What does Law mean, Mumu?

In episode 6, which was the last in the series, we hear about  the “Murphy Case” (1982), which dealt with the taxation of married women at that time in Ireland.  The sequence of events and the challenges involved in bringing this case successfully to the Supreme Court are described by acclaimed lawyer and academic Professor Yvonne Scannell who had been pivotal in raising awareness about the injustices involved with regard to the taxation of married women and ultimately bringing this case to court as a significant legal challenge - which changed the lives of many people.

This episode recalls the significance of the  Supreme Court decision in the case of:  “The State (Healy) v O’Donoghue”, and outlines the sequence of events leading to the Supreme Court decision establishing legal representation and legal aid as part of a fair trial, in Ireland at that time.  There is a detailed account  of the circumstances with regard to the prosecution of young offenders at a time when they  could be sent to places of detention, without having had a solicitor representing them, presented by leading Irish lawyer Ercus Stewart, S.C. who had been involved in a constitutional challenge that brought about change with far-reaching implications.

Episode 4 brings to light the significance of a High Court case, the decision of which was overturned in the Supreme Court in 1971.  The name of the case was “Byrne v Ireland”, the outcome  of which was that the former “prerogative of immunity from suit” did not exist in Ireland after the enactment of the Constitution of the Irish Free State,1922, and therefore was not vested or continued by Articles 49 and 50 of the Constitution of Ireland, 1937.  The “prerogative of immunity from suit” refers to the principle “The king could do no wrong” – meaning that the citizen could not sue the Monarch or the State.   The commentary on this case and its historical context was provided by the late Mr Justice Donal Barrington, S.C. who had actually acted in the case that he chose as being one of relevance to feature in this series. Donal Barrington passed away in 2018 and I extend my condolences to his widow – Eileen and his family.

This episode involves an analysis of the legal complexities in the divorce case of Mrs Katharine O’Shea, taken by her husband - Captain William O'Shea - in London (1890) which involved Irish Statesman - Charles Stewart Parnell.   The commentary on the 'O’Shea Divorce Case' in which Irish Politician Charles Stewart Parnell, was named as co-respondent, is provided by esteemed Irish author, biographer, and historian Frank Callanan, S.C.  

This episode reviewed the “McGee Case” (1973), in which Mary McGee, a 27-year-old mother of four, took a case against the Attorney General and the Revenue Commissioners, in Ireland, because at that time, she could not get access to contraceptives.  This case was selected by, Gerard Hogan, S.C., a leading Irish lawyer, author, and academic who provided the commentary and analysis.  It must be pointed out that Gerard Hogan’s career advanced significantly, in the legal world, since the recording of his observations and contribution in 2005. Having served in the High Court and Court of Appeal, he was Ireland’s appointee as Advocate General to the European Court of Justice, in 2018 and, in 2021, Mr Justice Gerard Hogan was appointed to the Irish Supreme Court.

The first programme in the series reviewed the “De Burca Case” (1976) which was about the automatic right of women to sit on juries, or put the other way, the right of women not to have to be tried by a jury of all men.  This episode benefitted from observation, commentary, and analysis from leading Irish lawyer and academic – now Judge of the Irish Supreme Court, Gerard Hogan, S.C., and had the benefit of an interview with one of the protagonists in the case – Irish journalist and writer - Máirín De Burca - who gives her first hand experience of the journey this legal challenge travelled to success in  the Irish Supreme Court.

In the postscript to the Podcast Series, Paulyn pays respect to the Poet Eavan Boland who died suddenly in April 2020. In Chapter six of the Book where Mumu discusses the Corn Laws and the Great Famine in Ireland, she had referred to one of Eavan Boland’s poems – ‘Quarantine’ – never imagining  that, in 2020,  we would be experiencing quarantines in face of the Covid – 19 pandemic. It seems appropriate to refer to Ms Boland’s significant contribution as a woman Poet and to read her poem ‘Night Feed’.

In Episode 14: we discuss many subjects in this last chapter of the Book. We reflect on words and their meanings and the need for precise clear communications in human interactions – we recognise that  the essential element of good communication is  listening – active listening    We discuss the fact that ‘ignorance of the law is no defence’.  That led us to an interesting discussion about Latin – the language of learning - and the part it plays in some legal concepts. We reflect on  the fact  that so many of the questions, that had come from the group of  young people, that gave rise to this Book, were about trust in police forces – trust in  the judges and the courts ‘to get things right’. It was quite revealing that the preliminary questions, that they told Mumu they had submitted, as part of their penfriend project, to their friend in France, were questions about the symbols of justice, how people dressed in the courts, what the formalities of the court systems were in France and also if people trusted their police and what  French people thought of them.   And, in many respects, the question that had been put by Nova, when we were discussing the horrors of the First and Second World Wars, as we sat in Collins Barracks, and reflected on the work of  the anti-war hero, Harry Patch, when she asked: “Why can’t we just share this world, we only have one world?” reveals so much. In that respect, she represented the curiosity that gave rise to this Book. This is an apt and fitting way of ending Episode 14 because this emerging ‘fledgling generation’ is now on its own conveyor belt. It is important for them to reflect on the principles discussed and to keep being curious - and keep feeling the need to ask and find out more - and scrutinise the information that they are being given - and testing the administrative processes that support our democracies.

In Episode 13: we reflect on topics with  reference to the continuing unrest in the United States and the focus on violations of police power in communities that already feel alienated and are subjected to an excessive  amount of police surveillance and even police brutality which is recognised to be rooted in prejudice and racism  .  We also look at bullying as a subject and we reflect on the difference between bullying and harassment and we delve into the many programmes that are there, both in schools, colleges and in work places which have the aim and objective of having zero tolerance for bullying and we discuss the ways and means of trying to ‘nip it in the bud ‘and ‘stop it at source’. We recall the long standing search in the law for the ‘reasonable man’ in an attempt to define a ‘an objective reasonable view’ and I introduce you to the concept of   ‘The man on the Clapham Omnibus’.

In Episode 12: we discuss some connected themes from the ‘walk and talk’ that opened up so many relevant topics. We reflect on the wisdom handed down by some of our poets over time and we recall a comment made by Seamus Heaney, the Poet Laureate who referred to every generation being on its own conveyor belt.  This led us to a discussion about technology, social media, and all of the landscape on which the upcoming generation is living and attempting to navigate.  We discuss the need for scrutiny over the dissemination of information and scrutiny with regard to the potentially damaging powers that social media can have in influencing people in many respects even with regards to how people vote. 

In Podcast Series 11:  we discuss the coincidence that some of the violence we have witnessed in recent times in the  United States, particularly in Minneapolis -where, as a result of excessive force by police officers  in the arrest of an African American man  resulting in the person’s death in front of bystanders in the street,  at the side of the pavement, which has led to huge outcry worldwide. We reflect on the fact that our Book in which a number of the questions, asked by the young people, propelled us towards discussions about police forces - how they work-  how they need to be constructed, how there needs to be a collaborative relationship between them and the community that they serve –  and  how there needs to be effective complaint and oversight mechanisms in place with independent investigating authorities who can properly assess whether police officers  have breached their duty or acted in excess of their delegated powers. In the circumstances of the Podcast Series it is interesting to note that the young people found that subject of such interest and now we are witnessing the outcry throughout the world at the way this man was treated ‘in custody’ when he appeared to be offering no resistance.  His name is George Floyd, and some say he will be remembered as being the catalyst for change.  We also in this Podcast discuss dispute resolution mechanisms and how all of the processes depend on timing and that much needed skill of listening.  Listening skills are discussed and addressed and can never be underestimated.

In Episode 10:  we discussed ‘breaking the mould’ and how the old pomp and circumstance and traditions at the bar and the practice of the law were gradually modified. We also shared an interesting anecdote about an eminent female Senior Counsel who caused a stir when she wore tailored  black trousers in Court  We recall a Bar Counsel committee meeting about a female Senior Counsel daring to wear black trousers with her senior counsel outfit.  We also discussed the delays and costs of  the adversarial system and looked at the emergence of mediation and the new Alternative Dispute Resolution processes (ADRs) that have swept across the world in the last 20 years and have created a substantial opportunity to widen access to justice and give people an opportunity of resolving their disputes without having to go through the acrimonious and bruising experience of a court case in the adversarial system. The Woolf Reforms and how this changed the landscape of case management through the courts.

In Episode 9: we find ourselves discussing the implications of a referendum and how these can lead to outcomes that, perhaps, were not fully understood at the time of the vote - in circumstances  where arguably  the vote in the referendum was not a matter that was appropriate or amenable to merely a ‘yes or no vote’. The European Union Project. Brexit and questions about the influence of Social Media platforms in voting processes – harvesting votes. The role of an Ombudsman.

In Episode 8: we discuss our right to ‘our good name’. Libel Laws are there to protect our right to protect our reputation and, if we take  a Court Case against someone who we assert has  has defamed us  – the jury makes the decision on the amount that should be paid in damages if our claim is upheld. What is the value of our reputation measured? We look at written Constitutions.

In Episode 7: we go behind the subject of that chapter and discuss restorative justice and the Penal Law Reform Trusts that advocate for custodial sentences being a last resort. Prisons should just, humane, and effective. We discuss rehabilitation and reintegration into society.   We discuss the famous debate that went on for many years between two eminent lawyers -  one Prof. Hart, a professor of jurisprudence at Oxford University, and the other a former Judge -Lord Devlin who debated aspects of law and morality and law and its relationship to society in the 1960s. This linked to our thoughts about young offenders.  We looked at the object of the prisons, whether that was to satisfy the public that retribution had been handed out, or do we punish to assist in rehabilitation. We discussed the benefits of community policing and look at the Swedish and other Scandinavian models where they have explored the benefits of Open Prisons. 

In Episode 6: we consider the notion of bad laws, in answer to a question from one of the Learners: “Is law always right, are the courts always right, do they always get it right?”- we reviewed some laws that have brough great misery and have been introduced for the wrong reasons with the intentions of the ruling class being served rather than the people. We talk about the ‘The Fugitive Slave Act’ – when in 1850 in the southern states of the U.S they introduced the Law to punish anyone who helped a slave escape with a sanction of a 1,000 dollar fine and six months in prison. We flash forward to the 1950s and recall the Montgomery Bus Boycott when a woman called Rosa Parks refused to give up her seat on the bus to a white man because the buses were segregated and white people had reserved seating – the boycott went on over a year before the Courts found the segregation unconstitutional. We recall a young fifteen-year-old schoolgirl who had made her own protest by refusing to move, some nine months previously, for which she was taken off the bus and arrested in handcuffs.

In Episode 5: we discuss the question of evidence and the significance of DNA fingerprinting, DNA typing and DNA profile that has assisted in more accurate identification of people who were implicated in crimes.   We also took a visit to a former British military barracks in Dublin   – Collins Barracks - which is now a museum and provides an opportunity of reflecting on the cycle of wars. We then recalled the life story of a man called Harry Patch – known as ‘the last fighting Tommy’ who died at the age of 111. Harry Patch had only begun to talk about the horrors that he had experienced, in the trenches at the Battle at Passchendaele in the First World War, when he turned 100 years and he  tried to come to  terms with the horror he had witnessed and the loss of his three friends.  He made it his mission, for the remaining years of his life, to talk about war being a ‘licence to murder’. He became an anti-war hero and when he returned to visit the cemetery and memorial with the names of those comrades  who had perished,  he  paid respect not just of his fallen comrades but also  visited the German cemetery in a gesture of empathy and reconciliation.

In Episode 4: we go to visit the Courts and get a flavour of the ‘theatre of justice’ where the system plays out – we view this traditional world with its distinctive dress code and discuss the powerful image that ‘Lady Justice’ represents worldwide. I share a story about ‘the yellow V.W Beetle case’ where no remedy was available for a couple whose beautiful car was vandalised.

In Episode 3: we discuss the treatment of people in prison and consider the experience of Nelson Mandela and the length of time he was restrained in a top security prison at Robben Island.  We discuss my visit to that prison and the introduction to the conditions and experience by a member of the staff who was also a prisoner called Derick Bossen.  We discuss the hypocrisy of the different churches who condoned Apartheid and who appeared to close their eyes and ears to what was going on and the way that the prisoners were treated.  We discuss then the importance of letters and how they were smuggled out to give revelations of the conditions inside the prison and to maintain momentum for the black people in South Africa to continue to strive for  their franchise to vote in elections to have self determination in their State.  We also discover how the term ‘learners’ struck a chord when Derick Bossen referred to a group of girls, in the room with us, who were on a school trip from Zimbabwe, as ‘the learners’...  It struck me at the time as being a really interesting word which has been adopted for the group of young people in the Book.

Episode 2: goes a little behind the subject of policing where the discussion extends to the exploration of the necessary relationship between the police force and the community – community policing is discussed and the  trust that is conveyed by members of a community to their police force into whose hands they give the power to police  and at the same time respect the needs of the community and discharge  their duties with a degree of restraint, balance and fairness.  We discuss the issue of police complaints systems and the benefits of having a police ombudsman who can deal with complaints from members of the public if there has been any allegation of misconduct or mistreatment by a member of a police force.   This is just one way of providing safeguards to allay the fears of the general public particularly where there are minority ethnic groups in those communities.  An independent Office of oversight is needed to allay fears of a police force getting out of hand or using force beyond what is reasonable in the apprehension of suspected lawbreakers.   There are other measures such as internal disciplinary procedures for the members of the police force but having the independent Office of ombudsman gives an extra layer of protection and most important – transparency.