The Conservative Divide Over Kavanaugh

The Conservative Divide Over Kavanaugh

Update: 2018-09-25

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Conservatives have been deeply split about how to respond to allegations of sexual assault against Judge Brett M. Kavanaugh. That’s now starting to change. Guest: Ross Douthat, an Opinion columnist for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

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Avoiding a Shutdown (by Declaring an Emergency)

We take a look at the president’s last-minute plan to fund his border wall — and at how we got here. Guest: Mark Landler, who covers the White House for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Avoiding a Shutdown (by Declaring an Emergency)

2019-02-1500:28:0230

The Parkland Students, One Year Later

It’s been a year since the shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland. We went to Florida this week to check in on some of the students we met 12 months ago. Guest: Clare Toeniskoetter, a producer for “The Daily,” spoke with four students who survived the shooting. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Parkland Students, One Year Later

2019-02-1400:26:4624

No Heat, No Power: How a Federal Jail Failed Its Inmates

A New York Times investigation found that inside a Brooklyn jail, more than 1,000 inmates were locked inside freezing cells for 23 hours a day, prompting an inquiry by the Justice Department. But the involvement of the Justice Department may not be the turning point it appears to be.Guest: Annie Correal, who covers New York for The Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

No Heat, No Power: How a Federal Jail Failed Its Inmates

2019-02-1300:24:0038

Why Chief Justice Roberts Just Protected Abortion Rights

From the moment he was confirmed, Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. has been a reliable conservative on the Supreme Court. So why did he just side with the court’s more liberal members to preserve abortion rights in Louisiana? Guest: Adam Liptak, who covers the Supreme Court for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Why Chief Justice Roberts Just Protected Abortion Rights

2019-02-1200:27:0940

The Standoff Over Food and Power in Venezuela

The humanitarian crisis in Venezuela is worsening as President Nicolás Maduro refuses to give up power and blocks food from entering the country despite widespread hunger. Here’s a look at why, in Mr. Maduro’s mind, giving up control of food means giving up power. Guest: Nicholas Casey, the Andes bureau chief for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Standoff Over Food and Power in Venezuela

2019-02-1100:23:4349

Democrats Wanted Zero Tolerance for Misconduct. Then Came Virginia.

Democrats have adopted a policy of zero tolerance for misconduct, past or present, by members of their own party. The growing political crisis in Virginia is testing that approach. Guest: Jonathan Martin, who covers national politics for The New York Times, spoke with us from Richmond, Virginia. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Democrats Wanted Zero Tolerance for Misconduct. Then Came Virginia.

2019-02-0800:25:3632

The Overlooked Scandal of Priests Sexually Abusing Nuns

The pope acknowledged for the first time the persistent problem of sexual abuse of nuns by priests. We look at why it took the Catholic Church so long to recognize this group of victims. Guest: Laurie Goodstein, who has covered the Catholic Church for decades. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Overlooked Scandal of Priests Sexually Abusing Nuns

2019-02-0700:24:1451

What Past State of the Union Speeches Tell Us About the Future

In his first State of the Union address since losing control of Congress, the president repeatedly spoke of bipartisan unity. But a history of these speeches suggests that it’s everything else he said that will best predict how he actually governs. Guest: Mark Landler, who covers the White House for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

What Past State of the Union Speeches Tell Us About the Future

2019-02-0600:26:3446

What Motivates Mitch McConnell?

Over the past decade, the Senate Republican leader has emerged as a skilled legislative warrior, obstructing President Barack Obama’s agenda and enabling President Trump’s. But what does Mitch McConnell himself actually believe in? Guest: Charles Homans, the politics editor for The New York Times Magazine. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

What Motivates Mitch McConnell?

2019-02-0500:28:2965

Making Peace With the Taliban

Nearly 18 years ago, the United States declared war on the Taliban, promising to drive it from power in Afghanistan. Here’s a look at why American officials are now offering peace to the same group. Guest: Mujib Mashal, a New York Times senior correspondent in Afghanistan. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Making Peace With the Taliban

2019-02-0400:28:5649

The President and the Publisher

On Thursday in the Oval Office, the president of the United States debated the publisher of The New York Times about the role of a free press. Guest: A. G. Sulzberger, The Times’s publisher, sat down with President Trump. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The President and the Publisher

2019-02-0100:33:1671

The Perils of Reporting on an Investigation of the President

The special counsel’s office disputed an explosive BuzzFeed report claiming that President Trump had instructed his former lawyer, Michael Cohen, to lie to Congress — and that investigators had evidence of this. The scrutiny that followed calls to mind another reporting team and its challenges in the 1970s. Guests: Bob Woodward, one of the Washington Post reporters who broke the Watergate story, and Michael S. Schmidt, who has been covering the special counsel investigation for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Perils of Reporting on an Investigation of the President

2019-01-3100:31:3662

How Democrats Will Govern (Now That Government Is Open)

For weeks, House Democrats have found their agenda overshadowed by the struggle to reopen the government. Now that it’s open, they have a plan. Guest: Nicholas Fandos, who covers Congress for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

How Democrats Will Govern (Now That Government Is Open)

2019-01-3000:24:0542

Dispatches From the Border, Part 2

After a 35-day government shutdown over a proposed wall along the U.S.-Mexico border, Democrats and Republicans in Congress are negotiating over what border security actually means. We checked back in with Annie Brown from “The Daily,” who’s been driving the length of the border with the New York Times reporter Azam Ahmed. Their last dispatch focused on migrants in Mexico deciding whether to cross the border illegally. Now, we hear what can happen once they cross. Guests: Annie Brown, a producer for “The Daily,” and Azam Ahmed, the Times bureau chief for Mexico, Central America and the Caribbean. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Dispatches From the Border, Part 2

2019-01-2900:29:5936

The Story of Roger Stone and WikiLeaks

The special counsel’s indictment of Roger J. Stone Jr. contains details as over-the-top as Mr. Stone himself, revealing, for instance, that he encouraged an associate to use a tactic straight from “The Godfather.” But the indictment — which shows the most direct link yet between the Trump campaign and WikiLeaks — is wholly serious. Guest: Mark Mazzetti, a Washington investigative correspondent for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Story of Roger Stone and WikiLeaks

2019-01-2800:24:3560

One Country, Two Presidents: The Crisis in Venezuela

A remarkable battle for power is playing out in Venezuela, with dueling claims to the presidency. We look at what’s happening in the country and why the situation is coming to a head. Guest: Nicholas Casey, the Andes bureau chief for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

One Country, Two Presidents: The Crisis in Venezuela

2019-01-2500:26:2452

ISIS Has Lost Its Land. What About Its Power?

More than 99 percent of the territory the Islamic State once held in Iraq and Syria is gone — but the United States government may be misunderstanding what that means. Guest: Rukmini Callimachi, who covers terrorism and the Islamic State for The New York Times, spoke with us from Iraq. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

ISIS Has Lost Its Land. What About Its Power?

2019-01-2400:22:0135

The Confrontation at the Lincoln Memorial

Over the course of three days, the narrative of an encounter between young men wearing “Make America Great Again” hats and a Native American veteran has become a pick-your-side story where who holds power and who’s at fault are all up for debate. What can actually be said about what happened on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial? Guest: Elizabeth Dias, who covers faith and politics for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Confrontation at the Lincoln Memorial

2019-01-2300:24:3050

The Freshman, Part 1: Rashida Tlaib

Now that the Democrats have taken back the House, their plan is to govern on a message of unity heading into 2020. A small group of new, progressive lawmakers threatens to upend that plan. Meet one of them. Guests: Representative Rashida Tlaib, Democrat of Michigan, and Andy Mills, a producer for “The Daily.” For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.This episode includes disturbing language.

The Freshman, Part 1: Rashida Tlaib

2019-01-2200:38:2045

A Rift Over Power and Privilege in the Women’s March

After the divisiveness of the 2016 election, the Women’s March became a major symbol of unity. But two years later, a rift in the movement has grown. Guest: Farah Stockman, a national reporter for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

A Rift Over Power and Privilege in the Women’s March

2019-01-1800:22:0833

A Republican Congressman From Texas Who Opposes the Wall

As the government shutdown approaches its fifth week, a few congressional Republicans are publicly breaking from the president in his push for a border wall. We spoke with one of them. Guest: Representative Will Hurd, Republican of Texas. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

A Republican Congressman From Texas Who Opposes the Wall

2019-01-1700:20:4237

William Barr Under Oath

In a hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee, William P. Barr, the nominee for attorney general, vowed to protect the Justice Department and seemed to tell senators what they wanted to hear. But was it what the president wanted to hear? Guest: Michael S. Schmidt, who covers national security and federal investigations for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

William Barr Under Oath

2019-01-1600:28:1622

Trump’s Pick for Attorney General

William P. Barr, President Trump’s nominee for attorney general, is set to go before senators today for the beginning of his confirmation hearings. What would it mean for the president and the special counsel to have an attorney general who is in charge of the Russia investigation? Guest: Katie Benner, who covers the Justice Department for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Trump’s Pick for Attorney General

2019-01-1500:23:3227

Dispatches From the Border, Part 1

As the shutdown continues over the president’s demand for a border wall, Annie Brown from “The Daily” joined Azam Ahmed, a New York Times reporter, and Meridith Kohut, a photojournalist, on their endeavor to drive the entire length of the U.S.-Mexico border. Here’s what they saw on the first part of that journey. Guests: Annie Brown, a producer for “The Daily”; Azam Ahmed, the New York Times bureau chief for Mexico, Central America and the Caribbean; and Meridith Kohut, a photojournalist who covers Latin America. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Dispatches From the Border, Part 1

2019-01-1400:25:5224

What a Border Sheriff Thinks About the Wall

A majority of Americans oppose the construction of a border wall. President Trump’s insistence on building it has led to a bitter political impasse and a government shutdown. We spoke with a sheriff on the border who supports the president’s efforts. Guest: Mark Napier, the sheriff of Pima County, Ariz. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

What a Border Sheriff Thinks About the Wall

2019-01-1100:24:2143

The Republicans’ Shutdown Strategy

In his latest negotiation with Democrats over the shutdown, President Trump slammed the table and stormed out of the meeting. We look at why his strategy requires giving no ground and forcing Republican senators to stand with him, no matter the cost. Guest: Julie Hirschfeld Davis, who covers Congress for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Republicans’ Shutdown Strategy

2019-01-1000:22:2519

Trump’s Prime-Time Address

Millions of Americans watched on Tuesday night as President Trump made his case for a wall on the southern border, and as Democratic leaders dismissed his talk of crisis. Guests: Michael M. Grynbaum, who covers the media for The New York Times, and Mark Landler, a White House correspondent. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Trump’s Prime-Time Address

2019-01-0900:24:1718

Is There a Crisis at the Border?

President Trump plans to address the nation tonight about what he calls “the humanitarian and national security crisis on our southern border.” But much of that chaos could be a result of the administration’s policies. Guest: Caitlin Dickerson, who covers immigration for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Is There a Crisis at the Border?

2019-01-0800:17:1325

Trump’s Plan to Withdraw Troops From Syria

President Trump’s decision to withdraw American troops from Syria surprised allies and enemies alike, and prompted public disagreement from military and civilian leaders. But the ensuing debate about the role of the United States military may be long overdue. Guest: Mark Landler, who covers the White House for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Trump’s Plan to Withdraw Troops From Syria

2019-01-0700:22:3919

Day 1 of a Democratic Majority

The 116th Congress has been sworn in. With that, Democrats have taken control of the House, and Representative Nancy Pelosi has reclaimed her position as its leader. Here’s the scene on Capitol Hill as the day unfolded. Guest: Julie Hirschfeld Davis, who covers Congress for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Day 1 of a Democratic Majority

2019-01-0400:28:1232

Chuck Schumer on the Wall, the Shutdown and the Era of Divided Government

On the 12th day of the government shutdown, the Democratic congressional leaders went to the White House and proposed that the president reopen the government while the two sides ironed out differences on funding for a border wall. A couple of hours after that meeting, we spoke with Senator Chuck Schumer, the Senate minority leader, about his newly emboldened approach and how he and Ms. Pelosi plan to stick together in a divided Washington. Guest: Senator Chuck Schumer of New York, the Senate minority leader. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Chuck Schumer on the Wall, the Shutdown and the Era of Divided Government

2019-01-0300:25:2427

What Will Democrats Do With Their New Power?

Democrats have waited two years for a chance to investigate President Trump on their own terms. Starting tomorrow, they can. We look at how they plan to use — and not use — that power. Guest: Jason Zengerle, a contributing writer for The New York Times Magazine. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

What Will Democrats Do With Their New Power?

2019-01-0200:31:5419

An Ongoing Look Into the Origins of Trump’s Wealth

This week, “The Daily” is revisiting some of our favorite episodes of the year and checking in on what has happened since the stories first ran. Today, we return to a New York Times investigation into Fred and Donald Trump’s taxes. After spending much of the past year poring over never-before-seen documents, our colleagues unearthed new information about the president’s financial history that contradict his story of being a self-made billionaire. Guests: David Barstow, Susanne Craig and Russ Buettner, investigative reporters for The Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

An Ongoing Look Into the Origins of Trump’s Wealth

2018-12-3100:32:2341

A Mother Talks to Her Sons About Brett Kavanaugh

This week, “The Daily” is revisiting some of our favorite episodes of the year and checking in on what has happened since the stories first ran. In October, we sat down with a group of teenage girls in Brooklyn to talk about their reaction to the accusations against Supreme Court Justice Brett M. Kavanaugh by Dr. Christine Blasey Ford. After that conversation aired, we received dozens of emails from listeners who wanted to hear the same questions posed to a group of boys. Guests: Ann Powers, a listener in Oregon, interviewed her two sons and one of their friends. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

A Mother Talks to Her Sons About Brett Kavanaugh

2018-12-2800:21:1119

The Scars of Family Separation

This week, “The Daily” is revisiting some of our favorite episodes of the year and checking in on what has happened since the stories first ran. Today, we’re going back to an episode from this summer, when we met Nazario Jacinto Carrillo, a farmer from Guatemala who was separated from his daughter at the United States border as part of the Trump administration’s crackdown on undocumented immigrants. Guests: Caitlin Dickerson, who covers immigration for The New York Times, spoke with Mr. Carrillo. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Scars of Family Separation

2018-12-2700:21:474

For a Family Divided by the Korean War, a New Chapter

This week, “The Daily” is revisiting some of our favorite episodes of the year and checking in on what has happened since the stories first ran. In April, President Moon Jae-in of South Korea met with North Korean leader Kim Jong-un to discuss formally ending the Korean War, a conflict that has divided thousands of families for more than six decades. Sylvia Nam’s family is one of them. Guest: Sylvia Nam traveled to North Korea to find out what happened to her grandfather, who left South Korea for the North nearly 70 years ago and never returned. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

For a Family Divided by the Korean War, a New Chapter

2018-12-2600:21:4921

The Year in Sound: An Audio Time Capsule of 2018

Between the government shutdowns that bookended the year, there were furious standoffs over a border wall; shootings at a high school, a bar, a grocery store, a synagogue; devastating wildfires in California. Handshakes and promises shared with autocrats in North Korea and Russia. Powerful men brought down by #MeToo or trying to make a comeback, and a Supreme Court nominee accused, then elevated to the bench. Questions about a murdered journalist, about election interference, about how much Facebook knew. A midterm vote that delivered one of the most diverse — and divided — governments in American history. Here’s what 2018 sounded like. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Year in Sound: An Audio Time Capsule of 2018

2018-12-2400:30:4130

The Latest Showdown Over a Shutdown

President Trump seemed poised to avoid a government shutdown and to carry his fight for a border wall into 2019, when the House will be controlled by Democrats. Then he shot down the spending deal. So what happened? Also, to cap off a chaotic day of breaking news, Jim Mattis resigned as secretary of defense. Guest: Jonathan Weisman, the deputy Washington editor of The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Latest Showdown Over a Shutdown

2018-12-2100:25:0916

Senator Claire McCaskill on Losing Missouri and the Politics of Purity

If any Democratic senator representing a red state was going to survive the midterm elections and continue serving in 2019, it was thought to be Claire McCaskill. But she lost. We spoke with her as her time in office was winding down. Guests: Senator Claire McCaskill, Democrat of Missouri, and Sabrina Tavernise, a national correspondent for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.This episode includes disturbing language.

Senator Claire McCaskill on Losing Missouri and the Politics of Purity

2018-12-2000:29:0416

The Ethics of Genetically Editing Babies

Ever since scientists created the powerful gene-editing technique Crispr, they have braced for the day when it would be used to produce a genetically altered human being. Now, the moment they feared may have come. What’s likely to happen next? We also look at the latest updates on a possible government shutdown. Guests: Jennifer Senior, an Op-Ed columnist for The New York Times, and Carl Zimmer, a science columnist for The Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily. What do you think about "The Daily"? Please fill out our listener survey at nytimes.com/thedailysurvey.

The Ethics of Genetically Editing Babies

2018-12-1900:23:3223

A Year in the Russia Investigation

At the start of 2018, the biggest threat to the Trump presidency was an investigation into his campaign’s ties to Russia. As the year draws to a close, it’s his hush payments to women. We look at what’s behind that change — and how the threat may change again next year. Guests: Mark Mazzetti and Michael S. Schmidt, New York Times reporters who have been covering the special counsel investigation. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

A Year in the Russia Investigation

2018-12-1800:18:5913

‘The Most Significant Campaign Contributions’ in U.S. History

It was never clear what motivated Rod J. Rosenstein, the deputy attorney general, to hand the investigation of Michael D. Cohen, President Trump’s former lawyer, over to career prosecutors in New York rather than to the special counsel. With that investigation now implicating the president in serious campaign finance violations, we look at how fateful the decision may be. Guests: Neal Katyal, a lawyer who drafted the rules that govern special counsel investigations, and Michael S. Schmidt, who has been covering the special counsel investigation for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

‘The Most Significant Campaign Contributions’ in U.S. History

2018-12-1700:22:1533

Undocumented and Working for Trump

Last week, Victorina Morales came forward and said that for the last five years, she had been working as an undocumented immigrant at President Trump’s golf club in New Jersey. A couple of days ago, we visited her in her home with Miriam Jordan, the New York Times reporter who first broke the story. Guest: Victorina Morales, a former housekeeper at the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster, N.J., and Miriam Jordan, who covers immigration for The Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Undocumented and Working for Trump

2018-12-1400:25:0516

The Rise of Right-Wing Extremism, and How U.S. Law Enforcement Ignored It

Despite repeated warnings over the past two decades, federal law enforcement officials in the United States have ignored the threat of violence from far-right extremists. Now, they have no idea how to stop it. Guest: Janet Reitman, a contributing writer for The New York Times Magazine who is working on a book about the rise of the far right in post-9/11 America. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Rise of Right-Wing Extremism, and How U.S. Law Enforcement Ignored It

2018-12-1300:28:2929

Why Republicans Want a Criminal Justice Overhaul

President Barack Obama came very close in 2015 to passing a bipartisan bill to rewrite prison and sentencing laws. Three years later, the same people who were responsible for stopping that bill may become responsible for passing a scaled-back version. Guest: Nicholas Fandos, who covers Congress for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Why Republicans Want a Criminal Justice Overhaul

2018-12-1200:23:1619

Waiting for Brexit

In a humiliating last-minute move, Prime Minister Theresa May of Britain postponed a vote in Parliament on Tuesday on the terms of the country’s divorce from the European Union. We look at why Britain is so frustrated by Brexit even before Brexit has taken effect. Guests: Ellen Barry, the chief international correspondent for The New York Times, and Stephen Castle, a Times correspondent in London. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.This episode includes disturbing language.

Waiting for Brexit

2018-12-1100:33:5516

The Business of Selling Your Location

A New York Times investigation has found that the information being collected about us through apps on our smartphones is far more extensive than most of us imagine — or are aware we have consented to. Guests: Jennifer Valentino-DeVries, Natasha Singer and Michael H. Keller, reporters who cover technology for The Times; and Gabriel J.X. Dance, deputy investigations editor. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.A note about this episode: The Times identified a small number of people in the location data with their permission. It did not identify anyone else in the data.

The Business of Selling Your Location

2018-12-1000:22:5033

The Photo of the Yemeni Girl

In the three years that Saudi Arabia, supported by the United States, has been at war with the Houthis in Yemen, very few journalists have been allowed into the country to document what’s happening there. The New York Times journalist Tyler Hicks is one. This is the story of how he came to take a photograph of Amal Hussain that drew international attention to the country’s plight. Guest: Tyler Hicks, a senior photographer for The Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

The Photo of the Yemeni Girl

2018-12-0700:23:4711

Watering Down Democrats’ Power in Wisconsin

Across the country, Democratic candidates for governor and attorney general won seats that had long been held by Republicans. But Republican-controlled legislatures in some states are resisting that transfer of power. Guest: Mitch Smith, who covers the Midwest for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Watering Down Democrats’ Power in Wisconsin

2018-12-0600:23:5814

What the West Got Wrong About China, Part 2

When China first began experimenting with capitalism in the 1980s, the West was certain the experiment would fail. But two of its assumptions — that government controls stifle economic growth, and that the internet cannot be tamed — were quickly proven wrong.Nearly 40 years later, China rivals the United States as a global superpower. Its continued success is challenging not just the West’s assumptions about China, but the West’s assumptions about itself. Guest: Philip P. Pan, the Asia editor for The New York Times. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

What the West Got Wrong About China, Part 2

2018-12-0500:23:5534

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The Conservative Divide Over Kavanaugh

The Conservative Divide Over Kavanaugh