What Say U?

You can put new curtains on the windows, light a candle, and set the table real nice — but if the milk ain’t clean, everything you pour it into is spoiled. Washington State made history when it funded the Charles Mitchell and George Washington Bush Reparations Study — only the fourth statewide reparations study in the nation. Our communities organized. WENA — the Washington Equity Now Alliance — raised nearly half a million dollars in supplemental funding from Pierce County, King County, and beyond. Close to a million dollars in total support. That’s not government writing a check. That’s everyday people putting their faith, their money, and their ancestors’ names on the line. So when the Department of Commerce ran the procurement process to select who would do this sacred work — the community expected excellence. Transparency. Integrity. What they got was something else. In this episode, sisters Melannie and  Audrey connect with Dr. Marcus Anthony Hunter — one of the nation’s leading reparations scholars and one of the unsuccessful bidders for the study. Dr. Hunter is the Scott Waugh Endowed Chair at UCLA, author of Radical Reparations: Healing the Soul of a Nation (HarperCollins/Amistad), the visionary who coined #BlackLivesMatter, inaugural Chair of UCLA’s African American Studies Department, two-term President of the Association of Black Sociologists, and the scholar who drafted Congresswoman Barbara Lee’s historic Truth, Racial Healing, and Transformation Commission bill. His work has been featured on C-SPAN’s BookTV, MSNBC, BBC, NPR, the Washington Post, the New York Times, and the LA Times. He submitted a proposal for Washington’s study. And then the system showed its hand. His proposal was quarantined in the state’s email system as “malware” for 22 days while other bidders were being evaluated. When he was finally told he wasn’t selected, the state denied him the debriefing that Washington law guarantees every unsuccessful bidder. Denied him twice. He had to retain an attorney just to access a process the law says is his right. Meanwhile, the winning bidder — a DEI consulting firm — was awarded the contract to do work that requires expertise in reparations research, historical accounting, intergenerational economic harm, genealogy, and public policy analysis. The community asked questions. Filed public records requests. And invited the winning firm on this very show. Their general counsel said they’d love to come. That was six weeks ago. Silence ever since. The milk ain’t clean. This episode is not about who won or lost a contract. Dr. Hunter is not here as a sore loser — he’s here as a witness. This is first-source, insider testimony about how the state administered a process that the community invested in, that the legislature authorized, and that our ancestors are owed. In this conversation you’ll hear: Why one of the most qualified reparations scholars in the country answered Washington’s call What happened to his proposal inside the Department of Commerce’s system — documented, timestamped, on the record The legal fight for a debriefing the state tried to deny him — twice Why DEI consulting is not reparations research — and why that distinction matters for every person this study is supposed to serve What this process tells us about whether the state is truly ready for the work of repair What we demand from our government — and what we owe our ancestors Reparations are policy, process, and praxis. If the process ain’t right, the outcome can’t be trusted. And trust, once broken, has to be earned back in public. This one is for the record. For the archive. For Charles Mitchell and George Washington Bush. For Mother Viola Fletcher. For every descendant who is counting on this study to tell the truth. To Truclusion – the successful bidder: the invitation is still open. Come tell your story. Show yourself. This IS community. And community is waiting…please. What Say U? LINKS & REFERENCES Previous Episode-Listen for Context “When the System Shows Its Hand: Sacred Work, Shady Process” https://whatsayupodcast.com/when-the-system-shows-its-hand-sacred-work-shady-process/ About Our Guest Dr. Marcus Anthony Hunter — marcusanthonyhunter.com Radical Reparations: Healing the Soul of a Nation — HarperCollins/Amistad (2024) UCLA Department of Sociology — soc.ucla.edu Dr. Hunter’s Op-Ed in the AFRO: “When Equity is Performed, Not Practiced” When equity is performed, not practiced Washington Equity NOW Alliance https://waequitynow.org/ Washington State Reparations Study WA Dept. of Commerce — Reparative Study for Washington Descendants — https://www.commerce.wa.gov/community-initiatives/reparations-study/ Community Action Petition: Stand for Integrity & Justice in Washington’s Reparations Process — https://www.thefactsnewspaper.com/post/stand-for-integrity-justice-in-washington-s-reparations-process-sign-the-petition More Context & Receipts Department of Commerce: https://www.commerce.wa.gov/community-initiatives/reparations-study/ Department of Commerce: https://www.commerce.wa.gov/reparations-study-update-january-2026/ Seattle Medium: “Community Questions Firm Named As Apparent Successful Bidder” https://seattlemedium.com/truclusion-consulting-firm-controversy/ Community Debate of the selection of Truclusion as apparent successful bidder: https://seattlemedium.com/reparations-legislation-community-concerns/ South Seattle Emerald: “Washington Will Spend $300K to Study Reparations” https://southseattleemerald.org/news/2025/06/07/washington-will-spend-300k-to-study-reparations-multiracial-solidarity-made-it-possible Attachment Department Commerce email naming Reparation Study scorers (.pdf)

This episode of What Say U? is a whole experience — rich, spirited, and full of that unmistakable energy that happens when three Black women sit down together with purpose. The Sisters welcome Congresswoman Marilyn Strickland for a conversation that is equal parts truth‑telling, celebration, and community care. It is a reminder that Black history is not just something we study — it’s something we live, honor, and pass forward. Congresswoman Strickland introduces Melannie and Audrey to the Black History Month Essay Contest, an invitation for students in Washington State’s 10th Congressional District to lift up the stories of Black Washingtonians — the veterans, educators, entrepreneurs, and civic leaders whose contributions shaped the region long before many people and systems were willing to acknowledge them. Throughout the episode, you’ll hear: Why Congresswoman Strickland launched this contest at this moment How local Black history grounds students in pride, identity, and belonging Why storytelling is a tool of liberation How young people can use research, writing, and civic engagement to claim their voice What it means to protect our history when others are trying to erase it Links Information about the contest Support Channel 253  

In this episode, the Sisters talk with Ria J Johnson-Covington of the Lakewood African American Police Accountability Committee (LAAPAC) about community safety, accountability, and building stronger relationships between Lakewood’s African American community and the Lakewood Police Department. LAAPAC Meetings 2nd Wednesday • 3:00 PM Lakewood Police Station 9401 Lakewood Dr SW, Lakewood, WA 98499 Connect With LAAPAC Facebook: LAAPAC – Lakewood African American Police Advisory Committee A community-led group working to unify Lakewood residents and the police department. Related City Committees Public Safety Advisory Committee – Provides community input to the Lakewood City Council on public safety policies. Civil Service Commission – Oversees the hiring, promotion, and demotion of police officers under state law. Channel 253 Channel 253 membership

Okay family, pull up a chair because we need to talk. Washington State recently became the third state in America to fund a reparations study for African Americans, and it should be a moment to celebrate. The Legislature allocated $300,000 in seed funding, and the Washington Equity Now Alliance — a community-based organization doing the real work — raised another $450,000 to ensure this sacred study is done right. Governor Ferguson signed the law that spells out who’s qualified to lead the study: a PhD focused on reparations, peer-reviewed publications, expertise in calculating uncompensated slave labor, and lived experience. So far, so good, right? But here’s where it gets messy. The Department of Commerce is creating its own procurement rules, and its decisions are now preventing the community from securing qualified consultants for this work. Somehow, an “apparent successful bidder” has been named – a company called Truclusion that doesn’t appear to meet ANY of the legal requirements got through the procurement process — while the nation’s leading reparations scholar, an UCLA endowed chair and Howard University department head who literally wrote a BOOK on Reparations, was denied due process on a technicality when he asked for his legal right to a debriefing. How is the state this incompetent with something this important? Sisters Audrey and Melannie sit down with Attorney Jesse Wineberry Sr. — former five-term state legislator, first Black House Majority Whip in Washington’s history, and Chair of WENA — to break it down, shed light on the matter, and invite the community to take action. Somethin’ ought to be said. What say YOU? Links Washington Equity NOW Alliance Reparative Study for Washington Descendants – Washington State Department of Commerce Truclusion Website (Apparent Successful Bidder) Dr. Marcus Anthony Hunter Dr. Marcus Anthony Hunter – Achievements Marcus Anthony Hunter – UCLA Sociology Review of City-Level Reparations across the United States (.PDF) Dept. of Commerce WENA Community Partner Designation (REPARATIONS STUDY) (.PDF) WASHINGTON REPARATIONS STUDY BUDGET (.PDF) Calls to Action Support Dr. Marcus Anthony Hunter The Department of Commerce has denied Dr. Marcus Anthony Hunter his legal right to a debrief in accordance with Washington State Law RCW 39.26.170(2). He now must incur legal costs to challenge this injustice. It’s not about the “contract” anymore – it’s about the “principle” of the matter and the blatant disrespect of “Black Excellence.” Please support Dr. Hunter in this fight. This work is SACRED and COLLECTIVE. Donate here File a public records request Department of Commerce – Public Records Request Office of the Governor – Public Records Request CUT & PASTE THIS TEXT INTO YOUR EMAIL PUBLIC RECORDS REQUEST Pursuant to RCW 42.56, I request all records in any format—including emails, texts, memos, notes, meeting minutes, and other documents—related to COMMERCE RFP 26-33740-001 (Charles Mitchell and George Washington Bush Reparations Study), managed by Michelle Griffin, Department of Commerce: 1. Bidder Evaluation and Selection All proposals submitted in response to the RFP Individual and composite scores for all bidders Identities of all scorers/selection committee members Evaluation criteria and scoring rubrics Deliberations and comparative analyses All records supporting the selection of Truclusion as the apparent successful bidder All communication transmitting Dr. Hunter’s proposal to the scoring committee 2. Deadline Extension All communications and justifications regarding the November 10, 2025 decision to extend the contractor announcement deadline from November 5-10 to November 18, 2025, including the stated need for “additional time for scoring” 3. Delegation of Authority Any documents authorizing the Department of Commerce to delegate review and selection duties for this RFP to the Commission on African American Affairs 4. Conflict of Interest Documentation All signed conflict of interest disclosure forms and/or waivers executed by selection committee members CONTACT: DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE commercewa@govqa.us Natasha Langer Public Disclosure Specialist Operations Division Office Services 360-725-3156 THE GOVERNOR’S OFFICE publicdisclosure@gov.wa.gov Tricia Smith Director of Public Information & Records 564-200-2106

Are you retired, laid off, or simply in transition? This episode is for YOU. The sisters dive into a dynamic and heartfelt conversation about creating a fulfilling life after work—on your terms. Discover how to embrace this new chapter with purpose, passion, and joy. From volunteering to lifelong learning, we explore ways to stay engaged, connected, and inspired. Highlights in this episode: How to redefine your identity beyond your career Practical ideas for seniors to stay active and purposeful Volunteering stories that show the power of giving back Lifelong learning and personal growth opportunities Opportunities for Seniors to Explore: Volunteering with animals: Sister Audrey shares her experience at the Humane Society for Tacoma & Pierce County. Food justice & community support: Melannie volunteers with Northwest Harvest, helping fight hunger across Washington. Lifelong learning: Melannie is completing her PhD at Fielding Graduate University, proving it’s never too late to chase your academic dreams. Suggestions for things to try: Join local senior centers for fitness, arts, and social clubs Mentor younger generations through schools or community programs Explore creative hobbies like painting, writing, or gardening Travel locally—day trips to parks, museums, or cultural events Take online courses in areas like history, technology, or languages Links Humane Society for Tacoma & Pierce County Fielding Graduate University Northwest Harvest Channel 253 membership

Guest: Marguerite Martin, Entrepreneur, Social Influencer, and alumna of the American Leadership Forum Tacoma/Pierce County Senior Fellows Program with Melannie In this honest and brave conversation, Melannie, Audrey, and Marguerite explore a moment from a leadership workshop where Marguerite unintentionally made racially hurtful comments toward Black men in the group—and Melannie checked her. Together they unpack: How the incident unfolded, from multiple perspectives. What it reveals about unintentional racism, power, identity, and belonging. Why the path to anti-racism is often messy, unpredictable, and requires resilience. How relationships, reflection, and accountability create openings for growth, healing, and deeper connection. This episode is less about blame and more about seeing, learning, and staying the course. Links American Leadership Forum Pierce County Intercultural Development Inventory Cycle of Socialization Channel 253 membership

After some time away from the mic, sisters Audrey and Melannie return with a powerful episode that’s part personal journey, part revolutionary challenge. Episode Highlights Personal Updates & Testimony The sisters catch up on their life journeys since the last recording one year ago, with Audrey sharing a moving testimony about her sobriety journey. The Linguistic Reframe The sisters explore how words carry power and trigger automatic emotional responses. They propose flipping the script on the word TRUMP – a word that dominates our cultural conversation – by returning to its original meaning – to surpass or overcome – what if every time you heard the word “TRUMP,” instead of triggering political division or anxiety, it became your cue to choose kindness? The concept: Let kindness trump hate. Let compassion trump cruelty. Have a problem with alcohol? There is a solution. | Alcoholics Anonymous The sisters draw from their own comeback journeys to demonstrate that kindness isn’t weakness – it’s revolutionary. Support the podcast Channel 253 membership

This is a very special episode as sisters Audrey and Melannie celebrate their mother Alean’s 85th solar return. In the heartwarming and insightful conversation, Mom Alean joins her daughters in the studio to discuss her favorite topic: politics among many things. The discussion is candid, fun and touches on various aspects of life, as Mom Alean shares the wisdom she’s gathered over the years and her hopes for the future.

Sisters Audrey and Melannie reunite on the mic after being away for some time. They catch up on current events, specifically digging deep into the polarizing vibe around the national elections and impact on the minds of the people. They welcome special guest Carol Coleman Mitchell, founder and CEO of the Institute for Black Justice. The conversation elevates further when they speak on the murder of Sonya Massey by police in her home, the imperative for every citizen to vote and offer shout-outs to local candidates running for political office. The discussion is unfiltered, insightful, and real. Notes Everything we know about the Sonya Massey shooting | The Independent 2024 Primary Election Voters’ Pamphlet by Pierce County – Issuu Kamala Harris whole name:  Kamala Devi Harris ‘Win With Black Women’ organizes tens of thousands in surge of support for Kamala Harris (msnbc.com) Win With Black Men Fundraises $1.3 Million For Kamala Harris (blackenterprise.com) White women raised millions for Kamala Harris. And broke Zoom. – The 19th (19thnews.org) Voto Latino pledges $44M to support Kamala Harris for president (thehill.com) Asian Americans move quickly to endorse Kamala Harris – AsAmNews ‘White Dudes for Harris’ hold mass online meeting to support Kamala (msn.com)

Sister Melannie, also known as Peace Queen, is solo on the mic as Sister Audrey continues her radical healing journey! Please send your prayers and good vibes! In this episode, Peace Queen delves into what it truly means to lead, advocate, and thrive as a Black woman in political leadership. She engages in “truth-tellin'” dialogue with two distinguished members of the Washington State House of Representatives: the Honorable Melanie Morgan of District 29 and the Honorable Kristine Reeves of District 30, who is also chair of the Legislative Black Caucus. Listen in as Peace Queen and the Sister Queens in the House candidly share their stories about the uniqueness of navigating leadership as Black women and confronting the pervasive impact of systemic racism. This discussion offers a rare glimpse into their journeys, challenges, and triumphs in the realm of public service and advocacy. Resources: Tema Okun. 1999. White supremacy culture. Dismantling Racism: A Workbook for Social Change Groups, Durham, NC: Change Work. https://www.whitesupremacyculture.info/about.html https://www.dismantlingracism.org/ Washington State Primary Election – August 6, 2024 – Cast Your Ballot! https://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/elections-calendar/dates-and-deadlines https://app.leg.wa.gov/billsummary/?BillNumber=2243&Year=2024&Initiative=false (https://www.commerce.wa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/CRP_Factsheet_FullVersion_final-10-17-23.pdf) https://lcb.wa.gov/se/social-equity-plan

Production Note: Sister Melannie is on the mic solo. Sister Audrey continues her healing journey. Dr. Eddie Moore, Jr., who is widely known as “Dr. Diversity” joins Melannie to unveil their exciting new collaboration at Pacific Lutheran University within the Continuing Education Department. Melannie is at the helm of creating a groundbreaking program called Anti-Racist Leadership Education, and Dr. Moore has officially committed to this initiative by signing a memorandum of understanding. Together, they delve into the program’s specifics and the potential it holds. After the break, Melannie and Dr. Moore are joined by the remarkable Dr. Yusef Salaam. Dr. Salaam is renowned for his involvement as one of the “Central Park Five,” a group of young men wrongly accused and imprisoned for the alleged rape of a white woman in Central Park, New York. Subsequently, they were exonerated and are now celebrated as the “Exonerated Five.” Dr. Salaam shares his plans to visit Tacoma on December 14-15, where he will engage with the community and provide valuable insights on a range of critical topics, including Prison Reform, Black Male Achievement, Juvenile Justice, Voting, Community Engagement, and more. Resources and Links Dr. Moore Dr. Salaam: Netflix – When They See Us Channel 253 membership

In a thought-provoking conversation, Melannie discusses the critical issue of Anti-Black racism and Anti-Blackness with author and truth-teller Dante King, alongside Rev. Brandy Renée McMurry from the Spiritual Care team at the University of California San Francisco. They draw attention to the unsettling parallels between this pervasive problem and a pandemic. The primary goal of their discussion is to shed light on the historical roots and current consequences of these issues on individuals and systems. They also delve into potential solutions to address the harm caused and the often-overlooked nature of the situation. Their conversation aims to explore actionable steps that can be taken to confront and challenge this deeply ingrained problem. Notes: Dante King Anti-Blackness/Colorism (.pdf) Center for Antiracist Research Channel 253 membership

Dr. Karen Johnson, the first-ever Director of the Washington State Office of Equity, was abruptly terminated by Governor Jay Inslee on May 17, 2023. This decision caused a significant fallout, leaving huge numbers of individuals feeling bewildered, hurt, enraged, and emotionally shattered. In light of these events, Sisters Audrey and Melannie engage in an open and honest conversation with Dr. Johnson, delving into the unfolding of the situation and conducting a profound analysis of the underlying white supremacist culture and its connection to her termination. This conversation reaches a depth that many have not yet had the opportunity to hear, as they examine the far-reaching consequences and ripple effects triggered by Dr. Johnson’s dismissal. Insight into why we named the episode this way: “Kizzy”, is a character in the miniseries adaptation of “Roots.” Kizzy is the daughter of the main character, Kunta Kinte, and his love interest, Bell. Though she is born into slavery, she is portrayed as a spirited, intelligent, and resilient young woman. She possesses a strong sense of identity and carries with her the cultural heritage passed down from her father. Thus, the phrase “Run Kizzy, Run” is used as a command and plea for Kizzy to escape from her life of bondage and seek freedom. It represents the desire for emancipation, self-determination, and the hope for a better future. The characters urging Kizzy to run recognize the dangers and cruelty of slavery and encourage her to flee the oppressive system in pursuit of a life in which she can exercise her own agency. Links Channel 253 membership Press about Dr. Johnson firing King5.com Seattle Times Seattle Times The Making of a Slave: Willie Lynch Governor’s Office of Equity Creation | RCW 43.06D.020 Office Equity Established – Purpose White Supremacy Culture End White Supremacy Cycle of Socialization & Liberation (Bobbie Harro) (.pdf)

Sisters Audrey and Melannie joyfully return to the microphone after an extended absence. During their time away, significant events have unfolded in the world, as well as in their personal lives. This episode serves as an honest reflection on the challenges, struggles, and “darkness” that caused them to step away from the mic for a while. However, it also highlights the powerful transformative force of LIGHT that has inspired them to return and use their voices to speak about freedom and liberation. State Representative Melanie Morgan (D-29th District) takes center stage in this episode as the Sisters celebrate June 19th – Emancipation Day! As the sponsor of HB 1016, a Washington State legislative act aimed at officially recognizing Juneteenth as a legal holiday, Representative Morgan provides valuable insights into the process of turning this bill into law, shedding light on the challenges, strategies, and efforts involved. She opens up intimately about her personal motivation to sponsor the bill and her vision for the long-lasting impact it can have on future generations. Links Channel 253 membership Representative Melanie Morgan Bio (.pdf) News on Juneteenth as a Holiday in Washington State House Bill 1016 (.pdf) U.S. Bill S.475

In this episode, the sisters talk about Tyre Nichols and the sadly familiar circumstances of his murder. Links Channel 253 membership

Guest host Bishop Gwendolyn Phillips Coates joins Sister Melannie in conversation with Dr. Eddie Moore Jr. Dr. Moore is the founder of the White Privilege Conference and the White Privilege Institute. He joins the conversation to discuss his upcoming presentation at The People’s Gathering: A Revolution of Consciousness Conference. Notes: Sister Audrey is on sabbatical. She will return to the mic soon. Links America & Moore The People’s Gathering 2022 Channel 253 membership

Inspired by the 1972 song The World Is a Ghetto” recorded by the band War, Melannie and Audrey cover a variety of topics in their “keepin’ it real” fashion relevant to their personal development and growth.