democrats will have to defend in next year’s midterm elections, in what’s shaping up to be a tough cycle. But with a little more than a year left in office, she still has to work on the big problems facing the Democratic Party, and the nation more broadly, including a rise in political violence and this week’s looming government shutdown.  In a live conversation recorded Saturday at the annual MinnPost Festival in downtown Minneapolis, Kara and Smith talk about why she thinks Democrats shouldn’t cave to Republican demands to keep the government open; how more of her colleagues should opt to retire instead of run for re-election; and what Democrats need to do to come out ahead in next year’s midterm elections. Smith also reflects on the recent spate of political violence, including the assasination of  her friend and fellow Minnesota Democrat, Melissa Hortman, in June. (The gunman reportedly included the senator on his hit list.)  Thank you to MinnPost for hosting this conversation.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Matt and Maria Raine say their son, 16-year-old Adam Raine, started using ChatGPT-4o in September 2024 to help with his homework. After Adam died by suicide this past April, his parents realized that ChatGPT was also lending an ear to Adam’s suicidal ideations and giving him advice on techniques. In a lawsuit filed against OpenAI and its CEO Sam Altman, the Raines allege that the chatbot actively isolated Adam from family and friends.  They say ChatGPT not only didn’t stop Adam from taking his own life —  it actually helped him do it. Kara speaks to Matt and Maria, as well as their attorney, Jay Edelson of Edelson PC, about Adam’s final months, why they believe OpenAI and CEO Sam Altman should be held responsible for Adam’s suffering and death, and what kind of safety features are needed for AI companions.  In response to a request for comment, an OpenAI spokesperson said: “Our deepest sympathies are with the Raine family for their unthinkable loss. Teen well-being is a top priority for us - minors deserve strong protections, especially in sensitive moments. We have safeguards in place today, such as surfacing crisis hotlines, guiding how our models respond to sensitive requests, and nudging for breaks during long sessions, and we’re continuing to strengthen them. We will soon roll out parental controls, developed with expert input, so families can decide what works best in their homes, and we’re building toward a long-term age-prediction system to help tailor experiences appropriately.” This episode discusses the death by suicide of a teenager in significant detail. If you are struggling, please reach out for help. In the US and Canada you can call or text the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988 anytime for immediate support.  This episode version has been updated with a revised introduction. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Former U.S. Secretary of Transportation Pete Buttigieg is on the shortlist of Democrats expected to make a run for the White House in 2028. Six years ago, the then-mayor of South Bend, Indiana, burst onto the national political scene as the first openly gay major presidential candidate. His centrist appeal and platform of good governance helped him win the Iowa Caucuses, edging out independent Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders and then-former Vice President Joe Biden. But should Buttigieg choose to run again, he’ll face a much more fractured Democratic electorate that’s still divided over Gaza, the 2024 election, and the best strategy to counter the MAGA movement.   In a live conversation recorded at the University of Michigan’s Rackham Auditorium, Kara and Pete talk about his concerns over how the Trump administration is using the assassination of conservative commentator Charlie Kirk to crack down on free speech; why he and other Democrats struggle to speak clearly about the war in Gaza; and his vision for a post-Trump America. Buttigieg also weighs in on whether he is, in fact, planning to run for president again in 2028. Thanks to the Gerald R. Ford School of Public Policy for hosting this conversation.  Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

For years, Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia was a Democrat with a habit of voting against the party line. Not surprisingly, that was something many Democrats despised and Republicans relished. His resistance cost Democrats big legislative wins, including President Biden’s $1.75 trillion Build Back Better Act in 2021. After being called a DINO (Democrat in Name Only) for years, Manchin flirted with a presidential run on the No Labels ticket and officially dropped the “D” to become an independent in 2024, shortly before leaving office. Kara talks to Manchin about his new memoir, Dead Center: In Defense of Common Sense, his reasoning for occasionally siding with the other side of the aisle, his defense of the filibuster, and why he thinks independents might have a better chance in 2028. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube (full episodes available now!) Instagram, TikTok, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices