Stephan Livera Podcast

Summary In this conversation, Keith Gardner from Branta, discusses the importance of security in Bitcoin transactions. Keith shares his background in engineering and how he became involved in Bitcoin after recognizing the complexities and risks associated with traditional finance.  The discussion covers common phishing and address replacement attacks, the innovative solutions offered by Branta to enhance transaction security, and the future of Bitcoin in relation to mobile integration and privacy concerns. Keith emphasizes the need for user-friendly tools that can help prevent scams and ensure safe transactions in the evolving landscape of cryptocurrency.  The discussion also covers long-term strategies for Bitcoin custody, innovations in software security, and key takeaways for individuals to safeguard their investments. Takeaways Keith Gardner transitioned from engineering to Bitcoin due to complexities in traditional finance. Branta was created to address the fear of losing Bitcoin through phishing attacks. Phishing and man-in-the-middle attacks are significant threats in Bitcoin transactions. Branta aims to provide a solution that verifies Bitcoin addresses before transactions. Mobile integration is a future goal for Branta, focusing on QR code technology. Branta operates as an invisible layer alongside existing wallets to enhance security. Privacy is a critical concern, and Branta ensures user data is protected. The software does not handle private keys or expose user Xpubs. Branta's future developments will include support for the Lightning Network. The goal is to make Bitcoin transactions safer and more user-friendly. Ensure secure transactions by verifying addresses before sending funds. Phishing attacks are prevalent; always guard your inbox. Education on security practices is crucial for crypto users. Creating friction in transactions can prevent impulsive decisions. Long-term strategies for Bitcoin custody are essential for security. Utilize multi-sig and cold storage for larger amounts of Bitcoin. Be cautious of urgency in requests for sensitive information. Nostra's web of trust can enhance security in transactions. Regularly check the authenticity of software before downloading. Treat your Bitcoin as if it were worth significantly more. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:36) - Keith’s background; What is Branta? (03:10) - Recent attack vectors on Bitcoin (Phishing and Address Replacement) (08:13) - Is Branta mobile friendly?  (12:12) - Is Branta for personal use or businesses? (17:09) - Integrating Lightning & other Layer 2 solutions  (18:24) - Sponsors (26:01) - Privacy concerns and User Data Protection (31:36) - Guarding against Phishing & Spoofing attacks (34:37) - Why is friction important in financial transactions? (38:50) - Bitcoin custody is a long-term responsibility  (39:15) - Sponsors (44:45) - What are the possible risks with Branta? (53:14) - Key takeaways for protecting your Bitcoin Links:  https://x.com/unfakekeith  https://x.com/BrantaOps  https://www.branta.pro/  https://github.com/BrantaOps  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Harris Irfan, CEO Cordoba Capital Markets & Advisor at @OnrampMENA joins me to discuss challenges and opportunities within Islamic finance, ethics of finance in business and the intersection of Islamic finance and Bitcoin. Harris highlights building a financial system focused on real economy transactions, sharing insights on finance, custody, and Bitcoin investment.  Summary In this conversation, Harris Irfan discusses his journey from conventional finance to Islamic finance and Bitcoin. He explores the challenges and opportunities within Islamic finance, particularly in relation to ethical finance and risk-sharing principles. The discussion delves into the intersection of Islamic finance and Bitcoin, highlighting the potential for Bitcoin to serve as a sound monetary system that aligns with Islamic principles. Harris emphasizes the importance of creating a financial system that prioritizes real economy transactions over speculative practices, and he shares insights on the future of finance, custody, and investment decisions in a Bitcoin standard. Takeaways Harris Irfan transitioned from conventional finance to Islamic finance and Bitcoin. Islamic finance emphasizes ethical finance and risk-sharing principles. Bitcoin is viewed as a modern form of sound money, potentially more Islamic than gold. The challenges of Islamic finance are exacerbated by the fiat banking system. Custody solutions for Bitcoin are evolving, with a focus on self-custody. Cultural perspectives on money influence the adoption of Bitcoin in Muslim communities. Trade finance can be structured to align incentives between investors and businesses. The VC industry may need to adapt to a sound money standard. Hurdle rates for investments will change in a Bitcoin economy. Optimism about the future of Bitcoin is essential for its growth. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro  (01:04) - Harris’s background with finance & Islamic banking (07:44) - Comparing Fiat banking with Islamic finance  (12:06) - The intersection of Islamic finance and Bitcoin (18:21) - Custodying Bitcoin - Individuals vs. Trusted custodians (25:51) - What are misconceptions about Bitcoin among muslims? (30:20) - What are the cultural differences when operating on a Fiat Standard vs Sound Money Standard? (33:27) - What does it mean to share risk in finance? (39:12) - The viability of different financial models (45:35) - What would finance look like in a Full Reserve Bitcoin banking world? (54:17) - How does one navigate with morality & ethics in the current Fiat world? (59:00) - Bitcoin compared to hurdle rates in investment decisions (1:02:11) - Outro Includes Paid Partnerships (16:04) - Sponsors (38:11) - Sponsor Links:  https://x.com/harris_irfan  https://www.ccmkts.com/ Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Summary In this episode, Kenji Tateiwa, CEO of Agile Energy X, discusses his extensive background in nuclear engineering and the impact of the Fukushima disaster on public perception of nuclear energy. He explains the innovative concept behind Agile Energy X, which leverages wasted renewable energy through Bitcoin mining to address curtailment and grid congestion issues in Japan. Kenji elaborates on the unique flexibility of Bitcoin mining as an energy buyer and its potential role in the future energy landscape, including the integration of circular economy principles. The conversation also touches on the challenges and opportunities in Japan's energy production, particularly regarding nuclear energy and the need for a diverse energy portfolio. Takeaways Kenji Tateiwa has a strong background in nuclear engineering. The Fukushima disaster significantly impacted public perception of nuclear energy. Agile Energy X aims to utilize wasted renewable energy through Bitcoin mining. Bitcoin mining can help solve curtailment and grid congestion issues. The concept of 'Megawatt to MegaHash' connects energy production to Bitcoin mining. Bitcoin mining is flexible and can be turned on and off as needed. AI data centers are less flexible compared to Bitcoin mining. Agile Energy X has a two-pronged strategy to hedge against market fluctuations. The circular economy can be integrated into energy solutions. Japan's energy future requires a diverse mix of energy sources. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:50) - Who is Kenji Tateiwa and what is TEPCO? (05:34) - What are the various components of energy markets? (06:30) - Fukushima and the perception of nuclear energy  (09:42) - What is Agile Energy X & why was it created? (14:15) - Convincing TEPCO to mine Bitcoin; Solving the energy issue (16:14) - Understanding Curtailment and Grid Congestion (20:06) - Sponsors (23:10) - Megawatt to MegaHash: Bridging Energy and Bitcoin (25:42) - Bitcoin Mining vs. AI Data Centers (29:02) - The competitive landscape of Bitcoin mining (33:26) - Sponsors  (37:58) - Challenges and opportunities in Nuclear Energy (42:12) - Curtailment of renewable energy could reach 42% in Japan by 2050? (45:41) - Scaling Bitcoin mining in Japan (47:02) - What is “The Ultimate Circular Economy”? (51:28) - The future of Japanese energy production (53:44) - The future of Agile Energy X Links:  https://agileenergyx.co.jp/en/   Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Lawrence Lepard, Managing Partner, Equity Management Associates, joins me to discuss the national debt crisis, inflation, possible price suppression of hard assets and the contrasting roles of gold and Bitcoin as sound money.  Summary In this conversation, Stephan Livera and Lawrence Lepard delve into pressing economic issues, including the national debt crisis, inflation, and the contrasting roles of gold and Bitcoin as sound money. They discuss the implications of the upcoming US election on economic policies and the market dynamics of gold and Bitcoin. The conversation also touches on the potential for economic suppression and the future predictions for both gold and Bitcoin in light of current financial trends. Takeaways The national debt is accelerating and poses a significant risk. Inflation is likely to rise again due to government policies. Gold is currently viewed as a safe haven, but Bitcoin is seen as the future of sound money. The upcoming US election could have major implications for Bitcoin and economic policies. Gold ETFs have been shrinking while Bitcoin ETFs are growing, indicating a generational shift in investment. The suppression of gold prices has been a long-standing issue, but Bitcoin may not face the same challenges yet. Future predictions suggest Bitcoin could reach $300,000 and gold could hit $5,000 in the next economic crisis. The need for sound money is becoming increasingly urgent as the dollar loses value. A monetary reset may be necessary to address the current economic challenges. Investors should consider diversifying into sound money assets like Bitcoin and gold. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (01:09) - US Govt. debt spiraling out of control (07:17) - Gold’s reaction to crisis (10:14) - Is inflation inevitable?; Managing interest rates (18:24) - CPI & asset inflation; Overvaluation of assets (24:18) - Sponsors (26:34) - Who is buying the Gold?; Gold vs. Bitcoin  (31:10) - Sponsors (33:12) - What does the US election mean for Bitcoin? (40:10) - What would cutting the size of the state look like? (45:58) - The significance of Bitcoin advocacy (48:43) - Gold & Bitcoin price suppression?  (55:00) - Possible Executive order on Bitcoin in the future? (57:07) - Will ‘The Next Big Print’ send Bitcoin to $350K? Links:  https://x.com/LawrenceLepard https://ema2.com/   Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

After a long and choppy bull-crab market, Dr. Ross notes that the bull market is here! Dr. Jeff Ross, founder, Vailshire Capital Management, joins me to discuss the ongoing sentiment in the markets, global liquidity, pitfalls and opportunities of this bull cycle, holistic living and more! Summary In this conversation, Dr. Jeff Ross discusses his transition from a bearish to a bullish outlook on Bitcoin and the broader market, emphasizing the importance of liquidity and central bank policies. He explains how liquidity flows impact asset prices, particularly Bitcoin, and outlines his predictions for economic growth and market behavior in the coming years. The discussion also touches on wealth inequality, the role of Bitcoin in addressing economic disparities, and strategies for investors, including the controversial 8% withdrawal rate for Bitcoin holders. Takeaways Liquidity is the key driver of asset prices. The transition from bear to bull markets is influenced by liquidity flows. Central banks play a significant role in market dynamics. Bitcoin is seen as a solution to wealth inequality. The US dollar remains the strongest currency despite global challenges. High liquidity environments lead to increased risk-taking behavior. Investors should consider Bitcoin as a significant part of their portfolio. Timing the market can be beneficial for fund managers but not for regular investors. The 8% withdrawal rate is reasonable for Bitcoin holders. Future economic growth may surprise - to the upside. Timestamps: Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:48) - Why is Dr. Jeff bullish?; Shift from bull-crab to bull (03:29) - The significance of M2 Money Supply & Global Liquidity (07:44) - Will the Fed rate cut increase asset prices? (10:38) - Liquidity into 2025? (16:09) - Recession fear overblown? (22:05) - Ever-increasing US Govt. debt and currency collapse across the world (30:07) - “Easy money begets stupid & risky behavior” (37:35) - Detachment of Bitcoin halving cycles from other major cycles (40:10) - Bhutan on a Bitcoin stacking spree; Changing world-order (44:01) - How do Gold & Bitcoin perform in a high liquidity environment? (47:23) - Asset allocation wrt Bitcoin for Institutional investors (53:23) - $475K Bitcoin target in play? (57:12) - Caution to take during a bull cycle (1:00:47) - Financial independence & 8% Withdrawal Rate? (1:07:24) - Closing thoughts Links:  drjeff@nostrplebs.com  https://primal.net/p/npub1k7vkcxp7qdkly7qzj3dcpw7u3v9lt9cmvcs6s6ln26wrxggh7p7su3c04l  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Andy Edstrom, Head of Managed Wealth at Onramp Bitcoin rejoins me to discuss the govt. debt levels, retirement planning on Bitcoin, price modeling, risks of leverage yield on Bitcoin and more! Summary In this episode, Andy Edstrom returns to discuss the evolution of Bitcoin since their last conversation, touching on price modeling, the risks of leverage, and the future of Bitcoin loans. They explore the implications of government debt, the role of gold, and the potential for yield in a Bitcoin standard. The conversation emphasizes the importance of understanding market dynamics and preparing for various economic scenarios. Takeaways Bitcoin's evolution has led to increased participation and conversation on the world stage. Price modeling in Bitcoin is fraught with challenges and often fails to predict future movements. Leverage in Bitcoin can lead to significant losses, as seen in past market downturns. The future of Bitcoin loans is uncertain, with a need for better credit analysis and terms. Retirement planning in a Bitcoin world requires careful consideration of inflation and spending habits. Government debt is at an all-time high, raising concerns about future economic stability. Gold still plays a role in the financial landscape, but Bitcoin is seen as the future. Yield may still exist under a Bitcoin standard, but it will differ from current fiat systems. The importance of maintaining on-ramps and off-ramps for Bitcoin in the future cannot be overstated. Expect wild times ahead as economic conditions continue to evolve. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (01:14) - How has Bitcoin changed since 2019? (04:12) - How significant are Bitcoin Price Models? (11:28) - Preparing for all possible scenarios when Bitcoin price appreciates (14:27) - Should you time the market?; Volatility, Retirement and Tax events to consider. (22:01) - How has the market for leverage on Bitcoin evolved? (27:45) - Sponsors (30:40) - The case for loans with Bitcoin as a collateral  (38:04) - Retirement planning and achieving FIRE with Bitcoin? (43:20) - Bitcoin on its way to $400K? (50:14) - The instability of the growing US Govt. Debt - what happens next? (55:25) - Sponsors (57:47) - The Haves and the Have Nots; Overvaluation of property markets (1:01:57) - What does yield look like on a Bitcoin Standard?  (1:13:22) - Closing thoughts Links:  https://x.com/edstromandrew  https://www.amazon.com/Books-Andy-Edstrom/s?rh=n%3A283155%2Cp_27%3AAndy+Edstrom  https://x.com/OnrampBitcoin/status/1836029421922263074  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

With growing institutional adoption of Bitcoin through custodians, investors will demand transparency through ‘Proof of Reserves’. Alexander Leishman, CEO & CTO, River joins me to discuss more of the institutional adoption of Bitcoin, Coinbase’s hesitation towards Proof of Reserves, US Govt. debt and more. Summary In this episode of the Stephan Livera podcast, host Stephan speaks with Alex Leishman, CEO and CTO of River, about various topics surrounding Bitcoin, including the current state of exchanges like Coinbase, the importance of proof of reserves, and the growing adoption of Bitcoin among businesses. They discuss the implications of stablecoins, the comparison between Bitcoin and gold, and the future of Bitcoin technology. Alex emphasizes the need for transparency in the industry and the importance of maintaining a solid foundation for Bitcoin's development. Takeaways Coinbase likely has the coins they claim, but proof is needed. Proof of reserves should include liabilities for full transparency. Bitcoin adoption is growing among businesses of all sizes. Stablecoins serve as a necessary tool for many users. The future of Bitcoin as a store of value is promising. Gold's historical significance may not hold against Bitcoin's advantages. Self-custody remains a challenge for many Bitcoin users. Bitcoin technology is evolving, focusing on reliability and security. The political landscape may influence Bitcoin's regulatory environment. Community education is crucial for fostering trust in custodians. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:34) - Does Coinbase hold all the Bitcoin they claim to? (02:33) - What happens when liabilities are more than assets? (06:44) - @River ‘s Proof of Reserves - Explained (10:32) - How does Proof of Reserves mitigate the risk of ‘Paper Bitcoin’? (12:07) - Sponsors (14:22) - Why Proof of Reserves could be difficult to implement for Coinbase? (17:56) - Why Business Bitcoin adoption grew by 30% in 1 year (21:30) - The increasing US Govt. debt & the role of Bitcoin (23:08) - Gold vs Bitcoin  (26:32) - Risks of centralization of Bitcoin custody through ETFs (30:45) - Sponsor (34:15) - Bitcoin’s role in commerce - Store of Value of Medium of Exchange? (38:00) - Does Bitcoin need an upgrade? (41:24) - Are stablecoins a hindrance to Bitcoin adoption? (47:20) - US Presidential election affecting Bitcoin (52:56) - Way forward with Bitcoin Development (56:45) - Closing thoughts  Links:  https://x.com/Leishman  https://x.com/River/status/1831374555530830304  https://x.com/Leishman/status/1836406012405772568  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Secession may seem like a dirty word, but it has happened many times in history and it’s worth understanding the political and economic benefits it can yield. Ryan McMaken, Executive Editor and Economist at the Mises Institute joins me to discuss his book, Breaking Away.  Summary In this conversation, Stephan and Ryan McMaken discuss the topic of secession and its advantages. They explore the historical and theoretical context of secession, highlighting the benefits of radical decentralization and the success of small, economically prosperous states.  They also examine the conditions that enable breakaway states, including economic factors, military power, and ethnic or nationalistic identity. The conversation emphasizes the need for people to come to terms with the reality that the federal government cannot offer long-term economic prosperity and that unity does not necessarily mean shared values or interests.  The conversation explores the challenges and potential solutions related to secession and breakaway movements. It discusses the negotiation process for exiting a larger government entity, the impact on national debt and pension obligations, and the historical examples of successful secession.  The conversation also touches on the Brexit movement and the potential for secession movements in the United States. It emphasizes the importance of developing competing elites at the state level and gradually asserting more local control over policies and resources. Takeaways Radical decentralization and the success of small, economically prosperous states are key advantages of secession. Breakaway states often emerge when the benefits of political unity no longer outweigh the benefits of separation. Conditions that enable secession include economic factors, military power, and ethnic or nationalistic identity. The federal government cannot guarantee long-term economic prosperity, and unity does not necessarily mean shared values or interests. Secession and breakaway movements require careful negotiation, especially regarding national debt and pension obligations. Historical examples show that debt write-downs and negotiations are common in secession processes. Brexit can be seen as a failure or a missed opportunity, depending on one's perspective. Competing elites at the state level can challenge the entrenched interests of the federal government. Gradual steps, such as asserting control over border policy and creating state-level institutions, can pave the way for secession. Developing local revenue sources is crucial to reduce reliance on federal funds and assert more autonomy. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (01:00) - What is Secession and why care about it?(05:25) - Why has the number of countries tripled since WW2?(09:00) - Why be Pro-secession? (14:45) - Pros & Cons of a ‘Large’ State; Political Decentralization  (19:28) - Sponsors (21:45) - Advantages of smaller countries (27:30) - Conditions that enable the pathway to Secession  (33:11) - Sponsors (41:07) - Dealing with Government Debt & obligations in a Secession (46:23) - Was Brexit a failure? (56:28) - Secession in the USA: A distant dream? (1:02:42) - Elites vs. Counter-elites (1:06:58) - Secession movements in the USA (1:15:39) - Closing thoughts  Links:  https://mises.org/profile/ryan-mcmaken https://mises.org/library/book/breaking-away-case-secession-radical-decentralization-and-smaller-polities  https://x.com/ryanmcmaken Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

My friend Pierre Rochard (VP Research at Riot Platforms) rejoins me on the show to discuss some of his latest views. Summary In this conversation, Stephan and Pierre discuss the concept of long-term savings in Bitcoin and its product-market fit. Pierre introduces a metric for measuring long-term savings by looking at the age of UTXOs (unspent transaction outputs). They also explore the idea of rebalancing and the importance of aligning financial decisions with personal goals. The conversation then shifts to the challenges of running a profitable business in a Bitcoin standard and the role of passive index equity investing in a hyper Bitcoinized world. Further, Pierre and Stephan discuss the implications of individuals and governments holding Bitcoin. They explore the idea of investing time in Bitcoin rather than just money, and how businesses can leverage Bitcoin without large capital investments. They also touch on the moral implications of educating others about Bitcoin and the potential cultural changes that may occur on a Bitcoin standard. The conversation concludes with a discussion on government adoption of Bitcoin and the impact it may have on society. Takeaways Bitcoin has found product-market fit in the area of long-term savings, as evidenced by the increasing number of UTXOs that have not moved in more than a year. The age of Bitcoin UTXOs can provide insights into the behavior of hodlers and the overall health of the Bitcoin network. Rebalancing should be driven by personal goals and values, rather than trying to time the market or follow others' advice. In a Bitcoin standard, it may be challenging for businesses to outperform Bitcoin in terms of returns, but there may still be a role for active investing and supporting entrepreneurial ventures. Passive index equity investing may become less prevalent in a hyper Bitcoinized world, as individuals prioritize holding Bitcoin and investing in businesses they are actively involved in. Investing time in Bitcoin can be just as valuable as investing money. Businesses can leverage Bitcoin without large capital investments. Educating others about Bitcoin is important, but it's not necessary to force people onto the Bitcoin journey. Cultural changes on a Bitcoin standard may include a shift towards lower time preference and more focus on family and spirituality. Government adoption of Bitcoin can move them away from being a state and towards a more decentralized entity. The amount of Bitcoin a government holds should be based on their immediate needs and the uncertainty of the future. Government adoption of Bitcoin can accelerate Bitcoin adoption among individuals. The moral implications of the government holding Bitcoin depend on whether it leads to the violation of the non-aggression principle. Taxation with Bitcoin becomes more difficult, which may lead to a reduction in government spending. Advocating for a strategic reserve of Bitcoin can lead to more conversations and ultimately more Bitcoin adoption. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:57) - Bitcoin’s Product-Market Fit for Long-Term Savings (02:12) - Measuring Long-Term Savings with UTXO Age (10:56) - Should you Rebalance your UTXOs?; Financial Decision-Making through Rebalancing(21:17) - Sponsors (23:57) - Is Running a Business on a Bitcoin Standard Profitable? (33:22) - Passive Index Equity Investing in a Hyper Bitcoinized World (39:43) - Trading your Time & Expertise for Bitcoin (44:32) - Educating Others about Bitcoin (48:35) - Societal & Cultural Changes on a Bitcoin Standard (53:07) - Sponsors (1:02:00) - Should the State Hold Bitcoin?; Neutrality vs Central Planning  (1:13:41) - Advocating for a Strategic Reserve of Bitcoin; Accelerating Bitcoin Adoption Links:  https://x.com/BitcoinPierre  Pierre’s analysis: https://x.com/BitcoinPierre/status/1831163386182164937  Hoppe article mentioned: https://mises.org/mises-daily/yield-money-held-reconsidered  Blocktime Podcast by Riot: https://www.blocktimebyriot.com/  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Tankred Hase has experience working with various Bitcoin and Lightning companies such as Lightning Labs and Swan previously. He joins me to talk about Bitcoin, Lightning and Liquid. We discuss some of the real world challenges and trade offs that builders and developers face, as well as the likely path forward from here. Summary Tankred discusses the current state of Bitcoin, Lightning, and Liquid development. He highlights the progress made in terms of user experience and liquidity. However, he also acknowledges the challenges that still need to be addressed, such as capital gains taxes, technical hurdles, and the need for more user-friendly solutions. Tankred emphasizes the importance of having multiple options for using Bitcoin as money, including custodial solutions, Liquid, and trust-minimized solutions like Fedimint. He also discusses the trade-offs involved in designing user-friendly Bitcoin and Lightning apps. Tankred and Stephan discuss the different trade-offs and options available in the Bitcoin ecosystem, particularly in the context of Lightning Network and Liquid. They highlight that while some Bitcoin enthusiasts prioritize non-custodial and pure Bitcoin solutions, many users, especially in regions like Dubai, Turkey, and South America, opt for custodial exchanges like Binance for their convenience. Tankred introduces StashPay, a solution that leverages the Breeze SDK and Liquid to offer lower fees for receiving payments. They also discuss the future of Lightning, including broader adoption of Bolt 12, asynchronous payments, and improved privacy for receivers. Takeaways Bitcoin and Lightning have made significant progress in terms of user experience and liquidity. There are still challenges to be addressed, such as capital gains taxes and technical hurdles. Having multiple options for using Bitcoin as money, including custodial solutions, Liquid, and trust-minimized solutions, is important for broader adoption. Designing user-friendly Bitcoin and Lightning apps requires making trade-offs and understanding the needs of different user populations. Users in the Bitcoin ecosystem have different preferences and priorities when it comes to trade-offs and options. Custodial exchanges like Binance are popular for their convenience, even among Bitcoin enthusiasts. StashPay, using the Breeze SDK and Liquid, offers a solution with lower fees for receiving payments. The future of Lightning includes broader adoption of Bolt 12, asynchronous payments, and improved privacy for receivers. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:43) - Current state of Bitcoin, Lightning, Liquid development (02:10) - Does the market support Bitcoin as a Medium of Exchange yet? (05:20) - What stops people spending/earning now?(18:42) - Sponsors (20:55) - Advancing Bitcoin as MoE (29:49) - Sponsors  (30:45) - Using Liquid and navigating skepticism around it (35:29) - What is StashPay?; Leveraging Breez SDK (43:00) - How does it compare with BtcpayServer (47:51) - Leveraging the economic density of Lightning Network Links:  https://x.com/tankredhase  https://blog.onionmill.com/p/introducing-stashpay-a-bitcoin-wallet  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Philipp Bagus rejoins me to discuss his newest book, ‘Full Reserve Banking versus The Real Bills Doctrine’. This is his response to Juan Ramón Rallo, and in it we discuss: 🔸 The currency school and the banking school 🔸The problem of ‘double availability’  🔸Why the creation of fiduciary media is a problem 🔸The correct categorization of goods and money 🔸Full Reserve in a Bitcoin world?  🔸Milei’s work in Argentina Summary: In this conversation, Stephan interviews Dr. Philipp Bagus about the full reserve banking versus the real bills doctrine. They discuss:  The importance of the fractional reserve banking system and its impact on the monetary system and society as a whole.  The historical context of the currency school versus the banking school debate in the 19th century.  The concept of double availability and its implications for the stability of the money supply. The real bills doctrine and its justification for fractional reserve banking. The categorization issues surrounding money and financial assets.  In this conversation, Philipp Bagus discusses the flaws of fractional reserve banking and the importance of understanding the distinction between stock and flow of savings. He explains that holding fiduciary media, such as government bonds, does not count as real savings because it involves credit transactions and does not free up consumer goods. Bagus also explores the potential for banking systems to evolve on top of Bitcoin, highlighting the need for full reserves and the importance of legal enforcement to prevent fraud. He concludes by discussing the economic and political challenges faced by Argentina's President Javier Milei. Takeaways: Fractional reserve banking, where banks create new money out of thin air, is a major problem in the monetary system and has far-reaching ramifications. The debate between full reserve banking and fractional reserve banking has historical roots and has been a topic of discussion among Austrian economists. The concept of double availability is crucial in understanding the distinction between loans and deposits, and the potential for credit expansion and business cycles. The real bills doctrine, which justifies fractional reserve banking, is based on the idea that banks can issue short-term loans backed by goods, but it fails to address the inherent problems of credit expansion. Money is not a financial asset, but a present good that facilitates exchange and reduces uncertainty. It is distinct from financial assets and should be categorized separately. Understanding the distinction between stock and flow of savings is crucial in evaluating the flaws of fractional reserve banking. Holding fiduciary media, such as government bonds, does not count as real savings because it involves credit transactions and does not free up consumer goods. The evolution of banking systems on top of Bitcoin should prioritize full reserves and legal enforcement to prevent fraud. President Javier Milei of Argentina faces economic and political challenges in his efforts to reform the country's monetary system. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (01:05) - Why care about full reserve banking? (03:18) - Currency school vs the Banking school and the role of Mises (09:15) - Free banking vs Fractional Reserve banking - the issue of double availability (17:17) - What is the Real Bills Doctrine? (31:50) - Sponsors (34:27) - The issue with the desire for a ‘stable money’ (41:20) - “Everything is either a real asset or a financial asset.” - J.R. Rallo; monetary substitutes (46:42) - Is money a financial asset?; Cash holdings (Stock) vs Savings (Flow) (55:21) - Sponsor (56:51) - Why does holding fiduciary media not count as ‘real savings’?  (1:00:30) - Summarizing the critique  (1:03:56) - Bitcoin substitutes - Ecash, Ark, L-BTC, Custodial bitcoin (1:13:27) - Potential for Bitcoin to evolve as a Full Reserve banking system (1:18:45) - Positive & negative assessment of Javier Milei  (1:26:07) - Implication of stablecoin use in Argentina  Links:  https://x.com/PhilippBagus  https://mises.org/profile/philipp-bagus  https://mises.org/library/book/full-reserve-banking-versus-real-bills-doctrine  Sponsors: Bold Bitcoin mempool.space/accelerator  CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Bitcoin security, especially during the upcoming bull run, is extremely important. In this high powered hardware security panel episode featuring NVK, Craig Raw, Rearden, Salvatoshi, AddBTC, we discuss the key trade offs of bitcoin hardware security. 🔸What are the implications of Dark Skippy? 🔸What are some of the most common ways people lose their coins?  🔸Risks of USB in hardware wallets 🔸Standardization & inspection of wallets Summary The panel discusses the recent Dark Skippy attack and its implications for Bitcoin security. They emphasize the importance of considering the entire threat model and the various ways in which users can lose their coins. The conversation touches on topics such as bad backups, social attacks, exchanges, and computer and phone vulnerabilities.  They highlight the trade-offs involved in hardware security and the need for a balance between security, privacy, and user experience. The conversation explores the security considerations and trade-offs in hardware wallets for Bitcoin. The participants discuss the risks associated with USB connections, the vulnerabilities of counterfeit devices, the importance of trust on first use, and the role of social security in the Bitcoin ecosystem.  They also touch on the need for standardized protocols, the challenges of inspectability, and the importance of a holistic approach to security. The conversation concludes with a reminder to not panic and to choose a hardware wallet that suits individual needs and preferences. Takeaways Consider the entire threat model when evaluating Bitcoin security. There are multiple ways users can lose their coins, including bad backups, social attacks, and vulnerabilities in computers and phones. Entropy plays a crucial role in key generation and signing. USB connections pose significant risks and may not be adequately secure. Hardware security involves trade-offs between security, privacy, and user experience. USB connections pose security risks due to the potential for exfiltration of sensitive information. Counterfeit devices, such as counterfeit FTDI UART to USB converters, can introduce vulnerabilities. Trust on first use is crucial in hardware wallets, as it establishes a secure foundation for subsequent operations. The Bitcoin ecosystem relies on a combination of technical security measures and social security practices. Standardized protocols and open standards are important for interoperability and reducing vendor dependence. Inspectability of software updates and communication processes is essential for maintaining security. A holistic approach to security considers factors such as usability, privacy, and user experience. Multisignature and Miniscript are practical solutions for enhancing security in hardware wallets. The best hardware security device for Bitcoin is the one that is used regularly and suits individual needs and preferences. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (01:03) - Panel’s reaction on ‘Dark Skippy’ (14:33) - Most common ways people lose their coins (22:57) - Entropy in key generation and signing (28:04) - Sponsors (30:41) - Risks of using hardware wallets with USB (47:54) - Sponsor (49:02) - Standardization of hardware wallets; synchronous communication between external devices (55:16) - Community review and safety (1:05:10) - Closing thoughts Links:  https://x.com/add_BTC https://x.com/nvk https://x.com/craigraw https://x.com/reardencode  https://x.com/salvatoshi  Blog post: https://www.ledger.com/blog/towards-a-trustless-bitcoin-wallet-with-miniscript  Prior episode on Dark Skippy: https://stephanlivera.com/episode/597/  Sponsors: CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Sahil Chaturvedi, Designer at Foundry joins me to share his experience of getting on zero fiat and fully embracing Bitcoin as a unit of account. We discuss:  🔸#GetOnZero fiat   🔸Tools required to crossover  🔸Tax implications 🔸Weathering volatility 🔸Using intermediaries to live on a Bitcoin Standard  Summary Sahil discusses the concept of 'Get On Zero' and the reasons behind it. The conversation explores the concept of 'get on zero,' which means minimizing fiat currency holdings and maximizing Bitcoin holdings. He explains that the idea originated from a Twitter space conversation and grew into a community discussing tactics and strategies for minimizing the amount of fiat currency held. Sahil emphasizes the importance of rethinking the function of fiat currency and considering it as a payment rail to move Bitcoin rather than an asset to hold. He also addresses objections related to fiat-denominated obligations, volatility, and the perception of being a hardcore Bitcoiner.  Sahil highlights the need for specific tooling, including interfaces with the legacy system, instant conversions between fiat and Bitcoin, fiat cards that auto-convert Bitcoin balances, and tax automation. Sahil explains that he personally holds 100% Bitcoin and sees it as a simple and beautiful way to manage his finances. He addresses the tax implications of using Bitcoin as a currency, emphasizing that capital gains tax is only applicable when there is a gain compared to holding fiat currency. Sahil also discusses the challenges and considerations for individuals, families, and businesses in adopting the 'get on zero' approach. Takeaways ‘Get On Zero’ is the concept of minimizing the amount of fiat currency held and rethinking the function of fiat as a payment rail to move Bitcoin. Objections related to fiat-denominated obligations can be addressed by considering the function of fiat currency and converting at the last millisecond. Volatility is a consideration, and building up a balance of savings is important to weather volatility. Specific tooling, such as interfaces with the legacy system, instant conversions, fiat cards, and tax automation, is necessary to achieve #GetOnZero. The 'get on zero' approach involves minimizing fiat currency holdings and maximizing Bitcoin holdings. Using Bitcoin as a currency can simplify financial management and eliminate the need to constantly buy and sell assets. Capital gains tax is only applicable when there is a gain compared to holding fiat currency. Tooling and technology play a crucial role in enabling individuals and businesses to adopt the 'get on zero' approach. Considerations for families and businesses include tooling, income vs. expenses, and the need for a cash balance for stability. Using intermediary companies and physical cash can be alternative ways to spend Bitcoin while minimizing fiat currency usage. The 'get on zero' approach may not be suitable for those who are strictly anti-KYC or uncomfortable with Bitcoin's volatility. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (02:23) - Managing the USD obligations & rethinking function of fiat currencies (04:43) - Should ‘Get on Zero’ be considered as a ‘purity’ test? (07:46) - Navigating the volatility of Bitcoin  (13:20) - Tools & services required to ‘Get on Zero’ (19:35) - Sponsor (20:53) - Tools & services required to ‘Get on Zero’ contd. (27:21) - Balancing cash and Bitcoin  (30:04) - Tax implications of ‘Get on Zero’ lifestyle (35:51) - Sponsor (37:05) - Sahil’s personal experience of getting on zero fiat (42:16) - Is it practical for families & businesses to ‘Get on Zero’? (49:40) - Using intermediaries to live on a Bitcoin standard (51:40) - Managing physical cash, Spending Bitcoin instead of ‘Selling’ Bitcoin (55:16) - Outro Links:  https://x.com/SahilC0  https://medium.com/@SahilC0/rethinking-the-function-of-fiat-currency-6263465aa2ff  https://www.tftc.io/author/sahil/  Sponsors: CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Dark Skippy is a new attack that in theory, makes it much easier for a malicious person to steal your coins. Listen in to learn about some of the ins and outs here, as well as mitigation and the path forward for the industry from @utxoclub , @LLFOURN & @robin_linus .  Why air gapping is not the be all end all Dark Skippy in context with other attacks Security while signing transactions, and security while generating keys RFC6979 Deterministic nonce generation Updating PSBT to help mitigate this attack Summary The conversation discusses the ‘Dark Skippy’ attack, a new method for leaking secret keys from a malicious signing device. The attack takes advantage of the nonces used in the Schnorr and ECDSA signature schemes. The new attack vector can potentially extract private keys and seed words from hardware wallets. The attack targets the nonce generation process during key generation and signing. The previous versions of this attack were inefficient, but Dark Skippy improves upon them. The contributors explain how the attack came about and its implications for hardware wallet security. They also discuss the RFC6979 deterministic nonce generation and the concept of anti-klepto signing protocols as mitigations against the attack.  While Dark Skippy is a sophisticated attack, it requires a high level of expertise and is not currently seen in the wild. The discussion highlights the importance of secure boot, upgrading the Partially Signed Bitcoin Transaction (PSBT) process, and improving the randomness of upfront key generation as potential mitigations.  However, it is emphasized that current reputable hardware wallets still provide a high level of security, and there is no immediate action required for users. Takeaways Dark Skippy is a new attack that leaks secret keys from a malicious signing device. The attack exploits the nonces used in the Schnorr and ECDSA signature schemes. Previous versions of this attack were inefficient, but Dark Skippy improves upon them. Mitigations against the attack include the RFC6979 deterministic nonce generation and anti-klepto signing protocols. Dark Skippy is a sophisticated attack that targets the nonce generation process during key generation and signing. Mitigations for Dark Skippy include implementing secure boot, upgrading the PSBT process, and improving the randomness of upfront key generation. Reputable hardware wallets currently provide a high level of security, and there is no immediate action required for users. The discussion highlights the importance of ongoing research and development to enhance the security of hardware wallets and protect against potential future attacks. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:45) - What is ‘Dark Skippy’? (04:39) - Is it an old attack vector? Bitcoin’s security evolving with time (12:41) - Sponsor (15:22) - What is a nonce?, RFC6979 Deterministic nonce generation (22:55) - Common ways of people losing their Bitcoin (31:08) - Sponsor (32:07) - Anti-klepto signing protocols; ways to mitigate risks of losing coins (39:51) - Updating PSBT to help mitigate this attack (43:26) - The role of Multisig in preventing the attack (49:57) - Other attack vectors in malicious actor’s toolkit (56:49) - Summarizing the steps to improve the ecosystem security (1:00:18) - Closing thoughts Links:  https://darkskippy.com/  https://frostsnap.com/  https://x.com/LLFOURN  https://x.com/robin_linus  https://x.com/utxoclub  https://x.com/utxoclub/status/1820520960476561825  Sponsors: CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) mempool.space/accelerator  Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Just like how English is the international language of business, Bitcoin’s lightning network is how various layers and apps and products will ‘talk’ to each other. Roy Sheinfeld, founder and CEO of Breez (@Breez_Tech) rejoins me to talk about updates in lightning and what’s new with Breez SDK.  We discuss the various layers and ways of interacting with Bitcoin and lightning, using Liquid (@Liquid_BTC) with swaps, and Bitcoin as a medium of exchange.  Summary: In this conversation, Stephan and Roy discuss the current state of Bitcoin and Lightning. They explore the contrasting narratives of Lightning startups shutting down and new partnerships being formed. Roy emphasizes that Lightning is a manifestation of the payments use case of Bitcoin and that the majority of Bitcoin usage is still for trading and as an asset. He believes that the value proposition of Bitcoin lies in its potential as peer-to-peer electronic cash. They also discuss the role of custodial and non-custodial solutions, the regulatory landscape, and the control exerted by governments and private companies.  Roy argues that Lightning is the common language of the Bitcoin economy, enabling interoperability between different subnetworks and protocols. He highlights the importance of Lightning as a rail for communication and the incentives for moving Bitcoin within the Lightning network. Breez is working on integrating Lightning Network into existing applications to make Bitcoin more accessible and usable. They have developed the Breez SDK, which allows developers to easily integrate Lightning functionality into their apps.  Breez offers two implementations: Greenlight, which is a pure Lightning implementation, and Liquid, which is a nodeless implementation of Lightning using the Liquid sidechain. The goal is to provide a seamless user experience for Lightning transactions and make Bitcoin a common language for payments. Breez is also exploring hybrid solutions and partnerships to expand the adoption of Lightning. Key Takeaways: The majority of Bitcoin usage is currently for trading and as an asset, but the value proposition lies in its potential as peer-to-peer electronic cash. Lightning is the common language of the Bitcoin economy, enabling interoperability between different subnetworks and protocols. There is a need for both custodial and non-custodial solutions, with a growing focus on self-custodial options. The regulatory landscape and control exerted by governments and private companies pose challenges to the use of Bitcoin as a medium of exchange. Incentives within the Lightning network encourage the movement of Bitcoin and the use of Lightning as a rail for communication. Breez is focused on integrating Lightning Network into existing applications to make Bitcoin more accessible and usable. They have developed the Breez SDK, which allows developers to easily integrate Lightning functionality into their apps. Breez offers 2 implementations: Greenlight, which is a pure Lightning implementation, and Liquid, which is a nodeless implementation of Lightning using the Liquid sidechain. The goal is to provide a seamless user experience for Lightning transactions and make Bitcoin a common language for payments. Breez is exploring hybrid solutions and partnerships to expand the adoption of Lightning. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:56) - The current state of Bitcoin & Lightning network (03:17) - Mutiny wallet’s contributions to Bitcoin (04:54) - Regulatory landscape, Dollarisation of Bitcoin & Importance of non-custodial solutions (14:43) - Sponsor (16:07) - HODLing vs Spending Bitcoin (18:55) - Lightning is the common language of the Bitcoin economy (22:50) - Lightning: Bitcoin’s interoperability protocol (29:42) - Liquid network - overview (31:27) - Existing frictions with the Lightning network; Greenlight implementation, Liquid implementation  (36:55) - Sponsors (38:57) - Boltz.exchange ( @Boltzhq ) X Breez (40:33) - Differences b/w Greenlight & Liquid implementation (49:00) - Lightning on Liquid soon? (52:25) - Possible future integrations & way forward for Breez (57:25) - Outro Links:  https://medium.com/breez-technology/lightning-is-the-common-language-of-the-bitcoin-economy-eb8515341c11  https://x.com/Breez_Tech  Sponsors: CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Mempool.space Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Thunder Funder is a new funding portal by Mike Jarmuz (CEO) and Rockstar Dev (CTO). This will be a new way to allow retail investors to participate in bitcoin company equity rounds. Muzz and I discuss the ins and outs of what this means, as well as what it could mean for bitcoin and open source companies.    Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:55) - Overview of Lightning Ventures & Thunder Funder (12:15) - Sponsor (13:50) - Pros and cons of investing in Bitcoin startups (19:28) - Liquidity, secondary transactions, Reg CF & overview of investing process (26:39) - Sponsor (27:30) - The etiquettes of information rights (32:02) - Carried interest  (35:25) - Getting involved in the bitcoin startup ecosystem (39:17) - Open source funding opportunities (42:14) - Way forward for Thunder Funder Links:  https://x.com/MikeJarmuz  https://x.com/r0ckstardev  https://x.com/ltngventures  https://x.com/ThunderFunderCF  https://thunderfunder.com/  Sponsors: CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Mempool.space Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Joining me is Antoine (@darosior), to discuss the latest developments around Liana and the growing importance of inheritance planning. We also delve into The Great Consensus clean up, important bug fixes and disclosure of Bitcoin core vulnerabilities.  Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:40) - The latest developments with Liana (02:16) - Inheritance planning with Liana (05:59) - What is The Great Consensus Clean up? (07:30) - What is the Timewarp bug? (15:51) - What would it take to fix the bug? (19:08) - Sponsors (21:08) - The Block Validation Problem (28:46) - The way forward with the fixes (31:23) - Sponsors (32:34) - Bitcoin core vulnerabilities (44:10) - Lesson from disclosures of Bitcoin core vulnerabilities (47:28) - Closing thoughts  Links:  https://x.com/darosior  https://wizardsardine.com/liana/  https://delvingbitcoin.org/t/great-consensus-cleanup-revival/710  https://bitcoincore.org/en/2024/07/03/disclose-bip70-crash/  Sponsors: CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Mempool.space Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Can you retire on Bitcoin savings? What do the numbers look like? Morgen Rochard, Founder and Lead Financial Planner of Origin Wealth Advisers joins me to explain:  The 4% rule and how to modify it Being conservative in your planning CPI inflation being hard to predict Do you rebalance?  Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (01:03) - 4% rule, Bitcoin & FIRE (04:41) - HODLers vs TradFi allocation (12:34) - Why you should be conservative with Bitcoin retirement (20:16) - What if you retire during a Bitcoin bull run? (22:24) - Sponsors (24:55) - Should you borrow against your Bitcoin stack? (31:41) - Where are the fiat financial planners going wrong? (37:34) - Separating Bitcoin from ‘Crypto’ (40:55) - The shift in sentiment about HODLing Bitcoin (42:39) - Sponsors (44:51) - Should you rebalance your Bitcoin allocation? (49:40) - Estimating currency debasement  (56:12) - Bitcoin’s CAGR Links:  https://bitcoinfinancialadvisorsnetwork.com/does-bitcoin-make-retirement-planning-obsolete/  https://x.com/MorgenRochard  https://www.originwa.com/  Sponsors: Swan.com (code LIVERA) CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Mempool.space Nomadcapitalist.com/apply Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

The global fertility crisis is on with many western and developed nations below replacement fertility. Joining me to discuss this problem is Daniel Hess (aka @MoreBirths on X).  Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro  (00:54) - How bad is the global fertility crisis? (04:50) - Implications of low birth rate for future generations (09:54) - Causes for declining global rate of fertility (11:53) - Marriages affecting birth rate (15:38) - Religion affecting birth rate (17:36) - Fertility rate in the East (21:28) - The impact of government policies on fertility rate (25:47) - Sponsors (27:43) - Urban planning & fertility rates (32:40) - The impact of welfare state on fertility rates (36:00) - Taking cues from the fall of Roman empire (41:16) - Insights from the population curve of South Korea (45:05) - Sponsors (47:30) - The ‘3 Child Norm’ (52:57) - The lessons from ‘Baby Boomers’ (55:38) - Recalibrating expectations (59:13) - The importance of low time preference  (1:04:00) - Deregulating childcare (1:14:20) - Outro Links: X.com/@morebirths  Sponsors: Swan.com (code LIVERA) CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Mempool.space Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack

Even as bitcoiners, we can’t deny that there is demand for ‘stablecoins’ or some kind of stable value feature. Tony Klausing, bitcoin and lightning developer joins me to talk about Stable Channels. This approach to stable value is self custodial, P2P, and bitcoin-native. We talk about the benefits, trade offs and who this would be suitable for.  Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro  (00:51) - Tony’s background  (03:28) - Opportunity of Stable Channels (05:46) - Fiat-backed stablecoins Vs. Crypto-backed stablecoins(10:23) - Overview of Stable Channels (14:17) - Difference between DLCs & Stable Channels (18:02) - Stable Channels during varying BTC price scenarios (21:34) - Sponsors (23:49) - Who are Stable Channels for? (30:50) - Dual funding & splicing on Stable Channels (32:24) - How do participants of Stable Channels find each other? (38:22) - Addressing concerns around Stable Channels  (41:12) - Sponsors (42:33) - Possible challenges for Stable Channels (46:43) - Payments on Stable Channels (52:07) - Is Stable Channels a ‘Quasi-decentralized exchange’? (53:57) - Lightning payment vs legacy financial payment (58:03) - Usability challenges (1:00:09) - Outro Links: https://x.com/tonklaus  https://stablechannels.com/  Sponsors: Swan.com (code LIVERA) CoinKite.com (code LIVERA) Mempool.space Stephan Livera links: Follow me on X: @stephanlivera Subscribe to the podcast Subscribe to Substack