The Off-Ramp Project

Episode 16: How do we create off-ramps for ourselves, and become able to offer off-ramps for other people -- especially people we're being urged to distrust, hate, or even dehumanize?In the 16 episodes of this season, we've looked at some of the complex factors that have led us to this polarized and endangering time of emotional manipulation, cultic mechanisms of control, cruel hierarchies of human worth, and the constant manipulation of our attention and our emotions in this time of unregulated endstage capitalism. It's a lot.But it's not everything.There are things we can do to support ourselves and each other in this time of trouble. We can become off-ramps for ourselves and step away from polarization, distrust, and dehumanization to reclaim ourselves again.We can refuse to become weaponized, and instead offer our presence to people we're being urged to exile.We can find ways to become off-ramps to others -- if they're ready to step away, and also if they can't quite do so yet. The time to make up your mind about people is never.This marks the final episode of season 1 of The Off-Ramp Project. Thanks for listening. Take care of yourself, and I'll see you in Season 2.Books mentioned in this episode:Missing the Solstice by Karla McLaren: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0F6TRWRBZBeyond the Politics of Contempt by Doug Teschner, Beth Malow, and Becky Robinson: https://beyondthepoliticsofcontempt.com/

In this episode, I'm joined by authors Doug Teschner and Beth Malow to talk about their new book: Beyond the Politics of Contempt -- and it's such an important book for our polarized and contempt-filled times. We've been taught to polarize ourselves and see difference as absurd or dangerous, and we've been invited to show contempt for people who don't believe or vote as we do. These are social injuries, and they require social solutions. Doug and Beth talk about their book and their work as Braver Angels volunteers and leaders -- which has helped them avoid contempt, and learn how to reach across divides, de-polarize themselves, and rehumanize others. Taking an off-ramp from this time of extreme polarization means identifying and challenging the ways we've been manipulated into warring camps. We don't have to agree, but we do need to stop exiling and demonizing others if we want to get anywhere worthwhile. Books and sites mentioned in this episode: Beyond the Politics of Contempt by Doug Teschner, Beth Malow, and Becky Robinson: https://beyondthepoliticsofcontempt.com/ Together Across Differences (Doug and Beth's FREE Substack): https://togethernow.substack.com/p/one-month-since-the-book-launch The Hidden Tribes Report (a research project about understanding polarization in the US): https://hiddentribes.us/ High Conflict by Amanda Ripley: https://bookshop.org/p/books/high-conflict-why-we-get-trapped-and-how-we-get-out-amanda-ripley/1aa1a2637891ca8d The Case for Phone-Free Schools by Jonathan Haidt: https://www.afterbabel.com/p/phone-free-schools?r=182klo&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email Bowling Alone by Robert Putnam: https://bookshop.org/p/books/bowling-alone-revised-and-updated-the-collapse-and-revival-of-american-community-robert-d-putnam/0a3388f210d22ad0 The Upswing by Robert Putnam: https://bookshop.org/p/books/the-upswing-how-america-came-together-a-century-ago-and-how-we-can-do-it-again-robert-d-putnam/64510b7b8b907f87 BALANCED AND UNBIASED MEDIA OUTLETS Tangle News: https://www.readtangle.com/ AllSides: https://www.allsides.com/unbiased-balanced-news he Flip Side: https://www.theflipside.io/ Ground News: https://ground.news/

Your situational depression is an essential emotion that helps you become aware of realities you may have been avoiding, and it removes your ability to move forward doing the wrong thing with the wrong intentions for the wrong reasons at the wrong time. Sadly, we've been taught to see our situational depression as an unwanted thing -- a psychiatric disorder, and something not to be trusted. This is such a shame. Sadder still, when the intelligence in our situational depression is not available to us, we can be vulnerable to people who want to control us by manipulating our depression (this happened on a national scale in 2015). In this episode, we look at ways to listen to our own situational depression so that we can be better protected around people who would try to manipulate us into depression for their own gain. Books and practices mentioned in this episode: The Depression Inventory: https://karlamclaren.com/taking-a-depression-inventory/ The Language of Emotions by Karla McLaren: https://karlamclaren.com/the-language-of-emotions-book/ The Language of Emotions Workbook by Karla McLaren: https://karlamclaren.com/loe-workbook/

Episode 13: Many people avoid shame, but don't realize that in so doing, they avoid growth, empathy, evolution, and becoming truly themselves. It's essential, then, to understand the difference between your own chosen, appropriate, and necessary shame versus the shame-blame that people use to control or abuse you. In this episode, we look at ways to know the difference, and what to do if your essential and life-giving shame has been hijacked by abusive, controlling, and unhealthy messages. Books and practices mentioned in this episode: The Eyes of Horus by Joan Grant: https://bookshop.org/p/books/eyes-of-horus-joan-grant/bacd6c470976e817 The Language of Emotions by Karla McLaren: https://karlamclaren.com/the-language-of-emotions-book/ The Language of Emotions Workbook by Karla McLaren: https://karlamclaren.com/loe-workbook/ The Burning Contracts practice for shame: https://karlamclaren.com/reworking-a-toxic-emotion/ The Burning Contracts video for shame: https://youtu.be/bsphw5C7aIE?si=K3lKUszSeUrADt07 Missing the Solstice by Karla McLaren: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0F6TRWRBZ Stolen Pride by Arlie Russell Hochschild: https://bookshop.org/p/books/stolen-pride-loss-shame-and-the-rise-of-the-right-arlie-russell-hochschild/645bfe0a64abb5be Mistakes Were Made (but not by me) by Carol Tavris and Elliot Aronson: https://bookshop.org/p/books/mistakes-were-made-but-not-by-me-third-edition-why-we-justify-foolish-beliefs-bad-decisions-and-hurtful-acts-carol-tavris/507560a2efd55431

Episode 12: Many of us have been chased away from shame, because it seems to cause nothing but pain. However, shame itself is a crucial social emotion that helps you become an upright and empathic person who cares about others and has a strong sense of ethics. The key to working with shame is to understand the difference between shame that helps you maintain your morals and ethics, and shame-blame that is thrown onto you by others. The blaming form of shame is actually, and simply, abuse. Reclaiming your own true and healing shame is crucial in a time when people are flinging shame-blame everywhere. In this episode, we begin to observe how people's tragic avoidance of shame, and their lust for throwing shame-blame at others, is damaging our capacity to learn, grow, connect, evolve, and heal. Your own chosen shame forms the center of your ethical core. It's essential. And a key to working well with shame is to understand the difference between shame and abuse. Books and practices mentioned in this episode: The Language of Emotions by Karla McLaren: https://karlamclaren.com/the-language-of-emotions-book/ The Burning Contracts practice for shame: https://karlamclaren.com/reworking-a-toxic-emotion/ Strangers in Their Own Land by Arlie Russell Hochschild: https://bookshop.org/p/books/strangers-in-their-own-land-anger-and-mourning-on-the-american-right-arlie-russell-hochschild/85585abfe16c457f Stolen Pride by Arlie Russell Hochschild: https://bookshop.org/p/books/stolen-pride-loss-shame-and-the-rise-of-the-right-arlie-russell-hochschild/645bfe0a64abb5be Mistakes Were Made (but not by me) by Carol Tavris and Elliot Aronson: https://bookshop.org/p/books/mistakes-were-made-but-not-by-me-third-edition-why-we-justify-foolish-beliefs-bad-decisions-and-hurtful-acts-carol-tavris/507560a2efd55431

Episode 11: Your panic is powerful, and if you don't know how to work with it, other people can grab its power to fuel their own ideas, their own movements, and their own ends.But be aware: If people are grabbing onto your emotions, especially the powerful, life-saving emotion of panic, they don't in any way mean you well.Your emotions belong to you, and no one should be jacking into them. The first step in retrieving your panic is to understand what it does, how it works, and how to work with its immense power in life-changing ways..Books and cards mentioned in this episode:The Language of Emotions Cards: https://karlamclaren.com/product/the-language-of-emotions-cards/Embracing Anxiety by Karla McLaren: https://bookshop.org/lists/karla-mclaren-s-booksThe Gift of Fear by Gavin de Becker: https://bookshop.org/lists/trauma-healing-e7c310b5-d52e-412e-ae0a-e3ed4ee8e040Waking the Tiger by Peter Levine: https://bookshop.org/lists/trauma-healing-e7c310b5-d52e-412e-ae0a-e3ed4ee8e040

Episode 10: Hatred is a powerful emotion, and as it is with anything powerful, it's a double-edged sword. It can be a astonishing force for good. No kidding.We're seeing hatred everywhere, and it's a sign of trouble throughout our species. If you don't know how to work with your hatred, its power can wound and destroy. This is especially true if you've been manipulated into hatred, because this is a form of emotional abuse that destabilizes and weaponizes you. And of course, being manipulated into hatred is never done with your health or well-being in mind. It's abuse. But even if you have been manipulated into hatred (if you know what hatred signifies, and you know how to work with it), you can evolve, integrate, deepen, and heal. The key with hatred is to turn inward and do your shadow work, because hatred signals a serious lack inside you that needs to be witnessed, welcomed, and integrated. Hatred can be magical like that. Books mentioned in this episode: The Language of Emotions by Karla McLaren, M.Ed.: https://bookshop.org/lists/karla-mclaren-s-books Owning Your Own Shadow by Robert A. Johnson: https://bookshop.org/lists/shadow-work-4ea99124-7347-4af8-9faf-915c6a0448aa A Little Book on The Human Shadow by Robert Bly: https://bookshop.org/lists/shadow-work-4ea99124-7347-4af8-9faf-915c6a0448aa Meeting the Shadow edited by Connie Zweig and Jeremiah Abrams: https://bookshop.org/lists/shadow-work-4ea99124-7347-4af8-9faf-915c6a0448aa

Episode 9: You don't need to avoid stress. In fact, avoiding it is a truly bad idea if you want to do anything worth doing, or be of help in difficult times. And in fact, stress is a weasel word that hides the essential emotions that arise to help us deal with trouble. Learning to reframe stress, name it properly, and work with it intentionally can improve and deepen every part of your life. And in times of trouble, it is our willingness to face difficulties head on -- with all of our emotional skills available to us -- that will make the difference. Stress is not the problem. Your stress (which is really your emotions) is the response to the problem, and your response brings you gifts, skills, and genius that you can't get anywhere else. Books mentioned in this episode: The Upside of Stress by Kelly McGonigal: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/316675/the-upside-of-stress-by-kelly-mcgonigal/ The Language of Emotions by Karla McLaren: https://karlamclaren.com/the-language-of-emotions-book/

Episode 8: There's something you can do right now to support yourself in this time of intentional chaos and intense polarization. The Braver Angel's organization is a nationwide group of people who have come together to help us learn how to talk to each other again. And to learn how to disagree and be in conflict without tearing each other apart. No one wins when we're pitted against each other like this, and Braver Angels will give you a place -- right now -- to reclaim the better angels of of your nature so that we can dream a better future and rebuild. Braver Angels: https://braverangels.org/our-mission/ Find a local alliance: https://braverangels.org/braver-citizens/find-a-local-alliance/ Beyond the Politics of Contempt: https://beyondthepoliticsofcontempt.com/

Episode 7: What can we do when polarization, dehumanization, and unhealthy mechanisms of control are at play? We can understand the powerful forces that are acting upon us, and do the work to become well-informed, emotionally whole, and prepared to reduce polarization, emotional manipulation, and dehumanization inside us, and in the world around us. Books mentioned in this episode: Missing the Solstice by Karla McLaren: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0F6TRWRBZ Escaping Utopia by Janja Lalich and Karla McLaren: https://www.routledge.com/Escaping-Utopia-Growing-Up-in-a-Cult-Getting-Out-and-Starting-Over/Lalich-McLaren/p/book/9781138239746

Episode 6: Healthy charismatic leadership involves being willing to learn from others, instituting checks and balances, maintaining a sense of humor and a sense of humility, being responsive to complaints and corrections, and treating people well and respectfully. When the charisma of a person or group is healthy, people are drawn to it and invigorated by it. When it’s not, their choices get tangled up with the leader’s need for total devotion and control. Breaking away from toxic charismatic authority is hard work, but it can be done, and people can learn how to identify – and support – healthy authority and healthy groups. SIGNS OF HEALTHY CHARISMATIC AUTHORITY The leader or group has behavioral checks and balances in place. The leader has healthy empathy and a realistic self-image. Members are treated as valuable individuals; they are not disciples, servants, or pawns. The leader has a sense of humor and a humane leadership style. Members retain their identities, family relationships and responsibilities, and private lives. The leader or group values and promotes members’ ideas and beliefs. Members have the right to question, doubt, and challenge the charismatic authority. The leader or group deals responsibly with conflicts and challenges; there is no belittling, punishing, or shunning. Members have the freedom to come and go as they please. The leader or group considers and promotes other ideas, other beliefs, and other groups. The leader encourages critical thinking and questions. The group is open to the outside world and to nonbelievers. People who are under the sway of a charismatic authority figure are being manipulated, certainly. But in most cases, they are also finding a sense of purpose, meaning, and pride as they work diligently to demonstrate their perfect devotion. These are worthy things; however, when they’re directed at the bottomless pit of an unhealthy person’s needs, perfect devotion only serves to trap followers in a web. SIGNS OF UNHEALTHY CHARISMATIC AUTHORITY • The leader or group has an inflated sense of importance and connection to greatness. • Members must idealize and revere the leader and the ranking leadership. • The leader claims special powers, knowledge, and lineage – or may claim to be divine. • Members are often publicly shamed or berated for not living up to the ideals of the leader or group, or for not meeting the needs and/or demands of the leader or group perfectly enough. • The leader’s needs, ideas, and desires are overriding; they de-legitimize and erase the needs, ideas, and desires of group members. • Some members are granted access to an inner circle with special privileges and special access, and often, these people can break the group’s rules without punishment. • The leader can do or say almost anything without repercussions; there are no checks or balances on his or her behavior. • The leader has complete control over the group’s belief system, rules, and norms – none of which can be questioned. The leader belittles all other belief systems and any other leaders who may be functioning in the leader’s realm (e.g., other New Age leaders if the leader has a New Age philosophy). • Members must display complete obedience and devotion to the leader or the group. • The leader takes credit for anything good that happens, and blames members for anything bad that happens.• The leader treats questions and challenges as threats, and he or she may see enemies everywhere – inside and outside the cult. • Members who challenge the authority of the leader or leadership group are punished, publicly humiliated, shunned, or kicked out, and may be portrayed as enemy traitors.

Episode 5: Influence is everywhere, and it can be heathy or unhealthy. Here are ways to know which is which. SIGNS OF HEALTHY SYSTEMS OF INFLUENCE The system helps people feel welcome and important to the group as they are. The system encourages healthy community, teamwork, and camaraderie, as well as open discussion and debate about group projects, goals, and decisions. Members are role models for each other, but internal competition is a choice rather than a requirement. Individual hard work and excellence are celebrated, and are attributed to the individual. The group encourages self-awareness and personal responsibility, but does not require public self-exposure. The system supports privacy, self-respect, independence, and kindness.Communication is direct and open, and secret-keeping is discouraged.Members are not required to spy on or report others. Members have the right to challenge the ways that group unity is achieved. Striving for excellence may be a group value, but the demands are not harsh, and people are not penalized for failure. Dedication may be a group value, but the group makes room for casual members. The system incorporates fairness, concern for individuals, and acceptance of outsiders. The group provides a healthy sense of belonging and realistic levels of commitment. The group does not require people to re-invent themselves or dedicate their lives to the cause. Leaders and special insiders are not above the rules, and they can be challenged if they disrupt or ignore group norms. The system helps members develop a unified group identity that does not erase their own identities. SIGNS OF UNHEALTHY SYSTEMS OF INFLUENCE There is constant pressure for people to change and conform. The push for change comes from above; the needs or ideas of members are not important. The system of influence is built into the powerful sense of community; this deep closeness is both supportive to members and also a way for the group to pry into and control members’ private lives. Loyalty to family or friends is discouraged; all loyalty must be focused on the group and the leader. Gossip, informal communication, and off-topic conversations may be forbidden. Members have no privacy; their actions, behaviors, emotions, and even thoughts are monitored. Members soon internalize the pressure to conform, and will obediently monitor and report their own behavior. Because members must report on themselves and also each other – a culture of confession will arise. Confessions are public; and punishment and humiliation are public as well. The leader’s behavior is off limits; no one can report on the transgressions of the leader, for they are perfect and can do no wrong. Special people around the leader or the leadership group are also protected from any criticism; often there are no consequences for their behavior or actions. The group may develop its own special language that outsiders cannot understand. Any successes or hard work performed by individuals will be attributed to the group or leader, while any difficulty or failure will be blamed on individuals. People in the outside world are treated as non-people: unenlightened, deluded, or evil – and they only have value if they can be converted. The group or the leader may reinterpret events to verify the group’s beliefs, fears, or visions of the future; everything will be fitted into their transcendent belief system.

Episode 4: Who Controls You?In healthy groups and relationships, members retain their own sense of what's right, their own voices, their intellectual freedom, and their own ideas. In healthy groups, the systems of group control are healthy and nourishing. In unhealthy groups, the systems of control will demand high dedication, high intensity, self-silencing, intellectual sameness, and extreme perfectionism. In unhealthy groups and relationships, the systems themselves are abusive. But there is no need to create systems of control that are high-demand or abusive. Healthy groups and relationships are everywhere, and learning about what healthy (and unhealthy) groups look like can protect each of us from unnecessary harm. SIGNS OF HEALTHY SYSTEMS OF CONTROL The system is democratic; all members have a say in how the rules and regulations are developed and implemented. Members have the right to question, doubt, and challenge the system. Checks and balances are in place so that the system remains fluid, responsive, and fair. The system supports equality, and no person is above the rules. The system incorporates fairness, justice, and leniency; no one is humiliated, abused, or shunned. Members appreciate the sense of structure and discipline that the system provides. The system provides a healthy sense of belonging and camaraderie. The system helps members develop a unified group identity that does not erase their own identities. The group encourages critical thinking and welcomes ideas from outside the system. When a system of control is healthy, its structure supports and nurtures the people inside it. Healthy systems of control involve rules that make sense, clear checks and balances on power, responsive and respectful leadership, and goals that are livable and beneficial for everyone. Unhealthy systems of control treat people like cogs in a machine, and they require total submission and unquestioning obedience, regardless of the personal cost. When a system is toxic, its structure crushes, demeans, and dehumanizes the people trapped within it. SIGNS OF UNHEALTHY SYSTEMS OF CONTROL The rules and regulations come from above: members have no say in the system. The system of control is undemocratic and does not allow independent thought or action. Members must be perfect in their obedience or face dire consequences. Rule-breaking is treated as a direct attack on the group or its leader. Rule-breaking has extreme consequences, such as public shaming, isolation, shunning, beatings, starvation, or excommunication. Publicly shaming or abuse of rule breakers is used as a scare tactic to keep other members in line. Members are encouraged to report rule breakers – including their own family members. Leaders or members in the inner circle can break rules without consequences. The system of control is connected to the working lives of cult members; hard work and even slavery are essential parts of the rules and regulations. The leader can change the rules, regulations, and system at will or on a whim. These lists are from the book I co-authored with Janja Lalich, Escaping Utopia.In this episode, I talk about Janja Lalich's book about two seemingly opposite cults that were basically identical in their social structures, Bounded Choice.I also talk about the group Braver Angels, who are helping people on the left and the right learn how to be people with each other again.

Episode 3: It's not what you believe. It's how.In this episode, we're exploring the first aspect of Janja Lalich's Bounded Choice model of cultic control: The Transcendent Belief System.If you don't understand high-demand, high-dedication, high-intensity, self-sealed, and cultic belief systems, you can fall into one very easily. Or more than one!We look at multiple transcendent beliefs, which are not exclusively religious or spiritual. Any belief system can fall into perfectionism and rigidity, and any belief system can imagine itself to be the best thing ever. Ways of eating, ways of learning, ways of exercising, ways of doing martial arts, ways of doing business .... if people don't understand cultic mechanisms of high control and high dedication, they can storm down the wrong path and leave trouble in their wake.Here are ways to understand when the belief systems you value are healthy.ASPECTS OF HEALTHY TRANSCENDENT BELIEF SYSTEMSMembers have the right to question, to doubt, and to think their own thoughts. The belief system makes room for other beliefs and other ideas. Members are treated as equals, and are not expected to be subordinate or perfectionistic. The belief system allows for personal autonomy, dignity, and freedom. Members retain their identities, finances, relationships, personal time, and private lives. The belief system includes rather than excludes people and ideas. Members can leave without being shunned or forced to abandon their friends and family. The belief system opens members to the world rather than isolating or segregating them from it.When a transcendent belief system is healthy, people have choices. When it’s not, their choices get tangled up with the group’s rigid visions of perfection and purity.ASPECTS OF UNHEALTHY TRANSCENDENT BELIEF SYSTEMSThe group’s sense of purpose is intense and urgent. The belief system is rigid, self-righteous, and excludes other beliefs, which are criticized or ridiculed. Members are expected to become perfect true believers; there is no room for doubt. The belief system is elitist; it is the only true path and the ultimate solution. The belief system promotes specific and demanding tools, practices, and rules to turn members into perfect followers. The belief system is perfectionistic, with all-or-nothing requirements that must be followed to the letter. The group is strongly hierarchical, with an inner circle of true believers who have special access, power, and privileges. The belief system cannot be questioned. The group creates internal and external enemies who are portrayed as threatening the very survival of the group. Members who question, break the rules, or leave are shunned or demonized, and may lose all contact with group members, including their own family members.In this episode, I feature my book with Janja Lalich, Escaping Utopia: https://www.routledge.com/Escaping-Utopia-Growing-Up-in-a-Cult-Getting-Out-and-Starting-Over/Lalich-McLaren/p/book/9781138239746And Janja's classic book that I edited for its revised edition, Take Back Your Life: https://janjalalich.com/blog/take-back-your-life/

Episode 2: Your emotions are the foundation of who you are, and in this episode, we look at how advertising, marketing, social media, and anyone who wants to influence you accesses your emotions as a matter of course (and as a matter of business). Becoming aware and skilled with your own emotions certainly benefits you and your relationships, but it can also protect you from manipulation and help you develop a deep form of social intelligence. Sadly, in endstage capitalism, our emotions are being monetized, and we're being funneled and fomo-ed into someone else's machine. When we're going along with the crowd, or losing ourselves in the machine of social media, we need an off-ramp. Thankfully, knowing how to work with our emotions can be the key to finding our way to the exit and back to ourselves. Also, a flying superhero pig from Tennessee and magical shoes may have something to do with it. In this episode, Karla features her book, The Language of Emotions: https://karlamclaren.com/the-language-of-emotions-book/ And its accompanying workbook: The Language of Emotions Workbook: https://karlamclaren.com/loe-workbook/ And free! (real free; not internet free) Her Emotional Vocabulary List (in 10 languages!) can help you track the emotions that are being evoked from you, forced onto you, and expected from you in the unregulated attention economy of endstage capitalism: https://karlamclaren.com/emotional-vocabulary-page/

Episode 1: How do we create (and survive) drastic changes? How do we leave unhealthy relationships, groups, belief systems, or entire identities? How do we take off-ramps when the crowd is pushing us forward, and how can we learn to create off-ramps for others -- especially when we've been taught to see them as our enemies? These questions are crucial in a time when so many of us have been drawn into polarized belief systems and conspiracy theories that are tearing apart families, friendships, political parties, and the foundations of American governance itself. But change and reclamation are possible at any time. Researcher, author, emotions and empathy expert, and cult survivor Karla McLaren, M.Ed. explores how we can reclaim ourselves and provide support for others. We all need off-ramps when we're being separated from each other, and when we're being taught to see enemies in anyone not like us. With personal stories, extensive research, emotional genius, empathic badassery, and humor, we explore how and why this bold American experiment has become a tragic powder keg, and how we can reclaim our good hearts, our good minds, and our good souls. We can imagine, build, and maintain off-ramps for ourselves and each other. In this episode, Karla mentions her newest book, Missing the Solstice (2025), available in paperback and on Kindle: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0F6TRWRBZ