Innerspace: Deep, Meaningful Conversations with Brett Kaufman

Michael Shapiro grew up in the shadow of the Holocaust. His grandmother survived Auschwitz. His grandfather was a Nazi slave soldier. By the time Michael was 12, he was self-medicating with drugs. By 15, he was having mystical experiences in the forest. By 48, he had become a Buddhist monk, a clinical psychologist, a Peace Corps volunteer in Thailand, and the author of Truth Medicine: Healing and Living Authentically Through Psychedelic Psychotherapy.This is a conversation about what it actually takes to heal. Not the shortcut version. The real version.Michael and Brett go deep on intergenerational trauma and why we carry our ancestors' wounds in our bodies, the difference between using psychedelic medicine recreationally and using it as a doorway into serious inner work, the sister's letter that cracked Michael open at 19, and why true transformation requires community, not just ceremony.If you've ever wondered whether you're doing enough work, or whether the work is even worth it, this episode is for you.Truth Medicine is available wherever books are sold.

Jenny Shuman didn't map any of this out.She became a mother at 16. She picked up her first loom at a summer powwow in 1992. She spent years selling beadwork from a booth while her daughter danced beside her in full regalia. She built a quiet, intentional life in Michigan and then left all of it behind for Oregon, her husband, and a new beginning she couldn't quite see yet.Today, her work is worn by Bob Weir, Oteil Burbridge, Duane Betts, Anders Osborne, Derek Trucks, and Michael Franti. She's crafted straps for some of the most sacred instruments in music, including Jerry Garcia's Wolf and Alligator Guitars. Each piece carries a story. A family. A soul.In this conversation, Brett and Jenny trace the full arc. The loving childhood in Rockford, Michigan. The grandmother who first put a needle in her hand. The teenage pregnancy, the alternative high school, the powwow trail with a toddler in tow. The sister she lost too young. The cross-country leap that cost her a pension and a paid-off house and opened something she never could have engineered.And always, the loom. The meditation of it. The intention woven into every bead.Jenny's story isn't a straight line. It's a perfectly imperfect tree, bent by wind and weather, shaped by love and loss, growing toward something most people spend a lifetime searching for: a life that is completely, unmistakably yours.Learn more about Jenny here: Beadworkbyjenny.net

Ben Katt spent a decade building something rare: a contemplative community center in Seattle rooted in belonging, service, and inner life. From the outside, it looked like purpose-driven work at its best. Beneath the surface, the same old patterns were quietly running the show — achievement, performance, the hunger for approval.It took a single moment on a morning run and the words if you don't have your heart, you have nothing to stop him cold.In this conversation, Brett and Ben trace the arc of Ben's life from a childhood shaped by church, brotherhood, and the need to earn love through performance, through a decade of entrepreneurial ministry, through burnout and unraveling, and into the clarity that eventually became his book, The Way Home: Discovering the Hero's Journey to Wholeness at Midlife.They explore why high achievers often do the most soulful work while still playing the same exhausting game. Why transitions are portals, not problems. And what it actually looks like to renovate your being from the inside out not just restructure your career.Ben is a coach, meditation teacher, author, and faculty-in-residence at the Modern Elder Academy. He's also living proof that the unknown isn't something to rush through, it's where everything changes.

Chris Voss is a former FBI hostage negotiator, bestselling author of Never Split the Difference, and one of the world’s leading experts on high-stakes communication. In this conversation, Brett and Chris explore what negotiation really is and why most of us misunderstand it entirely.Before he was teaching executives and founders how to navigate boardrooms, Chris was negotiating with terrorists, kidnappers, and people on the brink of taking their own lives. What he learned in those moments wasn’t about dominance or control. It was about understanding.They discuss the neuroscience of calm, why your nervous system is always negotiating before your words are, and how empathy, not agreement, not sympathy, becomes the most powerful tool in moments of conflict. Chris breaks down the internal “chatter” that sabotages us in difficult conversations and explains why curiosity is a competitive advantage in leadership, relationships, and business.This episode moves beyond tactics and into something deeper: how we regulate ourselves under pressure, how we create psychological safety, and why feeling understood can release potent forces for change.Whether you’re navigating a high-stakes negotiation, leading through tension, or simply trying to communicate more effectively in your personal life, this conversation reframes what influence truly means.

Vanessa Bennett is a depth psychologist, therapist, and author of The Motherhood Myth. In this conversation, Brett and Vanessa go all the way back. Vanessa grew up as a parentified child in a single-parent home — the overachiever who learned early that love was something you earned through achievement, not something freely given. At 25, a close friend told her she always seemed angry. That one honest observation cracked her open. It sent her into therapy, yoga, Al-Anon, and eventually across the country — alone, at 30 — to leave her career in New York advertising, end a long-term relationship, and start over completely. Her work now sits at the intersection of depth psychology, spirituality, and the real, unfiltered experience of being human. And when she became a mother, two weeks before COVID lockdown, the myths she'd spent years studying became impossible to ignore. This is a conversation about what actually heals us. And what gets in the way.

For years, The Gravity Podcast created space for meaningful conversations around business, creativity, and personal growth.But over the past year, something shifted.In this episode, Brett shares why he realized he was playing the external game — building, scaling, optimizing — and why he now wants to play a bigger game: the game of consciousness.After attending Abundance 360 and hearing Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, and Richard Branson present their visions for space travel, Brett entered a deep therapeutic and spiritual process that led to a powerful realization: while we are investing extraordinary energy into exploring outer space, most of us have barely explored the vastness inside ourselves.INNERSPACE is born from that insight.This podcast will trace the psychological and emotional origin stories of builders, creators, leaders, and seekers — starting with childhood and following the invisible threads forward.Less performance.More presence.More honesty about the human experience.The first guest episode drops Thursday, 2/19.Welcome to INNERSPACE.

In this very special 200th episode, host Brett Kaufman takes a heartfelt pause to reflect on the journey of the Gravity Podcast. What started as a simple idea for recording meaningful coffee conversations has turned into a five-year archive of deep, vulnerable, and inspiring stories. With no roadmap in hand, the podcast became a space to explore the human experience and build a conscious community around authenticity and connection.To celebrate the milestone, Brett revisits standout moments from some of his most impactful guests: people who have shaped the Gravity conversation and helped listeners feel a little more seen in their own lives.Today on Gravity: Chet Scott reminds us why real, connected community is essential to human survival and resilience.Jenny Britton of Jeni’s Ice Cream shares a deeply personal turning point and how her body, not her brain, guided her back to alignment.John Kim (The Angry Therapist) opens up about authenticity, healing, and the importance of embodied experiences.James Clear, bestselling author of Atomic Habits, talks about designing your life as a creative act—and how living intentionally is itself a form of art.Bob Roth, CEO of the David Lynch Foundation, reflects on his decades-long journey with Transcendental Meditation and making the practice accessible without the fluff.Lewis Howes shares his path through trauma and adversity, and how he transformed pain into purpose.Maggie Smith, poet and bestselling author, gets real about heartbreak, motherhood, and the creative process of turning personal pain into art that heals others.LEARN MORE ABOUT THE PODCAST:The Gravity Podcast - Available on Apple and SpotifyLEARN MORE ABOUT GRAVITY:The Gravity ProjectGravity on InstagramLEARN MORE ABOUT THE HOST:Brett KaufmanBrett Kaufman on Instagram

In this re-released episode in tribute to the great David Lynch, Brett Kaufman welcomes Bob Roth, one of the most experienced meditation teachers in the US and author of the New York Times bestseller “Strength in Stillness: The Power of Transcendental Meditation.” With nearly 50 years of experience, Bob has introduced thousands to the practice of Transcendental Meditation. As the CEO of the David Lynch Foundation, he has championed the cause of teaching meditation to over a million at-risk individuals across 35 countries. Bob shares his transformative journey, from witnessing Robert Kennedy's impactful speech and aspiring to be a Senator to his life-altering introduction to TM at the University of California, Berkeley. He delves into his early life, his father's wartime trauma, and the family's move to Marin County. Bob underscores the universality of trauma and the profound role of TM in calming the brain's amygdala, fostering resilience, and promoting overall well-being.Today on Gravity:Bob Roth's childhood, influences, and experiencing Berkeley in the '60sBob’s personal journey with Transcendental MeditationScience and benefits of TMAddressing trauma through TM and its societal impactDavid Lynch's influence and the expansion of TM in ColumbusLEARN MORE ABOUT THE PODCAST:The Gravity Podcast - Available on Apple and SpotifyLEARN MORE ABOUT GRAVITY:The Gravity ProjectGravity on InstagramLEARN MORE ABOUT THE HOST:Brett KaufmanBrett Kaufman on Instagram

“As a human being you look at a situation and say the intuition, I have there's potential within myself that hasn't come out yet and I want to enliven that I want to live life in a way that I'm doing my best and enjoying and meditation is the field for that.” – Cary Davis

"That's where the growth is. It's not about all the tricks, it's just about the consistency, creating that new pattern. And then once you create that new pattern, you can start to be the architect of the life that you want." – Joshua Steckel

"You don't have to publish, you don't have to be a writer in terms of writing a book, but you've just got to, you've got to write to author a great life." – Chet Scott

"There's something bigger than you or I, an energy that is more powerful. I think that being able to recognize the fact that there is something more powerful than my being and that's a good thing that we don't have all that control."

“It's so fun to see this community organically grow. And nothing makes me happier than when I teach group training and seeing the group form new friendships. it's beautiful.”– Kara Shaffer

"But the real birth of this huge wellness journey that I'm trying to impart on the world and make my impact started well before I was 10 years old, I always had this idea, big ideology of, ‘well, nobody's gonna do it. I'm gonna do it’” – Sean Carroo

"I learned from my father that in life we have these convincing experiences. And sometimes they're just the most mundane, stupid little thing. But it's a convincing experience where you're like, I don't know what's next, but it's better than where I am right now.” – Kate Borges

“What it means to make sure archive and history doesn't disappear is something I realize the power of art and photography.” – Tariq Tarey

“If I die today, am I proud of what I've done? And I was like, I've got so much more inside me that I want to put out in the world beforehand.” — Sean Sweeney

“I believe that the most healed people in the world do not give a f*ck what other people think about them, because they have given themselves the freedom of identity. They've allowed themselves the space to be themselves.” — Michael Unbroken

“I came to the realization that when it comes to spiritual and emotional healing for the modern day. It's really not about plant medicine or modern psychotherapy, It's actually the intersection of both. And that's where I really found tremendous healing, where I would have a medicine experience, and then I would go sit with a therapist for the next eight weeks.” - Wes Carter

This week, I’m re-releasing a previous episode featuring my friend Ken Jordan who passed away recently. I’m saddened at the loss of Ken who was such a beautiful soul, a wonderful man and a bright light in this world. Ken was instrumental in the psychedelics movement through his advocacy and journalism as founder of Lucid News. Ken left an imprint on me as a friend and collaborator. I will remember him fondly and carry his energy forward. My heart goes out to his family and friends. I wanted to honor Ken by re-releasing this episode to share his message with the world. His life story is a beautiful one and one that ended too early. I hope you enjoy & please check out Ken's publication, Lucid News to learn more about his legacy and journalism focused on the advancement of psychedelics.