In this episode Kathy and Joe dive into one of the most foundational and often overlooked ideas in organizational development: “self as instrument”.

Using humor, real client moments, and lessons from the field, they explore what it really means to walk into a room as a leader, facilitator, or consultant knowing you are the most influential tool you bring with you. From calibrating your energy and reading the room to navigating bias, countertransference, and emotional signals, they unpack how your presence shapes every conversation, every interaction, and every outcome.

They also discuss the leadership practices that keep your “instrument” in tune — authenticity, intentionality, modeling behavior, seeking feedback, and the non-negotiable role of self-care. Whether you're leading teams, coaching others, or simply trying to show up with more clarity and impact, this conversation offers practical, and human insight into how to bring your best self to the work.

A thoughtful, energizing episode for leaders and learners who know that change starts from within.