The Équipe Solitaire Podcast

This podcast originally aired in October 2022 but recent texts with Ian about music and dogs and life reminded me of how good this is and that it merits re-release. Since the original broadcast Ian, who is an underwater cinematographer, has worked on "Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny", "Shogun", "Wednesday" (a Tim Burton offering) and "Last Breath", which premiers in February 2025. Ian and I have spent a good amount of time working on a documentary together and perhaps in the next chapter, the one titled "Whatever Comes Next", we might see if a logical conclusion exists and can push it to the finish line. ___________Ian Seabrook returns to the podcast after a three-year hiatus. Ian is an award winning Underwater Director of Photography in the motion picture and television industry who first appeared on Episode 55. At that time he was in Utah to document the production and release of REFUGE, the first large book produced by NonProphet. This year Ian's return coincided with the printing of POISON so we strong-armed him into making a short film about that.Ian's underwater credits include “Batman v Superman”, “Deadpool 2” and “Jungle Cruise”, five episodes of the TV series, "See", and he was also the second unit cinematographer for Zack Snyder's "Army Of The Dead". More recently his work on "The Rescue" earned several cinematography awards, which we discuss intensively in this current episode.We start this talk with an in-depth review of the underwater shots in "Man of Steel", and simple behind-the-scenes things like how to keep personnel safe in the tank while the SFX crew sets the water on fire. Ian also discusses about the necessity of appropriate clothing, nutrition and fitness for long shooting days in water that is constantly extracting heat from one's body. The conversation shifts towards the current state of filmmaking and how it feels like cinema is a disposable medium these days (very different than in the 70s) and the sheer volume of output is shocking ... quantity vs quality diluted by frequency. We do a drive-by on the unreality of Reality TV and the difference between true documentary film and docu-drama or docu-fiction projects that are "dramatized" to "improve" the story. In an unusual twist, Michael brings up some of the positive aspects of new and social media but don't blink or you'll miss them.In review, Ian's descriptions of shooting underwater sequences for "The Rescue" are riveting, and easily worth the price of a listen.Ian's website:https://www.dorsalfin.net/

Mark sits with Bill McConnell to discuss, well, everything, starting with a quick exchange about the benefits of voluntary discomfort, moving into pre-Clovis arrowheads and onto evolving out of a wrestling mentality with regards to fitness into an appreciation of training for specific goals. In this case, for Bill, fitness supports his journey as a primitive survivalist, a condition that cannot be accurately pursued in a Globo-Gym. And that's the last time we talk about fitness because Bill's knowledge, experience and skills in the context of primitive survival trump just about any other topic we might discuss. By way of an introduction Bill humorously describes his drive to be "more than an Amway salesman for the bow drill." He talks about harvesting a bear with a stone point arrow and a "stick from the woods", homemade bow, homemade shaft, flint-napped arrowhead, and also about blowing 15-20 stalks in order to get close enough—15 yards—to an extremely sensitive antelope to shoot it with a primitive bow. Bill describes his path of experimental archeology (replicating old tools and using them in the real world) where he is in the real world, seeing artifacts and organic material, and being familiar enough with ancient cultures to imagine how the discovered and recovered artifact might have been used as a tool thousands of years ago. This is very different from scientific conclusions reached by researchers who have never been anything other than in 68 degrees and well-fed ...His explanation of building, customizing and using the AtlAtl is remarkable. The difference between foreshaft and main shaft is clear to me as it never was before, and how a hunter can weaponize the tool—the foreshaft—according to the game being hunted, from fish to antelope to elk and larger game, made me understand why humans are still here and many species that primitive humans hunted are not. "This is functioning art, the synthesis of art and science."At 1hr 26min they talked about the VO2 Max of various animals and the primacy of the antelope so after the conversation Mark dug up his old chart:Reinhold Messner (arguably the best high altitude climber ever)   48.8Mark Twight                                    56.6Alex Lowe (much better, faster, stronger climber than Twight)       69Miguel Indurain (five-time TDF winner)                    71Jim Ryun (1 miler world record in 1967)                   81Steve Prefontaine (1 mile in 3:54)                        84.4Bjorn Dahle (Olympic Gold Medals in several XC Ski distances)   93Certain Dogs have VO2 Max of                        90-100FunnyCide and other thoroughbreds are somewhere between    150-200Pronghorn Antelope (the highest ever recorded)            300We eventually land on the discussion of nutritional density and why people eating processed foods to fullness find themselves hungry a couple of hours later as the body inventories its intake and learns that the large meal lacked certain necessary nutrients. It's very different "when I harvest my own meat ... I don't have to eat as much of it because there is more nutrition within that food ..."Finally, it is very important to think about environment and how our presence affects it, "When we leave things for the next generation so that they find it as you did they at least have the ability to make new mistakes or try new things out ... we haven't diminished the resources ... but that's not how we have move through our environment, we have altered it, exploited it, removed some potential for understanding and growth ... and that needs to change."

This is a reboot of Episode 20, recorded in 2018 with my dear friend, Brian Enos. He published a new book on July 17th, 2024 so I figured it would be a nice means of sharing some of the history of the NonProphet podcast (formerly known as The Dissect Podcast) and helping listeners understand why they might very well be interested in the new book titled, "Practical Living". You may learn a bit more about the book by surfing to the Journal section of the NonProphet site. In the first mobile recording of the Dissect podcast, Mark sits down with friend and mentor, Brian Enos, to talk about shooting, Zen, temperament, road tripping, psychedelics and thinking about how to think. Brian is the author of “Practical Shooting — Beyond Fundamentals”. It is considered one of the best books on the subject, and certainly the deepest. During his career, he won multiple Area and National titles and despite this success—or maybe because of it—one day he quit cold turkey, which also comes up during the conversation.

Mark and Carl Kuschke discuss the preparation for an endurance event which was quite outside Carl's normal training focus and activity. He was recruited into a college tennis program but quickly realized going pro wasn't in his future so after graduating he entered the workforce and his training occurred mostly in the gym where he finally put on some muscle because the tennis training volume decreased. We discuss the concept of functional fitness, what functionality means, how to navigate the wilderness of fitness once the university coaching and programming are done, time limitations due to demands of family and work (10 hours per week, max), as well as the utility of online, remote programs. Often, the solution to a sense of stagnation in the gym is to break the routine, to choose an unusual objective and train differently for it. Mark concedes that obstacle course racing may actually be pretty fun, and Carl extolls the reassurance offered by a solid training plan, one that had him well enough prepared to actually enjoy himself on the day of the event. There are some details about the training itself, from VO2 intervals to grip work and the notorious Bulgarian Split Squat Test, and discussion of choosing an appropriate objective according to one's physical history, available time and innate curiosity. This isn't about a high end performance done by a famous athlete, rather it's a conversation that maybe lights the way for anyone to improve their fitness and enjoy the experience.

When I signed a copy of Extreme Alpinism for Pete in 1999 I wrote, "The moment of terror is the beginning of life. Be scared." I signed the book to a reputation—to hearsay—instead of signing it to the actual man. Years later, having become friends, he reminded me of the inscription. The phrase was my response to hearing a story of him bolting routes in Hyalite Canyon, sacrilege to me at the time; reducing risk to pursue purely technical difficulty and permanently altering the resource by chasing that grail. We had a good laugh 25 years after the fact ... we are both still alive to do so. In the moment of our early encounters I couldn't see the similarities between us. I focused on the hot-button issue in my own philosophical pursuits so I missed what could have been an influential and powerful relationship. What I couldn't see then was that Pete strove to connect with nature through adventure, exposing himself to great risk in exchange for the promise of great reward. That individual reward, when communicated and shared, becomes inspiration, becomes progression ... reinforcing the interconnectedness of the community, the climbers seeing and seeking and pushing limits out on the edge.Now that we are on the backside of the arc, the offramp so to speak, and still alive to be wondering, "What now? What next?" we sat down for a conversation. We spoke about the influence of music on climbing as an activity and attitude in that era, when there was a soundtrack to everything. The punk rock cry was "no future" and that might seem claustrophobic or oppressive but our interpretation of it was that, "If I have no future then I am utterly free to act in the present, to do what I want to do right now because I'm going to die anyway." But there was no map, no guideposts; we had to manufacture our own rites of passage into adulthood because the rites that were culturally common before no longer existed. Without a map, with only casual insight from brief exposure to mentors, we followed what we could, imitated what seemed appropriate, and struck out into a wild world where those who tried the hardest seems to live the shortest lives but we went there anyway. And somewhere out there we learned that fear is not a barrier, it's just good information.

Kelly Halpin is an artist, adventurer, and child of nature. Her love of the outdoors and running in the mountains is infectious. She recently sat down with Michael and Trevor Thompson to discuss her ultra exploits at the Running Up For Air event in SLC, UT — in which she won and set the female record. She also discusses her most recent challenge at The Barkley Marathons. She has incredible insight into what endurance can do for you when it is more than pinning a number or collecting FKTs. Her list of accomplishments in endurance sports is only overshadowed by her love of nature and her ability to translate that through her artwork.You can find more about her at www.kellyhalpin.com or her Instagram: @kyehalpin

Mark sits down with Raymond Ansotegui to learn about sheep, cows, Basque culture and bullfighting (and there's not a red cape in sight). We discuss the philosophical side of moving energy and keeping the flow, the somatotypes and psychological make-up required by the job. These are farm boys, ranch kids, good athletes who understand the movement of the animal and also have a particular temperament; maybe not the guy being cheered but the guy being thanked for the protecting the guy being cheered. Raymond's experience as a bullfighter gives him a unique opportunity to dispel misconceptions about rodeo, and bull riding, in particular. There isn’t any actual “fighting” in western rodeo bullfighting, rather it is a dance of grit and grace involving extreme focus, humility and respect for the animals and the athletes.Raymond describes some lessons from the arena — commit, slow down, get closer than you want to, and well, "it turns out that those same lessons applied to me helping my father live with Alzheimer's for the seven years before it took him."Later, when we were speaking about storytelling (it's how we met), and he said, "If we can find sameness then we can explore difference because we can always find our way back," which is a beautiful and universal lesson. We also dive into the concept of facilitation and conflict resolution, mediation and collaboration, and eventually the notion of a bullfighter not actually fighting the bull but rather steering and guiding its attention, another concept that has near-universal application. Raymond was born and raised in Livingston, Montana, earned his undergraduate degree from Montana State University where his father was a professor of animal science for thirty years. After attending higher education at Arizona State University (Masters degree in land reclamation, and plant and soil science) and working at the Nevada Test Site, he returned to Montana."We learn to believe in ourselves, commit to our goals and when we get knocked down, to get back up again and again."

Michael and Kegan sit down to talk about physiology and the gulf that language builds between knowing and understanding. They go deep into new thoughts on strength training and how much of what we have done might of worked but is also wrong, “all models are wrong, some are useful.” They bring up relevant topics such as the disconnect between performing exercises versus establishing a training stimulus. They ask questions about the common cultural assumption that “bad” technique causes injury. They meet at an understanding that the body’s posture is an early pull to the grave because of how it affects a fundamental process like subconscious breathing can lead to an inability to control your state.

What can I say about Daniel Strauss other than I admire him. And it isn’t his accolades and successes in jiujitsu (though there are many) or is it his impressive physical strength, that should be studied. Nor is it his ability to think differently in such a homogenized world. It’s because of his curiosity and his zeal for living. He embodies a practice and insight that is rare these days. In October, I flew to Mallorca Spain to participate in a week-long BJJ festival. The level and sheer amount of practitioners and mastery were world-class, and out of them all, Daniel’s humble approach to teaching captured my attention and opened up the world of BJJ to what I think it can be. He is a master of his craft and yet, I know he is not done progressing. We covered the roots of grappling, and its function as the foundation for Western Civilization. We went into depth on environments (sites of power), the marketing of BJJ as a “little guy” sport that disconnected it from strength training, and what difficult tasks mean as value. I’m grateful for his time and I hope you enjoy the conversation as much as I did. Books Referenced:How We Move  by Dr. Rob GrayTeaching: A Subversive Activity by Neil PostmanDinosaur Training by Brooks Kubik

Jack is a legend in the climbing world, a man I looked up to when I started climbing and still do today. His obsession with the Alaska Range produced first ascents of the Isis Face on Denali, the Diamond Arête on Mount Hunter, the Viper Ridge on Mount Foraker, and Mount Barille’s Cobra Pillar, he made the first ascent of the Elevator Shaft on Mount Johnson, the north face of Thunder Mountain, and several new routes on the Mount Huntington massif. Shifting attention to the Yukon, he made the first ascent of "Arctic Discipline" on the north face of Mount Kennedy with Jack Roberts. He has traveled all over the world to climb, making expeditions to Mount Siguniang (China), Everest, the Biafo Spires, Uzam Braak and the Ogre in Pakistan, as well as the Cordilleras Blanca and Huayhuash in Peru, and finally Kashmir, in India. He received the American Alpine Club’s coveted Underhill Award for climbing achievement (1999), the Italian Alpine Club award, “Genziana Giovanne” (1999), and the Sowles Award from the American Alpine Club. "conferred from time to time on mountaineers who have distinguished themselves, with unselfish devotion at personal risk or sacrifice of a major objective, in going to the assistance of fellow climbers imperiled in the mountains," in 2003.We recorded this conversation in October of 2022 but because we had spoken for over three and a half hours I was reluctant to undertake the editing. I started editing just before his 70th birthday but that came and went before I could finish it.The conversation started tentatively as we tried to find the entry point, discussing how and where we met (in 1986), the original carbon-fiber ice tool I'd been given by Grivel the year before that I then gave to Jack, which he returned to me in 2001, and that leads him the story of nearly being killed on the north face of Mount Augusta in 2002. The rescue that ensued is quite incredible—involving the US Air Force operating over the border in Canada—the details of which Jack shares in a very sobering and thoughtful way.Augusta is in the St Elias range, which is twice as large as Switzerland, and the tallest peak, Mount Logan, is the largest massif (described as base circumference) that is above water in the world. On average 110 skiers and climbers visit the area annually (contrasted with 1200 on Denali) and 90% of those attempt Logan, so on any other peak in the range one is quite likely to be alone in one of the vastest wilderness regions on the planet.Further along we discuss the importance of preserving climbing history and the American Alpine Club's work to record interviews and document events with the Legacy Series of short films. This leads to some talk about the resource itself—rock crags and cliffs as well as the higher peaks—and how our use permanently affects not simply the surfaces (heavily polished Italian limestone in Finale Ligura is one example) but also the surrounding environment. When Jack went to Everest in 1983 there had only been four prior American expeditions to that mountain and there were four US teams on Everest that very year, and the mountain had not yet been guided. Contrast that to 2021 when 145 people summited K2 in a single day and there likely had not been more than 100 climbers who had stood on top prior to that day; guiding, fixed ropes and camps, supplemental oxygen, and significant Sherpa support for the clients have all had a dramatic impact on the craft of climbing and upon the mountains themselves.This tangent led us to a distinction between someone who wants to do the climbing and someone who wants to be regarded as a climber, and Jack is most certainly one of the former.The Mount Augusta story.

The idea must be poisoned before the activity itself can become toxic. It is precisely the misunderstanding of what the term "fitness" means that leads many away from the true, original concept and towards the quick fix, the momentary, and ultimately, the detrimental. Michael and Kegan kick off by discussing the common practice of sacrificing health for wealth, and later trying to use the wealth to unfuck what was done to earn it. The youthful notion of invincibility makes all manner of physical damage acceptable if the result is wealth or notoriety but/and "athletic longevity" doesn't make sense to someone who can't yet define actual longevity for themselves. Once physical condition or performance begins to decline (through overuse, injury or simple aging) repeating what was done a decade or more prior can be very seductive but the training that got one to a peak won't reproduce that peak after one is moving down the back-slope of that peak; none of us are 20 years old any more. At some point it is important to know and understand when to quit ... without becoming a quitter.Michael admits, "when I was younger I had to prove I wasn't lazy but as I get older I want to prove I'm not stupid. I know I don't avoid hard things, I've proven it to myself, which means it's time to learn how to take care of myself." He and Kegan observe that childhood/adolescent programming affects behavior decades later, and that maintaining a relationship with physical activity can stall or counter age-related cognitive decline; vigor in the body directly supports vitality in the mind. Understanding the true and real "how" of fitness has become more important in this era where everything has a hack or shortcut, and physical appearance often belies serious, underlying health issues.

Joe Notebaert is originally from Phoenix Arizona, USA. He received his black belt from Cesar Lima and signed by Roger Gracie in 2017 after 9 1/2 years of training at the Roger Gracie Academy in London, UK. Joe is a 2X World Champion winning gold at purple and brown belt in the masters featherweight category in 2013 and 2017. He also won gold in the European Championships in Gi in 2013, and No-GI in 2012 at purple belt featherweight. Michael sat down with Joe during the Mallorca BJJ and Yoga camp in Mallorca, Spain. This event is a passion project that has been in the works since Joe first discovered jiu-jitsu living in London. They talk about the difficulties in making your dreams a reality, especially when this event was threatened in its second year during the pandemic. https://www.mallorcabjj.com/

Kegan and Lucas join Michael to discuss what is wrong with fitness culture and how to think about changing it. This conversation starts on the topic of training consistency and how folks maintain it, which requires them to define consistent training. This quickly presents the conundrum that negative feedback slows or stops consistency, that positive feedback is needed to maintain consistency, and one must train consistently in order to 'cause' positive feedback. And to train consistently one must be semi- or totally-obsessed; to excel requires obsession, you have to be thinking about it when you're not doing it.Training, actual training, starts with a purpose, what are you training for? Why are you doing it? If the Why isn't defined, and precisely, then the work is difficult to sustain ... if you have nothing to progress toward and no way to measure or appreciate it, well, doing it isn't as easy or defensible as might otherwise be true. The guys realize that one's timeline affects point of view but also the effectiveness of the effort. High intensity training leads to a short-term outlook; a 11-minute workout, regardless of how hard it is, does not compel or inspire you to think 72 hours ahead much less ten years ahead. How will what you are doing today influence your physical and psychological condition in ten years? Do you even care? Few actually think ahead, but we all should, because we might actually live that long. And "ahead" changes over time, with understanding. At a younger age, when an entire world was laid out ahead but our appetites were demanding, if acquiring a skill or developing a fitness characteristic took longer than twelve weeks it was too long. Later, with more experience and maturity we recognized it is totally acceptable to sit with the idea that learning to jump might take one year, and that's OK. The real outcomes take time. Sadly, a short frame of reference and quick execution doesn't develop the habits that sustain the condition that was achieved in a short amount of time. To be sure, surface changes, appearance changes may happen quickly but deep, meaningful, lasting change takes time, it takes getting used to ... and living with it. They discuss using competition wisely and wonder if the biggest mistakes made in business are the same ones made in fitness, which could be a launchpad for a marketing gimmick but Michael steers them back to the idea that the intent of a workout prescription affects and changes the execution AND the result of the training session. A laundry list of exercises has no value ... but we can overwrite a lot of wrongness with a proper intention (or thesis). And more important than intent is the story surrounding it, no one remembers or cares about the science of a workout or training style, but they do recall and carry with them the story of it, the narrative built around the session or overall program ... the best storyteller might actually be the best coach or trainer. So while people chase the numbers of a set/rep/duration structure believing these to be the magical keys, others understand, and have proven that if you go long enough or hard enough stuff comes up ... and if you are sensitized and aware, that stuff might cause meaningful change.

Roger Gracie is a 10x IBJJF world champion. More notably, he is widely regarded as the GOAT of competitive jiujitsu in the gi. His dominant style is subtle and simple but the way he has claimed so many victories is based on technical precision and an understanding of the details to a degree that baffles anyone who has pursued the sport. Michael was reintroduced to BJJ by Roger while working on a motion picture in London in the summer of 2016. They met up in Mallorca, Spain for a 5-day BJJ festival where Michael was able to have a conversation with Roger about the bigger picture of a professional jiujitsu athlete’s career, and what motivates and fuels a path in combat sport. They discuss what it takes to be a great athlete, the imbalances of sport-specific training, and what it means to add to the legacy of the Gracie name.

Back in 2018 Nate Pack, who at the time was the "Undisputed King of The Airdyne" joined us for a conversation (Ep. 53) and this is the Intro we wrote for that episode:"The guys speak with Nate Pack about capacity and tolerance, about the engine and its gas tank, and get down in the weeds about numbers, which is no surprise as Nate holds a PhD in bio-engineering and is a self-described “smart guy”. He also has a high degree of mastery in extensive effort. During the conversation they divulge the secret workout everyone has been asking for, and the dietary pairings used to amplify its effect. Finally—since this is an exercise and fitness podcast—they analyze the numbers in order to coronate the undisputed king of the Airdyne, and discuss how to plot the linear progression curves of power and time to expose truth."Those numbers, achieved on the AD4 fan bike, which was the standard at the time, are:10 minutes = 412 calories20 minutes = 705 calories30 minutes = 1002 calories60 minutes = 1935 caloriesNate returns to the podcast to discuss the many years of growth and change that has occurred since. We started by discussing how easily we can trick ourselves into believing that more and harder effort can overcome other poor choices, generally those of the dietary kind but when that doesn't work it's time for wholesale change. After having realized that he had gained more weight than he could tolerate or overcome with power, and along the way lost much of his aerobic fitness, Nate made a change. "Sometimes the mirror reflects the image we want to see and not the truth."He started training base (intensity) only for 15-18 hours a week, some on bike but also a lot of walking. He dropped 40 pounds in 15 weeks, 3-4 pounds per week on average, and then consciously slowed it down, taking advantage of the positive feedback but also realizing he needed to turn conscious behavior into a habit, which is more or less automatic. He took another ten pounds off over eight weeks, and slowed the weight loss down even more, while not losing focus. By the time the Logan-to-Jackson (LOTOJA) bike race was held in early-September of 2023 he had lost sixty+ pounds and rebuilt his long endurance and long threshold fitness back.This was the first time on our podcast when the following phrase was spoken, "without going into the biochemistry of PGC-1 Alpha ...", which relates to mitochondrial biogenisis and "promotes the remodeling of muscle tissue to a fiber-type composition that is metabolically more oxidative and less glycolytic in nature, and it participates in the regulation of both carbohydrate and lipid metabolism."It's a fitness podcast and sometimes complex details are discussed so a detailed description of training intensity ensues, referencing mitochondrial biogenesis, work/rest ratios for intervals, effort that produces 2.5 mmol/l lactate but would produce 5 if sustained but it isn't, etc. Yes, down in the weeds a bit but we didn't stay there, shifting instead to the concept of sustainability and the necessity of a big volume of consistency; measuring progress in years, not merely weeks or months. Once the topic of physical training is exhausted we moved on to the psychological, to freeing himself of 'expectations of outcome' while never questioning the expectation of the effort he is willing to make ... and 'will I give all that I am willing to give? Not able but willing ...' What are we willing to give to achieve our objectives, and what do we hold in reserve to apply to other activities or relationships?We hit the offramp with an exchange about learning to be kind to oneself in the midst of the unfairness of the universe, "This is the lesson I was searching for: not more watts but more growth."It's a long and powerful conversation, and sometimes quite in a niche—not every moment will be for every listener—but the high points are universally applicable, and understandable to anyone who is paying attention to the long journey called life we are all taking.

Michael and Kegan sit down with Nate Pack to discuss this year's annual Space Race, which occurs on New Years Eve. Previous editions include a 24-hour Assault Bike challenge in teams of three (580 miles was the final 'winning' score), 12-hour Dante's Triathlon (ski, row, bike 50-40-30-20-10 calories repeated in teams fo 3 or 4 depending on total weight of the team), and a 6-hour 40/400 AMRAP (40 calories plus 400m run) done solo. Continuing to cut total time by 50% would obviously lead to a 3-hour event and no one saw the point in that — the goal must be challenging and difficult enough to cause change or adaptation if that is what one seeks. And the power of having a date or deadline for performance, and people to do it with should not be underestimated.Once the structure of this year's event was determined they delve into the psychological (and physical) limitations of truly hard effort, the challenges of different time domains, and how most people never actually work hard but believe they do. Nate also discusses his impressions of the Capacity manual and the eight-week progression proposed therein ... and how ‘simple’ is much harder to abide than we imagine. Within this context they cover the various interval structures and training styles that helped develop them into the athletes they are today.Finally, Michael declares, "You have to rewrite what your brain thinks is hard in order to do something harder ..." and drops the mic. 

Nahko is a singer/songwriter — a musician — who truly journeys between genres and manages to reinvent his style with each successive expression. He sits down with Michael and returning guest, Adam St. Simons in the middle of their North American tour to discuss the creative process, his humble beginnings of farm work, and how great trials are often opportunities to make great music. Nahko can be found here and his tour dates here.

Michael and Kegan discuss the general frustration with people who believe they are training Zone 2 but aren't. Aerobic foundation-building sessions that are programmed by the ignorant perpetuate the lack of results and such failure is masked by cheerleading. They bemoan the “influencer” propagation that simply being on a bike or exercise equipment is Z2, and also clarify that training endurance is not an afterthought or something that you get from by merely redescribing your shitty efforts as something more “official.” They discuss using proper (accurate) language to describe aerobic training sessions in the gym and the expectations associated with it; you're not trying to get it over with you are trying to extend it.The lessons from those who have accomplished much and continue to progress in their endurance usually come to this conclusion: It's not about the time but about what happens within the time, the quality of the work is important (in this case quality is about attention, not speed). If you want to get better then you need to make the time to get better.They conclude by remarking how gym culture is in contradistinction to building endurance (punish vs reward) and how sometimes the benefit from both is simply seeing the contrast in how each develops. 

Michael and Kegan reflect on the origin of the “Fitness is F*cked” theme, confirming that it was, and still is a criticism of an industry, how it has evolved from a position reserved for ranting, and how they can shift it to improve the industry without becoming a shill or charlatan. They also discuss the common practice of gyms adopting new and popular affiliations as opposed to making their own system based on effective practice. It matches the common fitness enthusiast’s habit of changing from one form of branded exercise to another as opposed to learning how they respond to different stimuli.

Mark and Michael sit down for a an old school rant that begins with Michael asking the very serious question, "Did government, Illuminati, secret society light up Burning Man with ebola so that they could off all of the people who might be able to make psychedelics legal?"Clearly, this is a very serious conversation, wherein we discuss camping, capitalism, bartering and freedom (as it relates to the presence and function of the tent city that pops up in front of the NonProphet Event Center with some regularity), accepting or abdicating responsibility, and the influence of drugs on self-appreciation and value. Michael describes the remarkable difference between 'associative' vs. disassociative behavior and that perhaps, in order to steer oneself towards better life experiences, towards a 'higher plane' so to speak, one must actively associate with reality instead of evading it, and open oneself to feeling and sensing and being aware, and that may begin with a basic premise of making different decisions regarding the food one consumes. Change on the most fundamental, dare I ay mundane, level can influence an entire cascade of different outcomes.In the moment of fulfillment, after a good and healthy meal that doesn't make you feel like shit, shared with a loved one, people feel satisfied, but society — as it is set up here — can't handle folks who are satisfied because they aren't seeking and they're not consuming and they're not indulging ... they are appreciating where they are, in the moment. That's a good thing for the species but not necessarily for the frenzied socio-economic system we find ourselves within ... because whosoever is satisfied won't fall for the advertising.And then we turned the focus to business and marketing and Michael helped me realize that continual growth of cells in the body is cancer but continual growth in business is expected and if it doesn't happen the business is considered a failure. Or at minimum unsuccessful.So how do businesses keep growing, keep increasing market share and brand awareness? Which leads to us addressing social engineering as a mechanism to turn profit on the back of predictable human behavior ... ugh, the manipulation is at an all time high while the resources, the open-to-buy of the potential customers, is rapidly declining. That said, money changes everything, and those who have it don't have to spend time or energy getting what they believe they want; they can change the outcome without actually changing their behavior. And that is very seductive ... but also a dead end.Finally, when it comes to marketing for NonProphet, we agree that we should be careful about putting the business name and logo on such cheap shit as might quickly end up in a landfill ... is that how we want to be remembered in the present and in the future? Yeah, picking through useless NonProphet tchotchkes at the dump ... that sounds good. So go ahead, acquire stuff, let it weigh you down, because carrying weight is good training, and this podcast is about fitness.