Things Musicians Don't Talk About

Words hold huge power, and for a long time the word 'anorexia' felt dirty to pianist Ophelia Gordon. First experiencing its wrath while studying at the BRIT School and watching her parents' divorce unravel her life, anorexia would return two years ago when Ophelia separated from her husband. She joins Hattie and Rebecca to uncover the story of her eating disorder, the trauma of divorce and the ways in which learning and recording Nikolai Kapustin's music has saved her life.Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Hattie ButterworthMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

'If it could have gone wrong it has gone wrong'. The last five years for Jessica Curry, a composer of contemporary classical game music, has been marked by severe illness and personal loss. She joins Hattie and Becca on Things Musicians Don't Talk About to share her journey being diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis and subsequently shielding during the pandemic. She explains the emotional toll of isolation, the importance of community and support, noting the industry's lack of empathy and her efforts to promote inclusivity. Jessica's latest album, born out of the adversity of this time, Shielding Songs, is an album of her choral music recorded with the London Voices, which is out now on Bandcamp. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

We have reached episode 100 and so decided, as a celebration, we'd take a wee look back... we might now regret it! Listen as we react to the first episode we made together, now over four years ago! Becca also tests Hattie on five years of hot takes – who said what and when?Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: HattieMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

*Trigger warning: discussion of eating disorders, alcoholism, addiction*From our live event at the Royal Society of Musicians on 22nd May 2025Lauren McQuistin has been running the Instagram account @brutalrecovery for years now. Her advocacy for honest recovery discourse has resonated with many alcoholics, particularly with her with her trademark eloquence and dry humour. Lauren now shares her experience of eating disorders - anorexia and bulimia in particular - and how this was especially shaped by her time as a classically-trained soprano. We asked her about her journey through her musical training and her addictions, her views on why there is such a high prevalence of EDs in classical music, body image critique in the opera world, eating disorders as addictions, how her recovery looks day-to-day now, and her new book No Lost Causes Club. As Hattie and I say in the talk, we've really struggled to find someone in classical music to speak about this subject, so huge thank you Lauren for being that person.Check out Lauren on Instagram and go read her new book!Thank you to forScore for advertising with us and to the Royal Society of Musicians for their ongoing support.forScore: https://forscore.coThings Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor & engineer: Oscar GormleyMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hattie and Becca discuss the need for many creatives to prove themselves to others online, often sharing data about their work. Do we need a structure and numeric guide for practice or can it be intuitive? And how does this link to intuitive eating? They also go on to discuss the complexities of dealing with criticism, where that sensitivity comes from and how Hattie copes with empathy for performers whilst writing reviews02:51 Workaholics and their quirks16:20 Intuitive eating vs intuitive practice23:55 Hattie receives criticism at work26:15 Confidence, criticism and power structures35:45 Writing reviews and empathy for performers35:40 Cultural recommendationsWe've got some absolutely stellar interviews lined up for release, with some MORE FILMED CONTENT 🤯 see you soon!Thank you to forScore for advertising with us and to the Royal Society of Musicians for their ongoing support 🙏forScore: https://forscore.coRSM: https://www.rsmgb.org-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Rebecca ToalMusic: Katy Ehrlich#podcast #musicpodcast #musician #mentalhealth Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Mezzo-soprano Jamie Barton has been fighting the corner of the marginalised in classical music now for over 10 years. From a marriage breakdown to a queer awakening and struggles with learning repertoire, Jamie joins Hattie and Becca to discuss her experiences as a queer woman in America and her journey to discovering her ADHD. She also shares powerful insights into body positivity, her approach to music and the importance of using her platform to support marginalised communitiesJamie Barton is at London Classical Pride on 4 July. Tickets here!Thank you to forScore for advertising with us and to the Royal Society of Musicians for their ongoing support.forScore: https://forscore.coThings Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Emma WernerMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Entering our YouTube era...! And we're talking about returning to things we didn't expect to: Hattie to America and Becca to the harp. We also have a good ol' think about child prodigies, faith and praying, and Becca obsesses further about JULY. We've got some absolutely stellar interviews lined up for release, so stay tuned.Thank you to forScore for advertising with us and to the Royal Society of Musicians for their ongoing support 🙏 forScore: https://forscore.coThings Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Rebecca ToalMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

After a performance we term as 'bad', it can be difficult to return to a sense of confidence in our playing. In this fourth mediation, Ruth Philips leads a meditation to disarm the inner critic and restore a sense of peace and acceptance in our performing. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Our aim as musicians is to communicate generously and freely to our audience but we rarely turn towards ourselves with the same degree of care. In this meditation, Ruth Philips leads a loving kindness practice, exploring how it might be to extend that kindness outwards towards our audience Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This meditation aims to bring you closer to your instrument and aid in healing any sense of disconnect you may be feelingDiscover Ruth Philips *Ruth Philips and Lucy Russell are running a course 'Mindfulness for Musicians' at Benslow Music from 13-15 June. More information here*-------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

A meditation for musicians lead by cellist and mindfulness meditation teacher Ruth Philips for use to calm the mind around stage fright and performance anxiety. Discover Ruth Philips -------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

'On returning from America, I listened back to lots of my old recordings and discovered a paradox: I had no confidence but also thought I deserved more – thought I was better than I really was'. Hattie sits down to share reflections from her trip to America from health anxiety and Curtis, to self-love and deleting dating apps Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week we interview trumpet player Lucy Humphris about her journey through music college and the contemporary music scene. We speak about the institutional barriers Lucy and others face as a female brass player with a non-traditional career trajectory, sharing her experiences of feeling "othered" and misunderstood. From battling expectations of orchestral conformity to navigating the complex landscape of contemporary music, Lucy reveals the personal and professional struggles of forging her own path. She explores themes of identity, resilience, and the often unspoken challenges musicians face when their artistic vision doesn't align with traditional institutional norms. Lucy inspires us with her story, her dedication to artistic integrity, and the way she's found her place in the contemporary music world. Thank you Lucy!Check her out further:WebsiteYoutubeInstagramThings Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Rebecca ToalMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Eating disorders and intense practice obsession have a lot in common. How do we move from an 'all or nothing' mindset to something structured and regular? Becca shares the start to her return to exercise following healing from an eating disorder and Hattie shares the parallels to the toxic relationship she has to the cello and hours of practice Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

There are statements made time and time again when you approach the topic of women in music: 'but historically music by men is just better', 'I'm sick of this wokeism in classical music' and 'people won't buy tickets to concerts of just women's music'. CN Lester and Gillian Moore join us live at the Royal Society of Musicians to unpack these statements and uncover the truth to performance, programming and pessimism around classical women composers.Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Katy EhrlichMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

10 years ago trombonist Emily White lost her husband after a prolonged period of illness. She was thrown into the worlds of death admin and loneliness, but out of it discovered a perspective on what was important as a musician. She shares with Hattie and Becca an insight into her grief journey, as well as her infectious joy of teaching and hatred of the word 'should'. Emily also takes them through her interest in research about practice and performance optimisation and how much joy is able to impact us positively as musicians.Learn more about Emily here!Things Musicians Don't Talk About is now supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Oscar GormleyMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Is capitalism to blame for the mental health crisis? Should we separate the art from the artist? Rebecca and Hattie have been reading non-fiction. And they are sharing two of the books with each other. Naomi Klein's Doppelganger won the Women's Prize for Non-Fiction in 2024 and has had a strong impact since it hit the bookshelves. The pressure for us to 'perform' online is overwhelming, and Becca brings a musician's perspective to Klein's reflections. Then to what appeared to be anti-psychiatry in James Davies's book Sedated. He blames much of our negative mental health experiences on toxic work culture and the flawed nature of CBT. Medication may not have as much of an impact long term as we might like. Hattie has thoughts...Things Musicians Don't Talk About is now supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Emma WernerMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Mark Brierley came to the world of classical music via journalism and without any prior knowledge of the industry. Now, as Head of Membership and Communications at the Royal Society of Musicians, he spends every day hearing from musicians about the reality of their lives. He speaks with Hattie at the RSM headquarters about the origins of the 'Fund for Decay'd Musicians', his perspectives on the industry as an 'outsider' and how he's developed a love for it. They also discuss marketing and communications for musicians, how to be heard and the impact of membership at the RSM.Things Musicians Don't Talk About is now supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie ButterworthEditor: Oscar GormleyMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It's Becca's turn to sit down for a solo check in with the help of some listener questions. The grief journey continues, as does the freelancing, and Becca reflects on emotional regulation, balancing her various jobs, and processing the death of an abuser.Things Musicians Don't Talk About is now supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Rebecca ToalEditors: Rebecca Toal and @mehrose786Music: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hattie sits down for a late night chat about everything on her mind this Christmas. New Year's resolutions, jealousy, musician guilt, ambition and the illusion of festivity are chaotically unpacked. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.