Then and Now Preterist Podcast

This is the second of two lessons that Ed Stevens presented at the 2016 Blue Point Endtimes Conference. The first lesson looked at HOW the pre-70 saints lived, and WHY they lived that way. We looked at their expectations and hope and other motivations to live holy lives. In this second lesson we apply those principles to our lives today. We show when the Kingdom was supposed to arrive, and what Jesus and the apostles taught about our lives in the Kingdom AFTER it arrived. Even though we do NOT have the eschatological factors motivating our lifestyle (like the first century saints had), we DO have the same hope and the same vulnerability to persecution and the same challenges of life in this evil world that they had. And that is more than enough motivation for us to live godly lives.Support the show

This is the first of two lessons that Ed Stevens presented at the 2016 Blue Point End Times Conference. This lesson discusses the kind of godly lifestyle that the pre-70 saints maintained, and explains WHY they lived that way. Their reasons for living sensibly, righteously, and godly during that time of persecution right before the End, was somewhat complex. While they were motivated by all of the same reasons that we are, they had an additional factor of eschatology. The nearness of the Parousia, and the need to finish the Great Commission, plus the imminency of the great tribulation (Neronic persecution), all combined to intensify their need to live holy lives. Even though we do not have those eschatological factors motivating us today, we do have the same hope of immortal life in heaven which those pre-70 saints had. And that hope stimulates us to purify ourselves, just like it did for those saints in the first century. For a PDF written transcript of this lesson, click here. Support the show

The most important doctrine in all of Biblical revelation is the Deity of Christ and the Trinity. This teaching is certainly hard to wrap our minds around, but fortunately a full understanding of it is not crucial to our salvation. What is essential, however, is that we believe in the Deity of Christ, regardless of whether we fully understand it. So we will be looking at several Biblical texts which reveal and illustrate the Deity of Christ and the Trinity. We examine the powerful arguments of Anselm (eleventh century) who showed convincingly from Scripture that our atonement is completely dependent upon the Deity of Christ. No imperfect creature (man or angel) can atone for our sins. Only a perfect sinless sacrifice can die in our place, and only God is sinless. John 17:5 clearly teaches the Pre-Existence and Eternal Begottenness of the Divine Son of God. Revelation 5 shows all saints and angels in heaven giving equal worship and glory to both the Lamb and the One who sits on the throne. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

David Chilton gave these two speeches at a full preterist conference in Oklahoma City in 1997, not long after he had become a full preterist, and only a few months before he died. That was the occasion when he made the now famous remark: “...Here I am as a Full Preterist.” Chilton explained the meaning of Matthew 5:17-20 where Jesus predicted the passing away of the old heavens and earth. He shows that this was referring to the soon-coming end of the old covenantal world and the arrival of the new covenantal world in Christ and in the Church. He shows that this was the same “heaven and earth” and covenantal world mentioned in both 2 Peter 3 and Hebrews 8:13. He quotes from John Owen, John Brown, Milton Terry, J. S. Russell, and F. F. Bruce to support his point. Perhaps the most valuable part of this is his critique of Theonomy as it was explained by Greg Bahnsen and William Einwechter. Chilton clearly shows how the Theonomists misinterpreted both Matt 5:17-20 and Heb 8:13 when they bound the “jots and tittles” of the Ceremonial Law upon us today. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

Premillennialists connect the “Times of the Gentiles” (Lk 21:24) with the “fullness of the Gentiles” (Rom 11:25), and claim that both texts will only be fulfilled after “all Israel” has accepted Jesus as Messiah, returned to the land of Israel, and rebuilt the temple. They see the “times of the Gentiles” as being the whole period from AD 70 until that future restoration (now almost two thousand years). We show from Lamentations 1:15; Revelation 11:2; Daniel 7:7-25; Ezekiel 30:3; Jeremiah 27:7; the Dead Sea Scrolls; the Apocrypha; Yosippon; and Enoch that the two phrases “tread under foot” and “times of the Gentiles” are referring to the Roman invasion and conquest of the Jews in AD 67-70. We also explain what the “fullness of the Gentiles” means in Romans 11:25. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

We explain John 14:3 to show that Jesus was promising a real cognitive experiential "reception" (rapture) of his disciples into the unseen realm of heaven at His Parousia. Critics of the first century rapture have to SPIRITUALIZE the "dwelling places" language, and IGNORE the "receive you to Myself" promise of Jesus! But that was NOT just figurative language about a covenantal status or soteriological condition, or code for the Collective Body or life in the Kingdom in a spiritual sense only. We show that the dwelling places of John 14:2-3 are actually in the unseen spiritual realm of heaven, and were not accessible to the saints until AFTER the transition period, and that Jesus (actually, cognitively, and experientially) took his disciples out of the visible realm on earth and "received them" into those new dwelling places in the unseen spiritual realm at His Parousia. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

This is the first episode of our Summer 2014 Series. You are in for a treat this summer. We will be presenting some of our best seminar presentations, and former Preterist Radio podcasts that have not yet been posted here. This session will share a message that I presented at the 2009 Evangelical Theological Society conference in New Orleans. There were several young seminary students in the audience, along with a few fellow preterists. My lesson deals with the morals and ethics that come out of our eschatological worldviews. At the end there is a brief Q&A interaction with some of the young futurist seminary students who were in the audience. This is a good podcast to share with your non-preterist friends who do not understand the ethical problems facing Futurism. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

After Titus dismantled Jerusalem, gathered its spoils, and dispersed its captives, he left Judea to join his father in Rome. He commissioned Bassus and Silva to capture the three remaining rebel fortresses of Herodium, Macherus, and Masada. The Roman soldiers overturned every stone of the temple building in order to get the gold and silver that had melted into the cracks, unwittingly fulfilling Jesus' prophecy that there would not be left one stone upon another (Matt 24:2). The temple vessels and furnishings were taken to Rome by Titus. Herodium and Macherus offered little resistance, but Masada fought to the bitter end. We use evidence from archaeology, Josephus, Hegesippus, and Yosippon to support the idea that the Eleazar in command of Masada was the same Eleazar b. Ananias who had started the war and held the temple during most of the war. This same evidence suggests that Eleazar was the Man of Lawlessness that Apostle Paul referred to in his second letter to the Thessalonians. Those three historians talk about how Eleazar and his forces on Masada were ultimately defeated by the breath of the Lord's mouth and forced to be slain. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

Vespasian was proclaimed emperor by his troops in Judea, Egypt, and Syria. He left Palestine to go to Egypt before heading to Rome. He left his son Titus in Judea to begin the siege of Jerusalem. Titus waited until the city was full of people at Passover time to begin the siege. We read a number of passages from Josephus which have parallels in the book of Revelation, such as the weight of the stones thrown by the catapults, the pestilence and famines, as well as the blood in the lakes, rivers, streets of Jerusalem, and even in the Temple. We mention the famine during the siege which forced some to eat dung, and others into cannibalism. Josephus describes the cosmological symbolism of the temple veil and all the images that were embroidered on it (the heavens and earth and sea). The Holy of Holies was the place on earth where heaven and earth connected. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

Vespasian bottled up the Jews in Jerusalem, so that he could fight them all together in one place in one big decisive battle. Then Nero died and Rome was plunged into civil war and external rebellions. The Zealots thought that would force the Roman army to make peace with them and leave Judea. Wrong! After a year-long suspension of warfare, Titus came back with a bigger force than ever. The Zealots seemed oblivious to the danger, and weakened themselves by factional in-fighting. John of Gischala and his soldiers committed abominable atrocities, torturing and killing their own people inside the city. Conditions inside the city grew unbearably worse by the day. And then Titus began the siege. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

Vespasian literally went from victory to victory. He finished reducing all the pockets of resistance in Galilee, and sent detachments all over the Decapolis, Perea, Judea, Idumea, Samaria, and Jericho, methodically driving out all the remaining rebels and forcing them to flee to Jerusalem. There were rumors of revolt in Turkey, so Vespasian quickened his pace to finish the Judean war, just in case his forces would be needed elsewhere. Just when he was ready to besiege Jerusalem, news reached him that Nero had died. Everything was put on hold until a new emperor could give him new orders. It took over a year for things in Rome to get under control, but when the dust settled, Vespasian was proclaimed the new emperor. This changed everything. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

This time we dig a little deeper into the details of the Galilean campaign of Vespasian and Titus, as they began to subjugate all the fortified cities of Galilee (AD 67). Josephus had tried to unite all the cities of Galilee under his command, and get them fortified before the Romans attacked. But it simply did not work. Some of the Galilean cities were still allied to Rome, while others only wanted to participate in the Zealot rebellion if they could be in command. Josephus was only 29 years old at that time, so it is remarkable that he was able to do as well as he did. But they were no match for the well-equipped and well-trained Roman war engine. Vespasian took one city after another, pushing all the refugees ahead of him toward Jerusalem. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

We give a quick overview of the first year and a half of the Jewish War with Rome, which began in earnest in the Spring of AD 67. When Nero heard about the humiliating defeat of Cestius Gallus in the Fall of AD 66, he immediately sent Vespasian, one of his most capable generals, to settle the score. Vespasian and his son Titus gathered three legions from Syria and Alexandria, plus the whole army of Agrippa II, and other auxiliaries and mercenaries from surrounding allied nations. It was a fighting force of over sixty thousand soldiers. The first object of Vespasian's attack was the northern region of Galilee, where Josephus was the commander of the Zealot forces. Once Galilee was subjugated, the Roman army methodically worked its way south, pushing all Jewish rebels toward Jerusalem for the final siege. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

After Eleazar b. Ananias lawlessly put a stop to all Gentile sacrifices, the Moderates and pro-Roman citizens of Jerusalem pleaded with him to restore the sacrifices, but he refused. This division between the Moderates in the upper city and the Zealots in the Temple rapidly degenerated into armed conflict. Menahem overpowered the Roman garrison on Masada and brought all of its weaponry back to Jerusalem. The Zealots grew stronger by the day. The Greco-Syrian inhabitants of Palestine slaughtered their Jewish neighbors, and vice versa. Cestius Gallus and Agrippa II brought the Twelfth Legion to Judea to stop the rebellion, but ended up suffering staggering losses of men, equipment, supplies, and funds. This defeat of Cestius left Nero little choice but to send a huge force of over three legions to crush the rebellion. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

We are continuing to build a chronology of the Zealot rebellion and their war with Rome. We pick up the historical narrative in May of AD 66 just after Gessius Florus had attempted to seize all the remaining temple gold. This action by Florus forced the Zealots to revolt. Josephus mentions several of the reasons why the Zealots broke with Rome at this particular time. One of the first things the new Zealot government did, was to mint their own coins. After Agrippa failed to persuade them to break off the rebellion, Eleazar coerced the priests to stop accepting all sacrifices from all Gentiles, including the daily sacrifices from Caesar. The Zealots also made it quite clear that they would no longer pay taxes and tribute to Rome. This was clearly an open declaration of war. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

We begin by looking at how the Zealot leader Eleazar started the rebellion by blowing the ram's horn and rallying the troops inside Jerusalem to block Gessius Florus's attempt to get the rest of the imageless gold coins out of the Temple. This shows how Eleazar was the originator of the revolt, and the fulfillment of the Man of Lawlessness. Josephus gives "the day and the hour" of the Parousia with its associated resurrection of the dead and bodily change of the living. Josephus, Tacitus, Yosippon, Hegesippus, and Eusebius all record these events in their histories of the Jewish War. R. C. Sproul Sr. calls this historical testimony "a most remarkable record [which] lends credence" to the idea that there was some kind of coming of Christ in connection with the destruction of Jerusalem. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

After a few months of looking at the book of Romans, we are now picking back up with our historical studies. The last two historical podcasts (July and August 2013) dealt with the military campaigns of Cestius Gallus and Vespasian against the Zealot forces. Before getting into the chronology of the whole war (AD 66-70), we need to review the events that occurred just before the war (AD 64-66). Those last two years were chock full of false messiahs, rumors of war, abominations, lawlessness, signs in the heavens, signs on earth, angelophanies, and voices heard coming from the unseen realm. All the final events that Jesus predicted in Matthew 24 were exploding on the scene like a grand finale fireworks display. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

It has been almost two months since we shared some of the great listener feedback that we are getting. This is always interesting and encouraging for other listeners who often have the same thoughts and questions. The first question wanted an explanation of the differences between the Futurist Bodies Out of the Ground resurrection view (BOG) and the two Preterist resurrection views (CBV versus IBV). Other questions focused on Daniel's Seventy Weeks, the first century rapture, and how the NT manuscripts survived and remained uncorrupted in spite of the rapture removal of all the true Christians at the Parousia. Several more questions and comments dealt with the two resurrection views within Preterism: CBV versus IBV. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

As Douglas Moo notes in his Romans commentary, "Romans 12:1-2 is one of the best-known passages in the New Testament." Here Paul urges the Roman saints to present their bodies as living sacrifices to God, and be transformed by a renewal of their minds. Since some of the Collective Body advocates use this text to support their resurrection view, we show why the word "bodies" (plural) cannot be referring to a collective body. We quote from two of the Collective Body advocates to clarify their position, and then bring the excellent critical analysis of Robert H. Gundry to bear on it. We explain the original development of the Collective Body view by John A. T. Robinson, and suggest a possible reason why Max King used it to build his resurrection view. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show

Another of the most important texts which the Collective Body View (CBV) uses to support its concept of a collective body resurrection is Romans 8:23. They contend that the phrase “our body” mentioned here in this text is a reference to the collective body (the church) being resurrected or “redeemed” at the Parousia. Through grammatical and contextual analysis, as well as a look at similar passages, we very effectively debunk that theory and show that this text is talking about a bodily change for individual saints at the Parousia – the same bodily change that is mentioned in 1 Cor 15, 2 Cor 5, Phil 3:21, and 1 Jn 3:2. This podcast challenges all full preterists to discover what this bodily transformation really was all about. If you wish to have the free PDF written lesson outline for this podcast, simply email us to request it (preterist1@preterist.org). Be sure to mention the date of this podcast when you contact us.Support the show