The Legendary Leaders Podcast

Are you the person everyone turns to because you'll "just handle it"? The one replying to emails at 11pm, rewriting your team's work, or silently resenting the people you keep rescuing? In this solo episode, Cathleen O'Sullivan tackles a behavior that's as exhausting as it is common: over-functioning in the name of being helpful.  Cathleen reveals why constant helpfulness isn't kindness—it's a control strategy that stifles growth, creates dependency, and keeps you small. She shares the story of a leader who was praised for being dependable but passed over for promotion because she wasn't seen as visionary, and unpacks why always being the fixer means you're losing time, energy, and strategic thinking space.  This punchy episode delivers four practical steps to shift from over-functioning to actual leadership: building awareness around guilt-driven yeses, replacing rescuing with coaching questions, using scripts that empower without abandoning, and practicing the useful discomfort of not jumping in. Your team doesn't need a hero. They need a leader. And you need your energy back.   Episode Timeline: 00:01:01 Why being helpful is actually a curse  00:01:44 "It's just quicker if I do it"—the trap of over-functioning  00:03:43 The exhausted leader who felt like a parent to her team  00:04:35 How helpfulness backfires: creating dependency, not ownership  00:05:59 The people pleaser passed over for promotion  00:06:45 Step 1: Build awareness—am I doing work that's not mine?  00:08:19 Step 2: Replace rescuing with coaching questions  00:10:09 Step 3: The script for letting go without guilt  00:12:00 Step 4: Practice useful discomfort—let them struggle and grow  00:14:08 The truth: over-helpfulness is a control strategy in disguise  00:14:42 Your challenge: find one moment this week and don't jump in   Key Takeaway: Step 1: Build Awareness—Notice When You're Over-Functioning Am I doing work that's not mine? Saying yes out of guilt? Secretly resentful? One leader kept rewriting her team's decks—not for quality, but out of fear of being judged. Keep asking "why" until you hit the root cause.  Step 2: Replace Rescuing with Coaching Questions Don't jump into fix-it mode. Ask: "What have you tried? Where did you get stuck? What do you think could work?" Put ownership back in their hands. Let them think first—then see where they really get stuck.  Step 3: Use a Script for Letting Go Without Guilt Try this: "I trust you to run with this. If you hit a wall, I'm here, but I know you've got this." Leadership isn't about perfection—it's about empowerment and growing together.  Step 4: Practice Useful Discomfort—Let Them Struggle Wait 24 hours before replying. Let someone struggle without stepping in—they'll figure it out. Ask yourself: Am I fixing this to help, or to feel needed? Growth is messy. If you never let them wobble, they'll never walk on their own.   Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/    FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS

What makes a complete stranger walk up to you on a bus and say, "I'm really having a hard time today"? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, host Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with Darryl Stickel—trust researcher, founder of Trust Unlimited, and author of Building Trust—whose life's work reveals that connection isn't magic. It's a skill you can learn, practice, and pull off even when everything feels like it's falling apart.    Darryl shares why trust isn't just about certainty—it's about being willing to get hurt. He breaks down the formula, explains why leaders who admit they're not perfect inspire fierce loyalty, and walks through the exact steps he used to help warring union reps and board executives shake hands after five years in court. With disarming honesty, he opens up about surviving multiple concussions, navigating life as a legally blind leader, and discovering that accepting help isn't weakness—it's a gift you give other people.    Together, Cathleen and Darryl explore what it means to lead without pretending, why "share, don't scare" transforms relationships, and how pulling three specific levers can rebuild trust faster than you think. This conversation is for anyone who's tired of surface-level connections and ready to do the uncomfortable work that actually brings people closer.     Episode Timeline:   00:02:38 Why vulnerability is the part of trust everyone ignores  00:05:02 The trust equation: uncertainty × vulnerability = perceived risk  00:09:51 When not to be vulnerable: protecting yourself while staying open 00:15:54 Three levers every leader needs: benevolence, integrity, ability  00:26:35 Men, mental health, and the Aspirational Men's Program  00:30:53 Internal vs. external locus of control: what you actually control  00:39:43 The benevolence conversation: "What does success look like for you?"  00:50:41 Five years in court: how he got unions and executives talking again  00:57:48 "I feel uncertainty" vs. "I don't trust you": the language that neutralizes conflict  01:08:56 The one small step: start with a dose of vulnerability  01:14:09 The father who went from "they're scared of me" to "they fight over who sits next to me"  01:18:12 Hockey, concussions, and finding purpose in the wreckage     Key Takeaway:   Trust = Uncertainty × Vulnerability, and Both Are at All-Time Highs: Trust isn't just about predicting someone's behavior—it's about being willing to be hurt when you can't know for sure what they'll do. In deep relationships, uncertainty shrinks and vulnerability expands. But right now, with uncertainty spiking everywhere, even small asks for vulnerability feel like jumping off a cliff.  Refusing Help Is Selfish—You're Robbing People of Joy: Darryl told a room of executives: "You just shared how powerful it is to help someone. Now explain why you're so effing selfish—you never let anyone have that experience with you." When you never admit you need help or show vulnerability, you steal the gift of contribution from others. Even the struggling woman panhandling on the street felt meaning when she could help the blind guy cross.  Change the Story, Change Everything: Darryl's son wanted a baseball scholarship, so Darryl "nagged" him about eating well, practicing, studying, being a good teammate. But because they'd defined success together first, his son heard every nudge as "Dad has my back" instead of criticism. We interpret the world through stories—if you don't actively shape the narrative, 20 different versions will spread, and most won't work in your favor.  Start With One Small Dose of Vulnerability: Don't open the kimono. Don't pretend you're clueless. Just admit you made a mistake in the past, probably will in the future, or need someone's expertise on something. Leaders reach positions because of technical skill—that skill atrophies the moment you sit behind a desk. Tell people: "You're the expert now. I'm going to need your help." That small crack opens everything.     About Darryl Stickel:   Darryl Stickel is founder of Trust Unlimited and author of Building Trust: Exceptional Leadership in an Uncertain World. He holds a PhD from Duke University, where his doctoral thesis on building trust in hostile environments was so groundbreaking his advisors admitted he'd solved what they thought was impossible. After consulting at McKinsey & Company, Darryl founded Trust Unlimited in 2001 and has since worked with unions, military units, Fortune 500 companies, and nonprofits worldwide—from helping the Canadian military build trust with locals in Afghanistan to reuniting fathers with sons who'd given up hope. Legally blind and navigating the world with his guide dog Drake, Darryl teaches that vulnerability isn't weakness—it's the foundation of everything that matters.      Connect with Darryl Stickel: LinkedIn: ca.linkedin.com/in/darryl-stickel-phd  Website: https://www.trustunlimited.com/  Book: https://www.trustunlimited.com/book/  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/people/Trust-Unlimited-Inc/61563450129818/ Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/darrylstickel  YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/@DarrylStickel_BuildingTrust Podcast: https://imperfectcafe.buzzsprout.com/      Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/      FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS  

What does it take to lead with both purpose and perseverance? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, host Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with Kate Grant—CEO of the Fistula Foundation and author of No Woman Left Behind—whose remarkable journey from Madison Avenue to global health leadership reveals what can happen when compassion meets conviction.    Kate shares how walking away from a thriving advertising career became the first step toward transforming the lives of more than 100,000 women suffering from obstetric fistula—a preventable childbirth injury that still affects over a million women in the world's most underserved regions. With honesty and humility, she opens up about redefining success, the courage it takes to stay focused on one mission, and how saying "no" to good ideas is often the price of real impact. Cathleen O'Sullivan (Merkel)   Together, Cathleen and Kate explore the intersection of leadership, purpose, and humanity—what it means to build something that lasts, lead with heart, and never look away from the people and problems that need us most. This conversation is for anyone who believes leadership is less about power and more about the lives we choose to touch.     Episode Timeline:   00:03:34 What is obstetric fistula and why it still exists  00:07:39 The devastating social cost: ostracism, shame, and isolation  00:16:21 A survivor's story: 30 years of suffering and the gift of a chicken  00:28:30 Building a global network: from one hospital to 35 countries  00:33:12 The fundraising approach: efficiency, focus, and saying no  00:38:25 Ensuring quality: working with expert surgeons and measuring outcomes  00:47:15 Leaving Madison Avenue: when success isn't enough  00:53:05 The earthquake and breakup that cracked everything open  01:03:11 Redefining success: career, motherhood, and the myth of having it all  01:10:00 What's next: stepping down and training as a therapist  01:19:16 Final wisdom: listen to your inner voice and own your choices     Key Takeaway:   A Hidden Crisis with a Solution: Obstetric fistula—a childbirth injury from obstructed labor—affects at least one million women in Africa and Asia, leaving them incontinent and ostracized. Yet 90% of cases are fixable with surgery, making this needless suffering Kate refuses to accept. Relentless Focus Drives Impact: The Fistula Foundation does one thing exceptionally well—funding surgeries—and has helped over 100,000 women by resisting mission creep, measuring outcomes rigorously, and treating the nonprofit like a results-driven business. Listen to Your Inner Voice: Kate left a successful advertising career after travel exposed her to global poverty and an earthquake cracked her life open—proving that transformation requires quieting external voices and giving your own inner compass a microphone. Empowerment Through Accountability: When problems arise, assume you created them—not to blame yourself, but to empower yourself to learn and fix what's broken rather than playing victim to circumstances or other people. You Can't Have It All at Once: Success means making intentional choices about where to invest finite energy—Kate chose her son and the foundation over remarriage, showing that owning your trade-offs without apology is more honest than pretending you can do everything equally well.     About Kate Grant:   Kate Grant is a global health and social-impact leader with over 25 years of experience advancing maternal health and women's rights worldwide. As President & CEO of Fistula Foundation, she has expanded access to life-changing surgeries for thousands of women across Africa and Asia while building high-performing teams and partnerships with governments and NGOs. She is also the author of No Woman Left Behind – A Journey of Hope to Heal Every Woman Injured in Childbirth, a memoir highlighting her journey from a corporate career to leading a global health movement. Known for her equity-focused, collaborative leadership, Kate's mission is to ensure every woman has the opportunity to live a healthy, dignified life.     Connect with Kate Grant: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kate-grant-92110561/  Website: https://fistulafoundation.org/  No Woman Left Behind (Book): https://fistulafoundation.org/no-woman-left-behind/      Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/      FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS  

What does it really mean to design your own destiny? In this episode of Legendary Leaders Podcast, host Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with Donzel Leggett—former Fortune 200 executive, author of Make Your Destiny Happen, and founder of Destiny Development Delta whose career has spanned three decades of transformational global leadership.  From his Key West roots to the pivotal moment he walked away from professional football, Donzel shares how he turned missed opportunities and painful kicks in the butt into clarity about his calling. With warmth and honesty, he opens up about the weight of expectations, the courage to challenge them, and how a life plan created at 24 has guided everything since—including losing 90 pounds in four months and bouncing back from a million-dollar business failure that shaped his next chapter.  Together, Cathleen and Donzel explore the difference between change and transformation, why spending time with yourself is the most radical act of leadership, and how his Destiny Development Delta model helps people stop leaving life to chance. This conversation is for anyone ready to lead themselves with intention, passion, and purpose.   Episode Timeline: 04:49 Growing up in Key West: lessons in diversity and strong women leaders  07:41 College football and missed opportunities to lead teammates  10:12 Creating a life plan at 24—and what destiny really means  15:11 Challenging expectations: when others' dreams don't match your own  23:34 Walking away from professional football and the emotional fallout  30:36 Three pivotal moments: football, fatherhood, and finding his calling  36:14 Recognizing your calling: the feeling you can't ignore  40:45 Why 90% of people can't answer where they want to be in 10 years  47:06 First steps to self-leadership—even when life feels overwhelming  52:19 Getting back on track: losing 90 pounds and finding balance  55:44 The restaurant that failed—and the million-dollar MBA  01:01:20 The Destiny Development Delta model: A-Attitudes and iLead Change  01:04:23 Change vs. transformation: chameleon or butterfly?  01:09:05 Transformation as an iterative journey through life's shifts  01:13:32 What's next: spreading hope around the world   Key Takeaway: Creating Your Own Destiny: Donzel challenges the idea that destiny is predetermined—it's something you design by getting clear on what you want, building a life plan, and taking sustained action.  Leading Yourself First: Leadership isn't about titles or hierarchy—it's about taking charge of your own life, whether you're an executive, a barber, or a stay-at-home parent.  Transformation vs. Change: Real transformation means becoming something different (like a caterpillar to butterfly), not just making adjustments—and it starts with spending time with yourself to uncover what you truly want.  The Power of a Life Plan: Donzel created his life plan at 24 and has followed it for over 30 years, showing how vision plus intentional action creates both success and fulfillment.  Learning from Failure: From walking away from football to losing a million dollars on a restaurant, Donzel shows how reframing failure as learning and taking accountability fuels growth and resilience.   About Donzel Leggett: Donzel Leggett is a global operations and leadership executive with over 30 years of experience leading large-scale teams and operations in consumer products companies, including a 28-year tenure at General Mills. He is the Principal and Founder of Destiny Development Delta, LLC, where he coaches executives and teams to unlock their full potential and build inclusive, high-performing cultures. He is the author of Make Your Destiny Happen, a transformational framework for designing and living a purposeful life. Known for driving exceptional results while uplifting people, his leadership approach centers on authenticity, accountability, and helping others take charge of their destinies. Donzel's mission is to inspire people globally to transform their leadership, envision their future, and take sustained action to make it reality.   Connect with Donzel Leggett: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/donzelleggett/  Facebook (Donzel Leggett): https://www.facebook.com/donzel.leggett.9/ Facebook (Destiny Dev Delta): https://www.facebook.com/destinydevdelta Instagram (Donzel Leggett) https://www.instagram.com/donzel_leggett/ Linktree: https://li nktr.ee/destinydevdelta YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DonzelLeggett Make Your Destiny Happen Petite Podcast: https://feeds.captivate.fm/make-your-destiny-happen/ Website: https://destinydevdelta.com/ Make Your Destiny Happen Book: https://www.makeyourdestinyhappen.com    Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/    FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.

What does it really mean to bring your authentic self to leadership? In this episode of Legendary Leaders Podcast, host Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with Lenya McGrath—global brand strategist, creative leader, and award-winning marketer whose career has shaped some of the world's most iconic brands.    From her early days in Sydney's ad world to leading high-performing teams across continents, Lenya shares how she turned "too happy" feedback into her leadership superpower. With warmth and humility, she opens up about authenticity in the workplace, building psychological safety in creative teams, and how her personal compass guides her through change—from navigating anxiety during the pandemic to saying bold yeses (and firmer no's) in life and career.    Together, Cathleen and Lenya explore what it means to lead with heart, why self-awareness is the ultimate growth tool, and how small acts of courage can make people, brands, and businesses truly fly.     Episode Timeline:   01:03 Meet Lenya McGrath: a creative leader who makes people feel seen 03:20 Early lessons in creative partnership and leading with kindness 11:14 Why optimism is a superpower and how it builds psychological safety 21:13 Motherhood and mentoring: raising confident, self-aware daughters 24:33 Authenticity vs. oversharing—bringing your real self to work 26:44 How masking drains energy and connection 31:59 Reconnecting with your internal compass and values 33:13 Navigating anxiety during the pandemic and finding purpose 36:52 Lenya's five-step approach to move from problem to solution 40:46 Boundaries and values—knowing when to say no 45:12 Falling in love with creativity: from visual merchandising to ad agencies 48:57 How to tell if a company aligns with your purpose 50:29 Reflection and release: check-ins, "letters to self," and letting go 56:28 Saying yes to new adventures—and being firm with your no's 58:40 Why saying no can feel harder for women 01:02:34 Lenya's top two pieces of advice for aspiring creatives     Key Takeaway:   Authenticity as Leadership: Lenya shares how embracing her true, optimistic self—once labeled "too happy"—became her greatest leadership strength. Psychological Safety Through Positivity: She shows how lightness and empathy foster trust, creativity, and deeper collaboration. Purpose as a Compass: Whether leading teams or raising daughters, Lenya's guiding goal is to help people, brands, and businesses fly. Reflection and Renewal: Her weekly check-ins and "letters to self" reveal how intentional reflection fuels growth and resilience. Boundaries and Bravery: From saying yes to new adventures to confidently saying no, Lenya explores how alignment sustains authenticity.     About Lenya McGrath:   Lenya McGrath is a global brand and marketing leader with 15+ years of experience helping consumer brands stand out and scale. Her career spans agency and in-house roles, working with notable brands such as Amazon, PlayStation, Canon, Wilson Sporting Co., Herman Miller, and P&G (Olay). Known for her "market-shaper" mindset, Lenya blends brand strategy, integrated marketing, and leadership to help organizations embed authentic differentiation into their culture, behaviour, and business strategy. With a reputation for positivity, collaboration, and driving commercial results, her work has been recognised across creative and brand awards. Passionate about growth, creativity, and human-centred leadership, Lenya continues to inspire leaders to bring their whole selves to work, build purpose-driven brands, and drive meaningful impact.     Connect with Lenya McGrath: Website: https://www.lenyamcgrath.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lenyamcgrath/      Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/      FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS

What if productivity isn't about doing more—but doing less, with purpose? In this solo episode of The Legendary Leaders Podcast, host Cathleen O'Sullivan challenges one of leadership's biggest myths: that constant hustle equals success.    Drawing from her own journey and stories from the leaders she's coached, Cathleen exposes the "productivity lie" that glorifies busyness and burnout. She reveals why intentionality—not intensity—is what truly sets great leaders apart, and how creating space to think, rest, and reflect can actually amplify your impact.    From practical tools like the "stop doing list" and the one-minute pause, to mindset shifts that turn overwhelm into clarity, this episode is a masterclass in reclaiming your energy and leading with purpose. It's your permission slip to slow down, focus, and lead on your terms.     Episode Timeline:   00:00 Introduction and welcome back to The Legendary Leaders Podcast 00:45 The productivity myth: being busy means you're a better leader 01:59 The cultural addiction to busyness and confusing motion with progress 03:24 Why great leaders are intentional—not overworked 06:57 Client stories: breaking the busy habit and rediscovering focus 08:22 Practical tools to break the busy cycle 13:19 Delegating with purpose and empowering your team to grow 14:47 Escaping the busy trap and retraining others' expectations 15:33 Redefining productivity: protecting your energy like gold 16:01 Weekly challenge: cancel one non-essential meeting and make space to think 16:35 Closing reflections and invitation to lead on your terms     Key Takeaway:   The Productivity Lie: Cathleen challenges the belief that great leadership means doing more, showing how intentional focus creates greater impact than endless activity. Redefining Worth: Your value isn't measured by hours worked or meetings attended—true leadership is about clarity, direction, and energy. Breaking the Busy Cycle: Tools like the "stop doing" list, one-minute pause, and weekly calendar audit help leaders reclaim time for what truly matters. Delegation with Purpose: Letting go isn't about dumping tasks—it's about growing others, building trust, and creating space to lead strategically. Modeling Healthy Leadership: By slowing down, setting boundaries, and protecting your energy, you model balance and focus for your team. Lead with Intention: Doing less isn't laziness—it's leadership with purpose, giving you and your team room to think, create, and thrive.       Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/      FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS  

What does it really mean to do more good—and how can empathy spark genuine impact in our everyday lives? In this heartfelt episode of The Legendary Leaders Podcast, Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with Neil Ghosh, social impact strategist, entrepreneur, and bestselling author of Do More Good, a book featuring voices from global icons like the Dalai Lama and Bill Clinton to everyday changemakers making a difference in their own communities. With over three decades of experience across 50+ countries and sectors, Neil has devoted his career to one question: How can we do more good together? From his childhood lessons in empathy growing up in Calcutta to his work uniting governments, businesses, and nonprofits, Neil reveals how compassion, courage, and curiosity can transform both our lives and the world around us. Together, Cathleen and Neil explore the framework behind his philosophy: GEMSS (Get Involved, Empower Others, Micro-Philanthropy, Show Up, Start Small) and why doing good doesn't always require money or grand gestures. They also discuss the importance of listening to empathy's whisper amid life's noise, leading with authenticity, raising the next generation with kindness, and finding purpose through action. This is a moving conversation about humanity, leadership, and how one small act of good can multiply far beyond what we imagine.   Episode Timeline: 00:00 Welcome & introduction: redefining what it means to "do more good" 01:21 Meet Neil Ghosh: author, strategist, and global changemaker 03:45 Growing up in Calcutta: limited resources, unlimited empathy 06:31 The roots of Do More Good: stories that spark hope and courage 09:19 From awareness to action: turning empathy into engagement 11:23 The GEMSS framework for everyday impact 13:52 Moving from reactive to proactive living 17:07 The power of quiet: retreats, recharge, and self-empathy 19:30 Parenting and passing on empathy to the next generation 25:15 Leadership through compassion—even after personal challenges 29:28 Career pivots: from private sector to purpose-driven impact 34:11 When purpose calls louder than comfort 37:49 Authenticity, reinvention, and living a values-led life 42:00 Why helping others might just be the secret to happiness 46:32 The multiplier effect of kindness in communities 50:20 Lessons in empathy from neighbors, colleagues, and everyday life 55:40 Leading with empathy in organizations and business 57:00 The leaders who inspire Neil—and what true empathy looks like 01:05:25 Speaking up with courage (and when silence serves the mission) 01:12:01 Channeling anger into purpose: uniting through empathy 01:14:25 Final reflections: start small, stay consistent, and listen to empathy's whisper     Key Takeaways: Doing good doesn't require wealth or influence—just intention. Begin with one act of kindness and let it ripple. Far from being "soft," empathy is a strategic power for resilience, leadership, and unity. GEMSS Framework: Get involved, empower others, practice micro-philanthropy, show up, and start small. Tune out the noise of division and distraction to hear empathy's quiet call to action. Whether in parenting or leadership, people learn more from what we do than what we say. Growth is about becoming a better version of yourself—again and again.   About Neil Ghosh: Neil Ghosh is a social impact strategist, entrepreneur, and author dedicated to amplifying empathy as a force for good. His book Do More Good—featuring stories from the Dalai Lama, Kevin Bacon, and everyday heroes—has become a #1 Amazon bestseller, inspiring individuals and organizations to lead with compassion. Over his 30-year career spanning 50 countries, Neil has worked across government, corporate, and nonprofit sectors, building bridges through purpose-driven initiatives. Today, he continues to mentor leaders, ignite conversations on empathy, and empower others to turn intention into impact. Connect with Neil Ghosh: Website: www.neilghosh.orgBook: Do More Good – Available on Amazon Book trailer - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD0RtNTBb7U LinkedIn: Neil Ghosh Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/neilghoshauthor/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61575673626643 Bsky: https://bsky.app/profile/neilghoshauthor.bsky.social Resources Mentioned: Listen First Project: https://listenfirstproject.org Braver Angels: https://braverangels.orgFive Calls App: https://5calls.org Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/      FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS

What can honeybees teach us about leadership, focus, and living with intention? In this episode of The Legendary Leaders Podcast, host Cathleen O'Sullivan welcomes back Jones Loflin—speaker, coach, educator, and co-author of Focused as a Bee.  Drawing from his beekeeping journey with his daughter Sydney, Jones reveals how small shifts in focus can create big changes in how we lead and live. Their book is both a practical guide and a heartfelt tribute to Sydney's late best friend Alicia, reminding us that life is too short to glorify busyness.  Jones opens up about co-authoring with his daughter, navigating generational differences, and why giving ourselves "permission" may be the secret to better leadership. From consistency to the courage to be unavailable, this conversation offers golden insights—and plenty of laughs—to help you move from busy to truly focused.   Episode Timeline: 00:00 Introduction and welcome back to Jones Loflin  01:11 From busyness to focus: why activity isn't enough  03:34 Beekeeping beginnings and inspiration for Focused as a Bee  05:32 Honoring Sydney's best friend Alicia through storytelling  08:11 Three core goals of the book: focus, friendship, and tribute  11:07 Co-authoring with Sydney: lessons from generational differences  18:13 What bees teach us about teamwork, service, and focus  23:39 Progress moments: first honey harvests and surviving winter  25:30 Striking out "busy" and choosing focus with intention  28:39 What a focused day feels like: peace, accomplishment, and energy  31:09 Young professionals, multitasking, and the search for meaning  35:32 Permission to recharge and why leaders need downtime  39:35 Permission to be unavailable: setting boundaries and managing distractions  48:06 Practical first steps to build focus and giving yourself permission  54:39 Why it's hard to prioritize ourselves—and how to reframe it  01:00:30 The power of consistency: small actions with lasting impact     Key Takeaway: Focus Over Busyness: Jones explains why activity alone isn't enough, and how shifting from "busy" to "focused" leads to more meaningful progress.  Permission to Lead Differently: From recharging to being unavailable, Jones shares how giving yourself permission creates space for better leadership and wellbeing.  Consistency Counts: Drawing inspiration from honeybees, Jones shows how small, steady actions can build lasting results in work and life.  Generational Lessons: Co-authoring with his daughter Sydney revealed the power of bridging perspectives—and how younger leaders approach focus, priorities, and purpose differently.  Lessons from the Hive: Honeybees model clarity, teamwork, and service to the greater good—principles leaders can adopt in their own organizations.   About Jones Loflin: Jones Loflin is a dynamic speaker, coach, and educator with over three decades of experience helping people cut through the chaos and focus on what truly matters. His career has spanned keynote stages, corporate training, and leadership coaching, where he equips individuals and organizations with practical tools to thrive. An accomplished author, Jones has written several books including Juggling Elephants, Always Growing, and most recently Focused as a Bee, co-authored with his daughter Sydney. Blending humor, storytelling, and insights, his work inspires leaders to move beyond busyness, embrace clarity, and create meaningful impact. Passionate about growth and connection, Jones continues to guide leaders around the world to simplify their lives, strengthen their teams, and lead with focus and intention.   Connect with Jones Loflin: Business: https://jonesloflin.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonesloflin  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/jonesloflin  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLH4LXwQIBMcaI0BfBLuVKK4itb3KAKvzN Resources/s Mentioned: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jonesloflin_focusedasabee-worklife-activity-7343616539427762176-ttXg  Book: Focused as a Bee - https://jonesloflin.com/faab Book: A Minute To Think - https://www.amazon.com/Minute-Think-Reclaim-Creativity-Busyness/dp/0062970259  Book: Likeable Badass - https://www.amazon.com/Likeable-Badass-Women-Success-Deserve/dp/0385549148    Connect with Cathleen O'Sullivan:  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-osullivan/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/    FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS

Get ready for an inspiring conversation with our host Cathleen O'Sullivan  and Laura Venezia, an educational leader whose passion for nurturing others has taken her across the U.S., China, Hong Kong, and now Germany. In this episode of Legendary Leaders, Laura reflects on her early love of teaching, the challenges and lessons of working internationally, and how her commitment to kindness and inclusion continues to guide her as a leader. She shares practical advice on balancing technology with real connection, building collaborative relationships, and embracing those everyday moments that can have a lasting impact. Laura also talks about her shift from teacher to leader, learning to let go of needing approval, and the importance of staying true to your values when leading yourself and others.   Episode Timeline: 00:00 Introduction 08:11 Discovering passion in early education 15:48 Building a unique identity within a multicultural school setting 17:38 Spontaneous move to China, culture shock in education, and risks of individual learning over collaboration 26:02 Using tech wisely while embracing curiosity and unscripted teachable moments 32:15 Making space for curiosity and role modeling openness 37:33 Transition through COVID, values-driven community in Germany, and leadership journey 42:11 Leadership as guiding others, building trust, and creating safe spaces 45:43 Finding alignment through support, self-reflection, and feedback 52:34 Growth through uncertainty, shifting from classroom teacher to school-wide leader 55:41 Embracing authenticity and letting go of control 59:47 Asking better questions, listening deeply, and creating presence in family life   Key Takeaway: Purpose Over Performance: Laura highlights that leadership in education and beyond is about nurturing kind and authentic people, not just chasing results. Role Modelling and Connection: Laura explains why our behaviour as leaders matters most, from how we manage emotions to how we build relationships. Knowing Yourself: Laura and Cathleen talk about the importance of understanding your own values and letting go of the need for approval in order to grow as a leader.   About Laura Vinezia: Laura is an experienced educational leader with over 20 years experience in early childhood education. Her career has taken her across the globe, with impactful roles in schools in the United States, China, Hong Kong, and now Germany, where she continues to inspire and lead. Passionate about the foundational years of learning, Laura is deeply committed to nurturing young minds and hearts. Her work is guided by a clear and meaningful purpose: to help "make good people." Through her leadership, she strives to create inclusive, thoughtful, and compassionate learning environments that support the growth of both children and educators.   Connect with Laura: Business: lis.school LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laura-venezia X/Twitter: @LauraVCole   Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/ Youtube:   FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS Connect: 
 Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan Business: www.cathleenmerkel.com     Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com   LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel-2b0991151   Instagram: www.instagram.com/cathleenmerkel Twitter: twitter.com/CathleenMerkel7   SUBSCRIBE TO THIS PODCAST ON APPLE PODCASTS.  

Do you ever feel like you're chasing status, promotions, or recognition only to arrive and still feel unfulfilled? What if leadership wasn't about control, but about creative direction and truly designing a life and career that excites you?   In this inspiring episode of Legendary Leaders, host Cathleen sits down with Vincent Wanga, dynamic design thought leader, brand strategist, creative executive, and author of The Art of Direction. Vincent's story bridges cultures and continents: from a Kenyan childhood, to hustling through setbacks in America, to helping build a billion-dollar tech unicorn. Along the way, he's developed a philosophy of relentless adaptability, creative courage, and leadership that unlocks the best in others.   If you're craving more meaning, momentum, or creativity in your leadership journey, this episode will energise you to rethink what's possible.   Episode Timeline:   00:00 Introduction: Reframing creativity   02:45 Why chasing titles leaves us empty   07:02 From adversity to agency  13:04 Immigrant perspective: adaptability, onlyness and resilience   19:43 Building skills across industries & the power of pivoting   22:23 Embracing (and loving) imposter syndrome   33:47 Really listening and redefining expertise 41:28 The humility of leadership: paying yourself last   49:56 Nurturing leadership in teams and creating safe cultures   1:07:07 Vincent's leap into tech, loss, and building billion-dollar unicorns   1:13:43 Making adversity your rocket fuel (and what's next for Vincent)     Key Takeaways: Leadership is not about titles or control, but about creative direction and meaningful impact. Your darkest failures and detours are the rocket fuel for reinvention. If you want clients, teams, or work that truly excites you. Be both your boldest advocate and your most humble student.   About Vincent Wanga: Vincent Wanga is a dynamic international design thought leader, creative keynote speaker, award-winning creative and executive, author of The Art of Direction, serial entrepreneur, and experienced brand consultant with an exceptional range of expertise over a distinguished two-decade career.   Connect with Vincent: Website: https://www.vincentwanga.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vincent-wanga Book:https://www.amazon.com/Art-Direction-Personal-Perspectives-Leadership/dp/B0DWR3911D Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS

Have you ever wondered why, no matter how big your ideas or how talented your team, you keep running into the same old obstacles at work? Today, in Legendary Leaders, Cathleen O'Sullivan, is talking to Doug Hall,  renowned innovation expert, founder of Eureka Ranch and Brain Brew Distillery, and author of  Proactive Problem Solving. Doug is on a mission to help leaders everywhere "stop the stupid" and restore real joy and creativity to the workplace.   If you're tired of endless meetings, redundant tasks, and systems that just don't make sense, get ready. This episode is packed with real-world examples, practical strategies you can apply today, and leadership insights you won't find anywhere else. Episode Timeline: 00:00  The "Stop the Stupid" mission with Doug Hall 02:19  Leadership's silent killer, and the surprising truth about wasted time 08:49 Doug's journey; real-life stories of broken systems and how tiny changes spark massive engagement 11:08 Enable employees to proactively solve problems 18:13 Focus on fundamental processes and effective communication 25:29  Getting leaders onboard  36:09 Saving 3.5 hours a day stopping the stupid 47:33 Collaborative problem-solving breakthrough 01:03:56 Unclear strategic direction issues 01:19:33 Embrace authentic innovation Key Takeaways: "Stop the stupid" is a powerful lens: Most wasted time and disengagement in companies come from outdated or broken systems Managers waste 3.5 hours a day on avoidable problems caused by dysfunctional processes and unclear communication. Proactive problem-solving is a skill not an accident: Doug outlines a three-step system that can increase your team's effectiveness by up to 500%.   About Doug Hall Doug Hall is an innovation expert, founder of Eureka Ranch and Brain Brew Distillery, and the author of the book Proactive Problem Solving. With nearly 50 years of experience in leadership, innovation, and entrepreneurship, Doug's passion centers on helping organizations "stop the stupid"—his signature phrase for eliminating outdated systems that destroy productivity and creativity at work. Renowned for his energetic and practical approach, Doug translates complex innovation strategies into simple, actionable steps. He has worked with some of the world's largest companies, like Nike and Disney, and brings to the table real-world stories from both consulting and running his own rapidly-scaling bourbon business. Doug's mission is to empower leaders at all levels to create smarter, more engaging workplaces by tackling broken systems head-on and igniting the problem-solving power within their teams.   Connect with Doug:  Website: www.doughall.com Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS  

Have you ever found yourself stuck in the cycle of trying to be the "perfect" leader (always switched on, always in control) only to end up burned out and disconnected? In this solo episode of Legendary Leaders, Cathleen O'Sullivan shares what happened when she finally let go of performing leadership and started showing up as herself.   From moments of self-doubt to the awkward reality of what she calls being a "cow at work," Cathleen opens up about the pressures we put on ourselves to look like we've got it all together. She talks honestly about the impact it had on her well-being, her team, and her work and what changed when she chose presence over perfection. If you're feeling the weight of doing it all, or just wondering if there's a more human way to lead, this episode is for you. Episode Timeline: 00:00 Introduction 04:59 Leadership thrives in authenticity; burnout taught me to lead from presence, not performance. 09:15 I wanted to lead as me with flaws, feelings, tired days and all.  13:06 You can't lead well in survival mode 14:45 The power of saying "I'm not quite on today" 16:55 Rethink feedback and self-leadership Key Takeaways: Authenticity over perfection: Cathleen talks honestly about moving from trying to lead perfectly to simply showing up as herself. Letting go of the pressure to always have it together helped her build real trust with others even on the messy days Burnout changed everything: Working non-stop to meet impossible standards left Cathleen burnt out and disconnected. That low point pushed her to slow down, get honest with herself, and start leading with more care and clarity The SPACE method makes it practical: Cathleen shares a simple five-part tool to lead with more presence, not performance. Connect:   Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS

What does it really mean to lead with authenticity and move from "I" to "We" in today's ever-evolving workplace? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, host Cathleen O'Sullivan is joined for a second time by Kyle McDowell, bestselling author of Begin With We, speaker, leadership coach, and former Fortune 10 executive. They talk about what's changed since his book came out, how toxic cultures take hold, and why leading with principle matters more than ever. Episode Timeline:  1:38 Kyle's mission: moving from "I" to "We" in leadership  03:13 Cathleen invites listeners to reflect on their own leadership style and authenticity. 08:38 Kyle opens up about his long-standing experience with imposter syndrome. 12:16 The fine line between confidence and cockiness 15:31 Kyle shares his anti "fake it till you make it" stance  18:26 The continued growth of Kyle's book, Begin With We, and teases a second book. 23:03 The value of clear, jargon-free communication in leadership  26:24 How empathy and practical advice guide Kyle's evolution as a leader. 39:09 The challenges and impact of growing polarisation and toxicity in workplaces. 01:06:46 Kyle names his struggle with obsessing over details and how he balances strengths and weaknesses.   Key Takeaways: Real Leadership Starts with Principles: Kyle and Cathleen talk about what it really means to lead with values. For Kyle, it's about shifting from "I" to "we" and living out a set of clear, practical principles. Toxic Cultures Can't Always Be Fixed: They unpack what toxicity can look like, from one bad boss to a whole system. Kyle shares why it's important to know when you can create change and when it's time to walk away.  Doubt Happens, lead anyway: Both Cathleen and Kyle open up about imposter syndrome and how it shows up, even years into their careers. Kyle explains how he uses self-doubt as a check-in rather than a barrier.    About Kyle McDowell: Former Fortune 10 Executive turned inspirational speaker, bestselling author and leadership coach Kyle McDowell is on a quest to create cultures of excellence and reignite leaders' passion and purpose. With nearly three decades of experience leading tens of thousands of employees at some of America's biggest firms, McDowell's philosophy is rooted in his trademarked principles, The 10 WEs. While today's workforce is plagued with uncertainty and apathy, his strategy is simple - Begin With WE. McDowell's mission is clear: crush the deep-rooted dysfunctions so many organizations passively accept. During his incredibly successful run in corporate America, McDowell's leadership legacy was born from delivering superior results, empowering leaders, and driving massive cultural transformations. His Wall Street Journal and USA Today bestseller, Begin With WE, delves into the root causes of business dysfunction, offering a remedy through The 10 WEs framework. Rather than outsourcing solutions or ignoring cultural challenges, McDowell elevates leaders and sparks massive change within organizations by adopting a mindset that prioritizes "WE" over "I," "you," or "me." McDowell's insights have earned him invitations to speak at prestigious business, educational, and nonprofit institutions, and his expertise has been featured in major national publications, including The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, and Inc. Magazine. Connect with Kyle: Instagram: www.instagram.com/kylemcdowellinc/ TikTok :www.tiktok.com/@kylemcdowellinc YoutTube: www.youtube.com/@kylemcdowellinc Facebook: www.facebook.com/KyleMcDowellInc X: x.com/KyleMcDowellInc LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/kylemcdowellinc Website: www.kylemcdowellinc.com Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.

Get ready for a thoughtful and down-to-earth conversation with our host, Cathleen O'Sullivan and guest is Michael Frantl, Global Lead for Culture, Engagement, and Performance Solutions at Novo Nordisk about what really shapes strong leadership and why culture matters more than ever. With a career that's taken him across the US, UK, and Scandinavia, Michael shares his real-world experience of building workplace cultures that go beyond posters and buzzwords.   Together, they talk about leading with trust, creating space for belonging, and the small, everyday actions that bring values to life. Michael also reflects on the role of optimism, why control doesn't build connection, and how to make culture feel genuine wherever you work. If you're building a team, leading change, or just trying to show up more intentionally, this episode is for you.   Episode Timeline:  00:00 Introduction 04:36 Life since we last met: moves, parenthood, and big shifts 06:03 Taking the leap, moving to Denmark and starting fresh 10:50 Balancing positivity and reality in leadership 14:09 From rush to reflection: Building quiet moments Into busy days 19:48 Lessons from the family construction business 30:58 Listening to understand: what philosophy taught me about dialogue 39:09 Building workplaces that support people and results 52:06 The power of focus and consistency in culture work 01:03:26 Practical steps for organizations tobBring values to life Key Takeaways: Culture is about what you do every day: Michael and Cathleen stress that company culture isn't just about posters or slogans. It's about how people act and interact every day.    Positivity Matters, but keep it real: Michael talks about finding joy in small moments and connecting with others, but also warns against ignoring challenges.  Leading with intention and space: Move away from micromanaging to truly supporting people. Listening, clear communication, and giving teams room to grow are key.  About Michal Frantl: Michael is a Global Culture, Engagement, & Performance Solutions Lead at Novo Nordisk, based in Copenhagen Denmark. He is an experienced people and culture professional with a focus on culture building and measurement, leadership development/coaching, and employee engagement who has worked across international offices both in house and as an external consultant.   Originally from Wisconsin in the US, he has lived in the US, UK, Sweden, Italy, and Denmark and has a Masters degree in Organizational Behaviour from Birkbeck, University of London. Connect with Michael: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelfrantl/   Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.

Are you constantly busy? In this solo episode of Legendary Leaders, Cathleen O'Sullivan explores a powerful but often overlooked leadership principle: the importance of creating space. Drawing from her experience coaching leaders worldwide, Cathleen unpacks how stepping away from constant busyness and perfectionism can unlock greater clarity, impact, and presence. She introduces her signature SPACE method, offering practical ways to build in reflection, set boundaries, and lead with intention. A must-listen for anyone looking to lead with more focus, energy, and purpose, at work or at home.   Episode Timeline:    00:00 Introduction   04:13 The Book that changed my view on leadership   07:31 Introducing the SPACE Method: Leading with clarity and confidence   10:46 Responding vs. Reacting: The impact of inner space   15:14 The cost of carrying It all: Leadership and life load   18:43 What your arrival says about your leadership style   22:31 Rediscovering your light: What are your values and vision?   25:50 Where do you need more space?   Key Takeaways:   Cathleen explains that leadership isn't about doing more, but about creating space to pause and think clearly. She points out how being constantly busy, especially for women leaders, leads to burnout and stresses the need to set boundaries. The SPACE Method: Cathleen's method helps leaders stop, reflect, address limiting beliefs, and take clear steps to lead with confidence and ease. Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.  

What if your biggest career breakthrough came from breaking your own rules about what "success" is supposed to look like? On this episode of Legendary Leaders, Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with serial entrepreneur Joe Zentmyer for an honest, wide-ranging exploration of pivots, reinvention, and leading with genuine passion.   With over two decades of experience spanning Fortune 500 sales, food manufacturing, rock climbing gyms, and now a thriving aquarium supply business, Joe's unconventional story is living proof that authentic curiosity and adaptability trump following "the script." If you've ever held yourself back from a new opportunity because it didn't fit the usual definition of success, this episode is for you.   Cathleen and Joe unpack the mindset shifts, resilience, and hard-won lessons that come with building (and sometimes rebuilding) teams and businesses from scratch. From learning the art of self-awareness and dealing with rapid change, to rebuilding after a crisis and keeping the entrepreneurial spark alive, this conversation will inspire you to take bold steps even (or especially) when the path is unconventional.   Episode Timeline Highlights: 06:36 From corporate life to becoming a climbing entrepreneur 13:21 Entrepreneurial life - you need to embrace the unknown 16:55 Performance problems are often leadership issues, not just HR 25:18 Climbing gym staff protests 31:01 Leaders can lack perspective in the midst of a crisis 33:22 Overcoming work overload: Need to find balance 40:46 Rediscovering leadership passion, post-Covid lockdowns 46:26 Passion-driven marketing and staffing 54:26 Hiring challenges for small businesses 01:01:40 Entrepreneurs need to embrace long-term optimism   Key Takeaways: True success in leadership and business is not one-size-fits-all; embracing your own curiosity and passion is the best guide. Building great teams starts with self-awareness, clear expectations, and prioritising attitude over technical skills. Crisis reveals character: resilience, honest communication, and willingness to learn from setbacks will define your leadership. Entrepreneurship isn't for everyone the risks and rewards are real. Understand your motivations, know your limits, and be willing to reflect and reset. Protect your passion by delegating, innovating, and making time for self-reflection—don't let the business become all-consuming. ABOUT Joe Zentmyer: As a serial entrepreneur with more than 20 years of experience, Joe builds businesses by developing business managers along with systems that support those managers. He's very proud of the many young professionals he has mentored during his career. Joe's diverse business experience from food manufacturing to rock climbing gyms, gives him a unique perspective and ability to creatively assess every opportunity. He loves the process of creating a business and turning a concept into a profitable reality. Before launching Snaggletooth Goby, Joe c-ofounded First Ascent, a Chicago-based climbing and fitness chain. From 2013 to 2022, his partners, investors, and himself grew the business to seven locations in multiple markets. Each location was 20,000 to 50,000 square feet in size. They achieved this rapid growth by partnering with lenders, landlords and key vendors to identify and develop only the best locations.   Connect with Joe: Website: snaggletoothgoby.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joe-zentmyer/  Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.  

What if the working world wasn't designed for you, and following the rules held you back from the leadership and life you actually want? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, Cathleen welcomes Nyree Ambarchian, co-founder of purpose-led communications agency Jack & Grace, for a bold and honest conversation about ditching outdated workplace norms and rewriting the "rules" of work.   Nyree shares her journey from diligently following the rules to challenging and rewriting them, both in her own career and in building her business.    This episode is a must-listen for anyone ready to question inherited workplace "rules," embrace authentic leadership, and create environments where people and planet can thrive.   Episode Timeline: 01:35 What might happen if we stopped following outdated workplace rules and started making work fit us instead? 07:56 Launching her purpose-led communications agency during the lockdowns leveled the playing field  10:44 Motherhood led Nyree to reevaluate workplace norms  13:29 Personal challenges with miscarriage and infertility 18:09 Support for miscarriage should never be a one-size-fits-all policy 25:02 Jack & Grace founded as an experiment to challenge industry norms 27:33 Why unlimited holidays didn't work at Jack & Grace 29:24 Salary transparency is a powerful tool for reducing inequality 37:20 All jobs at Jack & Grace are offered part-time as standard   49:50 Measuring success not just by profit, but also people and planet Key Takeaways:   Most workplace "rules" weren't designed for the modern workforce and often exclude, rather than empower people. Open conversation about real-life challenges like miscarriage and menopause can transform organisational culture and support. Experiments in flexibility, salary transparency, and inclusive hiring aren't just "nice" they drive retention, talent attraction, and genuine well-being. Measuring success by profit alone ignores the vital health of people and the planet - embrace the triple bottom line. ABOUT Nyree Ambarchian: Nyree Ambarchian is a Co-Founder of Jack & Grace, a purpose-driven communications agency. On a mission to use comms as a force for good, Jack & Grace is a B Corp and only works with organisations that value people, planet, and profit equally. Nyree has twenty years experience in communications, specialising in behaviour change campaigns, delivering work for the likes of Riverford, the Duke of Edinburgh's Awards, and Defra. Having obediently followed the 'rules' of work all her career, in 2018, Nyree became a mum. Finding herself no longer able to stick to 'the rules', the burn of failure hit hard. Until she realised the problem wasn't her, it was the rules. That marked the start of her journey to rewrite the rules of work, so they work for more people. Connect with Nyree : LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/jackandgrace/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jackgracecomms/ Website: https://www.jackandgrace.co.uk/   Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.

What if burnout wasn't a personal failure, but a sign that something bigger at the system level needs to change? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, host Cathleen O'Sullivan sits down with Kelly Swingler, the renowned "burnoutologist" and founder of the Burnout Academy, to uncover the truth behind today's burnout epidemic. With candour and compassion, Kelly challenges the norms that glorify stress and exhaustion, exploring why real burnout is so much more than long hours. It's about broken systems, shame, and outdated definitions of success.   Together, Cathleen and Kelly dive into the emotional realities of burnout, breaking down stigma and sharing personal stories of their own experiences. You'll discover why leaders are often the first to "burn the brightest and break first," and how shifting our focus from individual fixes to systemic change is the real path to sustainable well-being at work. Filled with vulnerability, laughter, and bold truths, this episode offers both insight and a call-to-action: it's time to stop treating burnout as a weakness and start building workplaces and lives where well-being isn't just an afterthought. Episode Timeline: 03:27 Introducing Kelly Swinger, the "burnoutologist". 07:29 Burnout is the debilitating result of chronic stress 14:10 Leaders often misinterpret feeling overwhelmed or struggling as incompetence 19:47 Burnout is a global issue often caused by toxic workplaces 25:48 Living an unhealthy lifestyle can't be offset by minimal healthy activities 32:48 Many avoid discussing mental health as workplace stress rises 33:45 Burnout is often masked by other conditions due to stigma 56:27 Workplace freedom and creativity could reduce toxicity 01:07:35 Stressed leaders repeat outdated patterns 01:13:08 Leaders should focus on self-awareness and personal values over profits 01:20:20 Self-care routines can't cure burnout without genuine presence 01:24:49 Self-awareness and inner work are ongoing, challenging but rewarding. Key Takeaways:   Burnout is not just chronic stress or exhaustion, it's falling off the edge of your stress scale into a place that affects your whole life. Leaders and organisations must move beyond surface-level "well-being" fixes and tackle the root causes of systemic burnout. You can't "self-care" your way out of burnout, lasting transformation requires stopping, reflecting, and doing the deep inner work.   ABOUT Kelly Swingler Kelly is the Burnoutologist, empowering Leaders to Banish Burnout in the changing world of work for themselves and their people. She leads the world's number one Burnout Academy, training in Burnout Awareness. Known for being a rebel and a rule-breaker, Kelly has been ripping up the rulebook since 2002 after realising that the way we are working isn't working, and how we are taught to define success is outdated. Today, Kelly educates leaders, Coaches HR and managers from companies around the world on how to recognise, prevent and recover from Burnout. Connect with Kelly: The Burnout Academy: https://www.kellyswingler.com/burnoutacademy Book: https://www.kellyswingler.com/fckburnout   Social Media Links: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellyswingler/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/iamkellyswingler/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9Z6iJPB4gYz1MZoUPOgdlQ Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: https://cathleenosullivan.com/  Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.

What if your greatest legacy isn't what you build, but who you build with along the way? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, your host, Cathleen O'Sullivan, invites you into a candid conversation with Nick Peel, a leader whose career spans some of the world's most ambitious projects, from Arsenal Football Club to the cutting-edge NEOM "Line" project in Saudi Arabia. You'll hear how Nick's human-first approach to leadership has empowered teams to thrive under pressure, transcending titles and status in favour of authenticity, humility, and genuine impact. Together, they explore why self-awareness, openness to failure, and the courage to lead with empathy are at the heart of truly legendary leadership. Tune in to discover how embracing your humanity and building others up may just be the most powerful legacy you leave behind.   Episode Timeline:  00:00 Introduction 11:51 Embracing innovation and tackling ambitious projects 15:48 The importance of authenticity and being human in leadership 20:16 Learning from failure and the power of reflection 32:06 Building a strong, supportive family while leading global projects  38:09 Leading high-performing teams through empowerment and simplicity 44:22 The origins of NEOM's The Line: bold ideas and collaboration 52:03 Leading diverse teams and unlocking innovation through trust 57:31 Supporting women's leadership for future generations   Key Takeaways:  Nick shares stories of nurturing talent and pride in seeing former colleagues grow, highlighting the importance of building others up on your leadership journey. Nick discusses the value of showing up authentically, empowering diverse teams, and leading with humility, whether in the high-pressure corporate world or ambitious projects like NEOM's "The Line".  Nick's career, shaped more by "default than design," showcases how adaptability, curiosity, and learning steer personal and professional growth. He talks of the importance of reflection, being open to new ideas and leveraging lessons from both success and failure.   ABOUT Nick Peel Nick has over 30 years of senior commercial and operational leadership expertise under his belt with esteemed organisations like Arsenal FC, LandSec,  Battersea Power Station, McArthur Glen Designer Outlets, and Morrison Supermarkets. He has also held Non-Exec roles with a number of entities, including UCI World Cycling Championships, Streetwork charity, and Icons.com. His career spans retail, hospitality, property / real estate and sports, which he confesses is more by default than by design.    Nick is currently Director of Operational Readiness for THE LINE, the futuristic city under development at NEOM in Saudi Arabia. He specializes in building high performance teams, creating go to market strategies, building the new, and fixing the broken. He prides himself on a ' human first ' leadership style, and is motivated by change, learning, travel, and in particular his family and children.   Connect with Nicholas: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nick-peel-a5943a9?utm_source=share&utm_campaign=share_via&utm_content=profile&utm_medium=ios_app    Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: cathleenmerkel.com   Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.  

Is leadership about going it alone, or could sharing the load lead to even greater success? In this episode of Legendary Leaders, host Cathleen O'Sullivan welcomes the dynamic duo Clare Freshwater-Turner and Annabelle Richards to explore how job sharing could be the key to enhanced leadership and personal fulfilment. Clare and Annabelle, senior managers in sustainable business at Lloyds Banking Group, have mastered the art of job sharing, proving that two heads can indeed be better than one. Join us to learn about the unique partnership they've built over nine years, sharing insights into how combining different strengths and perspectives leads to superior outcomes. Tune in for a conversation that challenges conventional leadership norms and offers a refreshing perspective on ambition and success.   Episode Timeline:  00:00 Introduction ​​08:41 Supporting each other and managing priorities 17:49 The benefits of two coaches for a team  24:10 How to play to each other's strengths 32:07 Why creating a work-life balance is so important  47:42 Communication practises for effective teamwork 56:39 Flexible working enhances productivity and satisfaction   Key Takeaways:  Clare and Annabelle highlight how their contrasting personalities and skills enhance decision-making and problem-solving. They emphasise that two heads can indeed be better than one, providing richer ideas and solutions, which in turn benefits the entire team and organisation. The conversation addresses common misconceptions about job sharing, such as it being more work for managers or only suitable for certain roles. Clare and Annabelle debunk these myths by sharing their experience of managing each other's development and workload, easing the burden on their line manager.  On a personal level, job sharing has allowed Clare and Annabelle to maintain a healthy work-life balance. They can pursue personal interests and family commitments while still having fulfilling careers.     ABOUT Clare Freshwater-Turner & Annabelle Richards Annabelle and Clare are a jobshare and senior managers in Sustainable Business at Lloyds Banking Group, working in the Nature team. They have been with Lloyds Banking Group for many years, working in a wide variety of roles in the Finance and Sustainability functions. These included leading teams, culture change and developing manager training programs. They joined the Group Sustainable Business Team in 2022 supporting Dr. Rebecca Heaton in setting up the team. After they both completed the CISL course with a distinction, they transferred to the nature senior manager role. Within the Nature team, their primary focus is to integrate nature into decision-making and developing training to meet business unit requirements.     Connect with Annabelle & Clare: Website: https://thejobsharecoach.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/thejobsharecoach/   Connect: 
  Find | Cathleen O'Sullivan  Business: cathleenmerkel.com   Email: cmc@cathleenmerkelcoaching.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathleen-merkel/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legendary_leaders_cathleenos/     FOLLOW LEGENDARY LEADERS ON APPLE, SPOTIFY OR WHEREVER YOU LISTEN TO YOUR PODCASTS.