Turning Towards Life - a Thirdspace podcast

This episode celebrates the life and work of Wendell Berry, the  poet and farmer who died this week. Berry's brief  poem "The Real Work,"  invites us to recognise that when we no longer know what to do or which way to go, we may have arrived at our genuine calling. A conversation for all of us navigating confusion, loss, or disorientation, and wondering about how we might bring ourselves when we no longer know the way.This week is hosted as always by Lizzie Winn and Justin Wise of Thirdspace.This is Turning Towards Life, a weekly live 30 minute conversation hosted by Thirdspace in which Justin Wise and Lizzie Winn explore living with depth, attentiveness and care. Find us on FaceBook to join in the lively conversation on this episode. You can find videos of every episode, and more about the project on the Turning Towards Life website, and you can also watch and listen on Instagram, YouTube, and as a podcast in all the usual podcast places.Episode Overview00:00 Introduction to Wendell Berry's Legacy03:06 Surface and Depth05:58 The Real Work08:47 Finding Meaning in the Impeded Stream14:05 Others and Navigating Life's Challenges14:53 The Beauty of Not Knowing: A Personal Reflection17:37 The Song of Life in Chaos21:00 On Connection23:18 Responding to Life's Challenges Together26:55 The Transformative Nature of Uncertainty29:53 What is the Real Work?Our source for this week:The Real WorkIt may be that when we no longer know what to dowe have come our real work,and that when we no longer know which way to gowe have come to our real journey.The mind that is not baffled is not employed.The impeded stream is the one that sings.Wendell Berry (1934-2026)Photo by Jeffrey Hamilton on UnsplashJoin Our Weekly Mailing: www.turningtowards.life/subscribeSupport Us: www.buymeacoffee.com/turningtowardslife---Join Us Live in 2026Turning Towards Life Live Season 3, from 16 September 2026Our Turning Towards Life live programme of community, learning and reflection runs in six month seasons, in person on Zoom once a month. We're very excited about it. A chance to expand beyond the bounds of a podcast into forming a community of learning and practice.You can find out more and join us here: www.turningtowards.life/liveLearn Coaching with ThirdspaceFoundations of Integral Development CoachingOur two-day immersive introduction to integral development coaching. An opportunity to begin to learn to support others in deep, life giving discovery and development.You can read more 'Foundations' and book a place here:www.wearethirdspace.org/foundations-of-coachingYou can hear us talk about the philosophy of our coaching programmes here:www.turningtowards.life/coachingAnd our year-long Professional Coaching Course details are here:www.wearethirdspace.org/professional-coaching-courseJoin Our Weekly Mailing: www.turningtowards.life/subscribeSupport Us: www.buymeacoffee.com/turningtowardslife

A conversation about meeting one another's 'falling apart', the cultural pressure to stay buttoned up, the fertile potential hidden inside our moments of undoing, and what it means to be a person who can welcome and hold space for another's becoming rather than trying to put the lid back on. How genuine care for another might involve staying faithful to the life inside them, which is something deeper than their current circumstances, their current identity, or the version of them we first fell in love with.This week is hosted as always by Lizzie Winn and Justin Wise of Thirdspace.This is Turning Towards Life, a weekly live 30 minute conversation hosted by Thirdspace in which Justin Wise and Lizzie Winn dive deep into big questions of human living. Find us on FaceBook to join in the lively conversation on this episode. You can find videos of every episode, and more about the project on the Turning Towards Life website, and you can also watch and listen on Instagram, YouTube, and as a podcast in all the usual podcast places.Episode Overview00:00 Welcome02:56 Exploring Total Breakdown by Chelan Harkin05:52 Embracing Undoing09:05 Cultural Norms and Fears12:09 Keeping It Together vs. Falling Apart15:03 Finding Safe Spaces for Breaking Apart18:04 Context and Timing in Personal Growth20:56 Creating Relational Safety for Vulnerability24:01 The Moral Responsibility in Relationships27:13 The Power of Seeing Each Other's Life30:06 Conclusion and Invitation to EngageOur source for this week:Total BreakdownJune 2026 (Vol. XXXIX, No. 6)"She's having a total breakdown,"one put togetherand very self-satisfied seedwith no cracks in itwhispered to anotherabout a third seed who had begunto germinate."She's completely falling apart—her life is a mess!"They gazed superiorlyat the smooth, intact facadeof their shellsso perfectly upholdingexpectations of the status quo.Clearly, compared to that wild,sprouting seeddisrupting the peace,they were doing something right...right?But now and then,they secretly looked upwith longing at the tall-stemmed,bravely opened flowerwondering if there might bemore to themselves.Chelan Harkin, from WILD GRACE: POEMSpoetrycooperative.org/chelan-harkinPhoto by David Clode on UnsplashJoin Our Weekly Mailing: www.turningtowards.life/subscribeSupport Us: www.buymeacoffee.com/turningtowardslife---Join Us Live in 2026Turning Towards Life Live Season 3, from 16 September 2026Our Turning Towards Life live programme of community, learning and reflection runs in six month seasons, in person on Zoom once a month. We're very excited about it. A chance to expand beyond the bounds of a podcast into forming a community of learning and practice.You can find out more and join us here: www.turningtowards.life/liveLearn Coaching with ThirdspaceFoundations of Integral Development CoachingOur two-day immersive introduction to integral development coaching, led by Lizzie and Justin from Turning Towards Life. An opportunity to begin to learn to support others in deep, life giving discovery and development.You can read more 'Foundations' and book a place here:www.wearethirdspace.org/foundations-of-coachingYou can hear us talk about the philosophy of our coaching programmes here:www.turningtowards.life/coachingAnd our year-long Professional Coaching Course details are here:www.wearethirdspace.org/professional-coaching-course

A meditation on loss, presence, and what we learn from the people in our lives. Lizzie and Justin consider what each person might be teaching us, not just through their words, but through their presence. We explore how to see beyond the surface presentation of other people and wonder "what gifts and qualities is this person showing me? How are they sweeping the path for me?" And we consider what it is to extend this practice beyond those we grieve for to all our relationships, as both an act of love and as a practice for cultivating a more connected, compassionate world around each of us. This week is hosted as always by Lizzie Winn and Justin Wise of Thirdspace.This is Turning Towards Life, a weekly live 30 minute conversation hosted by Thirdspace in which Justin Wise and Lizzie Winn dive deep into big questions of human living. Find us on FaceBook to join in the lively conversation on this episode. You can find videos of every episode, and more about the project on the Turning Towards Life website, and you can also watch and listen on Instagram, YouTube, and as a podcast in all the usual podcast places.Episode Overview00:00 Introduction to Turning Towards Life03:12 Exploring the Poem: A Bunch of Consolation05:59 Reflections on Loss and Learning08:46 The Nature of Love and Relationships12:11 The Importance of Reflection and Eulogy Writing14:59 Seeing Beyond Surface Relationships17:55 Curiosity and Learning from Others21:09 Honoring the Living and the Dead24:06 Activism through Connection27:15 Closing Thoughts and InvitationsOur source for this week:A Bunch of ConsolationYou think they’ll always be there,(the ones who always have been).They showed you the way,not their waybut how to find your own(and what to say),sweeping the path of leavesor snowbut then the leaves, they go,before you were ready(how could you ever be ready?)to wonder, wondering,what have you learned exactly?To love, to speak up, to hold steady.Hold steady.Maura DooleyPhoto by Reza Madani on UnsplashJoin Our Weekly Mailing: www.turningtowards.life/subscribeSupport Us: www.buymeacoffee.com/turningtowardslife---Join Us Live in 2026Turning Towards Life Live Season 3, from September 2026Our Turning Towards Life live programme of community, learning and reflection runs in six month seasons, in person on Zoom once a month. We're very excited about it. A chance to expand beyond the bounds of a podcast into forming a community of learning and practice.You can find out more and join us here: www.turningtowards.life/liveLearn Coaching with ThirdspaceFoundations of Integral Development CoachingOur two-day immersive introduction to integral development coaching, led by Lizzie and Justin from Turning Towards Life. An opportunity to begin to learn to support others in deep, life giving discovery and development.You can read more 'Foundations' and book a place here:www.wearethirdspace.org/foundations-of-coachingYou can hear us talk about the philosophy of our coaching programmes here:www.turningtowards.life/coachingAnd our year-long Professional Coaching Course details are here:www.wearethirdspace.org/professional-coaching-course

We begin with Rick Rubin’s “The Prism of Self”. A conversation about the welcome and unwelcome, our inner multitudinousness, bringing forward what’s been in the shadows, discernment, and how art and open conversation can make room in our lives for more of the vast complexity we each are.This week is hosted as always by Lizzie Winn and Justin Wise of Thirdspace.This is Turning Towards Life, a weekly live 30 minute conversation hosted by Thirdspace in which Justin Wise and Lizzie Winn dive deep into big questions of human living. Find us on FaceBook to join in the lively conversation on this episode. You can find videos of every episode, and more about the project on the Turning Towards Life website, and you can also watch and listen on Instagram, YouTube, and as a podcast in all the usual podcast places.Episode Overview00:00 Introduction to Turning Towards Life02:37 Exploring the Prism of Self08:59 The Complexity of Identity13:05 Navigating the Spectrum of Self20:04 Welcoming it All25:59 Art as a Reflection of the SelfOur source for this week:The Prism of SelfDefining one’s true self is not so simple. It may be impossible. We inhabit many different versions of a changing self. The suggestion to be yourself may be too general to be of much use. There’s being yourself as an artist, being yourself with your family, being yourself at work, being yourself with friends, being yourself in times of crisis or in times of peace, and being yourself for yourself, when by yourself.In addition to these environmental variations, we are also always changing within. Our moods, our energy level, the stories we tell ourselves, our prior experiences, how hungry or tired we are: All these variants create a new way of being in each moment.Depending on who we’re with, where we are, and how safe or challenged we feel, we are changing all the time. Moving between different aspects of self.We may have one aspect that wants to be more bold or subversive, which wrestles with our more agreeable, conflict-avoidant self. There may be a dreamer aspect, aspiring to inhabit vast magnificent worlds, at odds with our pragmatic side that questions our ability to make our dreams real.There is a constant negotiation occurring between these various aspects. And each time we tune in to a particular one, different choices result, changing the outcome of our work.In a prism, a single beam of light enters and is broken into an array of colors. The self, too, is a prism. Neutral events enter, and are transformed into a spectrum of feelings, thoughts, and sensations. All this information is processed distinctively by each aspect of self, refracting life’s light in its own way, and emitting different shades of art.For this reason, not every work can reflect all of our selves. Perhaps it’s never possible, no matter how hard we try. Instead, we might embrace the prism of self, and keep allowing reality to bend uniquely through us.Like a kaleidoscope, we can adjust the aperture on our vision and change the results. We may aim to work from one particular aspect, like taking on a character, and create something from our darkest self or our most spiritual self.Those two works won’t be the same, but they both come from us and they would both be true colors.The more we accept our prism-like nature, the more free we become to create in different colors and the more we trust the inconsistent instincts we hold while making art.We don’t have to know why something is good or wonderful, if it’s the “right” decision or if it reflects us accurately. It is simply the light our prism emits naturally at this moment in time.Rick Rubinfrom ‘The Creative Act’Photo by Ruan Richard Rodrigues on UnsplashJoin Our Weekly Mailing: www.turningtowards.life/subscribeSupport Us: www.buymeacoffee.com/turningtowardslife---Join Us Live in 2026Foundations of Integral Development Coaching, led by Lizzie and JustinSept 9-10 2026, Online, Book HereOur two-day immersive introduction to integral development coaching, led by Lizzie and Justin from Turning Towards Life. An opportunity to begin to learn to support others in deep, life giving discovery and development.You can read more 'Foundations' and book a place here:www.wearethirdspace.org/foundations-of-coachingYou can hear us talk about the philosophy of our coaching programmes here:www.turningtowards.life/coachingAnd our year-long Professional Coaching Course details are here:www.wearethirdspace.org/professional-coaching-courseTurning Towards Life Live Season 3, from September 2026Our Turning Towards Life live programme of community, learning and reflection runs in six month seasons, in person on Zoom once a month. We're very excited about it. A chance to expand beyond the bounds of a podcast into forming a community of learning and practice.You can find out more and join us here: www.turningtowards.life/live

We begin with Ella Dessington’s poem “Where Words Kneel” and reflect on freedom, trust, safety, belonging and the limits of language. How language is always provisional, changing as we use it and inquire into its meanings. How fixed definitions can distance us from our living experience, and how relationships can remain alive through return, listening, apology, openness and the willingness to let one another change. An invitation to slow down, question what’s certain and stay with ourselves and one another until language becomes gentle and humble enough to meet experience.This week is hosted as always by Lizzie Winn and Justin Wise of Thirdspace.This is Turning Towards Life, a weekly live 30 minute conversation hosted by Thirdspace in which Justin Wise and Lizzie Winn dive deep into big questions of human living. Find us on FaceBook to join in the lively conversation on this episode. You can find videos of every episode, and more about the project on the Turning Towards Life website, and you can also watch and listen on Instagram, YouTube, and as a podcast in all the usual podcast places.Episode Overview00:00 Introduction 06:19 Ella's Poem: A Reflection on Language and Experience10:20 The Challenge of Language in Expressing Experience17:37 Speaking from Experience23:12 Change and Relationship29:25 Complexity and Reflection in Communication34:04 The Practice of Slowing DownOur source for this week:Where Words KneelFreedom is a restless word.The moment we believe we have found it,it begins quietly building walls around itself.Not because freedom deceives us,but because language longs to settle,while life refuses to stay still.Trust follows close behind.We speak of it as though it were something earned,something possessed, something carefully placed between two people like a bridge.Yet every bridge eventually becomes a structure,and every structure forgets it was first imaginedto help someone cross.I keep wondering whether words sufferfrom the same temptation as empires.They arrive to serve, then slowly begin governing.Not with force, but with definition.Not with violence, but with certainty.Safety.Freedom.Trust.Belonging.Each begins as a living experience, until we ask it to carry more than any word can bear.And still,beneath all the naming,life keeps escaping.Relationship does not speak in nouns.It speaks in returns.In the hand that reaches again.In the apology that arrives tomorrow.In the silence that makes room instead of closing the door.In the quiet decision to remain available after certainty has left the room.So I wonder if freedom has never been the absence of constraint.I wonder whether freedom is what becomes possiblewhen neither of usis requiredto remainwho we werewhen we first began speaking.And I wonder whether listeninghas never been the search for better language.Maybe it is the slower practiceof staying with one anotheruntil language itself grows gentle enough,humble enough,to kneelbefore experience.Ella DessingtonPhoto by jason hu on UnsplashJoin Our Weekly Mailing: www.turningtowards.life/subscribeSupport Us: www.buymeacoffee.com/turningtowardslife---Join Us Live in 2026Foundations of Integral Development Coaching, led by Lizzie and JustinSept 9-10 2026, Online, Book HereOur two-day immersive introduction to integral development coaching, led by Lizzie and Justin from Turning Towards Life. An opportunity to begin to learn to support others in deep, life giving discovery and development.You can read more 'Foundations' and book a place here:www.wearethirdspace.org/foundations-of-coachingYou can hear us talk about the philosophy of our coaching programmes here:www.turningtowards.life/coachingAnd our year-long Professional Coaching Course details are here:www.wearethirdspace.org/professional-coaching-courseTurning Towards Life Live Season 3, from September 2026Our Turning Towards Life live programme of community, learning and reflection runs in six month seasons, in person on Zoom once a month. We're very excited about it. A chance to expand beyond the bounds of a podcast into forming a community of learning and practice.You can find out more and join us here: www.turningtowards.life/live