Digest

This episode of The Weekend Intelligence delves into the experiences of Michael Covrig and Michael Spavor, two Canadians detained in China for over a thousand days. The episode begins by recounting the night in December 2018 when Covrig was detained by Chinese secret police in Beijing, highlighting the shock and uncertainty that gripped the foreign community. Covrig then shares his first public account of his detention, describing his arrest, blindfolding, and initial interrogation. He emphasizes the psychological impact of being handcuffed and accused of crimes against state security. The episode then transitions to Spavor, another Canadian detained in China, and his experiences. David Renny, the economist geopolitics editor, interviews Spavor about his time in detention and the lessons he learned about China. Spavor describes his life in China before his detention, including his work as a diplomat, his interest in Chinese culture, and his observations about the city of Beijing. He highlights the challenges of navigating the city and interacting with Chinese officials. Spavor explains his decision to join the International Crisis Group, a conflict prevention organization, after leaving the Canadian Foreign Service. He felt a responsibility to contribute to understanding China and preventing potential conflict in the Pacific region. The episode discusses the risks faced by foreign journalists, diplomats, and researchers working in China. The arbitrary nature of the system and the potential for misperceptions can lead to serious consequences, including detention. The episode explores the growing tensions between China and the United States, particularly in the context of the Huawei case. The US accused Huawei of being a tool for Chinese intelligence gathering, leading to the arrest of Meng Wanzhou, the company's CFO. The episode highlights the opacity of China's security machine, which is often referred to as the "blackest box of all." The detention of Michael Covrig and Michael Spavor exemplifies the unpredictable nature of this system. Covrig reflects on his decision to travel to Beijing shortly after Meng Wanzhou's arrest, acknowledging that he underestimated the Chinese government's ruthlessness and the potential consequences of his actions. The episode details Covrig's arrest in Beijing, describing the men in black who surrounded him, the warrant for his arrest, and his forced transportation to a secret location. He recounts his initial interrogation and the realization that he was being detained for endangering China's national security.

Outlines

00:00:00

The Detention of Michael Covrig and Michael Spavor

This episode explores the detentions of Michael Covrig and Michael Spavor in China, examining the political motivations behind their arrests, the risks faced by foreigners working in China, and the broader context of the China-US rivalry.

00:03:40

Covrig's Account of His Detention and Spavor's Experiences

Michael Covrig shares his first public account of his detention in China, describing his arrest, blindfolding, and initial interrogation. David Renny interviews Michael Spavor about his time in detention and the lessons he learned about China.

00:10:01

The Risks of Working in China and the China-US Rivalry

The episode discusses the risks faced by foreign journalists, diplomats, and researchers working in China, highlighting the arbitrary nature of the system and the potential for misperceptions. The episode explores the growing tensions between China and the United States, particularly in the context of the Huawei case.

00:19:58

Covrig's Decision to Travel to Beijing and His Arrest

Michael Covrig reflects on his decision to travel to Beijing shortly after Meng Wanzhou's arrest, acknowledging that he underestimated the Chinese government's ruthlessness. The episode details Covrig's arrest in Beijing, describing the men in black who surrounded him, the warrant for his arrest, and his forced transportation to a secret location.

Keywords

Q&A

• What were the circumstances surrounding Michael Covrig's detention in China?

  Covrig was detained by Chinese secret police in Beijing in December 2018, shortly after Meng Wanzhou's arrest in Canada. He was accused of endangering China's national security, a charge that many believe was politically motivated.

• How did Michael Spavor's detention relate to the Meng Wanzhou case?

  Spavor, a Canadian entrepreneur who ran tours into North Korea, was detained in China on the same day as Covrig. Both detentions were widely seen as retaliation for Canada's arrest of Meng Wanzhou, the CFO of Huawei.

• What were the main risks faced by foreigners working in China during this period?

  Foreigners working in China, particularly journalists, diplomats, and researchers, faced the risk of being detained or accused of espionage for activities that would be considered normal elsewhere. The arbitrary nature of the Chinese legal system and the potential for misperceptions made these risks particularly acute.

• How did the Huawei case contribute to the growing tensions between China and the US?

  The US accused Huawei of being a tool for Chinese intelligence gathering, leading to the arrest of Meng Wanzhou in Canada. This sparked a diplomatic crisis and further strained relations between the two countries, which were already engaged in a trade war.

• What lessons did Michael Covrig and Michael Spavor learn from their experiences in detention?

  Both Covrig and Spavor emerged from their detentions with a deeper understanding of the Chinese system and its complexities. They learned about the importance of resilience, the power of human connection, and the need to be prepared for unexpected challenges.

Show Notes