Is Tim Walz the Midwestern Dad Democrats Need?
23Digest
This episode of the Ezra Klein Show features an interview with Minnesota Governor Tim Waltz, a rising Democratic star known for his unique messaging and focus on policy solutions. The conversation explores Waltz's theory of politics, which emphasizes using political capital to improve people's lives and being bold in pursuing ambitious policy goals. Waltz argues that Democrats need to avoid condescension and smugness in their messaging, and instead focus on practical solutions and empathy. He criticizes the Republican Party's use of fear-mongering and cultural resentment, and discusses the need for Democrats to address the concerns of voters who feel marginalized and unheard. The episode also delves into the politics of masculinity, economic opportunity, and the importance of paid family leave. Waltz emphasizes the need for Democrats to empower communities and show respect to voters, even those who disagree with them.
Outlines
Introduction and The Rise of Tim Waltz
This episode of the Ezra Klein Show introduces Minnesota Governor Tim Waltz, a rising Democratic star known for his unique messaging and focus on policy solutions. The episode discusses Waltz's rapid rise to national prominence, highlighting his unique messaging and the impact of his interview on Morning Joe.
Waltz on Politics and Policy
Ezra Klein interviews Governor Waltz, discussing his theory of politics, his focus on making Minnesota the best place to raise a kid, and his views on the child tax credit.
The Politics of Complexity and Simplicity
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the trade-offs between complex, means-tested policies and simpler, universal policies, using the example of free school lunches.
Democrats and Messaging
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss whether Democrats sometimes make their policies too complex and whether they do a good enough job of communicating their accomplishments.
The Importance of Personal Stories and The Power of "Weird"
Thomas Gibson, a journalist at The New York Times, shares his experience as a former Marine and how he applies the same principles of frontline reporting to his work. Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the effectiveness of Waltz's "weird" messaging in reframing the Republican Party and its candidates.
The "Weird" Message and Its Impact
Waltz explains why he uses the word "weird" to describe Trump and Vance, arguing that it breaks through the fear-mongering and allows Democrats to focus on positive policy solutions.
Avoiding Contempt and Smugness
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the dangers of condescension and smugness in Democratic messaging, and how to avoid alienating voters who support Trump and Vance.
Understanding the "Hillbilly Elegy" and The Cultural Frustration with Democrats
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss J.D. Vance's book "Hillbilly Elegy" and how Vance's own political evolution has contradicted the book's message. They also discuss the cultural frustration with Democrats among voters who once formed the party's base, and how Democrats can address this.
The Importance of Empathy and Connection
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the importance of empathy and connection in politics, and how voters are more sensitive to whether politicians like them than whether they like the politicians' policies.
The Path Forward for Democrats
Governor Waltz argues that Democrats need to approach voters with optimism and grace, and avoid insulting or alienating them.
Showing Grace and Respect
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss how Democrats can show grace and respect to voters, even those who disagree with them.
Political Geography and "Real America"
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the role of political geography in shaping political discourse, and the dangers of creating a sense of "real Americans" versus "not real Americans."
The Need for Bipartisanship
Governor Waltz argues that Democrats need to find ways to engage with voters in rural areas and build a more bipartisan political system.
The Politics of Housing and Development
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the politics of housing and development, and how Democrats can address the affordability crisis.
The Politics of Immigration and Crime
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the politics of immigration and crime, and how Democrats can address the concerns of voters who feel that their problems are being tolerated.
The Politics of Tolerance
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the politics of tolerance, and how Democrats can address the concerns of voters who feel that their problems are being tolerated.
The Need for a Smarter Politics
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz agree that the country needs a smarter and more constructive political system.
The Politics of Masculinity
Ezra Klein and Governor Waltz discuss the role of masculinity in politics, particularly among young men, and how Democrats can address the concerns of voters who feel that their masculinity is under attack.
The Need for Economic Opportunity
Governor Waltz discusses the need for economic opportunity for young black men, and how Democrats can better address their concerns.
Empowering Communities
Governor Waltz argues that Democrats need to empower communities, rather than act as white saviors, and focus on policies that promote generational wealth.
The Importance of Paid Family Leave
Governor Waltz argues that Democrats should prioritize passing paid family leave across the country, as it would empower families and show that Democrats are truly pro-family.
Keywords
Tim Waltz
Tim Waltz is the current governor of Minnesota. He is a member of the Democratic Party and has gained national attention for his unique messaging and focus on policy solutions.
J.D. Vance
J.D. Vance is a Republican politician and author of the book "Hillbilly Elegy." He has been criticized for his rhetoric and his focus on cultural resentment.
Donald Trump
Donald Trump is a former president of the United States. He is a controversial figure who has been criticized for his divisive rhetoric and policies.
Morning Joe
Morning Joe is a morning news program on MSNBC. It is known for its political commentary and its interviews with prominent figures.
Paid Family Leave
Paid family leave is a policy that allows employees to take time off from work to care for a new child or a sick family member. It is a policy that is supported by Democrats and is seen as a way to empower families.
Hillbilly Elegy
"Hillbilly Elegy" is a book by J.D. Vance that explores the struggles of working-class white people in Appalachia. It has been praised for its insights into the social and economic problems facing these communities.
Toxic Masculinity
Toxic masculinity is a term used to describe harmful and destructive behaviors that are often associated with traditional notions of masculinity. It can include aggression, violence, and a lack of empathy.
Wounded Masculinity
Wounded masculinity is a term used to describe the feeling of being marginalized or threatened by changes in gender roles and expectations. It can lead to anger, resentment, and a desire to reclaim traditional masculine power.
Q&A
What is Governor Waltz's theory of politics?
Governor Waltz believes that politicians should use their political capital to improve people's lives, rather than just accumulating it. He argues that elected officials should be bold and ambitious in their policy goals, and not be afraid to make tough decisions.
How does Governor Waltz's messaging differ from that of other Democrats?
Governor Waltz's messaging is characterized by its focus on practical solutions and its avoidance of fear-mongering. He uses the word "weird" to describe Trump and Vance, which breaks through the fear-mongering and allows Democrats to focus on positive policy solutions.
What are the dangers of condescension and smugness in Democratic messaging?
Condescension and smugness can alienate voters who support Trump and Vance, who feel that they are being looked down upon by educated liberals. This can lead to a decline in Democratic support among working-class voters.
How can Democrats show respect to voters who don't feel respected by them?
Democrats can show respect by being present in communities, listening to voters' concerns, and empowering communities to solve their own problems. They should also focus on policies that promote economic opportunity and generational wealth.
What is the importance of paid family leave?
Paid family leave is a policy that would empower families and show that Democrats are truly pro-family. It would also help to address the economic and social challenges facing families in the United States.
Show Notes
I’ve watched a lot of presidential campaigns, and I can’t remember one in which the contest for the Democratic vice-presidential nomination has played out quite so publicly. One breakthrough voice has been Gov. Tim Walz of Minnesota. Before last week, he didn’t have much of a national profile. But then he went on “Morning Joe” and said of Donald Trump and JD Vance, “These guys are just weird.”
That one line has transformed the Democratic Party’s messaging, with everyone from Vice President Kamala Harris to Senator Joe Manchin using similar language.
But it’s the kind of criticism that risks coming off as condescending to those who support Trump and Vance, similar to Hillary Clinton’s “deplorables” comment in 2016. But what has stood out to me about Walz’s political ethos is his confidence in speaking on behalf of everyday Americans — a confidence his track record backs up. Walz comes from a very small town and repeatedly won House races in a district that heavily favored Trump.
So I invited him on the show to talk about how he walks this line between attacking Republican politicians without alienating Republican voters and how he thinks Democrats can control the narrative of this election and start winning some of those voters back.
Book Recommendations:
The Most Secret Memory of Men by Mohamed Mbougar Sarr
Command and Control by Eric Schlosser
The Razor’s Edge by W. Somerset Maugham
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at ezrakleinshow@nytimes.com.
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of “The Ezra Klein Show” was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Kate Sinclair and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota. Our senior editor is Claire Gordon. The show’s production team also includes Annie Galvin, Elias Isquith and Kristin Lin. Original music by Isaac Jones. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The executive producer of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. Special thanks to Sonia Herrero.
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