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Typology

Author: Ian Morgan Cron

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Who are we? Why do we act, think and feel the way we do? How can we become our best, most authentic selves? Welcome to Typology, a podcast that explores the mystery of the human personality and how we can use the Enneagram typing system as a tool to become our best, most authentic selves. Hosted by author, speaker and counselor, Ian Morgan Cron, Typology features interviews with thought leaders from every sphere of life, including renowned Enneagram authors and teachers, psychologists, theologians, artists, business leaders, neuroscientists, philosophers, and more. In other words, we’ll be talking with people who are trying to become the best version of themselves in the world.
154 Episodes
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“Mental health is health. We all have it. We can ignore it. We can mistreat it. We can take care of it. No matter what though, we can't deny that it exists.” This was Ryan Casey Waller’s response when I asked about his new book, “Depression, Anxiety, and Other Things We Don’t Want to Talk About.” This opened the door to a great, shame-free discussion about mental health and overcoming the stigma that often goes along with it.   Ryan Casey Waller is a psychotherapist, pastor, lawyer, and, according to his book, a co-sufferer.  In this episode we explore the: Experience that triggered his own journey towards healing Importance of mental health and seeking help when it is needed How he’s using the self-knowledge gained from the Enneagram to manage his own mental health. My hope is that this episode will highlight how complex each of us is, how our needs and desires differ, and why it’s important to avail ourselves of the multitude of resources available for healing.
Today, I'm answering a few carryover questions from our monthly Typology Institute Membership Town Hall.   Each month I host a live Town Hall for members where we go beyond Q&A because members get to ask their questions live and the answers end up facilitating great follow up conversations that we just can’t do on this show.  It's truly a great time!  So, I pulled a few questions to share with you this week to give you a peek. If you’d like to join the next Town Hall, just visit typologyinstitute.com/membership to sign up. We’ll send you the link.
This week’s amazing guest, Emily Ley, is the Founder of Simplified, a brand of planners and organizational tools for busy women. She's been featured in Forbes, Family Circle, Better Homes and Gardens, Glamour, and Good Housekeeping. She is also a national bestselling author of many books, including her latest, Growing Boldly: Dare to Build a Life You Love.  As an Enneagram Two, she’s doing her work to make positive changes in her professional and personal life.  We talk about her new journey in therapy, what it means to be a two and a leader in the corporate field, why she no longer keeps score at home, and even dig into the core struggle of the two...that need to be liked.  So, whether you are a Two, work with a Two, or love a Two, this episode covers a lot of ground and will open your eyes to the way a Two views the world.
Enneagram Nines appear to be so uncomplicated, and yet they’re actually very complicated.  Enneagram Nines share a tendency to be other-referencing or more tuned in to what’s going on in the outside than they are tuned into what’s going on inside. They have a tendency to want to create harmony in their environment, and avoid conflict. They have a unique sensitivity to tension and conflict that they want to prevent or avoid altogether. So, I asked Beatrice Chestnut to join me to go deep into the inner workings of the Peacemakers.  In today’s episode we:  Explore the nuances between each subtype  Highlight the various ways Nines wrestle with or express their anger Delve into the transformational path for each subtype
How does a traumatic incident shape the narrative you tell about yourself?  Our guest today, Amy Downs, shares her incredible transformation that occurred as a result of surviving the Oklahoma City bombing.  In the years since the bombing, Amy became a mother, lost 200 pounds, competed in an Ironman Triathlon, obtained her MBA, and became CEO of the same credit union that was bombed.  It’s one of the most dramatic stories we’ve ever had on this show.  Don’t miss this rich conversation as we learn her story, hear how the Enneagram helps in her personal and professional relationships, and explore whether she’s an Enneagram 3 or 9.
Today, Holly Hayes, award-winning author, founder and CEO of Sanctuary Project, and Enneagram 3 joins me to explore the Enneagram as it relates to healing and recovery, how understanding your stress and security points can help identify your type, and the work required to reconnect with your authentic self. It’s a powerful reminder that we all need a safe place to take off our masks and get back in touch with who we are meant to be.
Enneagram Ones value principles and integrity and are driven by the need to be good. They are conscientious and ethical and self-controlled. But as with all types, when you dig into subtypes and instincts you’ll see three different versions of the Improvers personality that look and behave differently. Today, Beatrice Chestnut and I dive into: The importance of being familiar with your passion and how to recognize when it’s taken the wheel What each subtype looks like and why knowing yours is critical How the growth path differs for each subtype of type one   Listen now on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player. 
I know many of you are looking forward to today’s show and I’m thrilled to share this rich conversation with Enneagram Nine, Seth Abram. Seth is a long-time friend, pastor, singer, songwriter, creator and founder of Integrated Enneagram, and co-host of the popular Enneagram podcast, Fathoms.  Seth not only shares his wealth of knowledge about the work that is needed to become the fullest expression of our true selves but also provides insight into learning to recognize and embrace the role that anger plays in the transformational path for an Enneagram 9.    In this episode we discuss the:  Fear and passion of the Peacemaker Tension of the polarity of wings on type Recognizing and growing into right action Listen now on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player, then share your thoughts with us on Instagram, Facebook, or Twitter.
Today’s guest, NBA Life Optimization Coach and former professional basketball player, David Nurse joins me to talk about the importance of self-awareness and the role it plays in leading others and optimizing your potential.  David also shares how making small pivots to look at things from a slightly different perspective can open up your entire perspective and lead to life-giving changes. In this episode you’ll learn: Where types go in health and in stress The importance of a positive mindset  How self-awareness impacts leadership and personal performance
In general, Enneagram Sixes focus on scanning for threats and risks, being prepared in case the worst happens, and predicting and anticipating what might happen next so they can be ready to meet whatever challenge occurs.  But, when you get into their subtypes...they can look and behave pretty differently.  I dive into this in-depth today with Enneagram guru, Beatrice Chestnut.  In this episode you’ll learn: What a passion is and why it’s so important to know yours What each subtype looks like and why knowing yours is critical How the growth path differs for each subtype  Listen now on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player.   
What are the benefits of using the Enneagram in the corporate space? The Enneagram helps grow self-awareness and self-knowledge among team members and executives in order to create a richer, more productive, more profitable environment that is also filled with joy, compassion and empathy.  When applied properly, it really gets under the waterline of consciousness and illuminates why you do what you do and can help you understand how you show up in the workplace.  In this special episode, business experts Scott Allender, Karen J. Hardwick, and Chris Carneal join me for a free-wheeling conversation about the benefits of applying the Enneagram in the workplace.
Everybody fights, so why not get better at it?  But how?   One of the great things about the Enneagram is it’s a wonderful tool for improving communication between friends, family, spouses, and even coworkers. It fosters the self-awareness needed to be able to disagree better, love more, and maintain healthy relationships along the way. Best-known for their hit parodies on social media, husband-wife duo Kim and Penn Holderness share their tips for communicating, talk about the rules of engagement for arguments, and explore their strengths and weaknesses through the lens of the Enneagram.
Each of us digests or metabolizes grief in separate ways. It's important to understand how differently people grieve and allow others the space to grieve in the way that is appropriate to their architecture. Author, speaker, and executive pastor at Church of the City, Jonathan Pitts shares his journey through grieving the unexpected loss of his wife, learning to carve out space for joy, and finding beauty in the small things.
Relationships are extremely important to Enneagram Twos.  They are the most interpersonal number on the Enneagram.  They are other referencing -- focusing their attention outside of themselves.  But when you mix the passion of the Two (pride) with their subtypes, Enneagram Twos not only present in very different ways but their transformational path also varies.     Psychotherapist, coach, business consultant and Enneagram guru Beatrice Chestnut walks us through the heart of the Befriender and provides insights into the growth path for each subtype.  So, if you’re a Two, if you love a Two, or if you’re in conflict with a Two, listen through the end of this episode with an open heart and take note of what all Twos share in common and where they differ. 
The journey of self-understanding isn’t easy. Each of us are deep, mysterious, and complex beings who don’t fit into one specific box.  Those complexities can sometimes make the process of uncovering your true self difficult. Today’s guest thought he was an Enneagram Seven for a long time but when he realized he was actually a dominant Six with a heavy Seven wing things changed.  Front man of the award-winning Chrisitan group, MercyMe, Bart Millard joins me for a great conversation about the complexities of personality and how fear plays into his daily life.  In this episode, we discuss: what let Bart to conclude his core type is a Six the strong influence wings can have on your core type the difference between about counter phobic and phobic sixes Tune in to hear our conversation and learn more about the inner workings of an Enneagram Six.
We’ve got another great interview today.  An entrepreneur, actor, musician, singer-songwriter, and music executive...hip-hop artist Lecrae joins me in a personal conversation about shame and grief.  We get really honest about his life, where he came from, what influenced his Threeness, a real identity crisis that he hit at the height of his fame, and what role therapy has played in his healing and restoration.  
What mud do you bring into your relationships?  Though we’re often unaware of them until we can no longer ignore them, each of us carries hidden beliefs adopted in childhood into every relationship. And until we bring that mud, those self-limiting beliefs, to the surface they’re going to work against us as adults.  This week, Toni and Carey Nieuwhof, join me to talk about the unconscious messages that impacted their relationship, identify the seven core issues that tend to take out marriages, and share what they learned while working through their “messy middle.”  
Enneagram Nines have an innate ability to foster peace with those around them.  With their intuitive wisdom and great skill in listening to differences and understanding multiple perspectives, Nines seem to have a leg up on the rest of us when it comes to spirituality.  Artist and multiple Dove award nominee, Audrey Assad beautifully gives us an honest look into the importance of spiritual community, embracing shadow work, and manifesting a non-anxious presence. Listen through to the end as Audrey also offers a few great tips for Nines.
How do you do the things within your control without falling under the illusion that you are in control?  Control is a big theme in all of our lives...it just shows up in different ways. No matter your type, we all try to control others with the suite of behaviors that go with our type.  In fact, we train people to respond to us and interact with us in a certain way based on our type. So, how does an Enneagram 3 respond when faced with something they can’t do -- something that’s out of their control?   National bestselling author, speaker, founder/CEO of the Own It Academy, and host of SHE, a top-rated podcast for women, Jordan Lee Dooley opens up about one of her most challenging struggles, how she is responding to the complex emotions surrounding grief, and learning to let go of the things she can’t control. We love it when our guests get vulnerable because it reminds us that we are not alone. And, you are not alone.
As we navigate the current climate it’s easy to become disconnected. But as humans, we’re actually wired for connection.  We must look for opportunities to connect with each other.  Connection is fuel for the soul. And who better to explain the beauty of connection, of togetherness, than Morgan Harper Nichols. For Enneagram Fives who may already isolate, and be comfortable there, Morgan’s words illuminate the importance and the challenge of balancing that space and connection. Morgan Harper Nichols is an artist and poet whose work is inspired by real-life interactions and stories. Morgan spent the first couple of years of her professional life as a college admission counselor, and then, as a full-time touring singer-songwriter and musician. It was on the road that she cultivated her curiosity and passion for writing, art, and design and slowly began to share her work online.
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Comments (82)

Christina Mendoza-Hoogkamer

this is the best podcast episode I have ever listened to. I have never felt so understood in my life. Every time Curt talks about Jesus and the crucifixion, something in my heart is stirred and screams yes! Thank you all so much!

Jun 14th
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Sarah Hissin

As a 4, I'm curious what subtype Ivan thinks Ben is.

Jan 1st
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Debbie Fuller

I really related to a lot of this podcast. Since many of your listeners are 1s, I'd specifically appreciate hearing more about the subtypes of ones and possibly all the other numbers.

Dec 23rd
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delaram dehrouyeh

Awesome👌🏻💜

Nov 14th
Reply (1)

Sheryl Jenkins

Where are the Ones?? 🙂

Sep 19th
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Richieand Shannon McConnell

This is THE BEST conversation I have heard regarding the heart and experience of a Two. Although I generally glean from each show, this one felt so personal to me in numerous ways and Lisa-Jo did so well to articulate her narrative and put words to countless life experiences and perceptions I share with her. Thank you, Lisa-Jo!!!

Aug 10th
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Richieand Shannon McConnell

I really appreciate how this couple speaks to one another. You can tell there is a mutual respect and love here.

Aug 8th
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Debbie Fuller

Still hoping for more episodes on type 1s. The majority seem to be about 2, 3, & 7.

May 28th
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Natasha Kovalam

Great episode! She seems to me type 3 from the very beginning. Authenticity that she talks about might actually be her virtue - she mentioned many events that had slowed her down and helped her to reevaluate things in her life. 3SP?

Apr 3rd
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Karen A. C. Goode

as an adult type 1 child of an unhealthy 4, I very much love the phrase 'your feelings are not the boss of me!"

Mar 26th
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Brittnee Love

Dear Mr. Cron (and team), I think you may have an unconscious bias against type 1s as many of your episodes include information and interviews with type 7s, 9s, 3s, 8s. I would love some more love for the 1s.

Mar 4th
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Lexie Oosse

After listening to this and being somewhat of a newbie to ennegram I think I'm a self-preservstion 2, thanks!

Jan 15th
Reply (1)

Andrea Bartell

Oh my, I did not realize my comments were public. I apologize for the confusion! 😬 Love Typology and the insight of self awareness that it has helped to cultivate in my inner self. Thank you for the depth of vulnerability paired with laughter!

Nov 20th
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Andrea Bartell

giving the tools to empower action for things that you are passionate about, empowering you to use your giftings and talents to change the world of young parents.

Nov 15th
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Andrea Bartell

25:00 not worthy of knowing or love

Nov 15th
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Tena L. C. Ritter

I’d love to hear from a 6 with wing of 7.

Nov 15th
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Andrea Bartell

44:00 CFO

Nov 15th
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Andrea Bartell

35:00 business culture

Nov 15th
Reply

Andrea Bartell

19:30 values of the company

Nov 15th
Reply

Andrea Bartell

anxiety in digital age

Nov 15th
Reply
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