Digest

This podcast episode delves into Dance Moms Season 5, Episode 13, dissecting Abby Lee Miller's intense critiques of Mackenzie's solo, her controversial management of the ALDC team, and the ongoing conflicts with the mothers. The discussion highlights Abby's harsh feedback, the moms' attempts to advocate for their daughters' music careers, and the persistent drama surrounding rival teams like Candy Apples. Key moments include Abby's criticism of Mackenzie's performance, the moms' frustration with Abby's perceived favoritism towards Maddie, and the strategic decisions behind routine assignments and competition placements. The episode also touches on Abby's legal troubles and her plans for a new studio in Los Angeles, all while the mothers navigate their complex relationship with Abby and advocate for their daughters' opportunities.

Outlines

00:00:00

Podcast Introduction and Early Banter

The podcast begins with upbeat intro music and a welcome to listeners. The hosts engage in lighthearted banter, mentioning their Patreon page and sharing a humorous anecdote about makeup mishaps involving gold flakes. They also reminisce about past "dance mom" experiences, like hair buns and pins, and announce upcoming tour dates.

00:01:45

Tour Updates and Travel Plans

The hosts discuss their current location in Detroit and their upcoming tour stops across various cities including Washington, New York, Boston, Atlanta, Charlotte, and Dallas. They share an anecdote about a historic Atlanta hotel and mention filming in a hotel lobby for better audio quality due to a dark room. Efforts to improve audio quality based on listener feedback are also mentioned.

00:41:55

Detroit Show and Chicago Foodie Plans

Excitement is high for a sold-out show in Detroit, with a mention of a "hometown story" involving Chloe, Paige, and Nia. Plans are made to discuss Chicago stories on the plane, including a craving for a classic Chicago hot dog. Lunch plans at a seafood restaurant are also discussed.

00:51:52

Travel Cravings and Appearance Commentary

One host shares upcoming travel plans to New Orleans, expressing eagerness to eat crawfish. A humorous and slightly disgusted description of a new face lotion is shared, followed by a brief recap of the previous episode featuring "Mrs. Talman" and a "Brooke Quidditch" theme.

01:07:21

Mrs. Talman's Petite Physique and Dance Training

The discussion focuses on Mrs. Talman's small stature, comparing her appearance to a Barbie doll in a cake. The intensity of dance training and potential muscle development are discussed, alongside a humorous anecdote about a broken wedding dress leading to an alternative outfit.

01:23:30

Wedding Dress Mishaps and Award Recognition

The hosts delve into the drama surrounding wedding dresses, including issues with fit and returns. A YouTube video is mentioned where dance mom moments were given "Academy Awards," including a Lifetime Achievement Award for dress alteration. A playful argument ensues about who was responsible for dress alterations.

01:36:13

Health Concerns and Martini Indulgence

A discussion about strange-tasting water leads to considerations about switching to diet soda. Humorous takes on dehydration and WebMD fears are shared. The hosts admit to drinking a large quantity of martinis the previous night and the subsequent need for recovery.

01:48:58

Season 5 Episode 13 Preview and Random Ailments

A preview of the upcoming discussion of Season 5, Episode 13 is given. Lighthearted moments include comments about ketchup on a chin and unexplained bruising. A burn injury is clarified, and a comparison is made to past bruising incidents, including those from house construction and a fall on a boat.

01:58:45

Privacy Concerns and Cruise Anecdotes

A funny story about a bathtub picture being sent leads to a discussion about privacy during phone calls and the potential awkwardness of being on FaceTime. A humorous anecdote about a cruise and extreme reactions to privacy violations is shared.

02:07:02

Illness, Outfits, and Nostalgic Dolls

A shared experience of getting the flu and "spooning" in bed while sick is discussed. Focus shifts to Mackenzie and the dancers' outfits, noting a lack of matching attire. Holly's outfit is compared to the "Holly Hobby" doll, leading to a nostalgic discussion about the doll and others like Strawberry Shortcake and Mrs. Beasley.

02:14:18

Competition Day and Maddie's SNL Absence

The competition day begins with Melissa's interview regarding Maddie's absence due to SNL. The moms and girls arrive at the studio to find Abby late, heading straight to the den. Concerns are raised about facing the Candy Apples team again, while recalling previous wins. Melissa reiterates Maddie's SNL schedule and upcoming move to LA.

02:32:28

Abby's Legal Issues and Mom's Speculation

The moms discuss Abby's legal troubles, speculating about her court hearing and whether her behavior was menacing. They discuss their agreement or disagreement regarding Abby's alleged menacing behavior in court. Kendall expresses her feelings about the upcoming move to Los Angeles.

02:38:03

Studio Dynamics and Choreography Hints

Gianna enters the den, and Jill is noted for calling her "G." Gianna informs the moms that Abby is late and the girls will start without her. Moms express their desire for a unique dance from Gianna, who hints at an exciting fast jazz funk routine. The group dance rehearsal is compared favorably to "Stomp the Yard."

02:45:05

Rival Team Intel and Abby's Court Hearing

Moms speculate about Kathy's team and her social media comments. They decide to investigate Kathy's Facebook page. Melissa provides details about Abby's court hearing in the Bronx related to the Kelly Highland lawsuit and her Entertainment Tonight interview. The moms are impressed by Abby's composure.

02:50:44

Legal Explanations and LA Studio Concerns

Holly clarifies legal terms for Kira, who expresses concern about opening a new studio in LA amidst negative publicity. Melissa updates on Maddie's schedule, and Jill suggests flying to New York. Gianna rehearses the group dance with new moves, and the girls seem to enjoy the jazz funk combo.

02:56:21

Abby's Arrival and Pyramid Announcement

Abby arrives with pyramid headshots and announces the week's assignments, explaining her lateness due to her court hearing. Discussion ensues about the court hearing date and whether anything significant stood out. Abby reminds the team about their return to LA and Maddie's SNL absence.

03:02:16

Defending Maddie and Production's Role

Abby defends Maddie's decision to prioritize her kids, even if it means missing SNL. A debate arises about whether Maddie was truly invited to SNL or if it was a production decision. One mom expresses relief that Abby wasn't present, implying a negative dynamic.

03:05:28

Competition Results and Rival Critiques

Abby congratulates the ALDC team on their clean sweep against Candy Apples. The ALDC's duets placed high, while Candy Apples' contemporary routine is critiqued as too innovative and weird. Abby criticizes their routine, questioning if certain moves are too advanced for the age group.

03:11:11

Group Dance Win and Sarcastic Remarks

The ALDC's group dance wins, beating Kathy's team, who placed third. Abby sarcastically comments on Kathy's loss, suggesting she wasted a talented team. A clarification is made that Abby's mention of "Chloe" refers to Kathy's team member. Melissa reveals Kathy is choreographing for Candy Apples.

03:15:44

Disrespect Claims and Social Media Drama

Abby expresses disappointment that Candy Apple dancers were not respectful. The hosts discuss Abby's claims of disrespect and the contradiction of telling the ALDC not to interact with Candy Apples. Moms discuss Chloe's Instagram post and Abby's harsh response.

03:18:59

Family Health and LA Studio Plans

Jill shares that her mom had successful surgery, bringing relief. Jill discusses family pressure to return home but highlights her dedication to the team. Abby announces her LA studio is down to two building options. Holly questions if the LA studio will be ready for dancing.

03:26:33

Studio Purpose and Pyramid Announcement

The purpose of the LA studio is questioned if it's not ready for dancing, with Abby mentioning headshots and merchandise. Abby announces the pyramid, pairing the girls like a chorus line instead of using headshots. JoJo and Kendall are placed on the bottom row after their duet placed third.

03:31:03

Duet Critiques and Individual Performances

Jill realizes the girls aren't in matching outfits because Abby was late. The duet featuring JoJo and Kendall is critiqued, with suggestions it should have been in the mini group. Mackenzie and Mia's duet is discussed, with Abby noting Mackenzie's dancing as juvenile but Mia's growth.

03:38:47

Nia's Strengths and Holly's Reaction

Abby acknowledges Nia's physical limitations but praises her facial expressions and stage presence. Holly's internal reaction to Abby's critique is humorously imagined. In her interview, Holly expresses a desire for Nia to receive compliments without backhanded remarks.

03:43:57

Maddie & Mackenzie's Duet and National Goals

Maddie and Mackenzie's duet is described as spectacular, earning them the top spot. Abby instructs Kalani to ensure the duet is practiced daily to win at nationals. Three assignments are given for the week, with the team heading to Cleveland, Ohio for a competition.

03:49:14

Competition Age Breakdowns and Kalani's Status

Abby expresses dissatisfaction with the age breakdowns at the competition and threatens to pull Kalani due to the age division. The moms calculate the age divisions without Maddie. Abby anticipates Candy Apples' presence and critiques their previous performance.

03:53:00

Rival Team Analysis and Production Influence

Abby acknowledges Kathy's dancers are strong individually but notes they don't fit well with her team. A comment suggests production prevented Kathy from replacing her entire team. JoJo is assigned the solo "Fancy," and Abby discusses her interview after the court hearing.

03:58:10

Solo Assignments and Identity Exploration

Mackenzie is assigned the solo "Who Are You?". Abby explains the solo's theme relates to Mackenzie's identity beyond being Maddie's sister. Mackenzie asserts her identity, prompting Abby to state that's what needs to be discovered. The group dance is assigned as a jazz funk routine.

04:04:00

Routine Choices and Strategic Decisions

Abby explains her reluctance to do a contemporary lyrical routine without Maddie, suggesting she avoids it to avoid giving credit for wins. Abby expresses uncertainty about the group routine, particularly regarding lyrical costumes without Maddie. The moms encourage Abby to push boundaries.

04:09:22

Maddie's LA Standard and Kendall's Music Career

Abby states that Maddie is setting the standard for dancers in Los Angeles. Jill inquires about the progress of Kendall's music career. Abby reveals plans to record songs and shoot a music video in LA. Jill seeks clarity on financial arrangements and contracts.

04:12:19

Contract Negotiations and LA Plans for Dancers

Abby and Jill discuss Jill's contract, with Abby wanting her involved but maintaining distance. Jill accepts the arrangement but wants more involvement. Kira asks about specific plans for Kalani in Los Angeles, and Abby mentions voice lessons, seeing potential. Kenzie is informed about another video shoot.

04:18:03

Moms' Questions and Abby's Confusion

Jess inquires about Abby's plans for involving JoJo in Los Angeles activities. Holly asks about plans for Nia. The moms' questions seem coordinated, and Abby appears confused, thinking Nia already had separate plans. Holly and Abby discuss past opportunities.

04:23:24

Abby's Excuses and Perceived Favoritism

Abby agrees to have a private conversation with Holly. Jill expresses annoyance with Abby's constant excuses. The moms discuss how Maddie seems to have different rules compared to other dancers, with Kira expressing irritation about the perceived preferential treatment.

04:26:17

Holly's Cautious Approach and Pre-LA Frustration

Holly reiterates her wish for an adult conversation with Abby about past events in LA. Despite agreeing to talk, Holly remains cautious and guarded. Holly expresses frustration even before arriving in Los Angeles, with a humorous observation that she always seems aggravated.

04:29:56

Contract Scrutiny and Rival Studio Visit

Melissa is confused why Jill is questioning the music contract with Abby. Holly is not surprised by Jill's scrutiny, given the ALDC contract's nature. The scene shifts to Candy Apples studio, with a humorous mention of a farm animal. Kathy addresses her team after their loss.

04:37:13

Kathy's Appearance and Choreographer Change

One host finds Kathy attractive and believes she plays it up. Kathy recaps the previous week's loss, blaming choreographer Keon. Kathy and Keon mutually agree he wasn't ready for the team and won't be returning. Kathy is surprised by the team's supportive attitude.

04:41:31

Confrontation and Rivalry Focus

Jennifer is prepared to confront Abby after Abby's social media attacks on her daughter. Abby was particularly harsh towards Chloe. The hosts note the irony of mentioning "maturity" in relation to Abby. Renee expresses dismay that the focus has shifted to fighting with ALDC.

04:47:32

Probation Lifted and Team History

Kathy announces the team is no longer on probation and declares this her premium team. She states her new team has a significant history with Abby and holds grudges, believing her team has a strong desire for revenge. A commentary on "dance mom scorned" is made.

04:52:03

Team Confidence and Contrasting Dancers

Kathy expresses confidence in her team's dancers and her ability to move forward with choreography. She contrasts her team with Abby's, stating she doesn't have any "Nias." A surprising revelation is made that Kathy won't be seen again until Season Seven.

04:54:12

Kathy's Departure and Liza's Illness

It's suggested that Kathy won't be part of the show once the team moves to LA. Kathy notices Liza is unwell and asks if she's okay to stay. Liza tries to pretend she's fine, but Kathy insists she leave to avoid infecting the team. A host expresses a wish to have been sent home when sick.

04:58:13

Studio Facilities and Identity Confusion

Renee confesses that Kathy's studio facilities are subpar and fears Tessa is losing skills. Hosts try to recall who Renee and Tessa's mom are. Kathy dismisses Renee's criticism by comparing Abby's studio to being "berman infested." Melanie criticizes Renee for being ungrateful.

05:04:16

Freedom to Leave and Standby Dancers

Kathy reminds the team they are free to leave if unhappy. She implies she has dancers on standby who would be grateful for a spot. The girls shake their heads, indicating they do not want to leave the team. Kathy introduces her sister-in-law, Aaron Rich, as a choreographer.

05:07:35

Maddie's Absence and Narrative Control

Kathy reiterates that Maddie will not be at the competition. A host expresses frustration that the narrative of Maddie's indispensability is being perpetuated, attributing it to the producers. Kathy suggests that while they don't have a Maddie, they have five Kalani's, highlighting Kalani's talent.

05:11:55

Kalani's Talent and Strategic Advice

A host praises Kalani as a spectacular dancer. Laura suggests the dancers should focus on being themselves rather than imitating others. Melanie believes the team has an advantage due to Abby focusing heavily on Maddie. Renee interrupts, wanting to discuss her solo privately.

05:15:32

Solo Discussions and Episode Conclusion

It's mentioned that solo discussions will happen later in the day. The podcast concludes with the hosts discussing the various storylines and dynamics presented in the episode.

Keywords

Q&A

• What was Abby's main criticism of Mackenzie's solo performance?

  Abby criticized Mackenzie for forgetting parts of the choreography and not thinking enough, even suggesting that homeschooling might not be suitable for her, which contradicted her earlier statements.

• How did Melissa defend Mackenzie against Abby's criticism?

  Melissa defended Mackenzie's intelligence and dancing ability, stating that Mackenzie was smarter educationally than Maddie and that Abby's comments were unfair.

• What was the core conflict between Abby and Holly regarding Nia's music career?

  Holly accused Abby of negativity and not having Nia's best interests at heart, while Abby accused Holly of secretly working with others and making her bed.

• Why did the speakers believe Abby shouldn't be trusted with Mia's music career?

  They argued that Abby had a history of abusing power and making dancers look bad on television, citing Brooke's negative experience as an example of distrust.

• What were the hosts promoting at the end of the podcast?

  The hosts promoted their upcoming tour dates, encouraged listeners to buy tickets and merchandise, and reminded them to rate, review, and subscribe to the podcast.

• What was the significance of Abby's court hearing mentioned in the episode?

  Abby's court hearing in the Bronx, related to the Kelly Highland lawsuit, was a reason for her lateness to the studio and was discussed by the moms regarding her legal troubles and behavior.

• How did the ALDC team perform against Candy Apples in the competition?

  The ALDC team achieved a clean sweep against Candy Apples, with their duets placing high and their group dance winning, while Candy Apples' routines were critiqued.

• What were the moms' concerns about Abby's new LA studio?

  The moms questioned the purpose of the LA studio if it wasn't ready for dancing and worried about the implications of opening a new studio amidst negative publicity.

• What was the theme of Mackenzie's solo, and what did Abby intend for her to discover?

  Mackenzie's solo was titled "Who Are You?", and Abby intended for her to discover and assert her identity beyond being known as Maddie's sister.

• What was Kathy's main grievance against Abby Lee Miller?

  Kathy believed her team had a strong desire for revenge against Abby due to past grievances and disrespect shown towards her team and daughter.

Show Notes