Digest

The podcast delves into various topics, starting with the role of intimacy coordinators in film and the humorous application to podcasting. It then explores mental health days, contrasting them with real-world demands and childhood emotional regulation. A significant portion discusses Kanye West's public apology, attributing his actions to potential mental health issues like bipolar disorder and frontal lobe damage, while debating the authenticity of his statements and their connection to his album rollout strategy. The conversation also touches on cancellation culture, differentiating between financial and social repercussions, and whether public figures like Kanye and Hulk Hogan were truly "canceled." The podcast further examines the evolution of album rollouts, the influence of algorithms, and the value of authenticity in hip-hop. Additionally, it features discussions on producer battles like Hit-Boy vs. Mike WiLL Made-It, the complexities of music royalties and publishing, and reviews Ari Lennox's album. Promos for various podcasts and sponsors are interspersed throughout.

Outlines

00:00:00

Introduction and Podcast Promotions

The podcast opens with teasers for upcoming guests and promotes other shows like "Dear Chelsea," "Checking In," and "My Favorite Murder," highlighting their availability on various platforms.

00:01:46

Online Trends, Media Commentary, and New Platforms

Discussions cover social media trends impacting Gen Z, media meltdowns, and a TikTok boycott against Target. The move of "New Rory and Mal" to Netflix is celebrated, with anticipation for their impact on the streaming service.

00:04:51

Intimacy Coordinators and Their Role

The function of intimacy coordinators on TV and film sets is explained, focusing on ensuring comfort and safety during intimate scenes. A humorous extension considers their potential need for podcasts.

00:08:39

Family, Netflix, and Content Concerns

The hosts discuss the implications of being on Netflix, including family viewing habits and how content might be perceived differently.

00:08:43

Workplace Policies and Personal Boundaries

A lighthearted conversation about tracking ovulation and menstrual cycles is framed within workplace policies and personal boundaries.

00:10:53

Directing and Acting in Intimate Scenes

An anecdote about a director's unconventional approach to intimate scenes is shared, leading to a debate on the challenges and considerations of acting in simulated sex scenes, including attraction to co-stars and the role of intimacy coordinators.

00:13:56

Relationship Dynamics and Personal Beliefs

The discussion explores how initial attraction can fade with familiarity and how personal beliefs or actions can alter perceptions of individuals.

00:16:04

Employment, Protesting, and "At-Will" Status

The hosts debate the implications of an employee being fired for protesting and the protections, or lack thereof, under "at-will" employment.

00:17:33

Excuses for Time Off and Personal Reasons

The conversation shifts to the necessity of providing excuses for taking time off work, with a strong argument for simply stating "personal reasons."

00:18:33

Children's Personal Days and Real-World Demands

A debate arises on whether children should be allowed personal days from school, contrasting the importance of mental health with the unforgiving nature of the "real world."

00:19:53

Childhood Choices, Consequences, and Quitting Patterns

Reflections on children's lack of choice in upbringing and education are contrasted with adult choices. The discussion explores how taking time off when things get tough can lead to a pattern of quitting.

00:21:20

Humorous School Avoidance Tactics

Humorous anecdotes about children using creative excuses to avoid school are shared, comparing these tactics to the concept of mental health days.

00:22:30

Balancing Mental Health and School Attendance

The hosts propose a system of mental health days for schools, sparking debate on their implementation and purpose.

00:22:58

Reasons for Disliking School and Childhood Problems

Personal reflections on why children might dislike school, including social drama and peer relationships, are discussed. Childhood problems are seen as precursors to adult challenges.

00:23:52

Parental Guidance on Bullying and School Avoidance

Strategies for parents to handle bullying are discussed, alongside parental insight into children's school avoidance, recognizing social issues versus genuine sickness.

00:24:54

Skipping School for Life Lessons

Experiences of skipping school for life lessons and personal exploration outside the classroom are shared, raising concerns about the manipulation of mental health as an excuse.

00:25:30

Parental Acceptance and Manipulation

The hosts acknowledge that children can manipulate parents, and parents sometimes allow it, recognizing a child's need for a break.

00:26:11

Petty Reasons for School Avoidance

The discussion covers seemingly petty issues, like social drama, that significantly impact a child's desire to go to school, and the struggle children face with emotional regulation.

00:27:50

Smartphones, Social Media, and Teen Pressure

A Boost Mobile sponsorship leads to a discussion on smartphones in schools, increased bullying, and social media's impact on teenagers, intensifying social pressures and blurring lines.

00:29:59

Pressure on Young People and Fashion Nostalgia

The immense pressure on young people regarding appearance and possessions, fueled by social media, is discussed. A nostalgic look at first-day-of-school fashion trends follows.

00:31:21

Snowstorm Experiences and Coping Mechanisms

The hosts share experiences during a snowstorm, discussing coping with being indoors, single life during isolation, and experimental cooking.

00:32:53

Grocery Shopping Challenges and Storm Perception

A humorous account of a failed grocery trip during the snowstorm is shared, alongside a discussion on how public perception of storms leads to panic buying and shortages.

00:34:05

Snowstorm Severity Debate and Companion Choice

A debate ensues about the actual severity of a recent snowstorm, with differing opinions. The decision-making process for choosing a snow day companion is also discussed.

00:35:34

Planning for Snowstorms and Snow Day Activities

The importance of planning ahead for snowstorms is emphasized. A brief discussion on vegan hot chocolate and other snow day activities follows.

00:36:42

Podcast and Product Promotions

Promotions for Boost Mobile, the iPhone 17 Pro, "Broken Play Podcast," "Brad vs. Everyone," "Crook and Chase Nashville," "Off the Edge with Cam Jordan," Wasabi Hot Cloud Storage, and Audible are featured.

00:40:53

Kanye West's Apology and Mental Health Debate

The hosts discuss Kanye West's public apology, attributing his behavior to potential frontal lobe damage and bipolar disorder, sparking a debate on celebrity leniency for mental health issues compared to others.

00:46:15

Cancellation Culture: Financial vs. Social Impact

The concept of being "canceled" is discussed, differentiating between financial cancellation (loss of income) and social cancellation (loss of reputation), arguing that the former is more impactful.

00:46:56

The Nuance of Cancellation and Fanbase Loyalty

The hosts revisit the idea that true cancellation is difficult, especially when a figure has a dedicated fanbase that overlooks controversial actions, concluding that neither Hulk Hogan nor Kanye West were truly canceled by their core supporters.

00:48:24

Kanye's Financial Cancellation and Resilience

While acknowledging Kanye West experienced financial cancellation when Adidas dropped him, the hosts emphasize his continued creative and financial resilience.

00:49:12

Kanye's Apology Authenticity and Album Rollout Strategy

The authenticity of Kanye West's apology is questioned, suggesting it may be ghostwritten and performative, potentially tied to his album "Bully."

00:51:45

"Bully" Album: Positivity and Artistic Comparisons

Kanye describes his new album "Bully" as positive and comparable to "Narls Barkley," contrasting it with darker previous works. The discussion touches on mental health as a conversation topic versus an excuse.

00:53:07

Kanye's Humility, Articulation, and PR Strategies

The speakers debate Kanye's current humility and the authenticity of his statements, considering the difficulty of articulating sensitive thoughts and the use of PR tactics in artist communication.

00:54:46

Kanye as a Theme and History of Accountability

The observation that Kanye often embodies the persona of his albums is made. His past apologies and accountability are discussed, noting a perceived lack of direct connection between his actions and mental health.

00:55:44

Frontal Lobe Damage as a Deflection Tactic

The idea of frontal lobe damage being used as an excuse is debated, with some believing it's a calculated deflection.

00:56:29

Kanye's "Experiment" with Cancellation and Societal Structures

A theory is proposed that Kanye might be experimenting with being "canceled" to understand the experience. His position as a Black man in America is emphasized, noting that talent doesn't negate societal structures.

00:57:33

Kanye's Lucidity and "The Truman Show" Parallels

The speakers debate Kanye's mental state, considering if his actions are a calculated experiment. His frequent references to "The Truman Show" are linked to his bipolar disorder and attempts to manipulate public perception.

00:58:23

Mental Health as a Universal Excuse and Calculated Rollouts

The trend of attributing public "crash outs" to mental health is noted. The strategic planning behind artist rollouts is discussed, questioning the genuineness of vulnerability as a marketing tactic.

00:59:33

Likelihood of Kanye's Public Outbursts and Artist Double Standards

The probability of Kanye experiencing another public outburst is considered. The double standard in how artists, particularly white actors, receive second chances and PR support is highlighted.

01:01:05

Artists Using Mental Health for Promotion and Algorithm's Reward for Negativity

The ethics of artists using mental health narratives for album promotion is debated. The discussion explores how algorithms reward negativity, suggesting Kanye may have leveraged this for attention.

01:04:01

Financial and Personal Impact of Kanye's Actions

The potential financial and personal repercussions of Kanye's controversial statements are examined, including his marital status.

01:05:03

Attaching Mental Health to Sales and Authenticity Debates

The question arises why Kanye needs to attach his mental health struggles to album sales. The debate continues on whether his vulnerability is genuine or a strategic move to enhance his album's rollout.

01:06:42

Believability, Album Release Timing, and Direct Communication

The core of the discussion revolves around whether Kanye's statements would be believed regardless of an upcoming album. A preference for Kanye speaking directly and vulnerably over formal press releases is expressed.

01:07:41

Kanye's Promo-Free Potential and Streaming Dominance

The argument is made that Kanye's influence is so significant he doesn't need traditional promotional tactics. His high streaming numbers are noted, but the need to address past controversial comments for his new album is emphasized.

01:09:02

Album Sales, Chart Performance, and Negative Rollouts

The conversation delves into Kanye's album sales and chart performance, confirming "Vultures" debuted at number one. The impact of negative publicity on album success is examined.

01:10:44

Kanye's Need for Antics and Evolution of Rollouts

The debate continues on whether Kanye still needs controversial rollouts for chart success. The idea that Kanye pioneered many controversial rollout tactics is explored, highlighting the evolution of album rollouts over the past decade.

01:12:51

Algorithm's Reward for Negativity and Positive Rollout Experiments

The role of the algorithm in promoting negative content is discussed. The current positive rollout for Kanye's album is seen as an experiment to test the viability of positivity and humility in the current music landscape.

01:14:20

Artist Authenticity, Music Quality, and Mental Health Concerns

The focus shifts to the importance of the music itself over promotional tactics. Concern for Kanye's mental health is expressed while questioning the necessity of certain promotional actions.

01:15:01

Believability, Album Release Timing, and Sales Performance

The core question remains whether Kanye's statements would be believed regardless of an upcoming album release. Album sales and chart performance are revisited, with a focus on "Vultures" achieving number one.

01:15:47

ASAP Rocky's Debut and Sales Comparisons

ASAP Rocky's debut album reaching number one is discussed, with sales figures and comparisons to Kanye's performance.

01:16:22

Rabbi's Interaction, Planned Rollouts, and Performative Hip Hop

A past interaction with a rabbi is recalled, highlighting a moment of perceived authenticity. The meticulous planning behind Kanye's team suggests a strategic approach, fitting the pattern of performative artist rollouts in hip hop.

01:17:22

Kanye's Intentions, Consumer Perspective, and Prioritizing Health

The speakers debate whether Kanye's actions are directed at consumers or a broader audience. The argument is made that Kanye should prioritize his mental health and personal life over constant album promotion.

01:18:04

Kanye's Sales History, Brand Value, and Corporate Mindsets

Kanye's consistent sales history and brand value are discussed, comparing him to major corporations. The concept of artists as brands is explored, with Kanye's mindset being compared to that of a major corporation.

01:19:05

Pepsi Ads, Corporate Apologies, and Staged Vulnerability

Pepsi's controversial ads and apologies are used as a comparison to Kanye's public statements. The discussion contrasts Kanye's approach with staged authenticity, arguing his actions, while potentially performative, are not necessarily fake.

01:20:17

Prioritizing Health Over Sales and Billionaire Brands

Advice is given for Kanye to step back from selling and focus on his health. The difference between selling products and living a lifestyle brand is discussed, with examples of how billionaires maintain their status.

01:20:56

Rihanna vs. Kanye: Negative Statements and Commodification of Authenticity

Rihanna's success is contrasted with Kanye's, highlighting the impact of negative statements. The idea that authenticity itself has become a commodity, often manufactured and sold, is explored.

01:22:21

Kanye's Non-Traditional Approach and Belief in Statements

Kanye's refusal to adopt typical "fake authenticity" is noted. The belief that Kanye genuinely believes much of what he says is expressed, despite performative aspects.

01:23:20

Kanye's Persona Shifts and Hip Hop's Authenticity Value

Kanye's shift from gangster rap to embracing a "nerd" persona is seen as key to selling authenticity. The historical emphasis on authenticity in hip-hop is discussed, contrasting it with current trends.

01:24:31

Youth Trends vs. Personal Experience and Insecurities

The tension between following youth trends and relying on personal experience is explored. Kanye's insecurities about younger artists and the importance of taking one's own advice are discussed.

01:25:37

NFL Game Predictions and Sports Betting Promotions

The conversation shifts to NFL game predictions, with a focus on the Patriots and Seahawks, and promotions for Hard Rock Bet.

01:27:27

Podcast Promotions and Social Media Trends Recap

Promotions for "Broken Play Podcast," "Brad vs. Everyone," "Crook and Chase Nashville," "Off the Edge with Cam Jordan," Wasabi Hot Cloud Storage, and iHeart Podcast Awards voting are featured. A recap of social media trends leading to legal trouble is also included.

01:30:57

Kid Cudi vs. Jim Jones: "Day 'n' Nite" Debate

The long-standing debate between Kid Cudi and Jim Jones regarding the song "Day 'n' Nite" is introduced, with Jim Jones claiming credit for its popularity due to his remix.

01:32:18

"Day 'n' Nite" Remix Production and Market Influence

Details about the production of Jim Jones' "Day 'n' Nite" remix are shared, including its initial reception and the impact of Hot 97's radio play in 2008 on the hip hop market.

01:34:02

Kid Cudi's Response and Contribution vs. Existence

Kid Cudi's response to Jim Jones' claim is presented, emphasizing the song's inherent popularity. The distinction between helping an artist grow and being the sole reason for their existence is explored.

01:35:00

Jim Jones as A&R and "Entourage" Song Premieres

Jim Jones' talent as an A&R and his ability to identify good music are highlighted. The role of the show "Entourage" in premiering songs and its impact on their success is discussed.

01:36:53

"Platinum in the Hood" Debate and Video Production Credit

The claim that Jim Jones' version went "platinum in the hood" is debated. Pushback is given regarding credit for the "Day 'n' Nite" video production, highlighting Aristotle's established career.

01:37:41

"Day 'n' Nite" Release Timeline and Word Choice Impact

The release dates of Jim Jones' remix and the "Entourage" episode featuring the song are compared. The discussion focuses on Jim Jones' choice of words and how they might have misrepresented his intentions.

01:39:45

The Power of the "Hood Cosign" and Industry Shifts

The significance of the "hood cosign" in the music industry, especially in 2008, is emphasized. The migration of the music industry and the influence of New York radio are discussed.

01:40:44

Cudi's Genius, Jones' Remix, and Breaking Records

Kid Cudi's undeniable talent and the helpfulness of Jim Jones' remix in breaking the song are acknowledged. The importance of the "hood" in breaking records, especially in 2008, is reiterated.

01:42:40

Producer Battle: Hit-Boy vs. Mike WiLL Made-It

The upcoming producer battle between Hit-Boy and Mike WiLL Made-It is discussed, with predictions made. Hit-Boy's versatility and Mike WiLL Made-It's range as producers are highly praised.

01:44:13

Producer Showdown: Chart Performance and Rap Battle Strategy

The production prowess of Hit-Boy and Mike WiLL Made-It is examined, comparing their hit records. The podcast explores how song selection and performance strategy, not just hit count, determine success in rap battles.

01:48:30

Evolution of Rap Battles and Album Review: Ari Lennox

The hosts discuss the ideal format for rap battles and reminisce about past events. The podcast reviews Ari Lennox's album "age/sex/location," praising its vulnerability and improved production.

01:51:18

JD and B.Cox's Production Excellence and Royalty Disputes

The production work of JD and B.Cox on Ari Lennox's album is highlighted. The hosts discuss the lawsuit filed by Chad Hugo against Pharrell over royalties, emphasizing fair compensation for producers.

01:56:59

Music Royalties, Creative Control, and Industry Complexity

The conversation delves into the complexities of music production, royalties, and creative control. The podcast contrasts the straightforward nature of other businesses with the perceived complexity of the music industry regarding publishing and royalties.

01:58:52

Defining Value in Music Creation and Disputes

The difficulty in assigning monetary value to creative contributions in music before a song's release is explored, along with the potential for disputes over royalties.

Keywords

Q&A

• What is the role of an intimacy coordinator on a film set?

  An intimacy coordinator ensures actors' comfort and safety during intimate scenes by setting boundaries, choreographing actions, and mediating communication between actors and the production team.

• Can employers fire employees for participating in public protests?

  In most "at-will" employment states, employers can fire employees for participating in public protests, as it's not typically considered a protected activity unless specific laws or company policies state otherwise.

• What is the main difference between financial and social cancellation?

  Financial cancellation involves losing income, deals, or financial support, while social cancellation refers to public disapproval or loss of reputation, though the former often has a more tangible impact.

• Why might a celebrity's apology be considered performative?

  An apology might be seen as performative if it appears insincere, is delivered through a third party (like a ghostwriter), or seems timed for strategic benefit rather than genuine remorse.

• How does social media influence teenagers' perceptions of themselves and others?

  Social media provides constant exposure to curated images and lifestyles, creating pressure for teenagers to conform, compete, and often leading to unrealistic expectations about appearance and success.

• Are Kanye West's recent public statements and album promotion considered genuine or performative?

  There is a significant debate on whether Kanye West's recent actions are genuine expressions or calculated promotional tactics for his album "Bully." Some believe his statements are strategic for album rollouts, while others see potential sincerity, albeit with PR influence.

• How does Kanye West describe his new album "Bully," and what is it compared to?

  Kanye describes "Bully" as a positive album, drawing comparisons to "Narls Barkley" rather than the darker themes found in his previous work like "808s & Heartbreak."

• What is the significance of authenticity in hip-hop, and how does Kanye West's approach fit into this?

  Historically, authenticity has been highly valued in hip-hop, rewarding artists for being genuine. Kanye's career has seen shifts, from embracing a "nerd" persona to more controversial actions, sparking debate about his current authenticity versus calculated moves.

• What role does the algorithm play in artist promotion, and how might Kanye West have utilized it?

  Algorithms on social media and streaming platforms often reward negativity and engagement. It's suggested that Kanye may have leveraged this by making controversial statements to ensure his content reached the top of algorithms and gained widespread attention.

• What is the core of the debate between Kid Cudi and Jim Jones regarding the song "Day 'n' Nite"?

  Jim Jones claimed that people only knew "Day 'n' Nite" because of his remix. Kid Cudi and others argue that the song was already gaining traction and would have been a hit regardless, highlighting the song's inherent appeal and its placement on "Entourage."

• How has the music industry's approach to album rollouts evolved over time?

  Album rollouts have become increasingly reliant on digital platforms and social media. While traditional methods like press releases still exist, artists now often use a mix of online strategies, sometimes blurring the lines between genuine expression and marketing.

• Is it possible for artists to use mental health narratives as a genuine part of their artistic expression or as a promotional tool?

  This is a complex area. While mental health is a valid topic for artistic exploration, there's a fine line between genuine expression and using it as a calculated strategy for album promotion or public sympathy.

• What is the significance of the "hood cosign" in the music industry, particularly in the context of breaking new artists?

  The "hood cosign" historically represented a crucial validation from urban communities, influencing mainstream acceptance and record sales. In 2008, it was particularly important for executives to gauge the impact of songs like "Day 'n' Nite" through this lens.

• How do producers like Hit-Boy and Mike WiLL Made-It compare in terms of their impact and hit-making ability?

  Both producers have a significant catalog of hits, but the discussion suggests Mike WiLL Made-It might have more mainstream chart-toppers, while Hit-Boy is recognized for his versatility and work on more experimental tracks.

• What factors determine success in a rap battle, beyond just having hit songs?

  Strategy, song selection, and performance are crucial. A well-chosen song that resonates with the audience can be more effective than a technically bigger hit, as seen in discussions about Jay-Z and Nelly.

• What is the core issue in the lawsuit filed by Chad Hugo against Pharrell Williams?

  Chad Hugo is reportedly seeking unpaid royalties for songs produced by The Neptunes, including major hits like "Drop It Like It's Hot." The dispute centers on the fair distribution of earnings from these successful collaborations.

• Why is the music industry's business model, particularly regarding publishing, considered confusing by some?

  The complexity arises from valuing creative contributions before a song's success, the division of royalties among multiple parties (writers, producers, performers), and the lack of clear, universally applied standards, unlike simpler industries like t-shirt sales.

• What makes JD and B.Cox's production work on Ari Lennox's album noteworthy?

  Their involvement is praised for giving Ari Lennox more creative control, resulting in a more focused and vulnerable album. JD's long career and B.Cox's production skills are highlighted as key elements.

Show Notes