What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• Why hitting the limits of your own capacity can reshape how you prioritize


• The moment Teresa realized no one has the “right answer” in hard times—and how that unlocked - her agency as a leader


• Petra’s hard-earned lesson about loyalty, burnout, and setting healthy boundaries


• How early user interviews (and a nudge from Marty Cagan) transformed Petra’s product practice


• The humbling reminders that you are not your user

Key Moments:

• [02:30 ] Teresa’s crash course as a startup CEO during the 2008 recession


• [11:20 ] Realizing prioritization is survival, not just a backlog exercise


• [18:45 ] “No one knows the answer” — the leadership shift that gave Teresa agency


• [29:10 ] Petra’s story: why the company doesn’t love you back


• [42:05 ] The pay raise that came too late


• [50:15 ] Marty Cagan and Petra’s first user interviews at Starbucks


• [01:02:00 ] Funny user research fails: “close the window” taken literally

Resources & Links:

• Follow Teresa Torres: https://ProductTalk.org


• Follow Petra Wille: https://Petra-Wille.com

Mentioned in this episode:

• The True Story of Struggles and Success Of A Startup CEO with Teresa Torres by Barry O’Reilly


• Petra’s work on coaching product leaders


• Marty Cagan


• iPAQ