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It’s Not a Race

Author: ABC Radio

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Race, racism, identity, culture, difference — let’s talk it out. It’s Not a Race, with host Beverley Wang, is the ABC podcast Australia needs right now.
22 Episodes
Jenna Wortham and Wesley Morris are two culture writers at The New York Times — and co-hosts of the hit podcast, Still Processing. They are pop culture commentary royalty, and on their first visit to Australia, Jenna and Wesley spoke to Beverley Wang on Stop Everything! for the only radio interview of their tour. As a special bonus for It's Not A Race, here's their full conversation. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
'Diversity' has become a popular talking point across all sectors of work, and diversity panels are regular fixtures of conferences, festivals and corporate events. But once the talk is done, and the warm, self-satisfied glow of attending has worn off — where does the hard work begin? For its season two finale, It's Not A Race teamed up with Audiocraft to present 'the diversity panel to end all diversity panels' with all-star guests Paola Balla, Santilla Chingaipe and Benjamin Law, live onstage with Beverley Wang, for a conversation about the double-edged sword of standing in for 'diversity' and where they would like to see the conversation progress. Also featuring a musical performance by Yeo. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
Things can become very racist, very fast on social media. We talk to a self-styled online 'Nazi-hunter' about her unusual hobby. And Yassmin Abdel-Magied, Osman Faruqi, Benjamin Law, Kumi Taguchi and Jeremy Fernandez share their advice for dealing with racism online. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
Candy Bowers and Busty Beatz are showbusiness sisters and collaborators who tell it as they see it. Fearless and unapologetic, they've long been vocal about the whiteness of arts institutions, and worked actively to critique representation from within and without. They talk to It's Not A Race about the highs and lows of decolonising creative spaces. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
International student, comedian, actor, Daily Show senior correspondent — Ronny Chieng has inhabited all these roles in many different locations. Malaysia born, US, Singapore and Australia-educated, Ronny's now based in New York. The self-described "forever immigrant" and "political cyborg" spoke to It's Not A Race about the shifting terrain of identity, and how he uses comedy to flip the script on conventional narratives. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
People of colour! It's the 'team name' for anyone who doesn't identify as white. But how well does this American term fit into the Australian context, and what are the tensions that lie beneath? We are unpacking team POC with Sangeetha Thanapal, an activist and writer who identified Chinese Privilege in Singapore, Loretta Ross, educator and US reproductive rights activist, and Eugenia Flynn, arts worker and community organiser. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
In 2013, #BlackLivesMatter shot into the consciousness as a cry from the heart. But four years on, how do you continue to galvanise interest and commitment in a movement that started with a viral message? Patrisse Cullors, Black Lives Matter co-founder, and Rodney Diverlus, co-founder of Black Lives Matter's Toronto chapter, talk to It's Not A Race. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
For many, the apocalypse is a future threat. But what if it had already happened, and we're living in a post-apocalyptic dystopia? It's Not A Race continues its exploration of storytelling by focusing on the way two Indigenous writers are drawing on history to envision future worlds. Claire G Coleman is the author of Terra Nullius, a speculative fiction novel with a twist, and Ryan Griffen is the creator of TV series Cleverman. Contact us at or tweet using #NotARace.
If stories are the basis for how we understand the world, how important is it to be the driver in the narrative? In the season two launch of It's Not A Race, Randa Abdel-Fattah and Anita Heiss explain how they're using their talents to claim space in the mainstream for marginalised characters. And find out how one mother responded when she discovered her child being used as a prop in a stranger's saviour story. Contact us at or tweeting #NotARace.
It’s Not A Race is back for a second season: race, racism, identity, culture, difference — let’s talk it out. Send us a tweet #NotARace, or an email to
British journalist and author Reni Eddo-Lodge stopped by for a Facebook live event at RN with Beverley Wang, and here's their conversation. Reni's the author of Why I'm No Longer Talking To White People About Race, which ironically has led her to talk to a lot of white people about race. She took your questions from Facebook and a few from Beverley too. Contact us at or by tweeting #NotARace.
All throughout the production of It's Not A Race, Beverley Wang asked her guests to finish this sentence, "The first time I saw me ... " When did they first see themselves represented in popular culture, in books, films, movies, music or TV? For some, the answers came easily. But for others, it was difficult. Contact us at or by tweeting #NotARace.
When was the first time you saw yourself reflected in a television character, film or book? If you’re a person of colour in Australia, it can be hard to find childhood fictional heroes that are truly representative. So while we were making It's Not A Race, Beverley Wang asked her guests to share their memories of connecting with pop culture Contact us at or by tweeting #notarace.
It's the question that doesn't go away, or lead us anywhere: Is Australia racist? It's Not A Race tries to figure out why we're so obsessed with this question, and whether it leads to any meaningful answers. Contact us at or use #NotARace.
What's it like to go from model minority to public enemy in the span of a year? People have strong views about Yassmin Abdel-Magied. But what does Yassmin think of it all? Contact us at or use #NotARace.
It's Not A Race explores what it's like to grow up as a biracial Australian, with Faustina Agolley, Lucie Cutting and Nkechi Anele. And producer Leona Hameed shares a story of sisterly conflict. Contact us at or use #NotARace.
Ask Dr Whiteness

Ask Dr Whiteness


This episode is all about what it means to be white, the concept of "whiteness", and why we can't talk about race without acknowledging whiteness. Dr Robin DiAngelo is a white woman, educator and consultant, and holds a doctorate in whiteness studies. She breaks it all down for It's Not A Race. We want to hear from you, send us an email or tweet us using #notarace.
In the most East Asian podcast episode ever produced by the ABC, Michael Hing, Caz Tran and Jennifer Wong drop by to chat with Beverley Wang. They talk about tackling assumptions, stereotypes, the "rep sweats" and Beverley's mum makes a prediction about podcasts. Contact us at or by tweeting us #notarace.
When you're part of a diaspora group, how do you break into the professional world that your parents want for you? It's Not A Race host Beverley Wang gathered Aamer Rahman, Santilla Chingaipe and Alice Pung together (gave them some seaweed snacks), and asked for their thoughts. Contact us at or #notarace on Twitter.
What was it like to be the first Indigenous star of a feature film? Get the story from Jedda herself, Rosalie Kunoth-Monks.
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