Grit in the Boardroom - Executive Interviews on Corporate Governance and Risk Management

When Chris’s appointment was leaked to the press before he'd even started, one newspaper called him a "colourful bachelor". Within a month, the regulator had issued its first ever official warning to his charity. And the board he inherited hadn't reformed its governance since 1974. In this episode of Grit in the Boardroom, Erika Eliasson-Norris, CEO of Beyond Governance, sits down with Chris Sherwood, Chief Executive of the NSPCC and former Chief Executive of the RSPCA. It's one of the most honest executive interviews yet on what leadership decisions it takes to reform a heritage organisation from the inside. The conversation opens with a moving tribute to Dame Esther Rantzen, whose vision for Childline has supported more than 6 million children and young people since it launched 40 years ago. [More information on Chris below.] The RSPCA's eighth chief executive in a decade, Chris inherited a board of 28 trustees, a £26m deficit and an impatient Charity Commission. Rather than cast himself as a hero, he took time to understand the problem and uncovered the real reason for resistance to reform. For trustees who had served for 25 or even 47 years, the RSPCA was their life; letting go felt like handing over a child. Within 12 months, the board shrank from 28 to 12 and the charity appointed its first independent chair in almost 200 years. The story offers one of Grit in the Boardroom's richest case studies in turnaround and management. Together, Erika and Chris explore the corporate governance questions every board should be asking. Why are most boardroom decisions really made outside the boardroom? How did reframing "should we change?" into "who wants to lead that change?" turn a regulator's warning into a mandate? And why does good risk management mean asking questions about harms that haven't been invented yet? Chris shares practical lessons on building trust between boards and executives, leading governance reform under regulatory pressure, and preparing for the risks of an AI-enabled world. He also speaks openly about why the NSPCC is personal. Childline was there for him as a child, and he explains why lived experience shapes his empathy but never his judgement. It's high stakes strategy, business resilience and company culture change, told with real warmth (and the odd very large glass of red wine). What you'll find in this episode of Grit in the Boardroom: Why Chris rejected the "hero on a pedestal" model of leadership and became the conductor of the orchestra instead. The real reason a 200-year-old board resisted reform, and why the official explanation was only the presenting problem. How to build informal authority when you have the title but not the credibility (even if colleagues think all you want to do is cuddle kittens). Why governance is about relationships, and why most boardroom decisions are made long before anyone sits down at the table. How a KC's opinion broke down a decades-old argument for doing nothing, and why you should never take "we can't change" at face value. Working with the regulator rather than fighting it: how constructive engagement delivered reform in 12 months instead of years in a statutory inquiry. The three warning signs Chris looks for on any new board: the chair and chief executive dynamic, a shared agenda, and a shared understanding of risk. Leading more than 230 redundancies with humanity, and why those decisions should never get easier. The swan metaphor, crisis communications, and how a charity AGM nearly knocked Boris Johnson off the front page. "Split screen leadership": running the day job while transforming the organisation, because disruption is the new normal for growth under pressure. How boards should govern risks like AI that move faster than regulation, and why fiduciary oversight is only part of the job. Chris's three pieces of advice for a new CEO or chair inheriting a broken board, starting with who's on your speed dial. Chris Sherwood is Chief Executive of the NSPCC, the UK's leading children's charity and the organisation behind Childline, a role he took up in January 2025. He previously spent over six years as Chief Executive of the RSPCA. There he led a governance overhaul that cut a board of 28 to a professional board of 12, turned around a planned £26m deficit, launched the ten-year strategy Together for Animal Welfare and oversaw the charity's first rebrand in more than 50 years. Before that he was Chief Executive of Relate. With more than 20 years in the voluntary sector, Chris is Trustee and Co-Vice Chair of NCVO and The Charity Awards judging panel, as well as holding the Institute of Directors' Diploma in Company Direction. Raised in Corby, Northamptonshire, he was the first in his family to go to university. In 2025 he was named one of Attitude magazine's 101 LGBTQ Trailblazers. _ Grit in the Boardroom is a bi-weekly podcast where Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with the best in business for executive interviews. She and her guests explore corporate governance beyond the sealed doors of the C-suite. As Governance Assessor for the Post Office Horizon IT Inquiry, the largest public inquiry in UK history, Erika Eliasson-Norris is helping shape accountability, governance reform, and corporate oversight across the UK. Beyond Governance provides on-demand company secretarial support, governance advisory, and governance training to boards, Company Secretaries, and General Counsel. Beyond Governance help organisations strengthen governance, manage risk, and support critical projects without the need for permanent hires. Learn more here: https://beyondgovernance.com/

Recorded in New Zealand during the Institute of Directors' IoD Leadership Conference 2026 in Wellington, this conversation with Cassandra Crowley brings Grit in the Boardroom's special series of executive interviews from New Zealand to a close. Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with Cassandra Crowley, a lawyer, accountant and seasoned chair who, as Erika puts it, has permission to offend both professions. She uses it brilliantly. Together they dig into the boardroom decisions and leadership decisions that separate box-ticking boards from truly great ones. Cassandra makes the case for renaming the risk committee the "opportunity committee", arguing that exceptional risk management looks to the horizon rather than back through a pile of assurance papers, and that "motherhood and apple pie" risk registers waste the chance to optimise a business. She also shares the one question she asks in every risk report and investment decision, a masterclass in strategic decision-making and high-stakes strategy: what would need to be true for this to go right, and what would need to be true for it to go wrong? Drawing on her recent work restoring functioning governance arrangements, Cassandra offers rare chair perspectives and governance lessons on what happens when governance breaks down, whether through corporate scandal or slow-burn dysfunction. "The board casts a long shadow," she warns. You can clear out an entire board and change every setting, but if management doesn't change, the culture won't either. It's a sobering take on company culture change, business resilience, and the trust it takes to rebuild an organisation that remembers everything. Why does a new highway belong to the board of decades ago? Why can you buy turnaround expertise but not curiosity? And why is not wanting to rock the boat one of the most dangerous things in a boardroom? Cassandra answers all three, with C-suite insights, management case studies and turnaround stories along the way. It's director dialogue at its sharpest on board effectiveness, leadership and growth under pressure. Her parting word on imposter syndrome: "You will always be the worst version of yourself when you're trying to be somebody else.” What you'll find in this episode: What a legal brain notices that an accounting brain misses, and vice versa Why risk committees should really be called opportunity committees The two-part question that reveals how deeply an executive has thought about risk How to stop a risk register becoming a document of history Why the board casts a long shadow, and where to start when governance breaks down Why changing the board without changing management won't change company culture How celebrating your predecessors helps boards think in decades, not quarters Why excellent directors are never afraid of silly questions, and why not rocking the boat is so dangerous Why strategy is the one judgment call governance should never outsource to a framework About Cassandra: Cassandra Crowley grew up in Taranaki on New Zealand's North Island and studied law and accountancy before becoming the youngest person ever to serve as President of Chartered Accountants Australia and New Zealand. A Fellow Chartered Accountant and barrister and solicitor of the High Court of New Zealand, she has more than 20 years of governance experience. She is Deputy Chair of NZ Transport Agency Waka Kotahi, where she chairs the Risk and Assurance Committee, Chair of Southern Cross Travel Insurance, and a director of Silver Fern Farms and South Port NZ. She has been recognised for her governance leadership, including the Women of Influence Board and Management Award. Grit in the Boardroom is a bi-weekly podcast where Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with the best in business for executive interviews, exploring corporate governance beyond the sealed doors of the C-suite. Beyond Governance provides on-demand company secretarial support, governance advisory and governance training to boards, Company Secretaries and General Counsel. It helps organizations strengthen governance, manage risk and support critical projects without the need for permanent hires. Find out more.

Recorded in New Zealand at the IoD Leadership Conference in Wellington, this episode is another in Grit in the Boardroom's New Zealand series, part of the show's international run of executive interviews with the country's most respected business leaders. In this director dialogue, Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with Tony Carter: Chair of Datacom and MyFoodBag, a director of The Warehouse Group, and former CEO of Foodstuffs New Zealand, who has also chaired Air New Zealand and Fisher and Paykel Healthcare. Tony's career offers rare C-suite insights and genuine chair perspectives on boardroom decisions, leadership decisions, and corporate governance, shaped by decades moving between the executive table and the board table across retail, aviation, healthcare, and technology. Together they explore authority versus influence, and why the worst words a leader can hear in the boardroom are "you're wrong." Tony shares governance lessons on spotting integrity red flags early, why the closeness between a CEO and a chair can quietly turn a board into passengers, and why moving beyond box-ticking risk management toward genuine "show me, don't tell me" scrutiny is critical to strategic decision-making and high-stakes strategy. Drawing on his years running Foodstuffs' franchise network and management case studies spanning private equity ownership and competing shareholder interests, he talks candidly about company culture, cultural fit in board appointments, and how leaders should think about company culture change as AI reshapes entire industries, while insisting "behaviour shouldn't change, value shouldn't change." He also reflects on business resilience and growth under pressure, from Air New Zealand's tailwind years before the airline was hit by pandemic lockdowns just months after he left, to Fisher and Paykel Healthcare's decades-long R&D discipline, and what separates real board effectiveness from a rubber stamp. It's an episode full of hard-won governance lessons from one of New Zealand's most experienced chairs. What you'll find in this episode: Why integrity red flags are the one thing Tony says he now weighs above all else in a leader How influence beats authority every time in the boardroom Why a CEO and chair who are too close can turn a board into passengers What the Australian banking Royal Commission's "show me, don't tell me" principle means for board scrutiny Why complacency is hardest to spot in the good years, not the bad ones How cultural fit — not just skills — decides whether a new director actually works Why Tony believes behaviour and values shouldn't change, even as AI forces everything else to About Tony: Tony Carter is one of New Zealand's most experienced company directors. He is Chair of Datacom and My Food Bag and a Director of The Warehouse Group. A retailer by background, he was CEO of Foodstuffs New Zealand before building a governance career that includes chairing Air New Zealand and Fisher & Paykel Healthcare, now New Zealand's most valuable company. Tony is known for his emphasis on transparency, listening and constructive challenge, and for a governance style built on supporting management rather than second-guessing it. Grit in the Boardroom is a bi-weekly podcast where Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with the best in business for executive interviews. She and her guests explore corporate governance beyond the sealed doors of the C-suite. As Governance Assessor for the Post Office Horizon IT Inquiry, the largest public inquiry in UK history, Erika Eliasson-Norris is helping shape accountability, governance reform, and corporate oversight across the UK. ... Beyond Governance provides on-demand company secretarial support, governance advisory, and governance training to boards, Company Secretaries, and General Counsel. Beyond Governance helps organisations strengthen governance, manage risk, and support critical projects without the need for permanent hires. Learn more here: https://beyondgovernance.com/

Recorded in New Zealand during the IoD Leadership Conference 2026 in Wellington, this episode continues Grit in the Boardroom's international run of executive interviews with another extraordinary leader. In this candid conversation, Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with David Downs: CEO of Education New Zealand, former stand-up comedian, cancer survivor, and self-described "genetically modified optimist," for a masterclass in leadership, emotional intelligence, and C-suite insights on what it takes to connect with people when the stakes are highest. David's career spans the comedy circuit, Microsoft, New Zealand Trade and Enterprise, the New Zealand Story Group, and medical innovation at the Malaghan Institute of Medical Research, a path that's given him a rare leader’s-eye view of strategic decision-making and high-stakes strategy across very different sectors. Together they explore boardroom decisions, leadership decisions, and corporate governance under pressure: why corporate storytelling, not spreadsheets, remains the most powerful leadership tool; how reading an audience translates from comedy clubs to boardroom dynamics; why vulnerability and a strong feedback culture are what separate good boards from great ones on the path to board effectiveness; and why moving beyond traditional risk management, treating risk as a portfolio rather than a threat, is what boards overseeing innovation need to embrace. Told he had six months to live, David shares governance lessons on business resilience and growth under pressure, including his "memory foam pillow" model, and why Viktor Frankl's Man's Search for Meaning changed his perspective on purpose-driven leadership. He also warns that organizational culture can absorb new people before they've had a chance to speak up and argues a leader's job is never to be the smartest person in the room but to create the conditions for everyone else to do their best work, echoing the Māori concept of Rangatira, to weave people together. Expect management case studies and turnaround stories delivered with the wit of a man who once got slow-clapped off stage at a plumbers' conference and lived to tell the tale. What you'll find in this episode: Why stand-up comedy is the ultimate masterclass in reading an audience and leading people How the 'five dumb questions' rule builds psychological safety, feedback culture, and better board effectiveness What a terminal cancer diagnosis taught David about resilience, risk, and perspective Why the Māori concept of rangatira redefines what it means to lead How boards overseeing innovation should think about risk as a portfolio, not a threat Why purpose, not happiness, is the fuel that sustains leaders through the hardest decisions What new employees and brand-new cars have in common (hint: don't leave either in the garage) Why company culture absorbs people, and how leaders can push back on that About David: David Downs is the Chief Executive of Education New Zealand | Manapou ki te Ao, the government agency connecting New Zealand with learners, educators, and future leaders worldwide. A former stand-up comedian and TV performer, he built a career across Microsoft in New Zealand and Asia Pacific, New Zealand Trade and Enterprise, and the New Zealand Story Group, where he served as CEO for five years. He is an Ambassador and Fundraiser for the Malaghan Institute of Medical Research, Chairman of the Well Foundation, and a Board Member of Blood Cancer NZ. A cancer survivor once given six months to live, David is a passionate advocate for medical innovation, purpose-driven leadership, and the power of storytelling. ______ Grit in the Boardroom is a bi-weekly podcast where Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with the best in business for executive interviews. She and her guests explore corporate governance beyond the sealed doors of the C-suite. As Governance Assessor for the Post Office Horizon IT Inquiry, the largest public inquiry in UK history, Erika Eliasson-Norris is helping shape accountability, governance reform, and corporate oversight across the UK. ... Beyond Governance provides on-demand company secretarial support, governance advisory, and governance training to boards, Company Secretaries, and General Counsel. Beyond Governance helps organisations strengthen governance, manage risk, and support critical projects without the need for permanent hires. Learn more here: https://beyondgovernance.com/

Recorded in New Zealand during the IoD Leadership Conference 2026 in Wellington, this episode brings Erika Eliasson-Norris's executive interviews to an international audience for the first time, as part of Grit in the Boardroom. In this director dialogue, Erika sits down with Ben Kepes, a professional director, technology analyst, entrepreneur, and investor, for a masterclass in leadership and C-suite insights on what it really means to challenge from within. A high school dropout turned electrician, Silicon Valley investor, firefighter, paramedic, and ultra marathon runner, Ben offers rare chair perspectives on strategic decision making, risk management, and business resilience. Together they explore boardroom decisions and leadership decisions under pressure: the tension between provocation and diplomacy, why high stakes strategy demands acting on incomplete information, and how strong corporate governance guards against the kind of corporate scandal seen in cases like the UK Post Office. Drawing on 20 years in Silicon Valley, over 50 startup investments, and 34 years building Cactus alongside his two sons, Ben shares governance lessons on board effectiveness, growth under pressure, and company culture change, arguing that not making a decision is the biggest risk of all. Expect management case studies and turnaround stories that move from the boardroom table to the ultra marathon trail. What you'll find in this episode: • Why board effectiveness depends on genuine cognitive diversity, not token disruption • How strong opinions loosely held shape better boardroom decisions • What being the son of Holocaust survivors teaches about obligation and legacy • Why not taking a risk is the biggest risk in strategic decision making • How ultra marathon endurance mirrors business resilience under pressure • Why company culture, not audit, is the real foundation of governance • How growth under pressure at Cactus mirrors leadership at the board level • Why compliance-for-its-own-sake is the conventional wisdom boards should challenge most Ben Kepes is a professional director, technology analyst, entrepreneur, and investor based in New Zealand. He left school early, trained as an electrician, and spent 20 years in Silicon Valley investing in over 50 startups. He founded Cactus 34 years ago and now runs it alongside his two sons. The son of Hungarian Holocaust survivors, Ben brings a personal lens to obligation and legacy, and has completed hundreds of ultra marathons. Known as a challenger director, he champions cognitive diversity and the conviction that the biggest risk a board can take is to make no decision at all. Grit in the Boardroom is a bi-weekly podcast where Erika Eliasson-Norris sits down with the best in business for executive interviews. She and her guests explore corporate governance beyond the sealed doors of the C-suite. As Governance Assessor for the Post Office Horizon IT Inquiry, the largest public inquiry in UK history, Erika Eliasson-Norris is helping shape accountability, governance reform, and corporate oversight across the UK. — Beyond Governance provides on-demand company secretarial support, governance advisory, and governance training to boards, Company Secretaries, and General Counsel. Beyond Governance help organisations strengthen governance, manage risk, and support critical projects without the need for permanent hires. Learn more here: https://beyondgovernance.com/