Everything Happens with Kate Bowler

How do you stay close to someone whose pain you can’t fix, whose questions you can’t answer? In this episode, Kate sits down with her dear friend, the Rev. Dr. Sam Wells, a longtime advocate of “being with,” a theology that goes beyond advice and into the sacred space of simply staying. Sam–vicar at London’s St.-Martin-in-the-Fields, an astonishingly wise thinker, and one of Kate’s favorite people on Earth–invites us into a deeper courage: to show up without trying to tidy things up.  In this beautifully honest conversation, Kate and Sam talk about: Why love can be so hard What it means to let go of the need to “help” The surprising beauty of just… showing up.  For everyone exhausted by easy answers, this episode is a hand to hold in the dark.   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

There are some realities we can never get over. And yet, we keep living. How do we do that well? Wilma Derksen writes and speaks on the topics of victimization and criminal justice. Her wisdom is hardwon. In the mid-80s, Wilma’s daughter, Candace, was murdered. Their family’s response to this tragedy has inspired so many people…and you’ll soon see why. In this conversation, Kate and Wilma discuss:  How we live with the things we cannot change What does forgiveness look like in practice How to start forgiving yourself If you liked this episode, you might also like:  Malcolm Gladwell on whether people can change Jerry Sittser on reflecting on tragedy decades later CW: murder of a child   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This week we're introducing you to a show we love called A Slight Change of Plans with Dr. Maya Shankar. Kate was actually a guest on the show, where she joined to talk about how her entire belief system was thrown into question when she was diagnosed with Stage IV cancer at age 35.  If you want to hear more conversations like this one, listen to A Slight Change of Plans wherever you get your podcasts. Plus, the show has new episodes coming on November 11.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

How do we stay hopeful in the face of despair and disillusionment—especially when politics threaten to tear us in two? Kate speaks with Parker Palmer, a writer, teacher, and activist. As you’ll hear, he has gone through seasons of deep clinical depression, and has hard-won wisdom to share with us on how to survive, how to regain a sense of agency, how to remain hopeful despite it all.  In this episode, Kate and Parker discuss: finding agency in the midst of depression and despair (including his trick of redefining achievement) why it is important to recalibrate our sense of reality—especially in the face of 24-hour news cycles and social media algorithms how a broken heart can either shatter or break open into a larger, more compassionate way of being So on a day like today when we all might be thinking about the state of our nation or the state of our world or the realities at stake for our families and friends (....or perhaps, more tempted to keep our head in the sand to just make it through Thanksgiving), might we pull up close and listen to what Parker has to teach us about how to keep our hearts soft and remain hopeful, still.  If you liked this episode, you’ll also love:  Sharon McMahon on the small differences we can make Will Willimon on aging into a new vocation   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

We need more room to be honest about what it costs when people or institutions fail us. Today's conversation is with Lord Charles Spencer, the 9th Earl Spencer. You might also know him as Princess Diana's brother. His latest book, A Very Private School, is a courageous and beautifully written memoir about his time in an abusive English boarding school that was shrouded in secrets, abuse, and cruelty. While his circumstances may be unlike something you’ve experienced, Charles speaks so candidly and tenderly about his painful childhood and what it has cost him and others too. In this conversation, Kate and Charles discuss: the challenge and catharsis of writing about personal trauma the casual cruelty Charles and his peers endured what happens when our innocence is stolen from us at a young age what healing looks like 50 years later If you liked this conversation, might also like:  Rachel Denhollender on getting justice you deserve Tara Westover on how our parents’ best might still not be enough   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In every deep relationship, there comes a point where we are asked to give up something of ourselves or change in ways we never anticipated. Who will this make me? What will this love cost? Tembi Locke fell in love with an Italian chef named Saro when she was studying abroad in Italy during college. Their romance was a story for the big screen. (Quite literally. One starring Zoe Saldana.) A rare illness upended it all. Tembi spent ten years as Saro’s caregiver before he died. In her grief, Tembi took their young daughter back to Sicily to see what of her husband she could find there—in his culture, in his food, and with his family. In this conversation, Kate and Tembi discuss:  becoming the architect of your life  the effects of long-term caregiving (both the beauty and the cost) who grief makes us If you liked this episode, you’ll also love:  Katherine and Jay Wolf on what caregiving costs us Thomas Lynch on how we become who we miss John Swinton on living at the speed of love   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

What if you started thinking really concretely about small, hard choices? That’s exactly what palliative care physicians do every day. They help us think about what we really want—knowing that we have limited time and limited resources. You’re going to love our guest today, Dr. Kathryn Mannix, palliative care physician and cognitive behavioral therapist. She offers practical steps to help people and their loved ones make sense of what limited choices they have, navigate any pain and fear they may experience, and gives the most comforting speech on what the end of a life looks like that we’ve ever heard. (I promise this is not scary at all. It is perfect.) In this conversation, Kate and Kathryn discuss: Why we want to keep a lid on the scary things of life  What even is palliative care How palliative care-type thinking can help us live better  What happens to hope when facing end of life This is a masterclass in walking right up to the edge with people, in the most gentle, compassionate way.  If you liked this episode, you’ll also love:  Sunita Puri on living in uncertainty Rev. Tom Long on the importance of the rituals for death and dying   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Sometimes you really need someone to believe that you are good. Unshakably good. Over 30 years ago, Father Greg Boyle started working with gang members in Los Angeles through Homeboy Industries. The lessons that he learns from whom he calls “homies” are contagious. Every day, they teach him about what it means to heal, to belong to one another, to practice compassion, and to relearn how to feel good again to God and others. These are just some of the transcendent truths that he has to share with us today. In this conversation, Kate and Greg discuss: what it means to see unshakable goodness in others what it would mean for our carceral system if we sought to heal instead of punish how can we have a greater capacity for joy If you liked this episode, you’ll also love:  Bryan Stevenson on rethinking what “justice” means Francis Collins on treating people kindly and with love Nicholas Kristof on hope as a muscle   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Nurse and writer Christie Watson found herself in a grocery store fish-finger freezer and realized something was very, very wrong. Why was she so desperate for more? (And also, why was she so extremely overheated? Oh wait…hormones?) In this hilarious and hopeful conversation, Christie speaks with Kate about the importance of prioritizing joy in the face of our emotionally expensive professions and roles, as well as joy’s importance as we get older (and how lucky we are to age in the first place).  In this conversation, Kate and Christie discuss: The intricate aspects of aging for women The significance of nurturing strong female friendships  Making room for the absurd in our life If you liked this episode, you will also love:  Christie Watson on what nurses teach us about the language of kindness Emma Gannon on whether we are in shut-it-down seasons or creative seasons Elizabeth Gilbert on finding our "purpose" (and why that is a load of BS)   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This week we have something special for you. Kate Bowler joins Rainn Wilson to explore the complexities of American Christian traditions and the nature of suffering on Soul Boom. Kate delves into her personal journey with stage four cancer, her struggles with the American healthcare system, offering profound insights into faith, resilience, and the misconceptions of positive thinking. Together, they discuss the dichotomy of American religious practices and the deep, often unspoken struggles that accompany a life of faith. Tune in for a heartfelt conversation filled with wisdom, humor, and authenticity. To hear more episodes, search for Soul Boom wherever you get your podcasts or follow the links below: Sign up for our newsletter! https://soulboom.substack.comSUBSCRIBE to Soul Boom!! https://bit.ly/Subscribe2SoulBoomWatch our Clips: https://www.youtube.com/@SoulBoomClipsWatch WISDOM DUMP: https://bit.ly/WISDOMDUMPFollow us!Instagram: http://instagram.com/soulboomTikTok: http://tiktok.com/@soulboomSponsor Soul Boom: partnerships@voicingchange.mediaWork with Soul Boom: business@soulboom.comSend Fan Creations, Questions, Comments: hello@soulboom.comProduced by: Kartik ChainaniExecutive Produced by: Ford Bowers, Samah TokmachiSpring Green FilmsProduction Supervisor: Mike O'BrienVoicing Change MediaTheme Music by: Marcos MoscatSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

It is a hard time to be a person in the world given the volatile political climate or state of our world or the realities we’re facing in our family. But the weight of the world’s problems are not on your shoulders alone. Sharon McMahon, America’s Government Teacher, joins Kate for a hopeful conversation that reminds us all of the small, faithful ways we can make a difference in our communities.    In this conversation, Kate and Sharon discuss:  why it’s not our job to fix every problem  how ordinary people can have an extraordinary impact  how to engage with others who may think or act (or vote!) differently than you    If you loved this episode, you’ll also like: Cindy McCain on what courage looks like in action Judy Woodruff on living in our beautiful, terrible days Abigail Marsh on altruistic kidney donors Anna Sale on talking across difference   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

We all experience seasons where all we can do is scratch our heads and say, “WHAT EVEN HAPPENED?!”  Dr. Francis Collins led the National Institutes of Health during 2020—our season of collective “WHAT EVEN HAPPENED!?” He is still picking up the pieces of heartbreak from how people responded to one another and to science at the time. Yet he hasn’t lost his faith in humanity.  In this conversation, Kate and Francis discuss:  Why faith and science seem at odds (and why they shouldn’t be) The importance of doubt and asking questions What happens when institutions (or their leaders) let us down and you’ll hear quite the case on practicing interdependence. How we might all have enough foolishness to imagine we can be part of bridging the great divides we see.  If you liked this episode, you might also love:  Angela Williams on the importance of community care Maggie Jackson on what staying open-minded offers us David Brooks on asking better questions To hear more conversations on science and faith with top scientists and Christian leaders, check out BioLogos’s Language of God podcast.   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Is it possible for anyone to change—change their mind, change their theology, change their priorities? What does it mean to hope when we live in such uncertainty? Richard B. Hays is a world-renowned scholar of the New Testament. He is also a dear friend and colleague of Kate Bowler. Richard and Kate were both unexpectedly diagnosed with cancer at the same time, which meant they spent many hours discussing the heart of what it means to hope. Their hard won wisdom adds such depth and heart to today’s episode. In this conversation, Richard and Kate discuss:   What it means to be hopeful A rich theological perspective of suffering in light of the resurrection How to pray when you are living in uncertainty  Why it's never too late to change your mind as you grow older This is a soulful conversation that embodies the humility it takes to change anything. Your mind. How your time is spent. Your certainties. We can’t wait to hear what you think.  If you liked this episode, you might also love:  Will Willimon on vocation (especially as we age) Tom Long on learning to number our days Stanley Hauerwas on needing fewer explanations Jeff Chu on discovering grace for people who think unlike you   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Nicholas Kristof understands how to hope—especially in the face of despair or disappointment. He has spent his life shining a light on global tragedies like the Tiananmen Square massacre or the genocide in Darfur. And yet, despite all the horrors he has born witness to, he maintains a sense of hard-won optimism. “Hope is a muscle,” he says, and one we can all learn to develop.  In this live conversation, Kate and Nicholas discuss:  How to maintain hope in the year ahead Nicholas’ best argument as to why this is the best time to be alive His strategies to seeing pain and courage up close over and over again Why our small actions matter (even when it feels like a drop in the ocean)  If you liked this episode, you’ll love:  Bryan Stevenson on justice in the face of unthinkable odds David Fajgenbaum on how hope pulls us forward Sarah Polley on why we should run toward what scares us   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Are you living your best life now? Not always? GREAT, ME NEITHER.  My name is Kate Bowler. I’m a Duke professor, bestselling author, and your friendly neighborhood Canadian. This is a show for people who have learned that life is… well, complicated. And we need better language to tell the truth about all of our ups and downs and in-betweens. I’ve always been fascinated by how we, as humans, try to make sense of suffering and happiness. Spoiler alert: there’s no magic formula, but there are some pretty brilliant minds who’ve given it a go. And I’m bringing them straight to your earbuds. So, if you’re tired of coffee mug platitudes and are looking for something…more, join us. New episodes drop every Tuesday. Subscribe now and, together, let’s find a bit more hope, in a world where, well, everything happens. A new season of honest-to-God funny conversations starts on September 3rd.  Mark your calendar. Make sure you’re subscribed. You won’t want to miss this.  EVERYTHING HAPPENS is available everywhere you get your podcasts. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Comedians have the ability to be unsparingly honest in ways that buck all cultural norms. It’s a truth-telling that so many of us crave.  Cue Rob Delaney.  Rob is a comedian, actor, writer, and director. His memoir, A Heart That Works is an unsparing account of the death of his beautiful son, Henry. Rob lives in London with his family where Kate visited him for this honest and hilarious conversation.  Kate and Rob discuss: The importance of finding people who really understand what you’re feeling What not to say to people whose kids have died How tragic loss exiles you to a planet where only those who understand grief live The ways we hope grief metabolizes in us and transforms us into empathetic, heart-open kinds of people Rob wants us all to understand that if the unthinkable happens, our hearts still beat so strong in truth and love.  CW: hard-earned explicit language of a bereaved parent, death of parent, Suicide, death of a child   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

There is this quote by writer and theologian Frederick Buechner. He writes, “Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid.” …But I always sort of wanted to amend his original words. Because the more honest truth is: “Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Be a little afraid.” Life is so beautiful. And life is so hard. For everyone. Sometimes at the same time. That is the premise behind my latest book of meditations called Have a Beautiful, Terrible Day! Perhaps these reflections on hope and fear in the midst of our real lives resonate with whatever it is you’re facing today. Pick up a copy (or listen on audio) wherever books are sold. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

How should you show up for people in grief? What do you say? What should you do? Why is it that beauty can exist alongside deep suffering? What can be said at funerals when the person who died was complicated? These are just a few of the questions I wanted to ask Steve Leder—a bestselling author and a rabbi who has presided over a thousand funerals with wisdom and kindness.  In this conversation, we discuss:   The mysterious way beauty can be found the closer we inch to death (our own or someone else’s). The importance of just showing up. And being you.  Honoring someone’s memory at the same time being truthful about how human they were The peace that comes from acknowledging that life is full of dualities  “If you have to go through hell, don’t come out empty handed” (Steve Leder), but no, the lessons were never, ever worth the pain CW: suicide, adult language   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is the story of one young doctor’s race against the clock as he searches for a cure for his own rare disease. In this conversation, Kate and David Fajgenbaum discuss: how love can turn hope into action what limited agency means how small steps can lead to big change This episode originally aired in 2020. Stay tuned to the end to hear an incredible update from David and the work he is up to now. He has expanded from finding the cure for his own incurable disease to developing an organization that does the same for others. Incredible.   Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here or visiting katebowler.com/podcasts. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter)—@katecbowler. Links to social pages and more available at linktr.ee/katecbowler.  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

How hard is it to be a parent today? After a pandemic? With social media breathing down our necks? It’s so hard! Navigating the delicate balance between granting independence and providing guidance can be daunting as a parent.  Dr. Lisa Damour (New York Times bestselling author of The Emotional Lives of Teenagers) has dedicated her life to unraveling the intricacies of adolescence and offering practical, heartfelt advice. In this conversation, Lisa and Kate: offer a more reassuring definition of mental health (hint: it’s about having the right-sized feelings that fit the situation at hand and managing those feelings effectively).  emphasize the importance of being a steady presence in kids’ lives, as well as offer scripts to try with your own teenager give language to what parents might be feeling if they missed this kind of parenting themselves  CW: Mental Health awareness    Watch clips from this conversation, read the full transcript, and access discussion questions by clicking here. Follow Kate on Instagram, Facebook, or X (formerly known as Twitter). See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.