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We welcome our old friend Tony Ortega back to the Fair Game podcast to talk about the current state of scientology, their ongoing financial crimes and the devastation COVID 19 has wrought on their information control. Learn more about your ad-choices at
We spoke with Roberta Blevins, a former member of a Multi-Level-Marketing (MLM) scam known as LuLaRoe.  Learn more about your ad-choices at
We talk to former executive of Church of Spiritual Technology (CST) about the organization established to preserve Hubbard's words in the event of a nuclear holocaust for all future civilizations, what the symbols etched into the ground mean, the various homes built for Hubbard after his death that are maintained to this day, and much more.  Learn more about your ad-choices at
Episode 77: Jefferson Hawkins

Episode 77: Jefferson Hawkins


Leah and Mike are joined by Jeff Hawkins, an extremely talented, thoughtful and articulate former Sea Org member to recount his experiences with David Miscavige, his role in making Dianetics a bestseller again the 80's and his journey into and out of scientology.  Learn more about your ad-choices at
Former scientologist Aharon Friedman is a professor of Physics and Electrical Engineering and serves on the Board of the Israeli Center for Cults’ Victims. Unlike L. Ron Hubbard, he really IS a nuclear physicist. We talk about his experiences in scientology, what drove him to escape and his work helping victims of cults today. Learn more about your ad-choices at
We welcome back our old friend Marc Headley to talk about Scientology and the internet, including covering the bonkers domain names scientology has registered, and how they have unsuccessfully attempted to control access to information on the World Wide Web. Learn more about your ad-choices at
We speak to our old friend and Leah family member Julian Wain about his experiences with WISE (World Institute of Scientology Enterprises) companies and how they implement high pressure sales techniques into dental and chiropractic offices, and are recruitment agencies for scientology. Learn more about your ad-choices at
This week we have a treat -- we talk with the creator of Operation Clambake, and one of the earliest non-scientologists to go head-to-head with scientology in the fledgling days of the internet.  Learn more about your ad-choices at
We bring back one of our favorites this week, the wonderful Stefani Hutchison. Stefani was never a scientologist, but has taken up the cudgel of exposing the lies of scientology on her excellent blog: Confront and Shatter. In this episode, we cover some of the sleuth work Stefani has done, investigating the claims made by scientology and their front groups.  Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike start 2022 with one of our favorites -- more Listener Questions. We cover a wide scope of topics, from Fair Game campaign tactics to preserving Hubbard's "legacy" on stainless steel plates in titanium capsules in nuclear-bomb-proof vaults and the embarrassing "We Stand Tall" song video... Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike continue their discussion from last week about Committees of Evidence with Claire Headley, covering the snitch culture of scientology and the subject of Knowledge Reports -- one of the most important control mechanisms within the scientology world.  Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike talk to their old friend and Aftermath OG Claire Headley again this week, this time to discuss Committees of Evidence. What are they exactly, our personal experiences convening, participating and being victims of them, and how they differ from arbitration. Learn more about your ad-choices at
This week Leah and Mike talk to their old friend Chris Shelton about cult apologists. These are the people who make a career (often lucrative) out of offering expert academic opinions in support of "New Religious Movements" -- cults. It's a racket that scientology has used to gain credibility. Learn more about your ad-choices at
This week we have another one of our favorite Listener Questions episodes... We have a lot of great questions, including what the organization does with all the money it makes? Are the PI's scientologists? What would happen if we tried to rejoin scientology? What is the most bizarre Hubbard policy? Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike welcome Dr. Willy Rice, Senior Pastor at Calvary Baptist Church in Clearwater to the podcast. Willy has been one of the few community leaders who has taken a strong, public stance against the abuses of scientology. We talk about the influence of scientology in the community and the lie that you can a Christian and a scientologist. Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike talk to filmmaker Aaron Kaufman. Known for producing Robert Rodriguez films, more recently he directed Crusaders, a documentary on Jehovah's Witnesses for Vice TV. Aaron was raised a JW. His doc focuses on the data base containing allegations of sexual abuse amassed by the organization which they have refused to make public. Plenty of scientology parallels in this discussion.   Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike talk to a long term scientology whistleblower, Tory "Magoo" Christman. Her story covers the gamut -- OSA dirty tricks, disconnection, the Lisa McPherson Trust, being Fair Gamed and a whole lot more. It is an episode that seemed too short with such a bright, smart and kind person. Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike welcome Nora Ames, former SO member and outspoken whistleblower concerning the hypocrisy of scientology's rampant homophobia. She has one of the most incredible and harrowing escape from the Sea Org stories as well as what she did to get her mother out of scientology. Both her father and mother were scientology Guardian Office workers. Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike welcome their dear friend Amy Scobee. Amy was in charge of scientology Celebrity Centres for many years and had a lot of personal experience with scientology's biggest celebrities. She was also the catalyst for The Aftermath when she reached out with the story of her mother, Bonnie. They were featured in the first episode. Learn more about your ad-choices at
Leah and Mike welcome back Julian Wain, who appeared with his wife Katherine in Episode 49. This time they discuss the Delphian schools -- Julian both attended and taught there. These, like other "Applied Scholastics" schools use Hubbard "technology" to indoctrinate kids and act as recruitment pools for the Sea Org, despite the public claims they make. Learn more about your ad-choices at
Comments (171)


is there going to be another episode?

May 10th

Lo K

Mike said they’re just taking a brief break right now. Working on new stuff. They did not get a cease and desist.

May 8th

Marc Watt

society at large is a cult...I for one won't participate.

Apr 20th

Marc Watt

wt-f.... no more episodes

Apr 20th

Marissa Pothering

Btw.. we do love when you say Fuck....

Mar 29th

kiras family

this is actually kinda creppy but i love it

Mar 2nd

Lindsey Puchala

Leah you made me spit out my water. 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Feb 24th

Jen Fimbel

Scientology is Spiritual abuse En Mass. It's so utterly disgusting.

Jan 20th

Rebecca Purdin


Jan 16th


Leah… he was scaring me too! And I’m only listening to a podcast. :|

Jan 14th


I love this. It's imperfect, shouty, sweary, but it's wonderful. Keep taking Scientology to task. You're doing so much good

Dec 29th


“Scientology is scared shitless of South Park.” — Mike Rinder I’ve never heard a funnier yet more accurate statement regarding any serious and complex discussion. Leah Remini and Mike Rinder always bring smiles amidst the tears, but for some reason (likely due to its absurd simple truth) this one statement has had me laughing for at least 5 minutes.

Dec 29th

Mary Ray

I am with you, I have not traveled internationally and I don't plan to. Love the podcast!! Thank you for keeping this alive. There is so much wrong with the Scientology.

Dec 2nd

Teresa Kintner Gunderson

Was this one supposed to end abruptly in mid sentence? It did for me. Excellent episode otherwise!

Nov 10th


literally the tactics the progressive left use to get what they want.

Nov 3rd


Hands down one of my favorite episodes so far.... Thanks Leah, Mike, & Aaron❣Love love love this podcast :)

Oct 18th

Aileen Fernandez

Did the end get cut off for everyone else? the audio repeated multiple parts and the end didn't finish. ☹

Oct 8th


Amazing episode.... Thank you Leah, Mike, & Ray❣

Oct 5th


what the hell was with the editing on this episode?

Sep 15th

Paula Barker

Ok, so you pay X amount for a lifetime membership. But when you sign on the dotted line to become a member, again paying X amount of money, you're contract states you're a member for 1 billion years???? Am I wrong in thinking that??

Aug 31st
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