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Courage and Spice: the podcast for humans with Self-doubt
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Courage and Spice: the podcast for humans with Self-doubt

Author: Sas Petherick

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Hey guys and gals and non-binary pals! Courage + Spice is the podcast for humans with self-doubt, hosted by me: Sas Petherick. I literally have a masters degree in self-doubt and I've spent almost a decade coaching hundreds of people how to develop robust self-belief. You can expect interviews with delightful humans, evidence-based resources and original proven coaching tools. If self-doubt is holding you back in your relationships, career, creativity or your business, Courage + Spice is especially for you.
145 Episodes
One of the biggest ways that self-doubt holds us back is by telling us that we aren’t ready. This shows up differently depending on your specific situation. Maybe you’re an artist waiting to feel ready to share your work with an audience, or a writer waiting to contact agents. A coach waiting to perfect your offer before putting it out into the world… even a parent waiting until the kids are older to pursue your dreams. No matter what your situation, I’ve found that we’re never really waiting to feel ready; we’re waiting to feel safe. Listen in for tips on how to stop the waiting game from holding you back... BIG news from the world of Self-belief School! I’d love to invite you to my free workshop, Why am I so mean to me?, which will show you how to speak to yourself with compassion, encouragement and respect. The workshop will take place on Wednesday 4th October 2023 at 8 pm UK time. All you have to do is register here: Self-belief School is also getting a very exciting update, and will soon be available for you to join at any time! No more waiting for enrolment to open… and certainly no more waiting to be 'ready’ 😁 These changes will be launching next month in October, so be sure to join the waitlist to be the first to hear when you can sign up:
Welcome back to Courage and Spice! As 2023 continues, today I'm sharing with you a compassionate and deceptively simple self-reflection process that has gotten me through uncertain times recently. Listen in for these two questions that you can use to support yourself when the future doesn’t seem so clear. QUOTES“Adulting has real periods of strain. And often there is no neat solution… we have to keep going. There's no destination. I'm unlikely to get to a time where there aren't pressures or some kind of constraint. I need to figure out a way to support myself in this.”“When the world or our lives feel really complex and uncertain and big, it's almost like we need to meet that with a big solution. But actually, I found that the simpler the solution, the more likely we are to do it.”
Believe it or not, we’re about half-way through the mystery magical adventure that has been 2023! Before we go on a podcast hiatus for the summer, I wanted to share the unexpected and twisty journey that this year has been with you. In January, if you asked me to imagine where my mind, heart, and even my body would be in July, I would never have come up with where I am now. A lot of this started with a trip back to my home and family in New Zealand, which evolved my relationship with the past and opened a new sense of possibility for the future. Tune in for more on where this has led! And if you’re interested in feeling more at home in your body, The Embodyment Workshop, is coming to you live in November:  QUOTES “I’m feeling a mix of grief and loss of leaving here and the people that I deeply care about, and also real excitement and trepidation about taking my business into a whole new place.” “There’s something about seeing through the haze and the fog of all those worries, doubts, and fears, to actually the truth of right now, in your heart.” “I’ve been thinking about all the places that I could belong that I maybe haven't allowed myself to, or that I've tried to protect myself from because of some anticipated risk that people won't like me if I go there.”
Are you feeling out of alignment with your natural rhythm? Maybe you don't even know if you have a natural rhythm? Perhaps you are searching for a sense of order outside of the 9 to 5 world of notifications and expectations? This episode is a treat! Jen Wright is a mentor who works with folks to build values-based, heart-led businesses and she is here to share her expertise in slow, sustainable, cyclical living.Listen in for her insights on how to tune into your body to create your own unique cycles and rituals, making the most of your time in the most nourishing, fulfilling, and intuitive way. The Aigned Community: Cyclical living and slow business support for gentle rebels about Jen: Randomly“It’s about tuning back into our bodies. Seeing when we can rest, when we can slow down, and when things feel easier for us, rather than just pushing all the time.”“If we think about a hierarchy of wellness, sleep is the big pillar at the bottom. That's where our body repairs itself, when our natural healing happens. When we dream, we are usually processing stuff from that day. In order to dream, we need to get into depth of sleep.”“Can you imagine a society where all of us are educated about the cycle of life? Where we ask, what does that actually mean for all of us? And commit to knowing that.”
If you’re not following Keri Jarvis on Instagram @keri_l_jarvis, what are you doing?! Keri is a developmental coach, intersectional feminist, community activist, and all-around bloody ace human. When we recorded this episode, Keri had posted some brilliant thoughts on Instagram about what it really means to identify with being an ambitious person and how her own sense of equity, justice and feminism has caused her relationship with ambition to evolve.We got together to chat more about ambition, getting comfortable with contentment, what gratitude really means in practice, and competition versus collectivism. Plus a huge amount of amazing references and resources that are sure to send you down a rabbit hole of info and inspo 📚REFERENCESYou can find Keri’s original post here: Pendleton podcast: Pick me up I’m scared on TikTok Podcast: UNLEARN EVERYTHING YOU THOUGHT YOU KNEW ABOUT ECONOMICS on Insta: Strategy Podcast: have better sex under Socialism: QUOTES “All of your consumption decisions, who you choose to work with, who you tell your stories to, the kinds of folks you spend your time with - they all get to be personal decisions.”“Capitalism says there's not enough to go around, so you have to fight for it. Collective liberation says ‘I don't believe in competition. I want us all to win.’ And some of us are starting at different places, so that means some of us need a ton more resources and support to get to the start line.”“If we accept that growth is where the happiness is, the inevitability of it, the necessary nature of it, it's not unusual for people to be quite stopped in their tracks and think, ‘why would I want more?’”
My guest today is Ellie Kime, writer, founder of Enthusiast and Co. and publisher of Voracious Magazine. Ellie has a master’s degree in enthusiasm (yes…literally!) and is here to share what it really means to live with unbridled passion for the things you love most. We’re throwing away surface-level good vibes and toxic positivity and diving deep into what it means to be joyfully enthusiastic. Tune in for advice on how to live by your own rules when it comes to business, hobbies, creativity, and everything in between. You can find out more about Ellie at:  QUOTES “My conclusion is to just to stop playing by the rules, cause if we can't win then let's play our own game.” “Even if you can't find somebody with your very specific enthusiasms, surround yourself with a group of people who really understand the depth of your enthusiasm, the embodiment of how it feels.” “You've just got to do everything with love. Otherwise what's the point?”
This week I’m speaking with the brilliant Bridgette Boudreau! Bridgette is a master certified life coach; she has been a CEO to multimillion-dollar corporations, built her own business twice, and developed programmes that have trained thousands of coaches… myself included!Bridgette’s mission these days is to infuse your working life with vision, meaning, growth and healing. But today, we’re digging even further into a ‘stealth mission’ that we both share, to educate clients, coaches, and any consumer of coaching, to be aware of the shadow side of the coaching industry.  Tune in for insight on the toxic side of manifesting culture, what accountability looks like within coaching practice, and the ways that a good coach will amplify YOUR light. You can find out more about Bridgette at: REFERENCESKelly Diels wrote a great post about the Launch Formula 'mental triggers' approach and why we should do better.Lianne Raymond: “Your limitations shape your purpose just as much as your gifts, strengths, and your light. So it doesn't mean you don't get to be what your heart wants – it means you can stop trying to prove yourself.”“It's not your fault if you paid a bunch of money to a super coach and they didn't give you the basic consideration that you should get as a customer… It is never okay for somebody to be mean to you, to be cruel to you, to lie to you, to make an example out of you, or to gaslight you.” “We project our light onto these people. We think they know The Things and they have The Right Way and all that stuff. And that's you. You can trust yourself.”
If you’ve been following along on Instagram, you may have caught that a few weeks ago I posted about my decision to cancel my biggest launch of the year. I had just announced Brave Coach Week, which was a joy to run last year and was shaping up to be the same. Off the back of that, I was going to announce the next round of the Self Belief Coaching Academy, the course that’s at the centre of my work and heart. All seemed like it should fall into place. And then… I just wasn’t feeling it.Tune in for my story of what happens when you ditch a launch strategy that just doesn’t seem to fit and embrace the complexity of making decisions that truly align with how you want to show up.QUOTES“Can we dispense with any notion that everything has to be a “hell yes”, or it's a no. We're so much more complex and nuanced than this. Decisions are rarely this clear cut, so if it's not clear to you, nothing's gone wrong.”“It's okay to show up as you are now and to trust that your people will come with you.”“Money comes from our relationships with people. It comes from trust and consistency, but that means that we really need to know who our clients are. We need to know how our thoughtful services and our helpful products make our clients' lives better.”
This episode is a little piece of magic brought to you live from Aotearoa, New Zealand. The day after I landed from the UK, I boarded a Very Tiny Plane in order to spend the day with dear friend and fellow coach, Sammie Fleming.Sammie’s coaching practice is all about supporting creatives, coaches, space holders, and healers to claim their wholeness, leadership and deep confidence with ease and flow.Tune in as Sammie and I give you a peek into our time together, including insights on the crossroads between ambition and intuition, accessing your true desires, and holding space in both your client work and everyday life. You can find Sammie at If you are ready to deepen your coaching presence and advance your coaching mastery, you are invited to consider the Self-belief Coaching Academy. This evidence-based, trauma-informed, ICF-accredited programme is specifically designed for practitioners whose clients are impacted by self-doubt. QUOTES FROM SAMMIE“It's a skillset to be able to be deep in the unknown and hold it without forcing any direction. To navigate your client and really, truly hold them.”“I’m quite disinterested in holding my clients accountable and nowadays. I'm so much more interested in cultivating a fire so strong that they are going to do the thing anyway.”“There's no such thing as the ‘good client’. You don't have to perform for me. You don't have to achieve for me. I'm just going to sit and bask in all of you.”“Abundance comes in many, many, many forms. Including the ability to pot around and drink your coffee slowly. Or be on stage in front of 10,000 people. Or spend an entire month reading all the books you wanted to read all year. Not one of these is more important or valuable than the other.”
In this episode, we are addressing a topic that comes up all the time during Supervision sessions and in training coaches in the Self-belief Coaching Academy: how to go 'deeper' with coaching clients.While the specifics for each of your individual clients will obviously vary, I wanted to spend some time looking at the generalised contexts that tend to be present. And also to know that this is a really, really common question for coaches to ask!I'm sharing three approaches designed to help you access a deeper space with clients. I also share why a desire for new approaches is a great sign that you are evolving as a coach. Let's get into it!  If you are ready to deepen your coaching presence and advance your coaching mastery, you are invited to consider the Self-belief Coaching Academy. This evidence-based, trauma-informed, ICF-accredited programme is specifically designed for practitioners whose clients are impacted by self-doubt. Quotes "As coaches, we can get wedded to our client's goals and we end up coaching around the goal and not the person. We can easily take it as a personal failure if the client doesn’t get to where they want to go. But what if the goal isn’t helpful for the client’s growth? What if the goal changes? What if the client achieves the goal but feels flat and disappointed? When we focus on goals, we can end up solving the wrong problem'."“The reasons that we have protective, resistant behaviours is no accident. They’ve served important purposes. But at some point, we need support to try new ways of doing things, of getting our needs met.”“After the first 100 hours or so of client work, you may have taken your foundational coaching skills as far as you can. You are likely to be feeling curious and ready for more.”
Our coach training equips us with incredibly helpful tools, concepts and approaches, and client work provides the real-world experience of supporting actual humans, most professional coaches find that there is still something missing. And no I don't mean a business coach! We need a different third thing - a learning space that helps us to make sense of everything. Where we can reflect on our relationship with very specific, three-dimensional, paying clients (not theoretical avatars or other trainee coaches).Where we can feel supported and frankly, less lonely in this work (it's super tricky when we work from the kitchen table or the spare room!)And we usually need other resources and choices for supporting clients more effectively (because none of us know what we don't know). As the coaching industry matures, being in Supervision is now recognised as the standard for coaching excellence. And having been in Supervision for a decade, I honestly don't know how any coach does this work without it. I'm delighted to welcome Kris Shepard back to the podcast to chat more about Supervision - Kris is a Life Coach and Supervisor who helps coaches show up authentically with their clients and masterfully hone their unique coaching style. In this episode, we talk through the ins and outs of coaching supervision, and why it should be the first point of call for coaches who are figuring out this beautiful, helpful work. You can find out more about Kris at  If you’re interested in coaching supervision with me, a Growth Edge Supervision Circle will be beginning in May. You can click here to find out more and join the waitlist:
Urgh criticism is The Worst, isn't it?  Just the thought of it makes most of us clench up. So let's have a peek at what's actually going on.In this episode, we'll explore why we are so afraid of criticism, where that 'urgh' reaction comes from, and what we can do to get more comfortable with what other people think. For this week’s free resource, you can download my recent workshop What will people think?!, which dives even further into how to lovingly detach from other people’s opinions: a question about self-doubt that you want me to answer? You can submit a question for the podcast right here: QUOTES“Self-doubt isn't particularly logical or rational. Most of the time we can see that this is not a very healthy belief for me to hold, but somehow, can't go through with an alternative.”“Anyone's opinion of you is first filtered through their own perspective. We have to be discerning about whose criticism is worth listening to”"Every quality is neutral. There is no inherent best or right way; it's all in the context and the nuance between the two poles."
This week my guest Sophie Howarth and I are diving into what it really means to create your own pace in a culture that prioritises faster and more.Sophie is an artist, writer and teacher, whose work is about deepening connection to ourselves, one another and the wider web of life.  We talk thorough ways to tune into your surroundings and get comfortable with going slow, and how Sophie includes and promotes this practice in her own work.Tune in to see just how much you can discover on a pilgrimage within the fabric of your own life! About Sophie Across an eclectic career spanning the arts, activism, social enterprise and government, Sophie has been committed to developing more imaginative responses to our most urgent concerns. Best known as the Co-Founder and first Director of The School of Life, Sophie has also been Curator of Public Programmes at Tate Modern, Faculty Lead at Year Here, Head of Education and Research at iniva, and a Special Advisor on Social Action in the Number 10 Policy Unit. She is also the author of several books including The Mindful Photographer, Street Photography Now and Family Photography Now.You can find out more about Sophie here: Interested in Self-belief School? Here’s all the info: References“Ode” by Zoe Higgins (poem)“I thank you god for this most amazing day”, E E Cummings (poem)If Women Rose Rooted, Sharon Blackie (book)Quotes“Tuning ourselves into noticing brings so much depth, but it can't be done in a hurry. You just can't do it if you're busy getting from A to B in a race.” “Sometimes making peace with all the things undone, all the people that we failed to get back to, all the ambitions that we're not pursuing, allows for this really loving space of just being with what is.”“With that privacy attention, these things that happen without an audience, that aren't shared, that aren't for anyone else except our ourselves and our beloveds. These are the really precious resources that we have.”
A huge 2023 welcome back to Courage and Spice! I took some time to reset over the Christmas holiday, a much needed step back that made me realise just want it means to fully commit to rest and rejuvenation instead of just stopping work.As I make plans for the new year, I’m realising that there’s no reason for the spaciousness that I felt to disappear. Which is why I’m focusing this episode on how to stay in a gear that honours your energy and creativity.I’m also making some changes to how our episodes are going to be released, which means that every solo episode will come with a free resource to help you put everything we talked about to action! Click here for this week’s Guide to Uncovering Courage Based Goals: Signups for Self-belief School are now open! Click here for more info: QUOTES“There's so much emphasis on growing and getting bigger and more audiences, and my fire has just gone out for that kind of stuff. I'm already connected to the most amazing folks”“When you just let your mind wander with no fixed destination or idea for what should happen, it's going to give you a breadcrumb trail that's worth following.” “A goal is just a temporary state: we are learning some stuff about ourselves, trying to achieve something or part of something. And at the end of that, we can go :what really worked? What do I want to do more of? What's the next 30 day goal?”
For my last episode of 2022, I’m talking about the number one action that I’ve taken to grow my business. Now stay with me, because I know this can come with a lot of feelings… that action is asking for feedback!We tend to avoid feedback because many of us equate it with criticism. The secret is that the benefits of getting that feedback far outweigh the fear around it. This means building the courage to ask is one of the best things you can do for your work, business and personal growth.So what’s this episode really about?I’m breaking down how feedback can really benefit you in order to challenge the fears around it and be able to use it as a strength! There are a few different angles to this:Feedback is the intel that will make ‘that thing’ that you’re trying to do the most impactful it can be, because it’ll speak specifically to those you’re trying to help.Conflicting feedback can strengthen your self-trust, as different perspectives put you in touch with your own.If you’re a perfectionist, practicing asking for feedback can take the pressure off feeling you need to be the expert on everything. Tune in for more on how to get comfortable with the how’s, when’s and why’s of asking for feedback, and then using it to take action! Connect with Sas Petherick:Website: if you heard my introduction and are interested in coaching supervision, you can sign up for Growth Edge Circle here: You can quote me on that…“Asking for feedback before you've made your thing, or completed it, is a great way of adding in your client's voice to whatever it is that you are creating on their behalf.”“If you ask a range of different people for feedback, you're probably going to get different perspectives, and sometimes they will be in conflict with each other. It’s a really great opportunity to just sink into your own discernment.”“My protective self-doubt is always telling me to wait until everything is right, to be afraid of risking criticism and rejection. And then I sit with the question, what else could be true? And I find that there's almost never a really good reason to wait.” Like what you hear? Why not help me reach more ears (and give my self-belief a boost) with a 5-star rating?Sign up for SBCA 2023 here:
Today, we are visiting our guest, Agnes Becker’s world.This is the world of we are stardust - a place where art and science collide to enrich your experience of and relationship with our messy, beautiful universe.So what’s this episode really about?Agnes creates artwork that inspires connection with the more-than-human world and online adventures that encourage you to rewild your soul.We talk about wonder, and hidden worlds, and finding both by slowing down and really looking. Agnes' invitation is to engage our senses and notice - and we'll be rewarded with the gift of opening our perception of ourselves and the way we experience the world.There is so much wonder in Agnes’ work. If you feel like you’re rushing around but you’re aware that something else is going on beyond that, in nature and in some deeper part of you, our conversation will help you find your way to your wild and beautiful soul.We discuss the attention economy, that first spring of COVID-19, how to let go of urgency and the grief that can come up when we reconnect with the natural world. She talks about how she navigated her way to a place where she weaves art and science together, and how We are Stardust is her place to belong in the world. If you’d like to connect to the more-than-human world, Agnes offers a portal.LINKSRewild Your Soul Workshop / Autumn Leaf Painting WorkshopBraiding Sweetgrass - Robin Wall KimmererSophie StrandAlan Watts quote / Ram Dass quote / Finding meteorite impacts in Aboriginal oral traditionConnect with Agnes Becker:Website:    @wearestardustukYou can quote me on that…“We are creatures not computers.” - Sas Petherick“That tiny moment, to look at that one leaf, it can change the perception of yourself, and change the way you’re thinking about the world and your life.” - Agnes Becker“What I love is the learning. Not just through the science but through the experience and observation and attention that art invites you to cultivate.” - Agnes BeckerLike what you hear? Why not help me reach more ears (and give my self-belief a boost) with a 5-star rating?Sign up for SBCA 2023 here:
If you notice there are stories you are telling yourself like “If my partner was different, I would feel loved” or “If my boss was a whole other human being, I would enjoy my work so much more” then this episode is for you!I'm sharing how to become aware of the expectations we carry around and the steps to take to make the shift from expectations to unconditional love. This process has dramatically transformed every single one of my relationships.What if no one needs to change for you to feel ok? What if the people you don't like, can be your greatest teachers? What if unconditional love is entirely possible for you to access? This episode is about relationships and the way we can show up to them from our healthy adult selves.You can quote me on that…“When we put our happiness in the hands of another human, we set both of us up to fail.” - Sas Petherick“Other people do and say things and we interpret what they do and say. That interpretation creates some kind of meaning that feeds into our beliefs. It’s what we believe that creates our feelings.” - Sas Petherick“When we’re willing to take responsibility for how we’re interpreting anyone else’s actions when we’re willing to take responsibility for what we believe, we crack a new level of adulthood.” - Sas PetherickLike what you hear? Why not help me reach more ears (and give my self-belief a boost)Sign up for SBCA 2023 here:
I’m really excited to chat with you today about a concept that has been brewing for me over the last few months - that every single story we tell about ourselves, has three different narratives.In this episode I discuss these three layers as I see them, and explain how going into the third layer is where we get to really understand something new about who we are.It's no accident that this is coming up for me right now, as I am currently in an in-depth training programme to certify as a Coaching Supervisor. In supervision what we’re trying to do is look at a bigger (super) perspective (vision) of our work as coaches. It's a big old soup of (sometimes uncomfortable) reflection!So do listen in:If you’re trying to figure out what’s happening for you in an area of your life that feels unsatisfying or confusing.If you’re a coach that’s curious about supervision practice, you might enjoy hearing more about my experience of it.And if you’re a human experiencing self-doubt, this approach to storytelling and meaning-making is likely to support you!LINKSWebsite: @saspetherickYou can quote me on that…“When we get into a reflective practice of some sort, we get to unearth an expanded narrative.” - Sas Petherick“Asking ‘what else could be true?’ brings in complexity, and also possibility. If we allow ourselves to really sit with that question we can start to see that the meaning-making we’ve drawn is specific to that story. It may not be a universal truth.” - Sas PetherickLike what you hear? Why not help me reach more ears (and give my self-belief a boost) with a 5-star rating?
Folks I’m so excited to welcome Katie Kurtz to the podcast. Katie is a licensed social worker and trained trauma specialist, certified coach, consultant and yoga teacher. Not only that, but she also facilitates a beautiful program called Cultivate, which is all about trauma-informed care, and has recently created the most beautiful card deck called Contain.So what’s this episode really about? This conversation is an in-depth conversation about trauma-informed care and trauma-informed coaching. Katie shares with us what trauma-informed care is, and how it came to be -  growing out of the roots of trauma therapy, PTSD and the experience of survivors. Trauma is something that affects all of us.We talk about how trauma-informed care has recently entered new and non-traditional fields, such as coaching, wellness and entrepreneurship businesses. Katie shares the importance of understanding that trauma-informed care has a significant history, and how to put this mode of care into embodied practice.We discuss how the current lack of supervision, mentorship, peer support, coaching and regulation means that many people are practising outside their scope if they identify as trauma-informed coaching people are practising outside their scope. It's really about how we move into this new wave of trauma-informed care to make it adaptable for all professions and spaces.We finish up with Katie explaining how she prioritises resourcing herself, and how she cares for her nervous system, as well as how her beautiful card deck was created as a way to create space for ourselves, and others.Why you should listenIf you experience any discomfort around identifying as a trauma-informed practitioner, this conversation will help you understand its scope and how to embody the practice as ethically and holistically as possible.LINKSYou can find the Contain card deck right here!Connect with Katie Kurtz:Website:    @_katiekurtzConnect with Sas Petherick:Website: can quote me on that…“I don’t think we need to remove the term trauma-informed care, we need to reclaim it. Reclaim it in a way that brings us back to shared language and understanding of what it is. And encourage people to adopt it with integrity and within their scope of practice.” Katie Kurtz“You can’t say you’re trauma-informed, you have to be it. What I simply mean by that is, you can’t just use words and not have action behind it.” - Katie Kurtz“It’s about how we show up with this commitment to widen our lens and be super mindful of the lived experience of both ourselves and others and apply that as much as possible to the entirety of our work.” - Katie Kurtz“The paradox of being trauma-informed as a coach, means you know where you don’t go. You almost need to have a trauma-informed lens, so you know when you have reached the limits of that.” - Sas PetherickLike what you hear? Why not help me reach more ears (and give my self-belief a boost) with a 5-star rating?
I’m really excited to bring you this episode today, especially for all the coaches in the house as I share an incredible conversation I had recently with a few members of my business mastermind group.In this round table conversation, I’m joined by Ellie Swift, Taryn Bolt, Sofia Bernardi and Nivek Harrison as we talk about all the aspects of running a coaching business - the good, the bad and everything in between. This was such a generous conversation and I know you’re going to get so many takeaways as we talk about what we would do if we were starting out in business again. These incredible women have taught me so much about what it means to be in a community, and being surrounded by their support, encouragement and wisdom has been next-level awesome.If you’re in that first phase of making lots of decisions in your business and perhaps feeling a bit lonely, this conversation will be a breath of fresh air for you.LINKSWebsite: what you hear? Why not help me reach more ears (and give my self-belief a boost) with a 5-star rating?
Comments (2)

Cherise Nunez

I completely get this concept; I have a disease that essentially shuts down my digestive system. Since this, obviously, causes weight loss to the extreme that seems to invalidate my being "ill". I can be laying in a hospital bed with ivs in, feeling so very sick and frightened, but I "look so good" so it can't be bad. But it absolutely is bad.

Jun 8th

Christiann Walls

Just started listening to you and love your interviews and the topics you present in your podcast! Love it!!! Keep up the great work!!

Jun 21st
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